Author Topic: DOS vs. Linux  (Read 11678 times)

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Online Nominal Animal

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Re: DOS vs. Linux
« Reply #150 on: June 11, 2021, 03:45:43 am »
In the past, userspace tools for loading and examining Linux kernel modules was called modprobe, provided by module-init-tools package.
For easier maintenance, kmod (and libkmod) was extracted from the Linux kernel, and is now used to provide modprobe.

(This is the background, and explains why the path is called /etc/modprobe.d/, but the tool that reports an error is libkmod.
Again, I'm not sure what these types of "errors" mean.
Your old kernel module blacklist file, /etc/modprobe.d/blacklist-ideapad.conf, uses syntax that was supported by old modprobe tools, but not the new kmod-based modprobe.  The new kmod-based modprobe didn't abort, only told you it would ignore those lines.

This file was used by old Linux distributions to work around BIOS/EFI/driver issues in some Lenovo Ideapads; at least some Legion Y720 backlight related issues.  Essentially, it told modprobe to not load certain drivers even if probing indicated the hardware supported by those drives is present.

Does this mean the update didn't get done correctly, is it an error that retried and eventually succeeded, etc...?
Like it says, the lines libkmod could not understand were ignored.  No operation was aborted or stopped; it just kept going.

So, if that file is used at all (and as far as I know, it is only used on Ideapads), some of the blacklisting rules are no longer enforced.
Does it matter?  Well, is it an ideapad?  Do all functions work?  Did the upgrade process remove the file (as it does not exist on most current Linux distributions anymore, I believe)?

If that file no longer exists, it did not matter even a tiny bit; it was just noise.  If your machine is not an ideapad, and the file still exists, you might get those warnings again later; you could just delete the file (although I'd check package manager which package owns the file, and if a config/data-only package, see if I could remove it without any side effects).

Updating a Linux distribution often works well, but sometimes this kind of "old configuration file that is no longer needed or conforms to current tools" issues do crop up.  They are not dangerous, just annoying.  Because of these, and accumulation of packages what were really only needed during a certain time period, not before or after, but the dependencies are circular or so complex the package manager does not autodetect they can be deleted already,  I like to occasionally (every couple of years) reinstall a new distribution.  I usually do a bit of testing first among the alternatives, to see which one is – maintenance/package selection wise – going in a direction I like.
It is easiest to do if you can easily swap storage media (SSD, HDD), so you can always go back if you decide the old one was better.
 

Online magic

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Re: DOS vs. Linux
« Reply #151 on: June 11, 2021, 08:45:38 am »
The transition to kmod appears to have happened over five years ago and I'm not aware of any legitimate syntax of the old tool that wouldn't work today or that would start with 'k', 'l', or 'nnn'.

https://git.kernel.org/pub/scm/utils/kernel/module-init-tools/module-init-tools.git/tree/doc/modprobe.conf.sgml

IMO the whole blacklist file is borked for some reason.
 

Offline netmonk

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Re: DOS vs. Linux
« Reply #152 on: June 11, 2021, 09:35:32 am »
...
EVERY SINGLE RESPONSIBLE SYS ADMIN ...
sleeps with a PERL cook book under the pillow..
...

Well after 20 years doing sysadmin in critical business, i just discover i'm an Irresponsible Sys Admin.
Never touched a line of perl in 20 years of Sysadmin, and for mental hygien it will be the same until the end.
Like Java, but that's another topic :)
 
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Online Nominal Animal

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Re: DOS vs. Linux
« Reply #153 on: June 11, 2021, 09:43:13 am »
I was trying to recall if one of the distros provided a blacklist-ideapad.conf that used a nonstandard comment separator that worked with original modprobe (even though as an undocumented feature), but not with the new one.  I think so, but that's just a very vague itch at the back of my mind; we'd need to see that file to be sure.
 

Online Nominal Animal

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Re: DOS vs. Linux
« Reply #154 on: June 11, 2021, 09:51:04 am »
Never touched a line of perl in 20 years of Sysadmin, and for mental hygien it will be the same until the end.
I got PTSD from trying to maintain and extend a certain Perl-based groupware around the turn of the century, for a couple of years.  Full of slightly modified copy-paste code, no real design, as stuff just ... agglomerated together.  For any important Perl expression, the most obscure and obtuse one was invariably chosen.  I don't know if it was a job-security thing the original developers did that or what, but that was absolutely a maintenance hell.  I so wanted to rewrite it from scratch!

I still don't like to touch Perl at all.

In fact, I just checked, and the sources are still available at SourceForge, untouched for almost two decades... I am tempted to download the sources and see if it really is as bad as I remember, but for the sake of my mental health, I better not.

(No, not actual PTSD.  Just memories of frustration and cursing the developers for just slapping things together with spit and bubblegum, and leaving bug fixing for others to worry about.)
« Last Edit: June 11, 2021, 09:53:24 am by Nominal Animal »
 

Offline bostonman

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Re: DOS vs. Linux
« Reply #155 on: June 11, 2021, 01:24:37 pm »
In the defense of Linux, Windows updates are less informative. At least Linux shows line-by-line as it updates, however, I guess with so much information, it causes more questions.

 

Offline dunkemhigh

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Re: DOS vs. Linux
« Reply #156 on: June 11, 2021, 02:05:01 pm »
Quote
I guess with so much information, it causes more questions

Indeed. If you get used to seeing that stuff you'll ignore the one actual important line. But where does the problem originate in this example? The parser is working correctly by saying it's ignoring those lines (that's a valid warning and might be imortant - the user of the util can only decide that). The higher level stuff seeing those warning should pass them on since they are warnings, etc. No-one is really responsible for saying "Yes, that's perfectly benign". So perhaps the fix here is to actually fix the source of the warning, which isn't the util but the configuration file.
 

Offline PKTKS

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Re: DOS vs. Linux
« Reply #157 on: June 11, 2021, 03:13:47 pm »

I still don't like to touch Perl at all.



I am in quite the opposite side...

I deal with PERL since the 90s - and it took me quite a while
to master a reasonable degree of comfort.. 

I am not close to the experts but I am pretty clear in a state
where I can say that PERL it the most competent
and clever language to do SysAdmin.

But!! not only that. Once you manage enough .. you will be
so easy going that PERL can actually do anything SHELL
and Object related in GTK QT Wx Curses or whatever you imagine

There is literally EVERYTHING in CPAN ready and PDL per si
is way above anything numeric as of today.

so IMHO - there is nothing even close to PERL as it is
very next to the OS layer and way above smart to do things..

but it takes some time and effort.
Paul
« Last Edit: June 11, 2021, 04:44:11 pm by PKTKS »
 

Online Nominal Animal

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Re: DOS vs. Linux
« Reply #158 on: June 11, 2021, 04:22:46 pm »
but it takes some time and effort.
Yeah, I've used a hammer to hammer in screws, so I know what you're talking about.

Me, I'm not that keen on any particular hammer.  I like screwdrivers, adhesives, wood joints, pegs, bolts, welding too.
 
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Offline PKTKS

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Re: DOS vs. Linux
« Reply #159 on: June 11, 2021, 04:32:13 pm »
but it takes some time and effort.
Yeah, I've used a hammer to hammer in screws, so I know what you're talking about.

Me, I'm not that keen on any particular hammer.  I like screwdrivers, adhesives, wood joints, pegs, bolts, welding too.

nahhh  may be .. just may be a steep step to jump in PERL

to be really comfortable in such a wide powerful environ..

But once that initial steep step is done..

There will be no doubt that PERL is some order of magnitudes
ahead other alternatives.. 

I agree with you.. the initial thing is not soft.
More like a slap on the brain

Paul
« Last Edit: June 11, 2021, 04:44:32 pm by PKTKS »
 

Offline Marco

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Re: DOS vs. Linux
« Reply #160 on: June 11, 2021, 04:40:32 pm »
Hell is other people's Perl.
 

Offline PKTKS

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Re: DOS vs. Linux
« Reply #161 on: June 11, 2021, 04:45:33 pm »
Hell is other people's Perl.

Whole shit.. you just made me aware I ve been
type typo'ing   PEARL in PERL..

what a kid keyboard... shit ... fixed.  ::)

But you are absolutely right..
the best logic of one brain is not for the other..

and PERL allows just any possible brain logic to be expressed

agreed.
Paul
« Last Edit: June 11, 2021, 04:49:24 pm by PKTKS »
 


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