Author Topic: Idea For Laser Soldering  (Read 6235 times)

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Online tggzzz

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Re: Idea For Laser Soldering
« Reply #25 on: October 03, 2024, 03:40:37 pm »
I am a bit confused about the safety issue. Both low cost and very expensive commercial style machines or desktop boxes are sold everywhere, safety is included, be it chinglish manual with pair of glasses, to commercial booths.

Eye safety is a complex subject; confusion is normal.

Many dangerous items are sold online, including direct to consumers. Amazon and Aliexpress mutter the right words to deflect legal blame from themselves, and do little to prevent such sales. Why would they: they can't be sued. :(

Quote
I think we all get the safety issues.

That's a not uncommon statement on this forum, and elsewhere. It is so common there's a standard figurative saying: "famous last words". https://www.phrases.org.uk/meanings/famous-last-words.html

It's accuracy is, in general, open to question.
There are lies, damned lies, statistics - and ADC/DAC specs.
Glider pilot's aphorism: "there is no substitute for span". Retort: "There is a substitute: skill+imagination. But you can buy span".
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Offline LaserSteve

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Re: Idea For Laser Soldering
« Reply #26 on: October 03, 2024, 04:28:28 pm »
So I just watched four videos on Youtube:

Method 1, Apply adsorbent metal or say black Boron Carbide mask over part and radiant heat the solder paste.

Method 2, Robotic placement of laser beam and use the fact that solder paste has organic adsorbent in it, at least until the flux boils away.
                which as I suspect, means you're not doing remelt with this technique.  Cook the flux, not the metal. 

Method 3.  Attach fiber optic pen with cheap jacketed but unarmored fiber to stereo microscope. DO NOT add safety shutters or wear safety glasses when using instrument.
                             Thats "aided viewing" of a laser source, and that was found early on to be one of the best possible ways to destroy your eyes with a laser, even a very
                        low power one.  Akin to staring at the laser spot with a high power telescope.   

                           You do not want to get me started on FAP/FC-Bar in operation without a flexible metal jacket in operation in a flexable cable without shielding. Get below the minimum bend radius on the fiber, the fiber WILL break, that energy will go somewhere.

-------------------------------

Of the videos I saw, NONE of those machines would be allowable in the US on under 21 CFR 1040.J , NONE in the EU, None in any of the CIS countries, None under Chinas new code, and here an unguarded, non interlocked laser, let alone one with "Aided Viewing", would have CDRH and OSHA both making your life miserable with recalls and fines if sold into commerce

Surgical Microscopes, Opthalmic Microscopes, and Laser Confocal, Laser raman scattering microscopes in labs all have multiple safety filters and redundant highly reliable shutters for a very good reason.


Yes, valid for certain niche uses, maybe.  But the "time to successful joint" is just as long if not far longer then using a conventional iron. Really, cook the flux and melt a matte powder?  Marginal utility, and lots of chance for error.  Not going to do rework with this.

 Again, don't build a handheld.   Just don't...   

OH, and its not just eyes.  CCDs fry easily. Many lose pixels at 10-15 mW into the camera lens. Rave Party camera destruction is well documented on Youtube / Photonlexiicon.com.

Steve 




               
« Last Edit: October 03, 2024, 06:33:46 pm by LaserSteve »
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Offline Randy222Topic starter

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Re: Idea For Laser Soldering
« Reply #27 on: October 03, 2024, 06:40:24 pm »
You are trying to nix a DIY project (DIY) because you think safety cannot be made?

Why optical noculars at all, I would use a camera and watch everything on a display. If a cam CCD burns up because of a "stray" reflection, ok, install a new CCD and use a better filter next time.
Perhaps a small box and the thing won't fire unless the translucent door is closed.

Many people use sharp knives, use lawn mowers wearing flip flops, without regard to safety, we should ban knives and mowers too. Lost eye, missing fingers and toes, OMG, what has the world come to. ;)

e bay has many used Coherent diode fiber units for sale, gonna get one or two to test with. Hard to find the blue ones though, ~800nm seems to be popular, but 30 or 40w might be enough. Will get my optics as needed from Edmund.
 

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Re: Idea For Laser Soldering
« Reply #28 on: October 03, 2024, 07:44:31 pm »
You are trying to nix a DIY project (DIY) because you think safety cannot be made?

Why optical noculars at all, I would use a camera and watch everything on a display. If a cam CCD burns up because of a "stray" reflection, ok, install a new CCD and use a better filter next time.
Perhaps a small box and the thing won't fire unless the translucent door is closed.

Many people use sharp knives, use lawn mowers wearing flip flops, without regard to safety, we should ban knives and mowers too. Lost eye, missing fingers and toes, OMG, what has the world come to. ;)

e bay has many used Coherent diode fiber units for sale, gonna get one or two to test with. Hard to find the blue ones though, ~800nm seems to be popular, but 30 or 40w might be enough. Will get my optics as needed from Edmund.

The only thing he - and others - are trying to "nix" is premature blindness.

When people misuse sharp knives and somebody else is hurt, the community takes action against the perpetrator. Quite right too.

Please ensure that nobody other than yourself is within direct or indirect line of sight when your experiments are powered up.

I hope you are as competent as you think you are. Your statements and your tone lead me to suspect otherwise.
There are lies, damned lies, statistics - and ADC/DAC specs.
Glider pilot's aphorism: "there is no substitute for span". Retort: "There is a substitute: skill+imagination. But you can buy span".
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Offline thm_w

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Re: Idea For Laser Soldering
« Reply #29 on: October 03, 2024, 09:10:17 pm »
You are trying to nix a DIY project (DIY) because you think safety cannot be made?

Yeah I'm going to trust the highly experienced laser professional over you when it comes to safety.
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Offline LaserSteve

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Re: Idea For Laser Soldering
« Reply #30 on: October 03, 2024, 10:42:26 pm »
The highly experienced laser professional is actually also one of the better known Laser Hobbyists and has been so since he was a wet behind the ears newbie long ago.

   He's terrified by what he sees on Youtube, and in person, having been out doing very safe, carefully controlled laser shows and having idiots illuminate the Laserist or Artist (often himslf) with pointers that have a very high irradiance that are well beyond by a factor or 100 or more over what he considers to be safe in terms of  beam product.  Note I said product, a nonstandard term consisting of the diameter, divergence, peak power, continuous wave power, a measurement known as M Squared, distance, the size of his or other's pupil,  and if the beam is scanned, Q-Switched, Mode Locked, up collimated etc.  I have a very good model in my head of what it takes to  fatigue the eye, bleach the pigment, or actually do damage. I've also been hit while in a friends light plane, and by teenagers on a bridge when driving.  High power laser pointers are evil.  OZ's rules of approved devices only and customs confiscation are great.

When I was in my late teens, a female friend from high school, whose parents were stockholders of a marine life park company, got me the "dream job" on what in 1990s Dollars was a Three Million Dollar nightly attraction using lasers, pyro, water-skiers, fast boats, 70 mm water-screen  rear projection , water skiers, dancers, etc.    I was working on what then was the state of the art  in visible lasers at the park, and learned the hard way about the real hazard, human nature.   I had the system idling and detuned at a vary low power.  I had a lock-out tag out on the main key switch some 1500 feet away.  An Idiot, ie slightly older college student, came in and pulled off the Tagout, ignored the note taped over the key,  and booted the system. 

   My "safe", by the book,  setup turned into a nightmare as actuators moved on the beam-table with no warning, and I found myself with a tiny burn in the peripheral.  Like most people who gain eye damage in the workplace, I went though hell as my brain adapted the visual cortex to try to work around the damage.  It will try, but watching your vision try to remap the neural net in real  time for the few weeks is NOT fun.  Not too bad after all, it missed the Fovea and the Macula,  just for the rest of my life I've had to look more then most when walking / driving at Crosspoint's.  I wont see the truck that hits me, is sort of the true joke, and over decades it has cleaned up a bit.

Having three universities , a government depository library, and a medical school near by, I spent a lot of time learning about laser safety.   I'll spare you the details, but there are a bunch of laser professionals who have became expert in radiation safety due to preventable or unpreventablk eye injuries.  Of  The best in the word who is still living, got his burn while looking down the bore of  Argon Ion Laser that had a malfunctioing start timer.   

To counter that, there are carefully designed and highly regulated  laser based projectors that legally able to audience scan, and after a really long moratorium on outdoor laser shows, due to an "incident", I have also fought for your right to legally own lasers in the background.   I've said that to assure you I'm not some bitter jerk who had a whoopsie and never recovered, far from it.

  So here's what I know, at the risk of your continuing down the path based on giving you more information.    Diode lasers suck at diameter, divergence, beamquality, wavelength statbily, sensitivity to certain kinds of back reflection, and multimode diode lasers do not propagate  though fibers worth a damn. Which is why bundles and correcting optics are used.  In teh past ten years there have been some breakthroughs, but MOST (Not all)  high power diode lasers have a figure of merit (known as M^2) parameter that is horrible, and always above 2 or more. 

This means the collimated divergence is huge, the spot size is very large, it takes a far higher  power system to achievde what  a more expensive different type of laser can do. A factor known as Etendue comes into play.

So large amounts of high power fiber coupled diode laser lasers get dumped into surplus. A large amount of factory rejects due to wavelength problems during manufacturing are out there too. As are some overuns dumped on the market.  Very high power diode arrays are out there, and they are all the rage for folks who cannot afford what I refer to as "the Good Stuff". With the FCDL leakage and stray light are huge.

  Fiber Lasers are also dumped on the market, subsidized,  to capture Dollars into certain countries, but Dave and I would agree that would diverge into a hugely unpopular political discussion fast.
The regulatory agencies have other issues to cover, like industrial, illegal medical laser devices, illegal drugs, etc.  Believe it or not US Customs tries hard to catch the illegal imports, but there is little that can be done about the surplus market in the US.  The rules have simply not caught up.  You can buy a Five Megawatt laser easily, and legally. What you do with it is when the law kicks in.  Again, I diverge.

This provides the illusion that high power lasers and uncertified laser cutters  are inherently safe..  They are not.   

Being one of the early, and premier laser hobbyists had an odd side effect.  In the past, I would frequently get calls from Law Enforcement who would track me down on behalf of a physician or institution of higher learning, and patch in a phone call asking what to do after a retinal injury. These calls were often frantic, and the turth is, after administering steroids and a few other drugs, only time will tell on the damage.  I would usually patch or link  the doctor or victims through to a military hospital who had the US Military center of excellence on laser eye injuries. That asset is no longer available to the public.

So, before you criticize me on my reply, I have pretty good physics and ethics reasons why I am discouraging you.

OH, BTW, in the US, when the insurance code is entered in the database for a laser injury, it goes down coded  as "Optical Neuropathy, Unspecified"  , so it is difficult to collect data on actual injury rates.  Its rare, but much higher then published. Stats say Local, Sate and Federal Governmens only take an interest in injuries when the rate reaches between 1 in 300,000 or 1 in 1,000,000. In fact there is a rough federal rule in the US on what the minimum amount of sick people has to be before Federal research Dollars can go toward a cause. This results in "Orphan" diseases that are horrible, but not addressed, except through sheer determination. 

 So your trying, in my opinion, to run a horribly inefficient process with the wrong laser, and your expressing a naïve attitude.  Your citing, if not clinging videos that show a distinct lack of shielding.

So the rule, if applied, Worldwide,  is properly shielded laser is designated Class I (very safe) with a second sticker on it that says do not defeat interlocks and housing (and a few other things).

 You can have a Class IV laser marked Class I, and this gives the public the wrong idea in videos on laser use. 


And for those who say, go ahead, hurt yourself if you want, but do not harm others, that is poorly thought out,  Nearly all of us have loved ones and persons who are dependent on us in one way or the other. Taxes have to rise for covering those who do not die, but live with a debilitating injury resulting in dependence on Social Welfare systems.  So...

Sort of Rant, Over. I've typed a few dozen variations over the years in various places, and spoke to this at industry and hobby conferences.

Steve



   


 
« Last Edit: October 04, 2024, 12:48:40 am by LaserSteve »
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Offline RoGeorge

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Re: Idea For Laser Soldering
« Reply #31 on: October 03, 2024, 10:46:14 pm »
Thoughts?

But why?  What would be the benefit of laser soldering over the classic soldering?
 
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Offline thm_w

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Re: Idea For Laser Soldering
« Reply #32 on: October 03, 2024, 11:21:49 pm »
But why?  What would be the benefit of laser soldering over the classic soldering?

Benefits: highly localized heating so nearby low temp parts would not melt, no air flow to push small parts around, no physical tip needing to touch the component leaving both hands free.
It would be amazing if it were safe.
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Offline Randy222Topic starter

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Re: Idea For Laser Soldering
« Reply #33 on: October 03, 2024, 11:22:11 pm »
Ordered a used Coherent FAP800-30 from e bay.

What are the benefits? Laser welding benefits have already been documented, but my project idea came from soldering Rf components without using excess solder and reducing the HAZ in the process.

I guess I will just need to do a show-&-tell when I get something going.

The only thing he - and others - are trying to "nix" is premature blindness.

When people misuse sharp knives and somebody else is hurt, the community takes action against the perpetrator. Quite right too.

Please ensure that nobody other than yourself is within direct or indirect line of sight when your experiments are powered up.

I hope you are as competent as you think you are. Your statements and your tone lead me to suspect otherwise.
Someone elses fingers? Own fingers, like blinding one-self.
And yes, I feel confident I can DIY what I am after, using a 30w laser-diode fiber coupled, for precision soldering. ;)
« Last Edit: October 03, 2024, 11:26:22 pm by Randy222 »
 

Offline LaserSteve

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Re: Idea For Laser Soldering
« Reply #34 on: October 03, 2024, 11:42:00 pm »
Here is a start on safety..

The checklists are onerous..

https://www.ecfr.gov/current/title-21/chapter-I/subchapter-J/part-1040?toc=1

https://www.fda.gov/media/72593/download

https://www.fda.gov/regulatory-information/search-fda-guidance-documents/compliance-guide-laser-products-fda-86-8260

https://www.fda.gov/radiation-emitting-products/laser-products-and-instruments/notices-laser-industry (See Chiefly 56, harmonization with international rules)

https://www.fda.gov/regulatory-information/search-fda-guidance-documents/compliance-guide-laser-products-fda-86-8260


----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Some "Light" reading

https://ehs.osu.edu/sites/default/files/laser_safety_procedures_manual.pdf

The Navy, a small part of their rules:  https://www.navsea.navy.mil/Portals/103/Documents/NSWC_Dahlgren/Laser/MIL_STD_1425A.pdf

This one's important:

https://d3qi0qp55mx5f5.cloudfront.net/researchsafety/docs/Laser_Safety_Calculations.pdf?mtime=1610127144

----------------------------

BTW, in most cases, the only way to ensure laser safety is by an intense series of measurements with really good  (and expensive) equipment.  Using cameras and other techniques plus 100% enclosure is mandatory for using non-medical high power lasers.

Steve

















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Offline LaserSteve

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Re: Idea For Laser Soldering
« Reply #35 on: October 03, 2024, 11:44:45 pm »
I hope you just payed between 350 and 450$ for a pair of high quality NEW  laser safety glasses from a known Optics and Lab Equipment vendor, at least OD6.

I hope you never forget to wear them, or trust your you own personal design safety review.   

Probably closer to the 450$ range and not cheap plastic...

You'd be amazed at the counterfeit glasses out there.

Your desire to shoot a Youtube video says it all.

I hope you have the sense to find an experienced, certified  LSO for review before you post that video. 

Ah, wait till you learn about the need for the fume extractor.  When you miss with a handheld probe you will quickly learn a lesson you never forget.  Especially on GRP and other board materials. A simple mask is not enough. usually the coughing goes away after about twenty-thirty minutes, but the soreness lasts for days.  Don't use Pine or wood in general  for your focal tests if you have any backblast . The fumes are more interesting (Toxic)  at 800 nm then they are at 10.6 U, which does a better job of disassociating  some of the combustion products.

I hope your UC never fires on you during boot or other undefined states.

You may have found an affordable FAP, and the ones you found are from a recent factory closure, but you didn't find other critical parts of FAP longevity or the needed optics cheaply. 



Steve
« Last Edit: October 04, 2024, 02:31:42 am by LaserSteve »
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Online tggzzz

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Re: Idea For Laser Soldering
« Reply #36 on: October 03, 2024, 11:59:44 pm »
I guess I will just need to do a show-&-tell when I get something going.

So, as I suspected, the answer to RoGeorge's question "But why?  What would be the benefit of laser soldering over the classic soldering?" is "Because look at me doing something kewl" :(

Quote
The only thing he - and others - are trying to "nix" is premature blindness.

When people misuse sharp knives and somebody else is hurt, the community takes action against the perpetrator. Quite right too.

Please ensure that nobody other than yourself is within direct or indirect line of sight when your experiments are powered up.

I hope you are as competent as you think you are. Your statements and your tone lead me to suspect otherwise.
Someone elses fingers? Own fingers, like blinding one-self.
And yes, I feel confident I can DIY what I am after, using a 30w laser-diode fiber coupled, for precision soldering. ;)

Those questions indicate you really, really have poor comprehension skills.

I'm sure you can DIY that. I'm also sure you lack the skills to do it safely. And since you lack the self-awareness to realise you lack the skills, that's Dunning-Kruger territory.

I hope you don't blind someone's child. If you do, beware of the parent's anger - because it will know no bounds.
« Last Edit: October 04, 2024, 12:01:50 am by tggzzz »
There are lies, damned lies, statistics - and ADC/DAC specs.
Glider pilot's aphorism: "there is no substitute for span". Retort: "There is a substitute: skill+imagination. But you can buy span".
Having fun doing more, with less
 
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Offline thm_w

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Re: Idea For Laser Soldering
« Reply #37 on: October 04, 2024, 12:09:05 am »
So, as I suspected, the answer to RoGeorge's question "But why?  What would be the benefit of laser soldering over the classic soldering?" is "Because look at me doing something kewl" :(

The question was clearly answered above.

If you want to go high tech you can do stuff like this:
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Online tggzzz

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Re: Idea For Laser Soldering
« Reply #38 on: October 04, 2024, 12:13:29 am »
I hope you just payed between 350 and 450$ for a pair of high quality NEW  laser safety glasses from a known Optics and Lab Equipment vendor, at least OD6.

Plus presumably a pair for every passerby that might be within line of (indirect) sight. Then he's got to ensure they are wearing them correctly.

Before my daughter left for university, I got her to speed-read a story I remembered from when I was her age: Tom Godwin's short story "The Cold Equations". She appreciated the (generic) point of the story; it remains as potent as when it was written.

Many people appreciate that story, so it is widely reproduced on the web. On the off-chance the OP will read and understand it, here's one example: https://maggiemcneill.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/03/The-Cold-Equations.pdf . There are many other copies knocking around.
There are lies, damned lies, statistics - and ADC/DAC specs.
Glider pilot's aphorism: "there is no substitute for span". Retort: "There is a substitute: skill+imagination. But you can buy span".
Having fun doing more, with less
 
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Online tggzzz

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Re: Idea For Laser Soldering
« Reply #39 on: October 04, 2024, 12:17:23 am »
So, as I suspected, the answer to RoGeorge's question "But why?  What would be the benefit of laser soldering over the classic soldering?" is "Because look at me doing something kewl" :(

The question was clearly answered above.

If you want to go high tech you can do stuff like this:


While that may well be a valid answer a professional would give for production purposes, I doubt it is the answer the OP would give.
There are lies, damned lies, statistics - and ADC/DAC specs.
Glider pilot's aphorism: "there is no substitute for span". Retort: "There is a substitute: skill+imagination. But you can buy span".
Having fun doing more, with less
 

Offline LaserSteve

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Re: Idea For Laser Soldering
« Reply #40 on: October 04, 2024, 01:00:50 am »
This laser professional watched a few of the videos recently presented, then watched the video on the 20 years of research it has taken one primary engineer to achieve those results.  He's good, very good, and as usually the case, there are some trade secrets in there that are not detailed.

Some of the "beam profilometry" scans : reading going on in real time  were um, interesting in what they had to do to pass IPC etc. If they are true scans.

I just inherited SMD production quality control as part of my duties with my new employer. So I can see the "WOW" in some of those videos, and I also know the videos were recorded through some really, really good IR blocking filters for "trade Secret" reasons. There are some glints here and there that make it through, and the active focus control is doing some interesting things. Some of the transverse modes shown indicate more then simple focus control.

Also I know the model of laser driver used, and pictured in one video. It, too, is capable of some interesting things in the time domain.

Another interesting thing is the proprietary flux used.  While a few of the videos show SAC as the alloy, most are not using it.

Thick Gold on the surrounds of the plated through hole. There is a clue or two  there, too.

So the learning curve will be steep.



Steve
« Last Edit: October 04, 2024, 02:18:57 am by LaserSteve »
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Online tggzzz

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Re: Idea For Laser Soldering
« Reply #41 on: October 04, 2024, 08:57:52 am »
I worked with BT Martlesham Heath research labs around 1980, when fibre optics were the great hope for the future. Naturally they worked with lasers, which had only existed for ~15 years, so the powers were much lower than today.

Everybody in the laser lab had to undergo induction and training. One part of the training was a video produced for, IIRC, the US military. In it a monkey was strapped down while a "high" power laser was played over its face. The face melted and burned. The monkey was presumably euthanised, and some of the audience vomited.

The staff took note of the "do not look into laser with remaining eye" reminders posted in the lab, and were paranoid about avoiding specular reflections.

I haven't been able to find any such video on yootoo, so I can't post a link.
There are lies, damned lies, statistics - and ADC/DAC specs.
Glider pilot's aphorism: "there is no substitute for span". Retort: "There is a substitute: skill+imagination. But you can buy span".
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Online tooki

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Re: Idea For Laser Soldering
« Reply #42 on: October 04, 2024, 09:53:41 am »
Ordered a used Coherent FAP800-30 from e bay.

What are the benefits? Laser welding benefits have already been documented, but my project idea came from soldering Rf components without using excess solder and reducing the HAZ in the process.

I guess I will just need to do a show-&-tell when I get something going.

The only thing he - and others - are trying to "nix" is premature blindness.

When people misuse sharp knives and somebody else is hurt, the community takes action against the perpetrator. Quite right too.

Please ensure that nobody other than yourself is within direct or indirect line of sight when your experiments are powered up.

I hope you are as competent as you think you are. Your statements and your tone lead me to suspect otherwise.
Someone elses fingers? Own fingers, like blinding one-self.
And yes, I feel confident I can DIY what I am after, using a 30w laser-diode fiber coupled, for precision soldering. ;)
At the bare minimum, assuming you do not care about your own safety at all (which appears to be the case), DO NOT under any circumstances operate the laser in a room with windows, nor with any open doors, nor when anyone else is in the room or able to enter the room. (That means locked from the inside.)

Yes, innocent people have been injured by laser beams that accidentally reflected off something and exited through a window.

But your confidence is precisely why you shouldn’t be going anywhere near a laser of any kind. At work, where I am the department electronics technician, I support the laser labs. The senior researchers who use them — and have been using them for decades — treat those things with respect, not confidence. One needs to have a healthy fear of them, because they can injure you and others permanently, and do so much, much faster than the blink of an eye. And for the most part you cannot see the danger at all (and with non-visible-wavelength lasers, you can never see it). You just notice when you have burned your retina or set something on fire.

So you need to have respect for these things, and until you do, you should not even think of turning one on.

What you intend to do seems like unmitigated insanity to me. But even more relevant is that a highly experienced laser professional is telling you it’s insanity. That should be stopping you in your tracks. It is highly concerning that it does not.
 

Online tooki

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Re: Idea For Laser Soldering
« Reply #43 on: October 04, 2024, 10:03:45 am »
Thoughts?

How good is your health insurance; and if you're selling kits, liability insurance?
Selling kits? Health insurance?
No, and health insurance is up to you.
He didn’t say health insurance.

He said liability insurance. That’s the insurance that covers your ass when your device causes harm to someone else and they successfully sue you for a million dollars for medical care, loss of income due to the injury, emotional trauma, and punitive damages.

I’d also get good prepaid legal insurance, since there are likely civil and/or criminal laws you’d break if you caused injury. Negligence is something that you can get in legal trouble for.


What you’re doing is as reckless as shooting a machine gun in your front yard. Even if you don’t aim it at anyone on purpose, if it injures or kills someone, you’ll be in hot water. The difference is that a bullet doesn’t easily ricochet off of all manner of things. If anything, a high power laser is more reckless, since a laser beam can easily end up hitting something you had no intention of aiming at.

And remember that the thing you’re planning to aim at (solder) is highly reflective and of varying shape, meaning that you have no way of predicting where the reflections go.
 

Online tggzzz

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Re: Idea For Laser Soldering
« Reply #44 on: October 04, 2024, 10:10:38 am »
<reiteration of good points snipped to enable concentration on the conclusions made by several experienced people>

So you need to have respect for these things, and until you do, you should not even think of turning one on.

What you intend to do seems like unmitigated insanity to me. But even more relevant is that a highly experienced laser professional is telling you it’s insanity. That should be stopping you in your tracks. It is highly concerning that it does not.

Precisely.

Unfortunately "there's none so deaf as them's won't hear", and "you can lead a horse to water but can't make it drink".

If the OP does take your suggested precaution and lock the door from the inside, I suggest he leaves the key in the lock so that he can feel it when he needs to leave in a hurry.
There are lies, damned lies, statistics - and ADC/DAC specs.
Glider pilot's aphorism: "there is no substitute for span". Retort: "There is a substitute: skill+imagination. But you can buy span".
Having fun doing more, with less
 
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Online moffy

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Re: Idea For Laser Soldering
« Reply #45 on: October 04, 2024, 10:45:15 am »
So, as I suspected, the answer to RoGeorge's question "But why?  What would be the benefit of laser soldering over the classic soldering?" is "Because look at me doing something kewl" :(

The question was clearly answered above.

If you want to go high tech you can do stuff like this:


Thanks for the video, very entertaining, but there was nothing compelling for the use of laser soldering. All of the use cases are possible using standard techniques, e.g. parallel soldering use infra red lamps etc. It does excel at minimising heating but that's really a non issue, such an expensive, difficult and potentially dangerous method to do something already possible with cheaper and safer alternatives.  :-//
 
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Online tooki

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Re: Idea For Laser Soldering
« Reply #46 on: October 04, 2024, 11:26:40 am »
Unfortunately "there's none so deaf as them's won't hear", and "you can lead a horse to water but can't make it drink".
And soon, he’ll be “there’s none so blind as those who won’t see!”
 

Online wraper

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Re: Idea For Laser Soldering
« Reply #47 on: October 04, 2024, 11:38:18 am »
Laser soldering makes some niche at tightly controlled  automated production. For manual, DIY, you simply don't have the money to buy something that actually will be alble to solder without burning PCB and components. Not to say safety issues already mentioned.
 
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Online tggzzz

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Re: Idea For Laser Soldering
« Reply #48 on: October 04, 2024, 12:02:14 pm »
Unfortunately "there's none so deaf as them's won't hear", and "you can lead a horse to water but can't make it drink".
And soon, he’ll be “there’s none so blind as those who won’t see!”

I don't care, of course.

I do care about innocent passersby.
There are lies, damned lies, statistics - and ADC/DAC specs.
Glider pilot's aphorism: "there is no substitute for span". Retort: "There is a substitute: skill+imagination. But you can buy span".
Having fun doing more, with less
 
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Online unseenninja

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Re: Idea For Laser Soldering
« Reply #49 on: October 04, 2024, 01:16:27 pm »


A while back, I decided to look at whether laser pointers available on eBay were really as dangerous as people say.

My first purchases were laser safety glasses. As I bought them from Amazon (hardly any more reliable than eBay), I tested them with a wide spectrum light source and a photospectrometer to confirm that they did actually block the advertised wavelengths. I also purchased a basic laser power meter.

These are the three laser pointers which I ordered from eBay. They were very cheap. Each colour (red, green, violet) has a sticker advertising the maximum power output as < 5mW.



However, as my power meter soon confirmed, these three laser pointers are far from safe.

The red one measured 9mW - close to 5mW but still strong enough to cause trouble.
The green one measured 27mW - ouch!
The violet one (which looks to our eyes like the most dim of the three) measured 44mW!!

Where I live, the maximum power allowed for any laser pointer is just 1mW and these are actually illegal to even own.

I've looked at the various laser engravers, etc that can be sourced from China and in every case, I decided that my eyesight was worth considerably more than the benefit I might obtain from these devices. Even if the OP manages to make something which would provide any benefit for electronics assembly over and above that provided by a more conventional heat source, I won't be buying one!

« Last Edit: October 04, 2024, 01:18:08 pm by unseenninja »
 
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