Author Topic: Solaredge power optimizers  (Read 744 times)

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Offline tszaboo

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Solaredge power optimizers
« on: June 08, 2021, 11:19:35 am »
Hi. I got my solar system installed on my roof this weekend.
I was previously questioning whether or not power optimizer are worth it.
Sunday was already a day without clouds, and I thought I upload my systems performance.
Also half cut cells seem to make a difference, I have 170W coming from a panel, that has entire cells shaded out b that tree.

System specs:
11x DENIM U - Mono 360 All Black Half Cut PERC
11x SolarEdge Power Optimizer P401-5R M4M RM
SolarEdge HD3500 inverter, 3500W
Got some 3400W peak out of the system.


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Offline Siwastaja

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Re: Solaredge power optimizers
« Reply #1 on: June 08, 2021, 05:32:03 pm »
But how do you know how much you'd have produced without power optimizers?

How do you even estimate return of investment for the power optimizers?

Are you sure you wouldn't be producing more if you had put the same money in getting more panels? (Of course, sometimes you are area constrained and then it may make more sense to optimize the available area for most production possible; but I still kind of assume by default that solar installations are constrained by cost.)
 

Online bdunham7

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Re: Solaredge power optimizers
« Reply #2 on: June 08, 2021, 05:43:21 pm »
The optimizers are a relatively small amount of the total cost, are they not?

As far as cost vs space issues, many times it isn't a simple calculation--you may have a certain amount of space where the installation cost will be low, but to increase the size may require a disproportionate additional investment for a variety of reasons.  In my case I'm not 'out of space' but any significant increase in the area of my system would come at greatly increased cost.  I'd be better off updating my existing panels.  I'm sure the NL is generally more space constrained than I am.  My roof is 450m2.
A 3.5 digit 4.5 digit 5 digit 5.5 digit 6.5 digit 7.5 digit DMM is good enough for most people.
 

Offline Marco

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Re: Solaredge power optimizers
« Reply #3 on: June 08, 2021, 09:10:08 pm »
Did you read the bit about SolarEdge optimizers causing interference on the C2000 network? The Germans mentioned that an EU country has started a procedure to block sales of P300, P370, P600, P600-M27 ... but maybe that's just the ones they tested up to now. Got a bunch of P505's here.

If they have to go fix every installation with SolarEdge optimizers that's going to cost a god awful amount of money to fix, installers would just go into bankruptcy instead of paying for that.

PS. here in the Netherlands people will generally be space restricted.
« Last Edit: June 08, 2021, 09:17:55 pm by Marco »
 

Offline tszaboo

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Re: Solaredge power optimizers
« Reply #4 on: June 08, 2021, 09:32:51 pm »
But how do you know how much you'd have produced without power optimizers?

How do you even estimate return of investment for the power optimizers?

Are you sure you wouldn't be producing more if you had put the same money in getting more panels? (Of course, sometimes you are area constrained and then it may make more sense to optimize the available area for most production possible; but I still kind of assume by default that solar installations are constrained by cost.)
The optimizers are 50 EUR each
Panels are 126 EUR, plus another 50-60 installation and mounting.
The inverter 3.5KW  845 EUR
Total system was 5K EUR, I can get back about 800 EUR tax. ROI of 6-7 years, probably more as they plan to change the feed in tariff  in a few years.

A 3.5 KW SMA inverter is 1100 EUR, so I could've bough maybe 1 extra panel for the same EUR amount with traditional string inverters. I could've fit maybe another 4 panels on the roof, but this would cover my needs already, and they would be in an even less ideal places.

Partial shading can be  tricky, but here is an example:

I usually simplify it that the string will produce the same % of power as the weakest link.

The optimizers are a relatively small amount of the total cost, are they not?

As far as cost vs space issues, many times it isn't a simple calculation--you may have a certain amount of space where the installation cost will be low, but to increase the size may require a disproportionate additional investment for a variety of reasons.  In my case I'm not 'out of space' but any significant increase in the area of my system would come at greatly increased cost.  I'd be better off updating my existing panels.  I'm sure the NL is generally more space constrained than I am.  My roof is 450m2.
Yes, basically it is 10% of the full system+installation cost. And as I mentioned, it makes the inverter cheaper, so its not even that clear cut.
Of course if ROI is the only deciding factor, then there are Chinese inverters for half the price, and cheaper panels.

Did you read the bit about SolarEdge optimizers causing interference on the C2000 network? The Germans mentioned that an EU country has started a procedure to block sales of P300, P370, P600, P600-M27 ... but maybe that's just the ones they tested up to now. Got a bunch of P505's here.

If they have to go fix every installation with SolarEdge optimizers that's going to cost a god awful amount of money to fix, installers would just go into bankruptcy instead of paying for that.

PS. here in the Netherlands people will generally be space restricted.
I didn't hear about it. Maybe I will poke around with an E field probe and see if it picks up anything?
« Last Edit: June 08, 2021, 09:36:14 pm by tszaboo »
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Offline Marco

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Re: Solaredge power optimizers
« Reply #5 on: June 08, 2021, 09:35:50 pm »
The optimizer is a pretty poor antenna, it's the signal it's putting on the wires which is doing it.
 

Offline splin

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Re: Solaredge power optimizers
« Reply #6 on: June 20, 2021, 11:33:30 pm »

Partial shading can be  tricky, but here is an example:

Indeed it can be tricky but it would be a very neat trick if you could get an 80% shaded panel to produce up to half it's peak power!  >:D



The power curves shown are wrong because the I-V curves are wrong - an 80% shaded panel can only output 20% of peak voltage @ rated current or 100% voltage @ 20% current, or some other combinations depending on the cell and bypass arrangements.
« Last Edit: June 20, 2021, 11:43:53 pm by splin »
 

Offline tszaboo

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Re: Solaredge power optimizers
« Reply #7 on: June 22, 2021, 07:26:37 am »

Partial shading can be  tricky, but here is an example:

Indeed it can be tricky but it would be a very neat trick if you could get an 80% shaded panel to produce up to half it's peak power!  >:D
Its partial shading of a string, not a panel.
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