Electronics > Projects, Designs, and Technical Stuff

Professional Prototyping Hardware Defined (Breadboard, Jumpers, low R stuff)

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tooki:
It’s so frustrating how in ANY question about (solderless) breadboards, the anti-breadboard brigade comes out with their anti-breadboard nonsense, acting as though:
a) prototyping were the only thing done on breadboards (it’s not; they’re more for experimenting, which is different from prototyping)
b) all breadboards were created equal, which they’re decidedly not, and
c) because breadboards aren’t suited to all types of circuits (which is absolutely correct), that they have no value for any purpose whatsoever (which is dead wrong).

tooki:

--- Quote from: tggzzz on July 22, 2020, 07:26:31 am ---
--- Quote from: sokoloff on July 22, 2020, 12:09:48 am ---Not my year, but 6.111 was one of my favorite undergrad courses. We had a “nerd kit” (briefcase with multiple breadboards and a back plane connector similar to the TI NuBus). This year looks like more generic kits. Final project was with at least one other student (by requirement) which meant usually multiple of these kits linked together.



--- End quote ---

And then somebody dropped some equipment onto the bench with a thump, and you had to figure out which connection had moved. Not my idea of a good use of my time.

--- End quote ---
If that was enough to cause a connection to move, then the breadboard was junk to begin with, or has been so horribly abused as to have merited throwing out long ago. A high quality breadboard that hasn’t been abused holds onto leads and wires tightly.



--- Quote from: tggzzz on July 22, 2020, 09:05:49 am ---
My comments have been about solderless breadboards, not about other types of breadboards. Contrary to your statement, Jim Williams used breadboards extensively - as shown in the picture.

--- End quote ---
The picture shows lots of soldered prototypes using various methods, but NO breadboarding!!  |O |O

Breadboard ≠ prototype!!!!

tggzzz:

--- Quote from: tooki on July 22, 2020, 09:15:23 am ---It’s so frustrating how in ANY question about (solderless) breadboards, the anti-breadboard brigade comes out with their anti-breadboard nonsense, acting as though a) prototyping were the only thing done on breadboards (it’s not; they’re more for experimenting, which is different from prototyping), and b) all breadboards were created equal, which they’re decidedly not.

--- End quote ---

I knowingly and deliberately express strident views about solderless breadboards. That's based on my unnecessarily having wasted too much time with them, and having seen beginners have more demoralising experiences. If a beginner's circuit fails to work, all too often they incorrectly think "I'm not clever enough and this is too difficult for me; I'm giving up".

In that context, I don't see any significant difference between experimenting and prototyping.

As for not all breadboards being equal... Agreed. The problems are identifying the better (not good) ones before purchasing them, and what happens if poor ones have been purchased (or become poor over time).

tooki:

--- Quote from: tggzzz on July 22, 2020, 09:27:30 am ---
--- Quote from: tooki on July 22, 2020, 09:15:23 am ---It’s so frustrating how in ANY question about (solderless) breadboards, the anti-breadboard brigade comes out with their anti-breadboard nonsense, acting as though a) prototyping were the only thing done on breadboards (it’s not; they’re more for experimenting, which is different from prototyping), and b) all breadboards were created equal, which they’re decidedly not.

--- End quote ---

I knowingly and deliberately express strident views about solderless breadboards. That's based on my unnecessarily having wasted too much time with them, and having seen beginners have more demoralising experiences. If a beginner's circuit fails to work, all too often they incorrectly think "I'm not clever enough and this is too difficult for me; I'm giving up".


--- End quote ---
But your tone is unnecessarily alarmist and discouraging, needlessly antagonistic, and ultimately unhelpful.

I am now working at a technical training center, where dozens of apprentices (almost entirely teenagers) come for classes each year. Breadboards are essential to lashing together the basic circuits used to learn electronics theory.

And heck, even the breadboarding failures are valuable, in that they teach troubleshooting skills, and learning the limits of your equipment.

Your message, which is ultimately “use the right tool for the job” would be far better received if you delivered it in an intellectually honest, useful way, instead of as a cantankerous harpy.


--- Quote from: tggzzz on July 22, 2020, 09:27:30 am ---In that context, I don't see any significant difference between experimenting and prototyping.

--- End quote ---
Then it’s been far too long since you were a beginner.


--- Quote from: tggzzz on July 22, 2020, 09:27:30 am ---As for not all breadboards being equal... Agreed. The problems are identifying the better (not good) ones before purchasing them, and what happens if poor ones have been purchased (or become poor over time).

--- End quote ---
Well, it’s not hard to identify a good one: buy a 3M.

Wearing out is indeed the bigger challenge. Now, in my experience, even a fairly abused 3M still holds onto leads quite well. Others here on the forums have noted that they’re still using the same ones 30 years later.

Meanwhile, I’ve relegated most of the fleabay breadboards I originally bought to being little more than soldering jigs. Ain’t nobody got time fo’ 2 ohm contact resistance!


P.S. I edited my post above after you responded to it, FYI.

tggzzz:

--- Quote from: tooki on July 22, 2020, 09:22:15 am ---
--- Quote from: tggzzz on July 22, 2020, 07:26:31 am ---And then somebody dropped some equipment onto the bench with a thump, and you had to figure out which connection had moved. Not my idea of a good use of my time.

--- End quote ---
If that was enough to cause a connection to move, then the breadboard was junk to begin with, or has been so horribly abused as to have merited throwing out long ago. A high quality breadboard that hasn’t been abused holds onto leads and wires tightly.

--- End quote ---

Those caveats are important. Ensuring they are valid is non-trivial in the real world.

There are easy alternatives with better performance and more repeatable results; not using them is somewhat peverse IMNSHO :)

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