Author Topic: Analog BK 1500 Scope Repair  (Read 7232 times)

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Offline xeonon

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Analog BK 1500 Scope Repair
« on: August 26, 2015, 07:48:32 pm »
Hey guys, so I am now the proud owner of a beauty of a classic scope. Works great in XY mode, but for some reason the sweep doesn't change no matter what timebase I've got selected. I'm opening it up now, but other than the usual cleaning of the contacts what should I look for. Below is the calibration point and oscilifun for the XY test. Lovely little scope if I can get it working 100%. Also ironically, it actually seems to be close in calibration so far. Hard to test with no sweep.


 

Online tautech

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Re: Analog BK 1500 Scope Repair
« Reply #1 on: August 26, 2015, 08:18:52 pm »
It does look nice and tidy.  :-+

Now keep the beam Intensity down so you don't get damage to the display Phosphors.

A failed Sweep generator is not too uncommon, but you'll probably need another scope to diagnose.

Grab the Tek troubleshooting pdf from the Repair Docs and Links thread and do some study.  ;)
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Offline xeonon

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Re: Analog BK 1500 Scope Repair
« Reply #2 on: August 26, 2015, 08:30:39 pm »
Will do. If nothing else I've got a good little XY scope. The intensity was a bit high in the pic... But that's mainly the camera. Phones are not made for pictures lol
 

Online tautech

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Re: Analog BK 1500 Scope Repair
« Reply #3 on: August 26, 2015, 08:34:24 pm »
I see you have another thread on this CRO:
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/bk-precision-1500-100-mhz-oscilloscope/

Can you post or provide a link to the pdf BK sent you? Was it a schematic?
We then maybe can advise test points for you to check.  :-//
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Offline xeonon

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Re: Analog BK 1500 Scope Repair
« Reply #4 on: August 27, 2015, 06:51:23 am »
They sent the calibration guide in PDF. It's below if you want to download it. I sent in a request for the schematic and manual, but we will see if they send one.
 

Offline MarkL

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Re: Analog BK 1500 Scope Repair
« Reply #5 on: August 28, 2015, 02:31:52 pm »
I used to have a BK 1590A many years ago.  On the outside it looked identical to your 1500 and it had the brightest screen I've ever seen on a scope.  It was also very finicky getting it properly calibrated, as I recall.

Perhaps this is stating the obvious, but in your one photo you have single sweep activated.  Did you try AUTO sweep mode?
 

Offline xeonon

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Re: Analog BK 1500 Scope Repair
« Reply #6 on: August 30, 2015, 04:52:50 am »
Nice on the 1590A, I am actually looking at one now. Far as I can tell the difference is very slight between the two. The sweep generator is dead on this unit. I was testing the single shot but it doesn't trigger correctly as it will not reset. If it's on auto, not normal but only auto, you can watch the triggered light come on as normal. If my assumption is correct I can grab this 1590A and swap out the sweep. On a related note, I do have a 100% working Tek 2245A on the way. But this BK has won my heart so I'm still going to fix it.
 

Online tautech

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Re: Analog BK 1500 Scope Repair
« Reply #7 on: August 30, 2015, 05:04:42 am »
The sweep generator is dead on this unit.  On a related note, I do have a 100% working Tek 2245A on the way.
With another scope it should be quite straight forward to fix and quite possible no calibration will be needed.
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Offline xeonon

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Re: Analog BK 1500 Scope Repair
« Reply #8 on: August 30, 2015, 05:06:41 am »
Yea, it's very hard to tell which problem is the root one. Trigger seems strange and so does sweep. I do know I don't have the 29V at the sweep gen board, but it looks ok.
 

Online tautech

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Re: Analog BK 1500 Scope Repair
« Reply #9 on: August 30, 2015, 05:13:48 am »
Unless you can get a triangular waveform output at the sweep you will get a display like this one you linked:

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Offline xeonon

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Re: Analog BK 1500 Scope Repair
« Reply #10 on: August 30, 2015, 05:28:36 am »
I attached the schematic for the trig/sweep board if it helps.
 

Offline mij59

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Re: Analog BK 1500 Scope Repair
« Reply #11 on: August 30, 2015, 05:29:55 am »
Got the Trio Kenwood CS2110 look almost identical to BK 1500 except for the 50 Ohm input option.
I can replicate the screenshot when in X-Y mode, do the horizontal display buttons work ?
Its strange that the single and reset led of the trigger mode are lit.
 

Offline mij59

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Re: Analog BK 1500 Scope Repair
« Reply #12 on: August 30, 2015, 05:40:47 am »
I attached the schematic for the trig/sweep board if it helps.

Start by checking the absolute value and ripple of the power supply voltages.
 

Offline xeonon

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Re: Analog BK 1500 Scope Repair
« Reply #13 on: August 30, 2015, 06:02:47 am »
54.7V   55V at JP49
19.75V   20V
4.81V   5V
9.814V   10V
-9.9V   -10V
.9mV   29V at JP41

As for ripples, this is the only scope I have. As I said, the 29V rail is the problem.

Edit: Also should note that HV is out of my domain. And as the scope works fine in x-y mode I shouldn't need to worry about it anyway.
 

Online tautech

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Re: Analog BK 1500 Scope Repair
« Reply #14 on: August 30, 2015, 07:33:53 am »
54.7V   55V at JP49
19.75V   20V
4.81V   5V
9.814V   10V

-9.9V   -10V
.9mV   29V at JP41

As for ripples, this is the only scope I have. As I said, the 29V rail is the problem.

Edit: Also should note that HV is out of my domain. And as the scope works fine in x-y mode I shouldn't need to worry about it anyway.
As I see those measurements 29V is not the only problem.

Highlighted voltages IMHO are low too. ^^^

Quick check for ripple can be made with your DMM on AC mV
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Offline mij59

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Re: Analog BK 1500 Scope Repair
« Reply #15 on: August 30, 2015, 07:55:41 am »
54.7V   55V at JP49
19.75V   20V
4.81V   5V
9.814V   10V
-9.9V   -10V
.9mV   29V at JP41

As for ripples, this is the only scope I have. As I said, the 29V rail is the problem.

Edit: Also should note that HV is out of my domain. And as the scope works fine in x-y mode I shouldn't need to worry about it anyway.

Trace back the 29V rail, probably its one of the power supply voltages.
As I recall the power supply is quite hard to get to, I replaced all the filter caps of the secondary side, some of the old caps had only half the capacity rated .
 

Offline xeonon

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Re: Analog BK 1500 Scope Repair
« Reply #16 on: August 30, 2015, 08:04:49 pm »
I know what you mean on the power supply on this one. It sits in the middle right around the crt. The HV board is on the other side of the crt. The 29v is not on that board though. On the rotary unit board is the usual calibration adjustment for the 29v rail. I attached that page as well if it helps. Correct me if I'm wrong but doesn't it take the 55v and output 29v based on the input of A VAR? I might be reading that wrong though.
 

Online tautech

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Re: Analog BK 1500 Scope Repair
« Reply #17 on: August 30, 2015, 08:29:34 pm »
I know what you mean on the power supply on this one. It sits in the middle right around the crt. The HV board is on the other side of the crt. The 29v is not on that board though. On the rotary unit board is the usual calibration adjustment for the 29v rail. I attached that page as well if it helps. Correct me if I'm wrong but doesn't it take the 55v and output 29v based on the input of A VAR? I might be reading that wrong though.
You are.

+29 is derived from a classic linear regulator made from discrete components and powered from the 55V rail.
Q2 is the pass transistor.
« Last Edit: August 30, 2015, 08:48:59 pm by tautech »
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Offline xeonon

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Re: Analog BK 1500 Scope Repair
« Reply #18 on: August 30, 2015, 09:21:25 pm »
I was looking at the wrong VR. So the other board takes that and does sweep etc. That does mean I at least have a problem on this one then?
 

Online tautech

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Re: Analog BK 1500 Scope Repair
« Reply #19 on: August 30, 2015, 09:38:23 pm »
I was looking at the wrong VR. So the other board takes that and does sweep etc. That does mean I at least have a problem on this one then?
I'd say so.

Check 55V is available a the collector of Q2 and ~7V at the emitter of Q4.
VR1 is the adjustment for 29V

VR2 (A VAR) is just a voltage divider not a regulator.
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Offline xeonon

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Re: Analog BK 1500 Scope Repair
« Reply #20 on: August 30, 2015, 09:57:32 pm »
 :palm: No go. Q2 had 55, and I might have mixed Q4 and Q1 up. Also might have shorted out Q1 and let out the magic smoke. So looks like I'm on my way to find some new ones :(
 

Online tautech

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Re: Analog BK 1500 Scope Repair
« Reply #21 on: August 30, 2015, 10:07:58 pm »
:palm: No go. Q2 had 55, and I might have mixed Q4 and Q1 up. Also might have shorted out Q1 and let out the magic smoke. So looks like I'm on my way to find some new ones :(
Now we know D2 is conducting.  :-DD

Often you need other means of connection for densely populated PCB's.
Even the cheap little grabbers work fine and can save you some grief.
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Online tautech

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Re: Analog BK 1500 Scope Repair
« Reply #22 on: August 30, 2015, 10:20:09 pm »
Also R3 and Q1 form the 29V current limit, check the volage across R3, it should be much less than 0.6V.
Anywhere near 0.6V means there is excessive load on this VR output.
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Offline mij59

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Re: Analog BK 1500 Scope Repair
« Reply #23 on: August 31, 2015, 04:05:56 am »
:palm: No go. Q2 had 55, and I might have mixed Q4 and Q1 up. Also might have shorted out Q1 and let out the magic smoke. So looks like I'm on my way to find some new ones :(
Transistor Q1 and Q4 are of the same type so mixing them up should not be a problem.
Check for shorts of the 29V rail to ground with the continuity test of your DMM .
Measure the voltage of D1 and C4 to ground.
 


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