Author Topic: RJ45 CAT6 crimp - is this one reliable?  (Read 2797 times)

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Offline DrirrTopic starter

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RJ45 CAT6 crimp - is this one reliable?
« on: December 01, 2022, 06:25:16 pm »
Hi,
I am trying to crimp shielded RJ45 connectors (CAT6, S/FTP, 23AWG)
All wires "jumped" to right side - as you can see in the picture.
Is this "ok"?  I do not think so...
I used to crimp CAT5E unshielded cables, but all wires were centered.
Any idea what to do/check? Should I buy RJ45 from different manufacturer? What can be wrong?

 

Offline DrirrTopic starter

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Re: RJ45 CAT6 crimp - is this one reliable?
« Reply #1 on: December 02, 2022, 08:42:46 pm »
So the problem was bad connector, bought from different manufacturer and problem is gone
 

Offline wraper

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Re: RJ45 CAT6 crimp - is this one reliable?
« Reply #2 on: December 02, 2022, 09:14:19 pm »
I'm quite certain connector is good. The issue is there are two connector types, for solid wire and for stranded wire. I've seen plenty of times connectors for stranded wires crimped on solid wires.
 

Offline DrirrTopic starter

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Re: RJ45 CAT6 crimp - is this one reliable?
« Reply #3 on: December 05, 2022, 08:11:29 am »
Both connectors were specified for solid wire. The difference is, that first one was "universal" for wire diameter 0,8-1,5mm (including isolation). It is better not to buy universal RJ-45. New one was 1mm diameter max.
 

Offline BTO

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Re: RJ45 CAT6 crimp - is this one reliable?
« Reply #4 on: May 15, 2023, 03:41:28 pm »
Ok first of all
- You are not Crimping (let's dispense with bad habits)  You are TERMINATING , it's technically a COMPRESSION connector
   but certainly not a crimp connector (Look up the definition of CRIMPING)  this is not it

  What happens when you terminate a connector is , the gold plated blades cut into the cable and form A TERMINATION (A conductive path)
  there is no crimping

- RJ45 is the wrong term to use as it refers to the Jack (Registered Jack 45), What you have here is a MODULAR PLUG or 8P8C Connector

- does it look good ?
No.. firstly i can see that the gold connectors are not lined up properly,  likely you didn't compress it hard enough

- Secondly, it doesn't look like you have the colouring scheme correct

LOOK AT THIS
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category_5_cable

You want to be using  T568A WIRING DIAGRAM
(The one where the orange and Orange/White are not together) but all other pairs are with their corresponding whites

as for the shield (well, you need a shielded Modular plug) if the plug doesn't have a metal ground then there was no point to buy
a STP (shielded Twisted Pair) Cable, in which case you can just cut the foil away and not use it

You also need to buy a modular plug that is suited to CAT6 and (i'm assuming you have SOLID CORE Cable) suitable for solid core cable

that's what i can see wrong with it

also you can end up buying crappy termination tools
when you buy it, compress it very slowly and WATCH THE TEETH COME DOWN
if they wiggle on the way down, don't buy it
if they come straight down , then it's ok
a lot of the time when they wiggle they will not make good contact with the pins on the modular plug and they'll bend them out of shape
« Last Edit: May 15, 2023, 03:43:12 pm by BTO »
QUESTION EVERYTHING!!!
 
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Offline EPAIII

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Re: RJ45 CAT6 crimp - is this one reliable?
« Reply #5 on: June 29, 2023, 09:51:06 am »
Actually that type of connector is called Insulation Displacement.

The wire, with the insulation still on it, is driven into a Vee shaped notch in the terminal. The sides of that Vee drive (displace) the insulation aside and reach down to the wire which is slightly deformed or pinched as it is forced into that notch. This makes a gas tight connection.

This technology was, I believe, pioneered by the phone companies with their wide use of type 66 and type 110 punch down terminal blocks. It was both faster to install and far more reliable in long term use than screw terminals. Before VoIP became the norm, virtually every phone call went through many of these terminal blocks. And who knows, perhaps they still do.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/66_block
« Last Edit: June 29, 2023, 09:53:50 am by EPAIII »
Paul A.  -   SE Texas
And if you look REAL close at an analog signal,
You will find that it has discrete steps.
 

Online nctnico

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Re: RJ45 CAT6 crimp - is this one reliable?
« Reply #6 on: July 09, 2023, 08:19:00 pm »
LOOK AT THIS
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category_5_cable

You want to be using  T568A WIRING DIAGRAM
(The one where the orange and Orange/White are not together) but all other pairs are with their corresponding whites
NO! T568B is most commonly used. Go to a shop and check any random ethernet cable.

To the OP:

Judging from your picture you are using crappy connectors and crap tools.

Where it comes to crimping RJ45 connectors:
1) Buy  A-brand quality connectors that are suitable for the type of wire you are using. There are connectors that can be used on solid wires only, stranded wires only or both solid and stranded. Molex 0449150021 is suitable for both stranded and solid wires. Using the wrong connector will result in poor contact or the effect shown in the photo

2) Use a steel ratchet style crimper that moves straight up. Not like a closing jaw because the pressure will be uneven (or not enough).
« Last Edit: July 09, 2023, 08:22:10 pm by nctnico »
There are small lies, big lies and then there is what is on the screen of your oscilloscope.
 

Offline wraper

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Re: RJ45 CAT6 crimp - is this one reliable?
« Reply #7 on: July 10, 2023, 12:38:52 am »
LOOK AT THIS
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category_5_cable

You want to be using  T568A WIRING DIAGRAM
(The one where the orange and Orange/White are not together) but all other pairs are with their corresponding whites
NO! T568B is most commonly used. Go to a shop and check any random ethernet cable.
It does not even matter which one you use if both ends are the same. And if they are different it still does not matter. The only reason both pinouts exist is due to early devices needing either straight or crossover cable depending on what was connected to what. But it's not the case for nearly anything made in last 20 years.
 

Offline connectTek

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Re: RJ45 CAT6 crimp - is this one reliable?
« Reply #8 on: August 27, 2023, 07:09:01 am »
In Australia 568A is used most commonly.
 

Offline Veteran68

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Re: RJ45 CAT6 crimp - is this one reliable?
« Reply #9 on: August 28, 2023, 12:20:54 pm »
A bit of a necro post, but yes in the US (North America?) T568B is the predominant standard by far these days. It's extremely rare to come across a T568A cable now, unless it's really old or you're looking at one end of a crossover cable (also becoming rare these days).

T568A was preferred (and initially standardized by ANSI) years ago for construction due to backwards compatibility with common POTS wiring for phones and faxes. More recent standards have dropped that requirement as such POTS installations are becoming less and less prevalent.

That said, as others point out, it really doesn't matter as long as both ends match for a straight through cable. You could make up your own color scheme and keep it the same on both ends and it would work, though you'd still want to be sure to separate the RX pair to minimize crosstalk interference. However it would for sure annoy the next network technician or electrician to come along and try to figure out what's going on from a visual inspection of the cable. The standards are easily recognizable by experienced installers.
 

Offline wraper

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Re: RJ45 CAT6 crimp - is this one reliable?
« Reply #10 on: August 28, 2023, 12:25:58 pm »
You could make up your own color scheme and keep it the same on both ends and it would work, though you'd still want to be sure to separate the RX pair to minimize crosstalk interference. However it would for sure annoy the next network technician or electrician to come along and try to figure out what's going on from a visual inspection of the cable. The standards are easily recognizable by experienced installers.
You can swap colors but allocation of twisted pairs must remain exactly the same, otherwise it won't work.
 

Offline bitwelder

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Re: RJ45 CAT6 crimp - is this one reliable?
« Reply #11 on: August 28, 2023, 12:36:07 pm »

T568A was preferred (and initially standardized by ANSI) years ago for construction due to backwards compatibility with common POTS wiring for phones and faxes. More recent standards have dropped that requirement as such POTS installations are becoming less and less prevalent.
So ok, initially T568A was preferrred for compatibility reasons. Was there a motivation to start preferring instead T568B when the recommandation for POTS was dropped, if it became the most common standard?
 

Offline Veteran68

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Re: RJ45 CAT6 crimp - is this one reliable?
« Reply #12 on: August 28, 2023, 12:52:54 pm »
You could make up your own color scheme and keep it the same on both ends and it would work, though you'd still want to be sure to separate the RX pair to minimize crosstalk interference. However it would for sure annoy the next network technician or electrician to come along and try to figure out what's going on from a visual inspection of the cable. The standards are easily recognizable by experienced installers.
You can swap colors but allocation of twisted pairs must remain exactly the same, otherwise it won't work.

Well, define "work." :)  The pairs are only twisted for noise mitigation. So up to a certain length, speed, and noise level it would likely work whether the pairs were split or not. You probably wouldn't get reliable 1000Mbps+ out of it, but 10-100Mbps could work over short distances (as in patch cables) as long as all colors were carried straight through.


T568A was preferred (and initially standardized by ANSI) years ago for construction due to backwards compatibility with common POTS wiring for phones and faxes. More recent standards have dropped that requirement as such POTS installations are becoming less and less prevalent.
So ok, initially T568A was preferrred for compatibility reasons. Was there a motivation to start preferring instead T568B when the recommandation for POTS was dropped, if it became the most common standard?

Honestly I'm not sure why the preference changed. I remember reading some time ago about the T568A compatibility reasons, but not why over time people seemed to intentionally move to T568B.  A quick Google came up with this article that mentions the initial logic behind T568A but not the reason for the switch.

https://www.truecable.com/blogs/cable-academy/t568a-vs-t568b

Quote
As of 2018, ANSI/TIA still recommends T568A for residential installations for plug-in backward compatibility with old technology like fax machines or a plug-in base station for wireless phone handsets. If you are not using any such devices, or have no intention of plugging ancient RJ11 plugs into RJ45 wall jacks like you would a “phone jack”, then it comes back to personal preference again. In reality, just how many people are using this old equipment any longer? I personally switched over to cell phones in 2006 and have not looked back. 

In the past, specifically with the old TIA/EIA 568-B-2 revision written and ratified around 2001, this recommendation was different for commercial and US government spaces. TIA recommended T568A at that time and further notated US government contracts require T568A. This was to maintain backward compatibility with older equipment like in the residential space (fax machines, etc.) As of the “D” revision, this is no longer the case and that recommendation and notation have been removed. The ANSI/TIA 568.2-D commercial standard is now mute on the subject unless you have a contractual or technical reason to go with one or the other. There is a warning in the commercial standard about making certain that both ends of the cable are terminated to the same scheme. In other words, pick one and stick with it.

EDIT: Now that I think about it (obviously I haven't up to this point, LOL), I'm not sure why a RJ11 POTS connection wouldn't be compatible with either standard. RJ11 only used the middle two conductors, both of which are the same blue pair in T568A and T568B? RJ14 added the outer two conductors which are the orange pair on T568B and the green pair in T568A, but as long as both ends of the building wiring were terminated that way it should still work, I would think.
« Last Edit: August 28, 2023, 01:01:04 pm by Veteran68 »
 

Offline wraper

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Re: RJ45 CAT6 crimp - is this one reliable?
« Reply #13 on: August 28, 2023, 01:12:30 pm »
You could make up your own color scheme and keep it the same on both ends and it would work, though you'd still want to be sure to separate the RX pair to minimize crosstalk interference. However it would for sure annoy the next network technician or electrician to come along and try to figure out what's going on from a visual inspection of the cable. The standards are easily recognizable by experienced installers.
You can swap colors but allocation of twisted pairs must remain exactly the same, otherwise it won't work.

Well, define "work." :)  The pairs are only twisted for noise mitigation. So up to a certain length, speed, and noise level it would likely work whether the pairs were split or not. You probably wouldn't get reliable 1000Mbps+ out of it, but 10-100Mbps could work over short distances (as in patch cables) as long as all colors were carried straight through.
Have you ever heard about transmission lines and controlled impedance? It will probably work up to meter or two but that's it.
 

Offline Veteran68

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Re: RJ45 CAT6 crimp - is this one reliable?
« Reply #14 on: August 28, 2023, 02:28:25 pm »
Have you ever heard about transmission lines and controlled impedance? It will probably work up to meter or two but that's it.

Yes I have, and I also stated it would likely work with low bandwidth over short lengths, as in patch cables. I'm not suggesting people do it, I'm simply stating there's nothing "magic" about the color sequence that makes it work. Obviously the twisted pairs are there for a reason and should be used as such.
 

Offline bw2341

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Re: RJ45 CAT6 crimp - is this one reliable?
« Reply #15 on: August 29, 2023, 04:26:14 pm »
EDIT: Now that I think about it (obviously I haven't up to this point, LOL), I'm not sure why a RJ11 POTS connection wouldn't be compatible with either standard. RJ11 only used the middle two conductors, both of which are the same blue pair in T568A and T568B? RJ14 added the outer two conductors which are the orange pair on T568B and the green pair in T568A, but as long as both ends of the building wiring were terminated that way it should still work, I would think.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category_5_cable
It looks like you swapped orange and green in your text. Pins 3 and 6 are orange on T568A and green on T568B.

If you look at the tables, there is a column for Pair. On both tables, the orange pair is Pair 2 and green is Pair 3.

So, the most likely reason for POTS preference for T568A is that a typical installation will have the correct colour codes for the first and second phone lines. If the existing wiring was T568B, phone line 2 would end up on the green which is pair 3.

 


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