Author Topic: Fluke 289 not quite sorted.  (Read 28044 times)

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Offline Old Don

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Re: Fluke 289 not quite sorted.
« Reply #25 on: November 30, 2017, 02:02:31 pm »
Purpose - if you have a can of air handy you can turn it upside down and spray the board with it. It should freeze the components and help with locating the hot chip(s). First to defrost are the hottest ones. Also, making the PCB cold can help with finding a cold solder joint. Spray sections of the PCB and turn on, when it functions every time a section is cold you've localized the problem area. A soldering iron or hot air gun to reflow should solve a bad solder joint, but not a flaky chip.
Retired - Formerly: Navy ET, University of Buffalo Electronic Tech, Field Engineer and former laptop repair business owner
 

Offline purpose

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Re: Fluke 289 not quite sorted.
« Reply #26 on: November 30, 2017, 03:43:57 pm »
Thank you Sir... sound advice... No air handy but just ordered some.
 

Offline Yakuzza

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Re: Fluke 289 not quite sorted.
« Reply #27 on: December 03, 2017, 09:21:17 pm »
I’ve checked voltages and compare it to @purpose readings. Most of the readings where consisten with the “good” meter. Here are some issue I’ve found:

TP  “good”  mine
...   ...        ...
8     6.53   I couldn’t locate the TP
9     1.11   ~0
10   -2.49  I couldn’t locate the TP
11   0.46   It goes from -1mV up while measuring (I've waited until -33mV and stopped measuring)
...    ...      ...

The rest of the readings are very close to the “good” meter.

I managed to check with a thermal camera that there is a region with higher temperature, but the camera was really crappy so it might be a false positive. I shall check the chip name and spec and see if it makes sense to have higher temp in there. Actually higher temp was on 4 resistor and 1 capacitor on the right side of that chip (ad8617).

I guess, I can try to trace the path from TP 9 and 11 to see if it leads to anything suspicious, but without a service manual it will be like chasing a wind. Any advice anybody?
 

Offline frenky

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Re: Fluke 289 not quite sorted.
« Reply #28 on: December 12, 2017, 07:22:19 am »
@purpose: Is there any progress on the repair?

I have bought faulty Fluke 287 from ebay and it has very similar voltages on test points as yours.
When powered on the power led stays green for ever and on the lcd is Fluke logo. Current consumption is 42mA.
I have already removed all the MOVs and super cap. And washed it with IPA.
Next I'll check the power supply voltages on all ICs and frequencies of the oscillators.

« Last Edit: December 12, 2017, 07:39:23 am by frenky »
 

Offline frenky

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Re: Fluke 289 not quite sorted.
« Reply #29 on: December 12, 2017, 07:29:15 am »
The only two components heating up are main IC and Q9 with markings: 1.R





Q9:
« Last Edit: December 12, 2017, 07:41:53 am by frenky »
 

Offline purpose

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Re: Fluke 289 not quite sorted.
« Reply #30 on: December 12, 2017, 04:06:01 pm »
Hi Frenky,
No progress yet.
Mine shows nothing on the screen, so am thinking mine is failing earlier than yours in the boot process.
To the right of the battery pads is an unpopulated switch pad, marked S2 MSP RST. I'm wondering if this might be something worth exploring.

peter
 

Offline frenky

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Re: Fluke 289 not quite sorted.
« Reply #31 on: December 13, 2017, 06:45:41 am »
I measured oscillators and there is no signal from it. Weird that power button works if it is connected to the IC with "sleeping" oscillator?

Anyway I made a list of all ICs on the meter. (Attached pdf)
It is very strange that nobody tried to reverse engineer 287/289 in the last 10 years. Or at least tried to identify all the elements on it.
This would help many with repairing their faulty units.
« Last Edit: December 13, 2017, 07:12:20 am by frenky »
 

Offline frenky

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« Last Edit: December 13, 2017, 07:40:13 am by frenky »
 
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Offline purpose

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Re: Fluke 289 not quite sorted.
« Reply #33 on: December 13, 2017, 08:45:48 am »
Nice digging.
When I was in touch with Fluke, they said they could help with component ident, but a bom might be out of the question.
I'll try my luck.

peter

PS I've just fired of an e-mail.
« Last Edit: December 13, 2017, 08:57:06 am by purpose »
 

Offline frenky

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Re: Fluke 289 not quite sorted.
« Reply #34 on: December 13, 2017, 09:04:04 am »
Great. Any info will be usefull.

I might have identified a few more elements:

1AM (sot23) 2N3904
ARB (SC70) TPS715
338 (sot23) NDS338N or BC338
A8L (sot23)  MMUN2234
2A (sot23) 2N3906
A41 (sot23) 1S2836 or OPA364
LTKH (S5) LT1615ES5-1
IL44 (sot23) perhaps BAT54S
A6W (sot23) BAS16
1R (sot23) MMBT5089
EHs (sot23) BCW66H
SS (sot23) BSS138
337 (sot23) NDS337N or BC337
R1E (sot23) LM4041EEM3-1.2
RAD (SC70-5) LM4041
5B1 (sot23) XC6106B032MR or XC9236A11CM
JY (sot23) BAV199
6B (sot23) 2N5484 or BC817-25
« Last Edit: December 13, 2017, 09:16:02 am by frenky »
 

Offline retiredcaps

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Re: Fluke 289 not quite sorted.
« Reply #35 on: December 13, 2017, 08:04:42 pm »
It is very strange that nobody tried to reverse engineer 287/289 in the last 10 years. Or at least tried to identify all the elements on it.
I suspect that most owners of the very expensive 287/289 just take advanage of the "lifetime" or minimum 10 year warranty rather than fix it themselves.

Others who come here for help usually find that something in the input protection is wrong.
 

Offline frenky

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Re: Fluke 289 not quite sorted.
« Reply #36 on: December 14, 2017, 02:00:51 pm »
@retiredcaps:
Yes, that makes sense.

@purpose:
If you still have the good dmm available for inspection, could you repeat all the measurements again relative to the "- pad" instead of the COM?
I believe that "- pad" is GND for all the ICs on the board, but it is not on the same potential as COM.
And if you could do separate measurements for when dmm is powered off and on, would be really great.

I know that it would take quite some time and effort but it would be for greater good.  ;) :-DMM

« Last Edit: December 14, 2017, 02:04:52 pm by frenky »
 

Offline purpose

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Re: Fluke 289 not quite sorted.
« Reply #37 on: December 14, 2017, 02:28:11 pm »
I think I could arrange that, but only because you're from the land of Melania T.
 

Offline frenky

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Re: Fluke 289 not quite sorted.
« Reply #38 on: December 14, 2017, 05:25:54 pm »
Thank you. :-DD

Not to downplay Melania's importance  ;D but we are a bit more proud of two guys:
Goran Dragic "The dragon"- NBA basketball player at Miami Heat; also led our basketball team to victory on EuroBasket 2017
Anže Kopitar - professional ice hockey player and captain of the Los Angeles Kings

 

Offline sacral

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Re: Fluke 289 not quite sorted.
« Reply #39 on: December 20, 2017, 06:41:53 pm »
Hi Frenky,

I will reply here, maybe it will be useful for more people...
The test points are measured in ON (VCA position), on a functional Fluke 287 with the negative pole of the power supply as reference. On Off position, only a few test points have power, the other have 0 volts.
There are also a few TPs that i didn't find on the pcb and there are marked with x on the list. Of course I am to lazy to type all the values I find so I will post a picture with my note (I hope it will be clear enough)
 
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Offline frenky

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Re: Fluke 289 not quite sorted.
« Reply #40 on: December 20, 2017, 07:10:48 pm »
Thank you. That is really nice of you. ;)  :-+
 

Offline frenky

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Re: Fluke 289 not quite sorted.
« Reply #41 on: December 27, 2017, 10:07:59 am »
When I power on Fluke 287 I get this out of TX:

Code: [Select]
+jffs2_read_inode() failed

fs: Open failed, error 2
Can't load '/system/apps/clem.img': error 0

err_printf: aborting command
load /system/apps/clem.img failed... trying /system/apps/BackupClem.img

fs: Open failed, error 2
Can't load '/system/apps/BackupClem.img': error 0

err_printf: aborting command
load /system/apps/BackupClem.img failed

No network interfaces found

RedBoot(tm) bootstrap and debug environment [ROMRAM]
Non-certified release, version v2_0_74 - built 15:56:18, Sep 27 2007

Platform: Fluke Clem (ARM9)
Copyright (C) 2000, 2001, 2002, 2003, 2004 Red Hat, Inc.
Copyright (C) 2003, 2004, 2005, 2006, 2007 eCosCentric Limited

RAM: 0x00000000-0x007fb500, [0x0004dcb0-0x005d8500] available
FLASH: 0x10000000-0x107fffff, 63 x 0x20000 blocks, 4 x 0x8000 blocks
RedBoot>

Do I have to reflash firmware? Is that done over IR or with jtag?
 

Offline purpose

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Re: Fluke 289 not quite sorted.
« Reply #42 on: December 28, 2017, 04:29:09 pm »
I'd imagine having to use the jtag, as our meters are kaput.
There is some info in this pdf that might help.
media.fluke.com/documents/287-289_mveng0200.pdf

peter

 

Offline frenky

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Re: Fluke 289 not quite sorted.
« Reply #43 on: December 28, 2017, 07:58:01 pm »
Thank you. This document does help me understand how this dmm works a bit better.

I did some investigation around this debug console (baud rate 115200) that I have found:
(This serial console is not related with IR port, there is nothing being transmitted via IR during boot)



On TX I get error message about missing system image. So I tried to hook on with with computer but no luck.
When signal pulls RX to the ground both RX and TX go to LOW state and stay LOW until I reset dmm.

I tried adding 100k pullup resistors to both lines but that did not help.
Every time I try to send a command from PC to DMM both lines go LOW.
I have no idea why.

I have extracted Fluke's exe file and found clem_1_16.img.gz which is the missing file on my DMM. I would like to put it back on via serial port...

Quote
RedBoot allows download and execution of embedded applications via serial or Ethernet, including embedded Linux and eCos applications. It provides debug support in conjunction with GDB to allow development and debugging of embedded applications. It also provides an interactive command line interface to allow management of the Flash images, image download, RedBoot configuration, etc., accessible via serial or ethernet. For unattended or automated startup, boot scripts can be stored in Flash allowing for example loading of images from Flash, hard disk, or a TFTP server.
https://wiki.openwrt.org/doc/techref/bootloader/redboot
« Last Edit: December 28, 2017, 08:00:12 pm by frenky »
 

Offline purpose

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Re: Fluke 289 not quite sorted.
« Reply #44 on: December 28, 2017, 09:49:03 pm »
Frenky,
I barely know the difference between resistors and raspberries, so that's all gobbledegook to me, but I'll leave it to you young ones to get to the bottom of the software stuff.

BTW... did you get enough voltage info from sacral, or do you still need another testfest?
« Last Edit: December 28, 2017, 09:54:58 pm by purpose »
 

Offline frenky

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Re: Fluke 289 not quite sorted.
« Reply #45 on: December 31, 2017, 09:34:17 am »
Sorry for late answer...

I would still like to get voltages of this points if possible:



Thank you. :-DMM
« Last Edit: December 31, 2017, 03:29:39 pm by frenky »
 

Offline Yakuzza

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Re: Fluke 289 not quite sorted.
« Reply #46 on: January 01, 2018, 03:44:45 pm »
@retiredcaps
If there would be something wrong with the input protection, what would be the symptoms for the device? I would assume that the device should boot up normally, but one could not make any measurements. My unit doesn’t display anything on the LCD, but most of the voltages on test points seem to be similar to those listed by @purpose and @frenky. Can I assume that any potential issue with the input protection does not have anything to do with blank LCD?
I’ve just measured voltages as @sacral described in post #39 and below are those, for which I got different readings.

@sacral
My unit powers down after few minutes and so the voltages are changing. Maybe some of the measurements you’ve made were made after the “sleep”? I’m just asking. It is probably different because mine is broken ;)

Here are deviations from @sacral list:
TP 1: 0.005
TP 3: 4.96
TP 9: 2.28
TP 16: 2.91
TP 18: 1.81
TP 32: 3.07
TP 33: 3.07
TP 34: varies in a mV range
TP 37 0.057

How can I test the LCD? Anybody can give me some simple guiding for this task, so I could eliminate the faulty LCD, please?
 

Offline retiredcaps

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Re: Fluke 289 not quite sorted.
« Reply #47 on: January 01, 2018, 10:49:10 pm »
@retiredcaps
If there would be something wrong with the input protection, what would be the symptoms for the device? I would assume that the device should boot up normally, but one could not make any measurements.
Correct.
Quote
Can I assume that any potential issue with the input protection does not have anything to do with blank LCD?
Correct.
 

Offline purpose

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Re: Fluke 289 not quite sorted.
« Reply #48 on: January 04, 2018, 01:40:42 pm »
Frenky,
I'll have the meter on Friday night, until Saturday afternoon, so get your questions ready.

peter
 

Offline frenky

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Re: Fluke 289 not quite sorted.
« Reply #49 on: January 05, 2018, 06:50:36 am »
Sorted by preference:

1. Voltages on my image a few posts up.

2. Voltages of all test points

3. Voltages of all tantalum capacitors:



All voltages measured at power down state. And power on state with dial knob on AC Voltage.
Ground reference should be - pad of battery: https://goo.gl/NT8har

Thank you in advance. ;)
« Last Edit: January 05, 2018, 06:59:38 am by frenky »
 


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