Author Topic: Fluke 199C scopemeter repair (Read 32550 times)

feedback.loop · « **on:** July 28, 2020, 12:22:26 am »

Two 199C units were picked up on eBay for parts. Both are incomplete, but one is more so. The other one was repaired. A keypad board was designed and manufactured. Despite of a silly mistake, this first version turned out to be usable. The second unit also shows some hope, but it needs a memory module and a power connector. It also features a very ugly spot on its LCD. And both units need batteries, so, perhaps, yet another li-ion battery upgrade is coming. Hopefully.

Connector on Mouser: https://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/649-SLW15S-1C7LF
FFC on Mouser: https://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/326-42103
Fan on Mouser: https://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/108-AFB0405LA-A

coromonadalix · « **Reply #1 on:** July 28, 2020, 01:35:26 am »

Incredible work

Shock · « **Reply #2 on:** July 28, 2020, 06:55:49 am »

Congrats on getting them up and running. Hopefully when the battery packs are in the nag goes away, easily tested anyway. Time to binge watch some more of your videos.

avellanet · « **Reply #3 on:** July 28, 2020, 12:43:38 pm »

I am a hobbyist and have learned a lot by watching your videos the last couple of years. I thank you for that. Keep them coming.

Per Hansson · « **Reply #4 on:** July 28, 2020, 03:12:14 pm »

Nice video, I have ordered the power connector directly from Fluke myself, it cost only ca $20 in Sweden excl tax.
This was for a Fluke 225C but the 199C is identical AFAIK only software difference (Bus health test feature)
The part number is provided in this post, it is actually for a 196C but it fit just fine

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/repair/another-fluke-196c-scopemeter-repair/msg985414/#msg985414

feedback.loop · « **Reply #5 on:** July 28, 2020, 07:57:00 pm »

A few hours after publishing my previous video I realized that there is a very easy fix for the problem with the mirrored connector. How come It did not occur to me right away? It is so obvious (once you know the answer)! Just use an FFC with contacts on the opposite sides.

Opposite-side FFC: https://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/710-686715100001

Simon Spiers · « **Reply #6 on:** July 28, 2020, 08:53:30 pm »

If you have a spare ASIC for the input I would be interested anyone?

EHT · « **Reply #7 on:** July 28, 2020, 09:13:23 pm »

Amazing job making the keypad!

I have a B model and I can hear the fan bearings are going. Pity the same model fan isn't available. I wonder if anyone else has find one that fits the mounting? If you're replacing one, maybe the metal housing can be reused? There is this 'nidec copal' on digikey as well as the Delta brand ones. However, it is 400mW...

coromonadalix · « **Reply #8 on:** July 29, 2020, 02:31:08 pm »

would a reversed flat cable could have worked ?

straight = flat pins on the same side
reversed = flat pins connector on opposed sides

feedback.loop · « **Reply #9 on:** July 29, 2020, 03:50:15 pm »

Here is the response from Fluke technical support regarding the memory module and the power connector with sealing ring:

PN 402224619841/ PN 2042555: Item Desc :FLASH/SRAM MODULE 190BC
This item was discontinued in March 2017

PN 402224492561/ PN 1285578: Item Desc :POWER CONNECTOR SP
MSRP: $33.98
ATP: 6 WEEKS

PN 402224498331/ PN 1286052: Item Desc :SEALING RING FOR POWER CONNECTOR
This item was discontinued in June 2009. Replaced with PN 2413816
PN 2413816: Item Desc :SEALING RING POWERCON.
MSRP: $7.21
ATP: 6 WEEKS

lostking2008 · « **Reply #10 on:** July 31, 2020, 02:15:04 am »

Hi FeedbackLoop,

That's an awesome feast to DIY the kaypad foil for 199C. I need one keypad foil for a 199C. Are you going to put the extra ones up for sale as you mentioned in your video #93?

Thanks,
Ken

feedback.loop · « **Reply #11 on:** July 31, 2020, 05:03:08 pm »

Quote from: lostking2008 on July 31, 2020, 02:15:04 am

Hi FeedbackLoop,

That's an awesome feast to DIY the kaypad foil for 199C. I need one keypad foil for a 199C. Are you going to put the extra ones up for sale as you mentioned in your video #93?

Thanks,
Ken

Perhaps. I still need to order some opposite-side cables, more connectors and give this a try.

Rollin Hand · « **Reply #12 on:** August 01, 2020, 01:18:48 pm »

I need the battery mod.

feedback.loop · « **Reply #13 on:** August 01, 2020, 08:34:08 pm »

Quote from: Rollin Hand on August 01, 2020, 01:18:48 pm

I need the battery mod.

I am working on it.
Teaser photo attached

feedback.loop · « **Reply #14 on:** August 05, 2020, 04:55:32 pm »

DIY Li-ion battery pack for Fluke 19x scopemeters. About twice the capacity of the original Ni-MH pack. Requires a small modification in the scopemeter: adding a 120K 1% resistor across R4113.

Li-ion battery testing using Agilent 661x: https://youtu.be/riB0NASj_KU

Connector housing on Digikey: https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/molex/0050375043/WM17405-ND/259392
Crimp contacts on Digikey: https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/molex/0008701040/WM17406-ND/259393

feedback.loop · « **Reply #15 on:** August 05, 2020, 06:50:49 pm »

I should have shown a close-up of the BMS in the video.

Vince · « **Reply #16 on:** August 05, 2020, 08:56:36 pm »

Wow, a lot of work/detail indeed, you really do seem to enjoy tinkering with battery replacements !

It was so in depth that I was kinda surprised and " disappointed " that you didn't go to the extent of actually measuring accurately the start-up current of the scope with.. another scope, to see exactly how much current it needs, see the shape of the waveform, how it progressively settles to 900mA etc.. would have been cool

feedback.loop · « **Reply #17 on:** August 05, 2020, 09:01:41 pm »

Many things could have been explored in more detail. Such things take a lot of time. At some point you just have to choose and call something good enough.

Vince · « **Reply #18 on:** August 05, 2020, 09:06:27 pm »

Yes of course !

lostking2008 · « **Reply #19 on:** August 05, 2020, 10:46:51 pm »

Hi FeedbackLoop: This modification is awesome as usual. BTW, I need one keypad foil for a 199C. Just wondering if you'll share the gerber file of the designed keypad foil if possible. Thanks a lot. ---Ken.

Rollin Hand · « **Reply #20 on:** August 06, 2020, 12:16:01 pm »

The BMS is 2S 7.4V 7.2V Li-ion Li-Po Battery Protection BMS PCM Ch/Dis. Current 4A 2S4AW004.

eBay item number:321761796022
I think this is the correct one?
You think is necessary to install the 130k resistor ? it will damage the pack by overvoltage? because my screen is fragile ,for me is to much risk to take it a part.
Thank you.
Rollin

feedback.loop · « **Reply #21 on:** August 06, 2020, 04:43:42 pm »

Quote from: Rollin Hand on August 06, 2020, 12:16:01 pm

The BMS is 2S 7.4V 7.2V Li-ion Li-Po Battery Protection BMS PCM Ch/Dis. Current 4A 2S4AW004.

eBay item number:321761796022
I think this is the correct one?
You think is necessary to install the 130k resistor ? it will damage the pack by overvoltage? because my screen is fragile ,for me is to much risk to take it a part.
Thank you.
Rollin

Looks right. Not the cheapest one though. I believe I have seen under $3 delivered.
I used a 120K resistor. 130K will probably set the voltage too high. I believe it is necessary. As I mentioned in the video, BMS will prevent catastrophic overvoltage, but we should not rely on it for normal charging. It is set to about 8.6V.
On the other hand, removing the main board does not involve removing the LCD. So I don't see a problem.

aqibi2000 · « **Reply #22 on:** August 06, 2020, 09:05:42 pm »

Feedback loop can you share the gerber file so he can fix his 199C?

feedback.loop · « **Reply #23 on:** August 06, 2020, 09:25:25 pm »

I don't mind sharing the gerbers. I am a bit reluctant because I am not proud of the connector placement. I would like to move it a bit down, so that it wouldn't need to be soldered a bit above the board, and it would be a bit easier to install the board. Perhaps I should make the change and run another batch, but I don't need them myself. Is there enough demand, say for 10 boards? Say, we call it $20 plus postage for one kit: board + connector + falt flex (with opposite-side contacts) for the new batch. I still have a couple from the first batch ($30 + postage).

cheeseit · « **Reply #24 on:** August 06, 2020, 10:00:24 pm »

I always thoroughly enjoy your videos!

cozza · « **Reply #25 on:** August 06, 2020, 10:30:16 pm »

I'd be keen for one of the keypad replacement boards, or to add one to your order if you're going to do a small production run. I use my 196B almost daily for work and it would be great to have a spare keypad standing by in case the foil keypad fails!

lostking2008 · « **Reply #26 on:** August 06, 2020, 10:35:44 pm »

Good point. Thanks.

Quote from: feedback.loop on August 06, 2020, 09:25:25 pm

I don't mind sharing the gerbers. I am a bit reluctant because I am not proud of the connector placement. I would like to move it a bit down, so that it wouldn't need to be soldered a bit above the board, and it would be a bit easier to install the board. Perhaps I should make the change and run another batch, but I don't need them myself. Is there enough demand, say for 10 boards? Say, we call it $20 plus postage for one kit: board + connector + falt flex (with opposite-side contacts) for the new batch. I still have a couple from the first batch ($30 + postage).

lostking2008 · « **Reply #27 on:** August 13, 2020, 01:59:45 pm »

Hi There, I need a memory module for Fluke 199C, but it has been discontinued by Fluke back in 2017. Unfortunately, the service manual doesn't come with the circuit drawing of the Flash/SRAM module (80 contacts in two rows, 0.8mm pitch) itself. Does anyone have a schematic drawing of the memory module?

Thanks,
Ken

lostking2008 · « **Reply #28 on:** August 18, 2020, 07:51:41 pm »

Hi Feedback loop,

Just curious where did you obtain a blank flash/sram module for your Fluke 190 series scopemeter?

Thanks.
Ken

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
FeedbackLoop
2 days ago
I do have a Fluke serial adapter. I would be interested in maintenance commands like loading firmware into a blank flash/sram module, maybe changing scope type from 196 to 199 and such. Any info on this? Thank you.

David V
David V
1 day ago
@FeedbackLoop Sorry, the only information I have regarding the commands is the information that came on the original PM9080 interface disk (3.5" floppy version 1.3) for DOS. These are all ( two letter) operating commands. Fluke can be awfully stingy with information.

ken tsai
ken tsai
5 hours ago
@FeedbackLoop I was wondering if the optical port of the fluke scopemeter (essentially a UART port) can be explored by the OPEN on-chip debugger along with GDB (The GNU Project Debugger) to create breakpoints during the firmware loading process in Fluke 190 series scopemeter.

FeedbackLoop
FeedbackLoop
1 hour ago
@ken tsai I don't know. Sounds like a lot of work. Probably easier to make an adapter for a programmer to read-write the flash chips directly. At least for the models with a flash/sram module (19x B and C). This discussion is in a wrong place. Should we move it to https://www.eevblog.com/forum/repair/fluke-199c-scopemeter-repair/

feedback.loop · « **Reply #29 on:** August 18, 2020, 07:58:53 pm »

Quote from: lostking2008 on August 18, 2020, 07:51:41 pm

Hi Feedback loop,

Just curious where did you obtain a blank flash/sram module for your Fluke 190 series scopemeter?

Thanks.
Ken

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
FeedbackLoop
2 days ago
I do have a Fluke serial adapter. I would be interested in maintenance commands like loading firmware into a blank flash/sram module, maybe changing scope type from 196 to 199 and such. Any info on this? Thank you.

I did not say I have it. I spoke hypothetically. Suppose we manage to produce one. How do we program it? I see only one method at the moment: building an adapter for a programmer to access the flash chips directly (with a jumper selecting one of the two chips), and copy from a working module, but that is a lot more additional work. It would be nice if there was a method to put a blank module into the scope and program it.

lostking2008 · « **Reply #30 on:** August 19, 2020, 02:50:58 am »

I believe one option is to make a blank Flash/SRAM module using memory ICs with alternative packages, e.g. TSOP-48 with DIP-48 socket adapter. Then it should be straightforward to program the two flash ICs individually with a universal programmer prior to assembling the memory module.

[/quote]
I did not say I have it. I spoke hypothetically. Suppose we manage to produce one. How do we program it? I see only one method at the moment: building an adapter for a programmer to access the flash chips directly (with a jumper selecting one of the two chips), and copy from a working module, but that is a lot more additional work. It would be nice if there was a method to put a blank module into the scope and program it.
[/quote]

feedback.loop · « **Reply #31 on:** August 19, 2020, 06:31:29 am »

Quote from: lostking2008 on August 19, 2020, 02:50:58 am

I believe one option is to make a blank Flash/SRAM module using memory ICs with alternative packages, e.g. TSOP-48 with DIP-48 socket adapter. Then it should be straightforward to program the two flash ICs individually with a universal programmer prior to assembling the memory module.

1. There is no room for bigger packages.
2. How do you propose to read a working module?

By the way, I ordered a TE connector you suggested (TE 5-5179009-3). Unfortunately, the slot is too narrow. It was not specified on the drawings because it is not a card edge connector, but a board-to-board connector, and should mate with a matching male connector. No luck. And I still did not figure out the schematic of the module.

lostking2008 · « **Reply #32 on:** August 19, 2020, 04:22:17 pm »

1. The Fluke 199C comes with at least two type of memory modules, see some photos at
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/buysellwanted/wanted-non-working-flashsram-memory-modules-from-fluke-190bc-series/msg3169542/#msg3169542

I tried the 5-5179009-3 Board-to-Board Receptacles. It seems a little narrow for the 1.2 mm pcb card type memory module (bottom photo in the above link), but it indeed can be pressed into the female connector.

The module (shown in the top photo of the above link) fits the TE connector better. This type of memory module will lay flat, paralleled to the main PCA. It saves more room than the cartridge memory module. So if a blank module can be designed like this it will accommodate four memory IC chips with TSOP-48 package or something similar.

2. Patpat proposed an excellent utility called FlashFW2bin back in 2017:
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/microcontrollers/fluke-19xbcii-firmware-to-binary-converter/

This utility supposes to takes the firmware file (Tetra.ldf, or data.bin) from within Fluke's FlashTool
(F190_II_V11.44.exe, FlashTool_19xC_2xC_V804.exe, FlashTool_F190C_V615.exe, etc.)
and converts it into 2 binary files for analysis purposes. FlashTool_19xC_2xC_V804.exe still is on Fluke website. But I don't know how to run the utility because my Windows 7 won't do it. Could you give it a try?

3. I concur the main obstacle right now is to figure out the schematics of the Flash/SRAM memory module pcb. It might be possible to remove the 4 memory ICs and trace the circuit for a donor or even non-working module.

USMC_Spike · « **Reply #33 on:** February 03, 2021, 08:19:08 am »

This is good stuff, thank you Feedback.loop.

I've gone through the process of trying to get my lowly 199 black & white meter
up and running as I've not used it in about a year. We know the routine.
Dead battery, plug in and let is charge for a few hours and then get start it up.

I checked things then turned off the power while it charged over night
thinking I'd follow Feedback.loop and use a LIon battery pack that I'll
have to make.

Bad news is I think this battery pack died. I tried to power up again and it wouldn't.
This is my second battery pack and they all do the same, they die on you and refuse
to start up again.

I know I'll need to add the 120K resistor, no problem.

QUESTION(S):

I can source six of the batteries to make the batterypack, no problem.
My question is to build the pyramid I'm not sure if I can solder leads to
the battery ends with out damaging them. Is there a method?

I assume that manufactured packs come from the factory with spot welded
leads and hook ups. Then I learned that I have to use the parallel series
protection board...you mentioned you'd share the gerbers.

I'm not very experienced doing SMD, I have some practice boards that I
destroy all the time. I've got no problems doing tube gear and older
test equipment as they have discreet components. I don't have a
hot air attachment for my rework station, which I think is needed
as I'm good at melting the SMD parts.

So, what is the best way to proceed?

Spike

feedback.loop · « **Reply #34 on:** February 03, 2021, 04:40:41 pm »

Gerbers were discussed with respect to keypad, not BMS. I always buy BMS. So many types are readily available for a few bucks.

RCO_JOE · « **Reply #35 on:** March 18, 2021, 03:35:04 pm »

@feedback.loop

I am a big fan of your personality and "Close enough" attitude on creating your solutions. I have watched your battery replacement on the 199C at least 50 times before i made the attempt on my 199B. I used a 100K resistor in series which produced a final voltage of 7.97 volts. I just wanted to share this info because it is difficult to find the voltage to the resistance value on a project like this.

My objective was to put abundant safety first in my scope since it will be sitting on the shelf more than being a daily used item.

EHT · « **Reply #36 on:** March 20, 2021, 12:26:16 am »

I think the backlight on my 196B is starting to get a bit dodgy. It takes a little while to 'warm up' and it's now noticeably brighter in the bottom left corner. Perhaps it could be the HV supply to it but I suspect the lamp. I can't find a thread about fixing this. From the service manual it looks like the lamp is integrated into the LCD module $:-\$ Anyone tried fixing the backlight? (maybe deserves a new thread if so...)

smaultre · « **Reply #37 on:** April 18, 2021, 01:13:57 pm »

Hi! Who know any terminal command to read the unit serial number? My two devices has abandoned stickers on back panel.

feedback.loop · « **Reply #38 on:** June 15, 2021, 07:14:08 am »

Finally I got around to this project of replicating a memory module for Fluke 19xBC scopemeters.

Runco990 · « **Reply #39 on:** June 15, 2021, 08:57:58 pm »

Wow... that is impressive!

Should you decide to offer this in the future, I would be in the market for one module.

feedback.loop · « **Reply #40 on:** June 15, 2021, 10:44:43 pm »

Quote from: Runco990 on June 15, 2021, 08:57:58 pm

Wow... that is impressive!

Should you decide to offer this in the future, I would be in the market for one module.

Do you have a scopemeter with no memory module? What model? Do you care about the firmware version?

Runco990 · « **Reply #41 on:** June 16, 2021, 02:19:41 am »

I picked up a 199c a long time ago with hopes to repair it.... the module and battery were missing.
At the time, the scope meter was free, so I didn't care and shelved it for a better day.
If I can get it going, I already plan to do your battery mod.
I DO know the scope works, as I had a chance to test it with a memory module from another one.

Love your videos, btw! Always a treat!

Quote from: feedback.loop
link=topic=248730.msg3588783#msg3588783 date=1623797083

Quote from: Runco990 on June 15, 2021, 08:57:58 pm
Wow... that is impressive!

Should you decide to offer this in the future, I would be in the market for one module.

Do you have a scopemeter with no memory module? What model? Do you care about the firmware version?

feedback.loop · « **Reply #42 on:** June 16, 2021, 03:37:53 pm »

Uploading the firmware just in case anyone is interested.

asis · « **Reply #43 on:** June 17, 2021, 10:17:22 am »

Hi,

Serial number of your "reference" scopmeter: DM8460252 (look at the back of the case, bearing in mind that the cover may be from another device)
.
The dump (s) you have read contain the SW, S / N and calibration constants of this instrument only with its actual serial number (DM840252).

Several years ago, I was not tasked with cloning the A201 module.

I just did the work of reverse engineering this module without unsoldering anything, in about the same manner as you did, and made an adapter for programmer, with the help of which, copied the contents of FlashRAM in two steps 16bit x 2 = 32 bit.

I copied working dumps v702, v804 from them and made an UPDATE to Fluke 225C with busheat and language support.

If you do this, your hands will be untied and you will feel confident.
The serial number of the device is fragmented and located in different SST39VF800A chips.

The most interesting is how do you UPDATE SW to v7.0 - v8.04?

Fluke stated that UPDATE SW from v6.12 to v7.00 can only be done at a service center with a 5500A or similar calibrator.

In any case, you have done a great job.

My congratulations.

feedback.loop · « **Reply #44 on:** June 17, 2021, 03:47:29 pm »

Hi asis,

Yes, the number is correct.
Please give more details. Where is the number located?
What connector did you use for your adapter? I could not find a suitable connector. Do you have a part number?

I made one more module and updated it to 6.15, which worked fine. No idea yet how to go to 8.04.
It seems I need to figure out the calibration process since the copied module does not match another unit anyway.
Looking at the documentation, it seems quite simple, and I have everything except one thing: a source of 50Vpp 1KHz square wave.
Perhaps I could arrange a special circuit for this, but that is another project.

feedback.loop · « **Reply #45 on:** June 20, 2021, 04:09:16 am »

In the previous video this original Fluke memory module was taken apart to trace connections on the board and to read FLASH chips. In this episode the module was put back together.

Per Hansson · « **Reply #46 on:** June 20, 2021, 09:47:28 am »

Very nice job!
Will you experiment with trying to make an external programmer for it now as some people theorized would be possible?
Would be nice to be able to make a safety backup of the CAL constants of the meter I have

feedback.loop · « **Reply #47 on:** June 20, 2021, 06:02:33 pm »

Quote from: Per Hansson on June 20, 2021, 09:47:28 am

Very nice job!
Will you experiment with trying to make an external programmer for it now as some people theorized would be possible?
Would be nice to be able to make a safety backup of the CAL constants of the meter I have

That would be nice to have, but that is another project. So far I could not find a suitable connector. 40x2=80 pins 0.8mm pitch 1.2mm slot.

Per Hansson · « **Reply #48 on:** June 20, 2021, 06:30:36 pm »

There is only one connector on Mouser with a pitch of 0.8mm, but the slot seems to be 1.0mm:
https://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/TE-Connectivity/440360-2?qs=WZRMhwwaLl8LRBi%2FdA7C5w%3D%3D

feedback.loop · « **Reply #49 on:** June 26, 2021, 12:10:28 am »

It seems that DigiKey ran out of CY62146G30-45BVXI RAM chips I bought for my first version for about $2/piece. Similar Cypress chips are $7.7/piece. So I looked around and found ISSI IS62WV25616EBLL-45BLI for $3.55/piece. I ordered a few chips, and built one more memory module. Works fine.

feedback.loop · « **Reply #50 on:** June 29, 2021, 11:37:59 pm »

Quote from: asis on June 17, 2021, 10:17:22 am

I copied working dumps v702, v804 from them and made an UPDATE to Fluke 225C with busheat and language support.

Could you share the dumps please?
Thank you.

Assafl · « **Reply #51 on:** September 30, 2021, 11:42:13 am »

Thanks for your videos. I put together a LiIon battery from a discarded bike battery and it works great (they are old 2200mAh cells - so they last "only" 7 hours! - and you don't have to fret the battery going dead for months).

Were you able to update to 225c?
AFAIK Bushealth option is a 10 character code away: Under USER -> VERSION & CAL menu click F1.

feedback.loop · « **Reply #52 on:** October 01, 2021, 03:12:24 am »

Quote from: Assafl on September 30, 2021, 11:42:13 am

Thanks for your videos. I put together a LiIon battery from a discarded bike battery and it works great (they are old 2200mAh cells - so they last "only" 7 hours! - and you don't have to fret the battery going dead for months).

Were you able to update to 225c?
AFAIK Bushealth option is a 10 character code away: Under USER -> VERSION & CAL menu click F1.

Do you know how to update to 225C?

Assafl · « **Reply #53 on:** October 01, 2021, 04:49:00 am »

Quote from: feedback.loop on October 01, 2021, 03:12:24 am

Do you know how to update to 225C?

Click on F1 in the VERSION & CAL menu.

Click on F1

I don't know what the code is though. An online search came up empty. I didn't even come across an option to update from Fluke. Maybe it was a shelved upgrade path?

asis · « **Reply #54 on:** October 02, 2021, 07:05:21 am »

Hi,
Static SRAM (CY62147CV33) located on the module A201 together with FlashRAM (ST39VF800A) is used to save TrendPlot Waveform and Setup data in Recorder mode.
Therefore, even if the scope is turned off, the module is still powered and consumes current until the battery is completely discharged.
In addition, the RTC is also powered by a battery.
Ultimately, the battery is completely discharged, which can lead to its complete degradation.
Therefore, after you have measured and saved the results, try to upload the data to the FlukeView SW as quickly as possible.
I suggest installing some kind of switch in the device that physically disconnects the battery and thereby extends its service life.
(Which, in fact, did).
The disadvantage is that the next time you turn on the device, you need to set the Date / Time, if this is important when creating reports.
Remember to turn on the switch to charge the battery.

feedback.loop · « **Reply #55 on:** October 02, 2021, 04:16:37 pm »

Quote from: asis on October 02, 2021, 07:05:21 am

Static SRAM (CY62147CV33) located on the module A201 together with FlashRAM (ST39VF800A) is used to save TrendPlot Waveform and Setup data in Recorder mode.
Therefore, even if the scope is turned off, the module is still powered and consumes current until the battery is completely discharged.

SRAM chips consume about 8-9 uA in standby, and Flash chips consume about 4 uA. I don't see any reason to worry about it.

feedback.loop · « **Reply #56 on:** October 03, 2021, 10:41:05 pm »

A dedicated programmer for Fluke 19x memory modules was developed including software in C for an Atmel microcontroller and a piece of software in Python to control the programmer from a PC.

Xenawise · « **Reply #57 on:** October 04, 2021, 07:41:47 pm »

I must congratulate you on this project. Surely many, many hours of work has gone into this and I for one have to say I am appreciative of all this hard work.

Any plans on making this public and/or open source? I for one think I would like to build one of these as I too have a few of these 199C scopes in my lab.

If you do decide to make it public or even decide to sell it or ask for donations, I just want you to know I would be interested.

Again, thanks for the all the hard work you have done to bring this to life.

Regards,

Xenawise

feedback.loop · « **Reply #58 on:** October 05, 2021, 01:49:39 am »

Quote from: Xenawise on October 04, 2021, 07:41:47 pm

I must congratulate you on this project. Surely many, many hours of work has gone into this and I for one have to say I am appreciative of all this hard work.

Any plans on making this public and/or open source? I for one think I would like to build one of these as I too have a few of these 199C scopes in my lab.

If you do decide to make it public or even decide to sell it or ask for donations, I just want you to know I would be interested.

Again, thanks for the all the hard work you have done to bring this to life.

Regards,

Xenawise

Is there anything wrong with your units? What would you like to do with them? Keep in mind that upgrading like this will need recalibration. I built a module for a scope with a missing module, so it needs recalibration anyway. Also I don't know (yet) how to modify the serial number in the Flash so that it would match the one marked on the back cover. I would love to know how to do this.

As to making it public, perhaps I could. Perhaps, I also could build the remaining 4 boards if someone is interested. (I wonder what would be a reasonable fee for this).

Per Hansson · « **Reply #59 on:** October 05, 2021, 08:06:38 pm »

It would be interesting to be able to make a backup for sure of a working unit, flash chips do fail as you know.
At least when you have a backup you are assured your unit will never fail in a way requiring the backup

Thank you very much for making this video series, it has been very interesting!

Assafl · « **Reply #60 on:** October 07, 2021, 06:53:07 pm »

Quote from: feedback.loop on October 01, 2021, 03:12:24 am

Quote from: Assafl on September 30, 2021, 11:42:13 am
Thanks for your videos. I put together a LiIon battery from a discarded bike battery and it works great (they are old 2200mAh cells - so they last "only" 7 hours! - and you don't have to fret the battery going dead for months).

Were you able to update to 225c?
AFAIK Bushealth option is a 10 character code away: Under USER -> VERSION & CAL menu click F1.

Do you know how to update to 225C?

This works: https://xdevs.com/doc/Fluke/19x_2xxC_Scopemeter/fw_V804_225C_for_199C/

feedback.loop · « **Reply #61 on:** October 08, 2021, 03:15:07 am »

Quote from: Assafl on October 07, 2021, 06:53:07 pm

Quote from: feedback.loop on October 01, 2021, 03:12:24 am
Quote from: Assafl on September 30, 2021, 11:42:13 am
Thanks for your videos. I put together a LiIon battery from a discarded bike battery and it works great (they are old 2200mAh cells - so they last "only" 7 hours! - and you don't have to fret the battery going dead for months).

Were you able to update to 225c?
AFAIK Bushealth option is a 10 character code away: Under USER -> VERSION & CAL menu click F1.

Do you know how to update to 225C?

This works: https://xdevs.com/doc/Fluke/19x_2xxC_Scopemeter/fw_V804_225C_for_199C/

Yes, that worked! Thank you very much!

mr.fabe · « **Reply #62 on:** October 08, 2021, 11:32:27 am »

Quote from: Assafl on October 07, 2021, 06:53:07 pm

This works: https://xdevs.com/doc/Fluke/19x_2xxC_Scopemeter/fw_V804_225C_for_199C/

Do you know if recalibration is necessary after using this flash tool?

Thanks!

Enginerding · « **Reply #63 on:** October 09, 2021, 01:54:43 am »

@feedback

Great attention to fine details in your vids.

Any chance you have one of those PCB's left, or can share the gerbers you made?

Assafl · « **Reply #64 on:** October 10, 2021, 09:40:29 am »

Quote from: mr.fabe on October 08, 2021, 11:32:27 am

Quote from: Assafl on October 07, 2021, 06:53:07 pm
This works: https://xdevs.com/doc/Fluke/19x_2xxC_Scopemeter/fw_V804_225C_for_199C/
Do you know if recalibration is necessary after using this flash tool?

Thanks!

According to https://www.fluke.com/en-us/support/software-downloads/fluke-190c-series-or-2x5c-series updating to 8.x needs recalibration if updating from 6.xx versions. For 7 & up recalibration isn't necessary (at least according to the Fluke site).

feedback.loop · « **Reply #65 on:** October 12, 2021, 03:37:15 pm »

Quote from: Enginerding on October 09, 2021, 01:54:43 am

@feedback

Great attention to fine details in your vids.

Any chance you have one of those PCB's left, or can share the gerbers you made?

Yes, I am thinking about publishing this, and building the remaining boards. Give me a few days.

feedback.loop · « **Reply #66 on:** October 19, 2021, 12:06:06 am »

Here we go: https://github.com/feedbackloopchannel/fluke19x-programmer

PM for assembled boards.

Enginerding · « **Reply #67 on:** October 20, 2021, 12:14:13 am »

@FeedbackLoop, I'm embarrassed I wasn't more clear, but was referencing the replacement keypad. Derp on me.

But I see the community has been blessed with another amazing project. Thank you.

Would it be possible to share those board files also?

commongrounder · « **Reply #68 on:** November 03, 2021, 08:23:08 pm »

Quote from: feedback.loop on October 02, 2021, 04:16:37 pm

Quote from: asis on October 02, 2021, 07:05:21 am
Static SRAM (CY62147CV33) located on the module A201 together with FlashRAM (ST39VF800A) is used to save TrendPlot Waveform and Setup data in Recorder mode.
Therefore, even if the scope is turned off, the module is still powered and consumes current until the battery is completely discharged.

SRAM chips consume about 8-9 uA in standby, and Flash chips consume about 4 uA. I don't see any reason to worry about it.

I happened to come across this thread just as I was replacing the battery pack in my 199c Scopemeter. I went and set up to measure the current draw in various states. This is using a bench power supply set to 8.4 volts, and current limited to 1.5 amps.
Standby current: 840 microamps
Peak startup current: 1.221 amps
Running current: 880 milliamps bright backlight
Running current: 808 milliamps dim backlight
I did do a power up sequence using a current clamp on my scope. If anybody wants to see that, I can post it here. Nothing other than the backlight setting changed the running current.

noidea · « **Reply #69 on:** December 01, 2021, 05:07:22 pm »

Quote from: Assafl on October 07, 2021, 06:53:07 pm

Quote from: feedback.loop on October 01, 2021, 03:12:24 am
Quote from: Assafl on September 30, 2021, 11:42:13 am
Thanks for your videos. I put together a LiIon battery from a discarded bike battery and it works great (they are old 2200mAh cells - so they last "only" 7 hours! - and you don't have to fret the battery going dead for months).

Were you able to update to 225c?
AFAIK Bushealth option is a 10 character code away: Under USER -> VERSION & CAL menu click F1.

Do you know how to update to 225C?

This works: https://xdevs.com/doc/Fluke/19x_2xxC_Scopemeter/fw_V804_225C_for_199C/

Do you know if this will work with a 196C or is there any way of upgrading a 196C to enable this?

Per Hansson · « **Reply #70 on:** December 06, 2021, 07:42:46 pm »

A special thanks to feedback.loop for this project, I now have a backup of my unit

I did run into a special case, but it is solved by simply installing a later version of Phyton 2.7 that I used here:

Code: [Select]

python programmer.py -i
  File "programmer.py", line 54
    print('.', end = '', flush = True)
                   ^
SyntaxError: invalid syntax

However I did find out that the connector in my unit is not in the best shape, because the unit did not power back on after re-assembly until I cleaned it a bit.
It is made by a company called SUYIN and has the marking 18215
The mating connector on the memory board has the marking 28304
I did find this connector on their website and asked how it could be bought but got no reply.
I also asked Fluke but their reply was that the connector with PCB designation X3501 and their part number: 0016 105 00041 is no longer available.
If anyone has some idea where to find it that would be nice, both for my unit but also for the programmer project itself of course...

asis · « **Reply #71 on:** December 07, 2021, 04:00:27 am »

Hi,
For every taste.

Per Hansson · « **Reply #72 on:** December 09, 2021, 07:27:34 pm »

Thanks for your message asis.
Perhaps I should have been clearer: feedback.loop has used connector 5-5179009-3 for his programmer project.
But he has stated in his latest video and in the project details that it is not a perfect fit for Fluke's original part.
That is the part I have mentioned in my previous post.
It would be best to find the exact part: because otherwise both connectors need to be replaced to get a proper fit...

asis · « **Reply #73 on:** December 10, 2021, 01:06:22 am »

Hi,

Ordering Code: 0016 105 00041 - May be Fluke manufacturing specification, but is a purchase item.
It's just a unified product from different manufacturers.
It is the size and presence of gilding on the contacts that are important here, and not the feeling that it is tight.
Notice the second line in Table 8-3. Main PCA Parts:
B2000 QUARTZ CRYSTAL 25.00MHZ C2 Ordering Code: 4022 303 20181
I'm talking about that.
--
I do not quite understand the purpose of creating this programmer (device).
It can be made easier.
Purchase two connectors for A201, make a backplane and route the data bus to different connectors (0-15 = I; 16-32 = II) and read / write in two steps, swapping (or switching the data bus) A201.
Any programmer that read / write SST39VF800A chips can be used.

The address bus, control bus and strobes are parallel. To prohibit access to SDRAM, pull up ROMCS1 to VDF so that it does not interfere.
(You still need the Fluke Flash Tool to update and calibrate, and in your case, you will need to collect a complete dump.)
If you are pursuing the goal of cloning A201 modules and putting them on stream, then there are doubts about this business, since the calibration process is not produced.
Although, this is your right.

It is important that you do it with incredible persistence, which commands respect.

Assafl · « **Reply #74 on:** December 23, 2021, 05:17:45 pm »

Quote from: noidea on December 01, 2021, 05:07:22 pm

Quote from: Assafl on October 07, 2021, 06:53:07 pm
Quote from: feedback.loop on October 01, 2021, 03:12:24 am
Quote from: Assafl on September 30, 2021, 11:42:13 am
Thanks for your videos. I put together a LiIon battery from a discarded bike battery and it works great (they are old 2200mAh cells - so they last "only" 7 hours! - and you don't have to fret the battery going dead for months).

Were you able to update to 225c?
AFAIK Bushealth option is a 10 character code away: Under USER -> VERSION & CAL menu click F1.

Do you know how to update to 225C?

This works: https://xdevs.com/doc/Fluke/19x_2xxC_Scopemeter/fw_V804_225C_for_199C/

Do you know if this will work with a 196C or is there any way of upgrading a 196C to enable this?

It won't I think work with a 196. I know the PC board assembly is the same for all versions of the Scopemeter and Fluke Service Center sets the correct model somehow. Maybe it is a command in the Mask ROM.

asis · « **Reply #75 on:** December 23, 2021, 08:26:35 pm »

Hi,
How do you look at it?

Now, I wanted to ask you:
how do you explain the fact that any cloned module works successfully in any scopemeter.

It turns out that the mechanisms for checking the ROM ASIC mask (UHM Universal Host Mask v3.0) do not start and this is only required when SW updates and / or calibration are performed via the PM9080 or OC4USB cable and the Fluke Flash Tool and MET / CAL.

During calibration, a report (certificate) is generated, tied to the serial number of the scopemetr and is an integral part of the calibrators Fluke 5500A or similar.

feedback.loop · « **Reply #76 on:** December 24, 2021, 03:14:25 am »

asis, do you happen to know how to change the serial number in the FLASH? perhaps there is a checksum that needs to be adjusted or something like this?

asis · « **Reply #77 on:** December 24, 2021, 09:42:58 am »

Hi,

I have not thoroughly analyzed the dump.
But, during the period when I was working on the A201 module, there was an attempt to replace part of the dump (modification) of the American version of SN (7-digits) with the European (8-digits), which did not lead to anything.
The Flash Tool did not accept the SN that I was trying to enter in the "Instrument: DM" field.
There should be a mechanism for calculating the checksum, but I do not know it.
In fact, you have everything to get started with this work.

Plus Fluke probably uses serial number ranges for the scopemeter's various models.
Good luck!

jasom · « **Reply #78 on:** February 19, 2022, 04:10:24 pm »

Hello, is there some way how indentify serial number from scope? My sticker is missing and I cant do update. Thank You

hugos31 · « **Reply #79 on:** February 28, 2022, 03:48:28 pm »

Please, someone explain to me how to update my fluke 196c to 215c. I need it for the can bus measurement...

alpher · « **Reply #80 on:** March 11, 2022, 10:07:31 pm »

Hi, anyone care to share the latest firmware for 199c ?
Looks like Fluke pulled it from their website, I have one with firmware 7.02 and like to uppgrade to the latest.
Much appreciated.

feedback.loop · « **Reply #81 on:** March 13, 2022, 08:51:09 pm »

Quote from: alpher on March 11, 2022, 10:07:31 pm

Hi, anyone care to share the latest firmware for 199c ?
Looks like Fluke pulled it from their website, I have one with firmware 7.02 and like to uppgrade to the latest.
Much appreciated.

attached

feedback.loop · « **Reply #82 on:** March 13, 2022, 08:53:11 pm »

This is a new version of the Li-ion battery pack for Fluke 19x scopemeters.

CORRECTION: the label on the battery pack should have said 6300 mAh. The donor pack was 3s2p, and I tested each PAIR before building the pack, and measured about 4200 each. But then the pack was reconfigured as 2s3p. Sorry about this confusion.

alpher · « **Reply #83 on:** March 14, 2022, 12:31:17 am »

Quote from: feedback.loop on March 13, 2022, 08:51:09 pm

Quote from: alpher on March 11, 2022, 10:07:31 pm
Hi, anyone care to share the latest firmware for 199c ?
Looks like Fluke pulled it from their website, I have one with firmware 7.02 and like to uppgrade to the latest.
Much appreciated.

attached

Thx.

calin · « **Reply #84 on:** May 28, 2022, 11:46:40 pm »

I just got a 199C ... with a bad keypad (this one seems usual); no battery and no fan.

Battery I got a new one of Amazon, just because I am lazy to make the amazing LiPo one that Feedbackloop has built.

I solved the fan issue with a Noctua NF-A4-X10 40x40mm I had lying around plus a bit of cable cutting. Yeah way too fancy and expensive but it was just sitting thrown in a box. It takes a tad more power than the standard one but I think is OK.

Now the keypad. I confirmed that the scopemeter works on all (most) functions emulating the keypad with a jumper wire .. CAREFULLY !!! and with a steady hand short correct row and column and Bob's your uncle. I found one for about 75$ on the fleabay but sincerely I would rather do the board mod rather than spending 75$ on a piece of paper waiting to go bad again soon. Does anyone has one to sell ? Maybe Feedbackloop

Oh yeah the charger ... By miracle I had a laptop charger with the good voltage in the junk bin; a bit of cable surgery to flip polarity to negative center and put a normal barrel connector on its end and happy camper.

EHT · « **Reply #85 on:** May 30, 2022, 09:50:42 pm »

Quote from: calin on May 28, 2022, 11:46:40 pm

Now the keypad. I confirmed that the scopemeter works on all (most) functions emulating the keypad with a jumper wire .. CAREFULLY !!! and with a steady hand short correct row and column and Bob's your uncle. I found one for about 75$ on the fleabay but sincerely I would rather do the board mod rather than spending 75$ on a piece of paper waiting to go bad again soon. Does anyone has one to sell ? Maybe Feedbackloop

You can check to see if one of the row/column lines is shorted to ground on your keypad foil. If so, you can try to fix this by peeling away the ground plane from the affected track where it bends.

calin · « **Reply #86 on:** May 31, 2022, 05:09:25 am »

Yes, I tried but looks like something else has gone crazy on the keypad and I gave up the fight. Anyhow I found this 75$ but it is the board not the foil one - https://www.ebay.com/itm/231220191481 . I pulled the trigger and got one, I hope is not just the board but it comes with a connector and cable. Will let you know.

BTW, for those that want some probes that look like the originals, they are pretty close .. at least in looks and promised performance of 300Mhz; so they should do it OK. One advantage, they don't have the insane price as the original ones - see here https://www.ebay.com/itm/185411884333

feedback.loop · « **Reply #87 on:** May 31, 2022, 05:20:24 am »

Quote from: calin on May 31, 2022, 05:09:25 am

Yes, I tried but looks like something else has gone crazy on the keypad and I gave up the fight. Anyhow I found this 75$ but it is the board not the foil one - https://www.ebay.com/itm/231220191481 . I pulled the trigger and got one, I hope is not just the board but it comes with a connector and cable. Will let you know.

BTW, for those that want some probes that look like the originals, they are pretty close .. at least in looks and promised performance of 300Mhz; so they should do it OK. One advantage, they don't have the insane price as the original ones - see here https://www.ebay.com/itm/185411884333

Post the pictures of this keypad please. I thought that for $75 they have a decent replica of the original.

EHT · « **Reply #88 on:** May 31, 2022, 08:17:12 pm »

Quote from: calin on May 31, 2022, 05:09:25 am

BTW, for those that want some probes that look like the originals, they are pretty close .. at least in looks and promised performance of 300Mhz; so they should do it OK. One advantage, they don't have the insane price as the original ones - see here https://www.ebay.com/itm/185411884333

Good find. I bought a couple of these Staubli Isoprobes (version II i think) which I believe are the same as the original. Can't see them for a good price now though. The Chinese ones look the same as that

calin · « **Reply #89 on:** June 01, 2022, 01:13:02 am »

Yes, I will make a good photo once I get it. I dropped them a message and they did confirm that it comes with connector and flat flex cable. Looks like is the same guy that is behind http://scopemeterrepair.com/

dirtcooker · « **Reply #90 on:** June 05, 2022, 03:30:20 am »

Quote from: calin on June 01, 2022, 01:13:02 am

Yes, I will make a good photo once I get it. I dropped them a message and they did confirm that it comes with connector and flat flex cable. Looks like is the same guy that is behind http://scopemeterrepair.com/

I just bought one of these https://www.ebay.com/itm/231220191481
It took 10 minutes to install and my Fluke 199C is back up and running. The quality of the key contact board is excellent. Prior to the repair, my 199c powered up, responded to signals on the probes, but did not respond to any other keys except, holding down power and user reset to factory as intended.

minhhvktqs · « **Reply #91 on:** June 06, 2022, 09:48:16 am »

Hello
I have a Fluke 196C. But it is not working:((
This ram is bad.
Can you help me?
can you send me a file ( gerber....) for Module Ram.
Thanks u so much

dirtcooker · « **Reply #92 on:** June 07, 2022, 07:35:26 pm »

Quote from: feedback.loop on October 03, 2021, 10:41:05 pm

A dedicated programmer for Fluke 19x memory modules was developed including software in C for an Atmel microcontroller and a piece of software in Python to control the programmer from a PC.

fantastic work! I would be grateful if you could post gerbers for the memory modules. Even better if you could make the modules available for sale, perhaps on a kickstarter, and maybe a preprogrammed option too. I would certainly buy one for $100. I just replaced the keypad contacts in my 199c, and now it seems that the memory modules go bad as well. I was under the false assumption that Fluke stuff was indestructible. Given that a comparable fluke 190-202 costs US $5k, it is well worth having a spare module.

Note: to clarify, my 199c is working well now, but it would be nice to have some spare parts for it.

feedback.loop · « **Reply #93 on:** June 07, 2022, 10:52:27 pm »

Quote from: dirtcooker on June 07, 2022, 07:35:26 pm

fantastic work! I would be grateful if you could post gerbers for the memory modules. Even better if you could make the modules available for sale, perhaps on a kickstarter, and maybe a preprogrammed option too. I would certainly buy one for $100. I just replaced the keypad contacts in my 199c, and now it seems that the memory modules go bad as well. I was under the false assumption that Fluke stuff was indestructible. Given that a comparable fluke 190-202 costs US $5k, it is well worth having a spare module.

Do you mean that your module is fine, but you want to have a spare just in case? I doubt this is really necessary. Anything can fail, of course, but I don't think these modules fail often. And if you don't copy your module, but just buy some other random module, it will have different calibration and different serial number.

It would be cool to know how to change serial numbers, and even better to know how to read and write modules right in the scope. Fluke must have some utility for that I am almost sure.

smaultre · « **Reply #94 on:** June 21, 2022, 06:29:44 am »

Can anybody add the double flash dump "low.bin and high.bin" as pictired

For 199C 7.xx or any upgradeble to 8.xx flash?
And i need the same for 199B (Black/White LCD).

feedback.loop · « **Reply #95 on:** June 21, 2022, 07:09:57 am »

Quote from: smaultre on June 21, 2022, 06:29:44 am

Can anybody add the double flash dump "low.bin and high.bin" as pictired

For 199C 7.xx or any upgradeble to 8.xx flash?
And i need the same for 199B (Black/White LCD).

Do you care about calibration and serial number?

smaultre · « **Reply #96 on:** June 22, 2022, 04:15:39 pm »

Hello, no, i don't care, i have a calibration eqip for these..

feedback.loop · « **Reply #97 on:** June 22, 2022, 04:35:34 pm »

Here is the latest 8.04 version with BusHealth option.
https://github.com/feedbackloopchannel/fluke19x-programmer
You just need to split it into low and high, which can be done in a few lines of, say, Python.

smaultre · « **Reply #98 on:** June 22, 2022, 07:01:38 pm »

000FFFF0 - the split?

feedback.loop · « **Reply #99 on:** June 22, 2022, 07:12:10 pm »

Quote from: smaultre on June 22, 2022, 07:01:38 pm

000FFFF0 - the split?

I don't understand your question, but I guess that you are not sure how to do the splitting.
Here it is attached.

feedback.loop · « **Reply #100 on:** July 12, 2022, 06:15:59 am »

Quote from: calin on June 01, 2022, 01:13:02 am

Yes, I will make a good photo once I get it. I dropped them a message and they did confirm that it comes with connector and flat flex cable. Looks like is the same guy that is behind http://scopemeterrepair.com/

Have you received this replacement part? I would love to see what it actually looks like. Thanks.

Ferrum · « **Reply #101 on:** September 19, 2022, 09:05:56 pm »

feedback.loop thanks for your work!
Your work helped me a lot and greatly simplified the installation of new batteries.

EHT · « **Reply #102 on:** September 22, 2022, 10:43:57 pm »

I'm still wondering if anyone has had to attempt replacement of the backlight or entire LCD. I see that the repair site listed above want $400 for a USED one, obviously not economically viable and may not last long anyway.

Ferrum · « **Reply #103 on:** September 28, 2022, 05:58:16 pm »

Collected manuals and diagrams for you

https://mega.nz/folder/tJBRABrS#F_W2j4ED2dR7qS0YI_zkxw

https://www.manualslib.com/products/Fluke-Scopemeter-199c-2783159.html

timeandfrequency · « **Reply #104 on:** November 03, 2022, 01:44:26 pm »

Many thanks feedback.loop for your comprehensive work on repairing Scopemeters.

***** How to retrieve the actual serial number of your Scopemeter *****

Context
I could not upgrade the firmware of my Fluke Scopemeter 199C because it once went to Fluke for repair/upgrade. They must have changed the motherboard. The number on the sticker (located at the rear of the device) did no longer match with the actual serial number of the motherboard. On the latter, I could not locate any sticker with a valid serial number.

How to?
So I wiretapped the serial connection to get the actual serial number of the motherboard.
Details on how to proceed are provided in the attached 7z file.

Enjoy

Jo08 · « **Reply #105 on:** January 18, 2023, 03:15:04 pm »

Hello
I changed my keyboard for one ordered on Aliexpresse, the new keyboard is shipped quickly, well protected by a polystyrene box.
The quality seems inferior to the original fluke keyboard, but everything works perfectly again.
https://fr.aliexpress.com/item/1005004649936018.html?gatewayAdapt=glo2fra
Thanks to feedback.loop for his help

asis · « **Reply #106 on:** January 18, 2023, 04:02:30 pm »

@timeandfrequency

Why is it so difficult?
Scope -> ON
OC4USB/PM9080 & COM: 1200;N;1;8;N.
QI 11 (QI_space_11)-QUERY INSTRUMENT = S/N

timeandfrequency · « **Reply #107 on:** January 18, 2023, 06:33:58 pm »

Hi asis,

Quote from: asis on January 18, 2023, 04:02:30 pm

Why is it so difficult?
[...]

Because I asked a few guys who repair scopemeters on how to proceed to catch the serial number, and nobody raised the idea of using ASCII commands to query the unit.
On my side, I actually use the scopemeter for its usual purpose, as an oscilloscope, without having any in-depth knowledge of its guts.

My aim was only to update the firmware and I was stuck because of a motherboard change. So, I did it my way, in a couple of hours, and succeeded. Then, I shared my experience.

Now, I'm glad to learn that an easier way exists, by just sending an 'ID' query to the unit. And for sure, your trick will be really helpful to other forum members.

feedback.loop · « **Reply #108 on:** January 18, 2023, 07:58:54 pm »

Hi asis,
do you know how to change the serial number?

asis · « **Reply #109 on:** January 18, 2023, 09:07:37 pm »

Hi feedback.loop,

As far as I understand, the serial number is programmed into the D-ASIC OTP ROM area at the production stage.
UHM Universal Host Mask checks it.
There is a DEBUG X3510 connector, but I haven't explored it.

feedback.loop · « **Reply #110 on:** January 18, 2023, 09:33:17 pm »

Quote from: asis on January 18, 2023, 09:07:37 pm

Hi feedback.loop,

As far as I understand, the serial number is programmed into the D-ASIC OTP ROM area at the production stage.
UHM Universal Host Mask checks it.
There is a DEBUG X3510 connector, but I haven't explored it.

Why it is also in the flash memory? Why in two places? Why the scopemeter works fine with a memory module from some other scopemeter (except calibration won't work, as I understand)

Assafl · « **Reply #111 on:** January 19, 2023, 07:15:14 am »

Quote from: feedback.loop on January 18, 2023, 09:33:17 pm

Why it is also in the flash memory? Why in two places? Why the scopemeter works fine with a memory module from some other scopemeter (except calibration won't work, as I understand)

I don't know why they kept the serial itself in two places but the ROM is where (I think) they kept the model type (192, 196 or 199). The serial number is then linked to the type (so that certain serial numbers are/aren't allowed to get certain updates - and the user doesn't get a free BW or feature update).

It was mentioned in one of the longer form service manuals that when the main board is not available except to service center as they have to program the device type in the board. I know that some of the Scopemeter repair shops do a model updates so maybe that ROM is rewritable? Or they use a hacked firmware (like the Bushealth firmware).

feedback.loop · « **Reply #112 on:** January 26, 2023, 07:43:23 pm »

I would love to know how to tweak the content of the flash to make the serial number there match the scopemeter (SN on the back cover). Suppose we have a scopemeter with a missing module. How can we produce a proper replacement from a copy of a module from another scope?

asis · « **Reply #113 on:** January 27, 2023, 02:15:15 am »

Hi feedback loop,

You just need to try to change the serial number in the dump and write it to any module you have.
In what addresses and chips - I already showed you.
You will probably need to find a place and recalculate the checksum.
The serial number can be taken from the photos posted on EBAY.
And, the QI_11 request will let you understand where it was read from.

rauldm · « **Reply #114 on:** February 24, 2023, 01:30:35 am »

Someone know if is possible upgrade Fluke 123 to 125? similar to 199c to 225c, Regards.
PD My 199C is now 225C.

flukeandhp · « **Reply #115 on:** March 11, 2023, 09:48:45 am »

Hi feedback.loop,
I appreciate all the information you have kindly provided in this thread and in your excellent videos.
I also purchased 199C from eBay, which was cheap and did not work. It had the symptoms, which many others have seen as well. The power button only produced a beep and nothing else happened. It wasn't very clear whether the mask-ROM or the normal software ran, since the expected signal produced by the mask-ROM was not in one of the keyboard lines. I was getting ready to ask if I could obtain a new FLASH/RAM board from you, but the problem turned out to be that the keyboard cable was not properly working or attached to its connector.

Anyone with the same symptoms that is one of the first things you should check.

professor_jonny · « **Reply #116 on:** May 08, 2023, 12:05:51 am »

HI

I have a 199c and it was dropped and it no longer operates.

upon opening it the memory module was not seated correclty and the red wire was broken off the battery.

I have repaired the battery and it just does a short beep when plugging in the battery or if you press the power button, is this indication of the memory module being faulty/ corrupt ?

I have tried to fit a new battery but still just the short beep sadly , I have access to another unit but I'm not keen to swap the module over and test the faulty unit if it some how messes or breaks the other unit.

Can I hot swap and boot with a working module and flash a new image with the firmware update tool or something?.

asis · « **Reply #117 on:** May 08, 2023, 06:16:30 am »

Hi,

Do you have a PM9080 or OC4USB communication cable?

professor_jonny · « **Reply #118 on:** May 08, 2023, 09:56:36 pm »

Yes I have the optical usb interface cable cable.

asis · « **Reply #119 on:** May 08, 2023, 10:57:09 pm »

Hi,
Move the RAM module to a working ScopeMeter after inspecting it first.
Plug in the power adapter and battery.

Fulfill the conditions described in SM RAM Test (page 20-21).
If you get a value of "zero" the module is OK.

Turn on ScopeMeter in normal mode - should work.

Move the RAM to the non-working SCOP and repeat the procedure.
I advise you to download the circuit and check all the base voltages.
Service Manual for Fluke 192/196/199 ScopeMeter.

professor_jonny · « **Reply #120 on:** May 09, 2023, 12:16:48 am »

I currently dont have access to the other meter it is in use but i get no respones from terminal command ID in the faulty unit.

I'm sure the com port is correct and settings are good, I can test with the other meter when it is back it is in one of the other sparky's van

willinsau · « **Reply #121 on:** August 18, 2023, 12:43:30 pm »

This works: https://xdevs.com/doc/Fluke/19x_2xxC_Scopemeter/fw_V804_225C_for_199C/
[/quote]

The links looks doesnot work. Do someone succeeded before help to teach how to do this?

Regards,

feedback.loop · « **Reply #122 on:** August 21, 2023, 05:46:38 pm »

I believe I used this flash tool before to upgrade version 7+ to the latest 8.04 plus bushealth option.

willinsau · « **Reply #123 on:** August 22, 2023, 12:03:48 pm »

Quote from: feedback.loop on August 21, 2023, 05:46:38 pm

I believe I used this flash tool before to upgrade version 7+ to the latest 8.04 plus bushealth option.

So appreciate!

djsb · « **Reply #124 on:** September 05, 2023, 02:23:13 pm »

What software can be used to communicate with the fluke 199c via its optical interface? Thanks.

Assafl · « **Reply #125 on:** September 05, 2023, 04:39:31 pm »

Quote from: djsb on September 05, 2023, 02:23:13 pm

What software can be used to communicate with the fluke 199c via its optical interface? Thanks.

From Fluke it is Flukeview1. Version 5.4.

You'll need a key for full features.

You can also program it - attached is the programming guide.

Sigrok is also supposed to support it.

https://www.fluke.com/en-us/support/software-downloads/flukeview-for-scopemeter-test-tools

satmaster2000 · « **Reply #126 on:** October 14, 2023, 08:08:54 pm »

Hi feedback.loop!

my beloved Scopemeter 196c quit on me. The infamous "just beeps won't turn on"

Thanks to Fluke's fine Service-Manual I was able to query the scope via the Universal Host Mask software. here are the results:

Code: [Select]

XXXXX0
ID
0
Universal Host Mask software; UHM V3.0
XXXXX0
EX11,#H20400000,#H80000
0
XXXXX0
WW10000000,2,00020002
0
XXXXX0
EX12,#H44000000,#H100000
6
A ?

Looks to me, that I have a bad A1 module

If I remove the A1 Module, I get the same results. Is this to be expected?
Opon visual inspection I could not see any obvious defects on the module.
Tried to reflow it gently with the hotair soldering station, no luck.
Further Internet research broght me to your terrific YouTube video where you rebuilt such a memory module.
Is this module RAM only or is there also stuff stored (ROM) on it? If stuff is stored on it, what type is it? Firmware, Calibration data?

I would love to get my Scope back running again. Could you send me a memory module? All expenses and a tip are paid of course!

Feel free to PM me.

Cheers Satmaster

Asker_OFF · « **Reply #127 on:** November 12, 2023, 12:13:10 am »

Hi all! I am using a translator, so please forgive any possible inaccuracies in the wording.

So. I have a Fluke 199 C (European) and a Fluke 199 B (American).
There were no problems with the European one and I flashed it without difficulty. But with the second one there were difficulties checking the serial number.
Somehow it seemed like a good idea to rearrange the instrument memory modules and try to turn them on. If I was successful, I was going to just flash everything in one device. But, unexpectedly, I received two “bricks” instead of instruments. Apparently, at startup, some kind of data is written to the memory card.

At this point, the 199C started to start up, but for no more than 30 seconds. Then there will be either several reboots or just a shutdown. 199B does not turn on at all.
I ordered components for the programmer to make backup copies of what was left and will experiment. I don't want to lose the calibration of instruments. If anyone knows the location of the boot sector and/or the location of the calibration coefficients, I would be very grateful! The .bin-file for 199B and FlashTool 8.04 for American is also very useful.

Thank you very much in advance everyone! Wish me good luck!)

Andrey_Ak · « **Reply #128 on:** January 03, 2024, 01:48:40 pm »

Hello! I wanted to buy myself a Fluke 199C.
Tell me, I'm looking at this option:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/285549701043
What problems can there be when purchasing a used appliance? What should I pay attention to, how to choose a good device?

Following the ebay link, the device display shows the message:
"With this ScopeMeter we offer you a free bonus" what does this mean?

Asker_OFF · « **Reply #129 on:** March 13, 2024, 07:47:40 am »

You haven’t answered for a long time, so I’ll answer you)
When I chose my device, I looked at the condition of the case and the performance of the channels. The seller did not have a calibrator, so he could not demonstrate the accuracy of the readings. I asked him to make a video of him simply measuring some voltage-1. And he touches probe-2 with his finger. I needed to see that interference would appear on the screen, which meant that the channel was most likely alive.
Maybe I'm wrong somewhere, but that's exactly what I did with my purchase.


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