Electronics > Repair
Charging by the hour is unfair!
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ifonlyeverything:

--- Quote from: SteveThackery on July 05, 2024, 08:38:21 am ---NOBODY WANTS TO BUY YOUR LABOUR, THEY WANT TO BUY THE FRUITS OF YOUR LABOUR!  AND IF THERE ARE NO FRUITS, WHAT ARE YOU CHARGING THEM FOR?

--- End quote ---

Compensation for time spent analyzing the device and determining whether or not a repair is feasible. If the repair is feasible then it's customary for additional time to be billed for the repair. I'm not an engineer -- I work in professional services. Consultation fees are customary in many professional services with absolutely no guarantee of outcome. The client pays for an expert intake analysis which determines the path forward, if any. If the consultation is "at no cost" then it's baked into other services -- there's no such thing as a free lunch.
vk6zgo:

--- Quote from: SteveThackery on July 05, 2024, 08:38:21 am ---
--- Quote from: fmashockie on July 04, 2024, 06:50:42 pm ---Final observation: the fact that you are calling the people in this thread sociopaths as you continue to 'like' every post made in opposition to you is also ironic.

--- End quote ---

It is not ironic!  "Liking" a post is my way of saying "thank you" to everyone who takes the time to contribute. And I am genuinely grateful, regardless of how vigorously we disagree. 

By the way, I didn't call anyone here a sociopath. I said that sociopaths "might feel comfortable" with the behaviour I was referring to because it showed a lack of empathy with the customer.  It's a way of drawing attention to what seems to me like extraordinary behaviour.


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There is arrogance in this thread, but it has a singular source, and that source is you.
[/quote]

Wow! I don't believe I have shown any arrogance at all, but maybe we define arrogance differently.  I think there HAS been A LOT of arrogance and lack of empathy from the professional repairers in this thread.  For example, the very thought that a technician might sometimes end up doing work without pay fills them with horror and outrage, but they cannot seem to understand that this is EXACTLY ANALOGOUS to the customer paying money and getting nothing back.  The latter is fine, apparently, but not the former.

I know exactly what my opponents are going to say: "They aren't getting nothing back, they're getting half a day of my highly skilled work".  At which point I remind you of this, which I have been saying consistently from the beginning. 

NOBODY WANTS TO BUY YOUR LABOUR, THEY WANT TO BUY THE FRUITS OF YOUR LABOUR!  AND IF THERE ARE NO FRUITS, WHAT ARE YOU CHARGING THEM FOR?


--- Quote ---Also, you keep using the analogy of an appliance.  You're discussing this with people who are mainly talking about the component level repair of PCBs.  Boards that generally don't have schematics available or have parts that have become obsolete.  It is a big difference. 

--- End quote ---

My use of the term "appliance" was just a generic term to refer to anything that needs fixing, in the context of this thread anything electronic.  It isn't an analogy.

I can't let the absurd claim that the only arrogance in this thread is from me. I'll show you plenty of examples later on.  Meanwhile, what's this "F... Fa... Fai" thing all about?
[/quote]

There is a member called "Faringdon", who often starts argumentative threads.
Yours is eerily similar.
tooki:

--- Quote from: SteveThackery on July 05, 2024, 08:38:21 am ---NOBODY WANTS TO BUY YOUR LABOUR, THEY WANT TO BUY THE FRUITS OF YOUR LABOUR!  AND IF THERE ARE NO FRUITS, WHAT ARE YOU CHARGING THEM FOR?

--- End quote ---
Just because you want to only buy the fruits of your labor doesn't mean you're entitled to having that wish fulfilled!

The alternative -- which some service providers do choose to do -- is to bake the cost of unsuccessful repairs into the prices they charge the customers who have successful repairs.

To use your merchandise analogy: when you buy fish from a fishmonger, you can choose to take the whole fish (guts and all), the cleaned fish, or to have him filet it. But no matter what, he's going to put the whole fish on the scales first and charge you that price, regardless of whether you take home the guts, scales, head and bones or not. If you buy fish filets that are already fileted, then the cost of the waste bits of the fish has been precalculated into the price for the filets, which is much higher than for the whole fish. So you are paying for the guts, scales, head and bones, whether you realize it or not.

No product has 100% yield, and the waste is always calculated into the price, one way or another. It's bizarre that you think services behave any differently. But not as bizarre as the fact that you think people should work for free...
Smokey:

--- Quote from: SteveThackery on July 05, 2024, 07:54:04 am ---
--- Quote from: Smokey on July 04, 2024, 07:27:05 pm ---Hmmmm..  a user who makes wacky posts and then proceeds to argue with everyone while also liking every post....
Doesn't that sound familiar.....   F...  Fa...  Fai..... Fair....

--- End quote ---

Sorry - I have no idea what this alludes to.

--- End quote ---

If that's really true then you should never take a 23andMe genetic test.  There is a good chance you have a brother you don't know about.....
MK14:

--- Quote from: tooki on July 05, 2024, 08:54:19 pm ---But not as bizarre as the fact that you think people should work for free...

--- End quote ---

You can (or use to), encounter such a concept, at least in the UK.

Consider a hairdresser.

There is the standard charge, for simplicity, lets call it £10(-) .. £15(+) for a haircut, by a standard, experienced/qualified hairdressing professional.

The same hairdresser, my occasionally offer reduced prices (or even free), I can't remember exactly, by I think it was something like half-price, or reduced price, as a minimum.

If you let the trainee hairdressers, cut your hair.

So, a similar concept, could apply, to an upcoming, not yet properly experienced/(qualified if/as necessary)/equipped/etc, repair individual/shop/entity.

I suspect the right/better way to do it, is for the repair person/company, to offer such a service (free, unless we succeed in repairing your device), on a case by case basis.

I.e. Only with certain types of repair, and certain (trustworthy/suitable) customers, with perhaps other stipulations.

E.g. Some faults, by their description, can sound like the repairer, has a reasonable or better idea, as to what is wrong.  So, success is likely, and finding out it is unrepairable/uneconomic etc, would be reasonably quick.

If it was a PC, an estimation of the parts and repair time, is not too difficult.  So for a competent PC repair technician, accepting a free, unless we fix it.  Wouldn't sound too bad.

But other electronics repair, especially to the individual electronic component level, can be problematic/expensive/risky, as already mentioned by many others, in this thread.

But if it is building up, an upcoming repairer's, experience level.  Without them needing to pay (possibly lots of money), paying for learning resources (such as actual qualifications).  With perhaps significant upfront costs, no guarantee of final success.
Possibly needing financial resources, that the person involved, simply doesn't have access to, at the moment (i.e. a sort of chicken and egg situation).

Then maybe, it could be a solution.
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