Author Topic: Need help configuring Wifi router behind a Bell Home Hub internet wifi modem  (Read 1060 times)

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Offline edy

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Hi folks,

I’m having trouble with a networking setup and not sure what to do. I have a Bell Home Hub 2000 on 192.168.2.1 connected to internet. There are a bunch of devices hooked up to it’s Wifi. What I wanted to do is have another group of devices (e.g. kids devices) connected to another Wifi router so that I could use parental controls. I don’t like the scheduling/access control on Bell Home Hub 2000 so I got the ASUS (RT-AC65) AC1750 WiFi Router.

I plugged the ASUS WAN port into the Bell modem LAN2 port, it shows up as 192.168.2.93 but is inaccessible from the Bell network when I’m logged into Bell wifi when the ASUS is set as “wifi router mode”. When I set the ASUS up as “Access Point mode” it becomes a device on the 192.168.2.x (I can reach it’s login screen at 192.168.2.93) and I can see all the devices attached to the Bell modem wifi as well as the ASUS wifi. Only problem is it disables parental control options completely on the ASUS device in this mode.

On the other hand, when I set the ASUS in “Wifi router mode” it can only be accessed when I join the ASUS wifi and go to 192.168.50.1. In this mode it shows parental scheduling options. However it is no longer accessible on the 192.168.2.x network, and it also loses internet connectivity. So if I join the ASUS wifi I can’t browse the internet. I noticed that in access point mode it says it disables a bunch of things like NAT, IP sharing and firewall and it then can access the internet but I lose parental control. I’ve tried disabling these things when I have it configured in “wifi router mode” but it doesn’t solve the problem.

Can someone please help me configure this setup. I have the ASUS router with WAN on, NAT on, DHCP on, DNS everything set to automatic and default when it is wifi router mode. But it is setting up it's own separate network and doesn’t seem to be communicating through to the Bell network and vice versa to pass internet traffic. Thank you in advance for any help you could provide! I’m new to networking and looking forward to learning.

« Last Edit: September 21, 2022, 11:20:19 am by edy »
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Offline edy

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Just to add… I have a Linksys smart wifi router at work also connected behind a Hitron cable modem. It has no problem connecting to the internet. The parental controls work, it was as simple as plugging it in. The local LAN the Linksys wifi router exists on is on 192.168.1.x and the stuff connected directly to the Hitron cable modem wifi is all on 192.168.2.x. I can access both no problem. When I connect to the Linksys I’m able to get to my settings for the Hitron modem at 192.168.2.1 and settings for the Linksys at 192.168.1.1 and also 192.162.2.162 (it’s IP assigned on the Hitron modem) and I can browse internet no issues whatsoever. When I’m connected to the Hitron via wifi I cannot get to the Linksys modem at 192.168.1.1 and it also won’t let me get to 192.168.2.162. I’m assuming that’s a feature of the Hitron wifi modem to prevent people using the wifi from trying to hack into other devices on the network… it will only pass traffic out to internet when on the Hitron wifi. :-//
« Last Edit: September 21, 2022, 01:34:28 pm by edy »
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Offline SL4P

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My first question is… Why have two routers ?
If your plan is well designed, in most cases a single decent router will handle 90% of typical domestic requirements.

If the Bell is a modem AND router, you have two choices - replace it with a standalone modem, and carry on, or just disable it’s firewall/router, and use a real router to do the important work.

The idea of a single integrated modem/router/access point ‘gateway’ imposes a lot of limitations, but makes it simple for unskilled customers.
Don't ask a question if you aren't willing to listen to the answer.
 
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Offline edy

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Thanks for replying. The Bell home hub is a DSL modem provided by our telephone company with our monthly internet service. It does not seem to have much in the way of configurability and the software in it is extremely sluggish. It is dated 2017. I don’t necessarily need 2 routers either so I will look to see if there is any way to disable it.

As I mentioned earlier at work I have a HiTron cable modem/wifi and then have another the Linksys  wifi/router plugged in and it seems to be giving us no issues with traffic on the Linksys going through the HiTron and out on to the internet. I figure it’s this Bell DSL home hub that is giving me problems.

Note from the attached screenshots that the ASUS wifi router seems to “see” the internet as it’s claiming connectivity but yet nothing gets through.
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Offline edy

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I’ve looked through every option the Bell home hub 2000 (see photo attached) and haven’t found any way to really change most of the configurations, certainly nothing close to my Hitron cable modem at home. This Bell device is an all-in-one designed to be simple for home users. It handles internet and TV.

However I have another possible solution although not what I was looking for. I can set the ASUS to access point mode, it will connect to internet no problem but then I lose parental control options on it. However I get all kids devices to connect Wifi to it and then use the scheduler in the Bell modem to cut the entire router on/off. This way I have a master switch for all of them. Otherwise the Bell modem scheduler does let you do individual device scheduling but it is a pain, even with grouping devices. A single switch on/off of the entire ASUS access point may be easier. That’s a really dumb inefficient way but I don’t have a better option as long as I’m stuck with this Bell modem? Unless there is someone who knows how to get around this.

What I don’t understand is why parental control on the ASUS turns off when using  Access point mode? It should still let you schedule items that connect to it’s own Wifi, why wouldn’t it allow that feature?
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Offline SL4P

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I didn’t look into it any deeper, but it certainly looks like your Bell box is an entry level ‘gateway’, which includes modem, router and access point. Not unusual, but very limited in its routing capabilities.

If you can put it into ‘bridge mode’ it loses the router/AP functionality - and just becomes a modem.
Then you can use your newer gadgets to serve your house.

This where and why the carriers tried to dumb it down for mainstream consumers,
It’s like an all-in-one computer or hifi system… at some point you’re going to want more than what comes in the box.
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Offline Hogwild

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Offline bw2341

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Something about the ASUS is not normal. It is either misconfigured or broken. In Wireless Router Mode, it should behave similarly to the Linksys and allow you to browse the internet from a connected device. Try a factory reset and redo the initial installation settings. Delete the WiFi settings for the ASUS on your client device and start again. Try a wired Ethernet connection to the ASUS from a client device.

If you still can’t browse the Internet, return it to the seller for a refund.
 
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Offline edy

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Thanks for the advice. I’ll try. At this moment I noticed a strange behaviour. I connected via wifi to the ASUS (which is in Wifi router mode) and was able to browse YouTube but no other website?!? I opened up a terminal and tried to ping a few sites and it is showing 40-50% packet loss but can ping other sites. But when I’m in Chrome browser I can only see YouTube.

[Edit:] Ok so I tried with my iPhone to connect to ASUS wifi and couldn’t connect to anything including YouTube. Then I went back to my laptop and now not working again either.

I also used the actual ASUS network analysis tool in the router and pinged a bunch of sites and it was able to get through and showed 0% packet loss. This is using ASUS router’s built-in network tools page. But when I do that and go through my terminal and try pinging same it is hit or miss. Sometimes works and most times doesn’t. Interestingly it is able to resolve the domain name, I always see an IP associated with the ping request.
« Last Edit: September 25, 2022, 02:28:06 pm by edy »
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Offline bw2341

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It seems crazy to me that the ASUS status page shows a proper connection in Wireless Router Mode. The fact that everything works in Access Point Mode rules out a hardware problem with the WiFi and the WAN Ethernet port. The parental controls not working in Access Point Mode is probably normal. It looks like it is emulating a standalone Wireless Access Point. A WAP is only used to physically connect wireless clients to the wired network. An upstream router is needed to manage the clients.

The only thing that makes sense to me is if the router is used and not new-in-box. Maybe there are obscure advanced settings such as VPN, proxies or DMZ blocking the traffic. But these should all be erased if you pushed the hardware reset button.

You could also check your clients for atypical network settings. I would also remove any ASUS apps for managing the router and use the router's webpage. I personally would have given up on the ASUS at this point and moved on to something else. If the Bell Home Hub 2000 has sufficient granularity in the access controls, it might be worth using even if the interface is annoying. It would be a one-time annoyance anyways unless you were buying new gadgets for the kids every week.

For Hogwild, that link at dslreports refers to FTTH service on a different modem. It's for serious networking enthusiasts who wanted to get the full speed from that generation of hardware. It doesn't matter now since the current HH4000 has a 10g Ethernet port. Avoiding the Bell hardware might be cool for enthusiasts but it precludes subscribing to Bell TV. Besides, any Bell customer who wants a direct connection for their own router can use PPPoE passthrough with their DSL username/password.
 
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Online jonpaul

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Re: Need help configuring Wifi router behind a Bell Home Hub internet wifi modem
« Reply #10 on: September 26, 2022, 04:19:54 am »
Most DSL and cable modems with combination router can be managed in " bridge mode"

That eliminates the internal junk router and wifi, so the ethernet has direct internet access

Get a modern router like Linksys WRT1900AHC, update the FW, you get much better firewall
, network config etc

Finally check open source FW like DDWRT if exists for the router.

We used bridge configuration with Motorola Cable modem at 100 MBS in USA, and the Linksys mentioned, for years.

Situation should be similar in Canada

Jon
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Offline bw2341

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Re: Need help configuring Wifi router behind a Bell Home Hub internet wifi modem
« Reply #11 on: September 27, 2022, 12:24:57 am »
While it might make sense for advanced users to try alternate hardware, the OP's Bell TV service makes it difficult or impossible.

Bell TV in this case is a traditional linear TV service with WiFi connected set-top boxes. The setup and configuration is not user accessible. By regulation, the set-top boxes are not nomadic and cannot be used on an Internet connection outside the service address.

Whatever technological method used to enforce this is hidden from the customer so reverse engineering a solution just to use an alternate modem does not make sense.
« Last Edit: September 27, 2022, 12:26:59 am by bw2341 »
 

Offline edy

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Ok everybody, thanks for all the help! I followed your suggestions and did a "factory reset" on the advanced settings page and after it booted me off I went to sleep. When I woke up I forgot about it and basically left it alone almost a week. Today I was browsing on my phone for a few hours and by chance noticed I was actually connected to the ASUS Wifi (192.168.50.x) instead of the BELL Modem Wifi (192.168.2.x), and there was no problem at all!!!!  :-+  I connected my laptop to the ASUS Wifi and now I'm typing this post!  :-+ I'm also able to access my Bell Home Hub at 192.168.2.1 while I'm on my ASUS Wifi. I enabled "login from WAN" on the ASUS and so if I'm on the Bell Wifi I can access my router at it's IP on the Bell modem/router at https://192.168.2.93:8443 (default port 8443 for the login screen). This is exactly what I was expecting and what I experienced out of the box with my Linksys at work.

So basically I think the ASUS router was returned and repacked by the store, and some settings may have been screwed up. Something definitely was wrong with it out of the box. What a freakin' waste of time trying to figure this out.  :palm:   Anyways I'm glad it's resolved, I thought I lost my mind there for a second, and I didn't really want to return it.  :-DD Thank you all for your help. I've never encountered this before and didn't imagine that a store-bought brand new device all wrapped in plastic would behave like this, so I assumed something was faulty with either the ASUS or the way my Bell Home Hub handles routers. You live, you learn!
« Last Edit: October 04, 2022, 04:48:33 am by edy »
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Offline edy

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TO COMPLICATE MATTERS:    |O    :palm:

So turns out that on my Ubuntu laptop (22.04 jammy) depending on whether I fresh boot or resume (from hibernation) and move to a different location or switch WiFi, there is something up with the systemd-resolved service which causes a loss of the DNS function (or it's pointing to the wrong DNS and not refreshing it). This added some more craziness to the situation which I could not explain, as my iPhone and other devices had no issues connecting to the internet once I factory-reset the ASUS WiFi router, yet my laptop was *still* having sporadic issues.

My laptop was able to ping specific IP's and I was able to use VNC to connect to work (because I direct it to a static IP) yet it could not resolve any domain names so I couldn't browse typical websites by name. At first I thought something was up again with the ASUS router but nope, it's my linux machine! After a reboot the service seems to have corrected itself. Just a coincidence, maybe some bug introduced in recent upgrade at same time as I got the router, or a problem already there that I just didn't notice until I started to change my network.
« Last Edit: October 07, 2022, 06:28:12 pm by edy »
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Offline Hogwild

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For Hogwild, that link at dslreports refers to FTTH service on a different modem. It's for serious networking enthusiasts who wanted to get the full speed from that generation of hardware. It doesn't matter now since the current HH4000 has a 10g Ethernet port. Avoiding the Bell hardware might be cool for enthusiasts but it precludes subscribing to Bell TV. Besides, any Bell customer who wants a direct connection for their own router can use PPPoE passthrough with their DSL username/password.


Mmm...I see your point. However, I'm pretty sure I saw somewhere a workaround for using your own gear while still being able to get Bell TV. I can't remember where, though. I think it was just some VLAN settings.
 

Online Ed.Kloonk

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TO COMPLICATE MATTERS:    |O    :palm:

So turns out that on my Ubuntu laptop (22.04 jammy) depending on whether I fresh boot or resume (from hibernation) and move to a different location or switch WiFi, there is something up with the systemd-resolved service which causes a loss of the DNS function (or it's pointing to the wrong DNS and not refreshing it). This added some more craziness to the situation which I could not explain, as my iPhone and other devices had no issues connecting to the internet once I factory-reset the ASUS WiFi router, yet my laptop was *still* having sporadic issues.

My laptop was able to ping specific IP's and I was able to use VNC to connect to work (because I direct it to a static IP) yet it could not resolve any domain names so I couldn't browse typical websites by name. At first I thought something was up again with the ASUS router but nope, it's my linux machine! After a reboot the service seems to have corrected itself. Just a coincidence, maybe some bug introduced in recent upgrade at same time as I got the router, or a problem already there that I just didn't notice until I started to change my network.

Were you able to solve this?

Does restarting the network service on the lappy fix it, rather than rebooting?
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