Rigol DS1102E, LCD issue, seeking repair advice

[WDC]

I own the above referenced scope which has developed an LCD screen issue of which I'm seeking comments regarding what could be the cause and or repair advice. DIY preferred.

I should start by advising that I have little knowledge about this unit or oscilloscope's in general.  I purchased it a couple years ago to look at audio signals and I've never gotten around to using or fully understanding it.

 That said, the LCD screen has always worked flawlessly until today.  I turned the unit on and after about 30 minutes of the display being normal, it switched to horizontal white lines going through the screen  .  You can still see the text and graphs behind the horizontal white lines as shown in the attached video clip.  After fiddling with it, it went good, and then sometime later, bad again, and is now staying bad

I suspect it is an LCD driver since all the images are there but having horizontal lines making it difficult to read.  Adjustments does seem to agitate the images and then it settles back down.

Has anyone else had this problem with a Rigol DS1102E screen and/or any suggestions on what could be or how to repair it?

Thanks in advance,
Will

PS: .  Being inexperienced I could have something out of adjustment, but I don't think so.  I've searched for a factory default reset, but I'm not seeing one.  If there is one, would someone direct me to it.

Video link showing problem: https://youtu.be/JDXnyzOe6Ss

Thanks in advance,
WDC

PSS; sorry newbie to forum, not seeing upload photos when using "Attachments and other options".  Update for other newbies, the attached photos are at the bottom, apparently they don't show up in preview mode.  FYI the large photos directly below were embedded using BBCode.

LCD issue-001 by William Cherrington, on Flickr

LCD issue-002 by William Cherrington, on Flickr

[coromonadalix]

I think you lcd screen is dying,   it would require dismantling to check if the lcd ribbon cable is well seated in the connectors,  if it is   the lcd maybe dying,  normally you can find some brand and a part number printed on it, and do a search to find if its available somewhere and have a pricing ....

Your problem could be dismantling the scope to get inside, you have to be very careful  and have anti static protection  just in case.

[gnavigator1007]

Had this same issue, but I think it was the 1102D. Never did anything with it aside from harvesting some parts in a pinch. Always intended to have a closer look at it, just never got around to it. Still have another 1102E that's never developed any problems

[WDC]

Thanks for your response, your comments are logical , helping me widen my perspective.  It's easy for one to get blinders on ignoring other possibilities, hence, LCD driver.

Thinking about your comments, all of the attributes that should be generated by the driver are there.  Everything that should be on the screen is on the screen through each function, and the problem is only that it's difficult to read due to the fine horizontal white lines, reducing the possibility that's it's a driver problem.  As I understand it, the driver drives screen pixels and and they're all there and where they should be.

Early on, I was thinking (or hoping) it could be a loosened ribbon cable or LCD, but how often does one get that lucky.

I'll take on board your comments about static discharge, and when I get a bit of time I will open this unit up and have a look.

If anyone has a source for aftermarket LCDs or has had the same issue, please chime in. .  I see in the service manual there is a part number (Color Screen: FG050600ANNNA-01) but that's likely a Rigol PN.  Hopefully, as you have stated , there are some identifying marks that will lead somewhere.

Thanks again,
WDC

[gnavigator1007]

Hey I was just rummaging through some boxes and found the screen from that 1102D. Checked ebay already and they're readily available. Part number to look for is TM056KDH02. Most look to be $40-$50 shipped from China, but may be cheaper if you can find them elsewhere

[rvalente]

Try poke and push around the edges, check if the behavior changes.

Put the scope in a plastic bag and throw in the fridge for a few hours, any change?

[WDC]

Hello gentlemen,  Thank you for taking the time to provide the LCD PN and source.  As stated, there there are an abundance of these on eBay and for $40 delivered, and for that it was well worth purchasing one, and having it on hand before tearing the unit down.  While waiting for delivery, I'll read the service manual and other sources to search  the best method for tearing the unit down (the minimum to change out to the screen). 

In the meantime, I will try rvalente suggestion of throwing the unit in the freezer for a few hours.  I've heard of this on hard drives and I'll give it a shot.

I thank you both,
Will

PS I have found this tear down, but it seems a bit rough https://youtu.be/XCvXfSCWUd8

[cheeseit]

You could be lucky and reseating a ribbon fixes it, or maybe a simple dodgy solder joint. I'd suggest that you'd take it apart and find out, before buying anything.

rvalente mentioned the fridge, not the freezer, and if you try either then beware of condensation which could create a whole host of other issues and repairs.

[Rasz]

I dont quite understand the point of a fridge, freeze spray to look for bad solder joints yes, but WTF is fridge to do here?
You put HDD in the fridge as a desperate attempt to influence marginal magnetic head readings from failing drive.

[WDC]

Thanks for that, I'll read a bit closer next time.  I did put it in a plastic bag with 100% seal to ensure moisture did not get into the unit.  After reading your comments I pulled it after 4 hours and will give it time to come to room temperature as not to shock the components when firing it up.

Let's hope it is a loose ribbon connection (or solder joint as mentioned) but I have ordered the screen and I'll wait and to have it on hand before tearing the unit down, considering the screen costs the price of being prepared. 

That said, I thank you and appreciate any and all recommendations and comments.

Will

[gnavigator1007]

PS I have found this tear down, but it seems a bit rough https://youtu.be/XCvXfSCWUd8

I'm actually the person that sent him that scope lol. Taking these apart is certainly not the most fun you'll ever have. I warned him ahead of time about a few of the hazards regarding disassembly, but pretty sure he had to find the screws under the handle for himself. Been awhile now and I haven't rewatched the video, but I think he pretty well covers most of it. Not sure if it's in there, but I remember having to desolder a strap from the usb to the metal housing

[gnavigator1007]

I dont quite understand the point of a fridge, freeze spray to look for bad solder joints yes, but WTF is fridge to do here?
You put HDD in the fridge as a desperate attempt to influence marginal magnetic head readings from failing drive.

I don't see the point here either. I've used the fridge to keep a smartphone up that would otherwise crash and get stuck in a bootloop (LG  ) to retrieve everything off of it with a usb cable running out the door to a laptop, but this situation seems like all risk and no reward. Cold being applied to the whole thing isn't exactly going to narrow down the problem.

[WDC]

PS I have found this tear down, but it seems a bit rough https://youtu.be/XCvXfSCWUd8

I'm actually the person that sent him that scope lol. Taking these apart is certainly not the most fun you'll ever have. I warned him ahead of time about a few of the hazards regarding disassembly, but pretty sure he had to find the screws under the handle for himself. Been awhile now and I haven't rewatched the video, but I think he pretty well covers most of it. Not sure if it's in there, but I remember having to desolder a strap from the usb to the metal housing

Funny how often that happens, it's a small world.

I took note of the handle screws and de-soldering the USB although I'm not certain I need to remove the bottom PCB for what I'm doing so, the USB should not be an issue.  If it wasn't for the LCD back-light cable connection directly behind the front (vertical power board) PCB, it looks like the ribbon cable connection is accessible, and one could remove the screen without removing any PCB's.

I was wondering about the screws in the C13 power-cord receptacle where he is removing the screws in order to get the plastic case to clear (3min into the video).  It's hard to believe there's not a better approach to this as you have the same problem during assembly, only in assembly, there's no access to backing up the nuts.  I'm sure that the Rigol design engineer had designed a better solution during mass assembly.

Thanks again I appreciate your (and everyone's) input.
WDC

[rvalente]

You could be lucky and reseating a ribbon fixes it, or maybe a simple dodgy solder joint. I'd suggest that you'd take it apart and find out, before buying anything.

rvalente mentioned the fridge, not the freezer, and if you try either then beware of condensation which could create a whole host of other issues and repairs.

Agreed, condensation can be a problem here but, its kind easy to go around.

Just put the scope + mains cable in the bag, tie everyone down with a zip tie (evacuate the air out with a straw) and let the scope cool down in the fridge and warm inside the plastic bag, no worries with condensation anymore.

[WDC]

I would like to thank @gnavigator1007 for the advise and LCD part number, along with anyone else offering recommendations.

The new LCD screen ($38, eBay) fixed the problem and was an easy tear down and install.

Thanks again and all the best.
Will

Boot splash screen, a screen test before finishing the assy.

 LCD issue-103 by William Cherrington, on Flickr

Test signal

LCD issue-102 by William Cherrington, on Flickr



   

[gnavigator1007]

Glad it worked out for you!

[coromonadalix]

 

[Mechatrommer]

good for your fix... i'm also ordering TM056KDH01 from our more trusted online store.. no TM056KDH02 (i know there are abundant in aliexpress, but ali give slow less trusted shipping method) i dont see any difference between TM056KDH01 and TM056KDH02 in datasheet, i will give it a try on my dormant DS1052E (broken down physical polarizer layer on LCD).. they are $15 only... thanks to gnavigator for providing the LCD model number.

[WDC]

I wish you the best of luck, I think you’ll find it’s a pretty straightforward replacement.  I was able to find one video showing a tear down (Rigol DS1102E / DS1052E Oscilloscope Teardown), which was helpful, at least up to the 10-minute mark where he takes out the power board. Behind the power board there are 5 screws holding on the face and I found no need to remove the side shielding only the back cover. Also, I’m not certain it’s necessary to remove the screws in the C13 power receptacle.  I did, only because he did, but I was able to assemble it with the screws and place.

I cannot speak to the variance in part numbers  I followed @gnavigator1007 advice.  I found ones with free shipping all came in around $35-40.  I selected one that came out of Taiwan which historically is faster shipping,  7 to 10 days in this case.  TIANMA TFT LCD SCREEN 5.6" TM056KDH02. . BTW , they all look like they're coming from the same factory.

Good luck and keep us posted, WDC
 

[Mechatrommer]

it will look like that (attached) until the LCD arrives... since i'm not using it anymore (it has long story of life and journey after i purchased DS1054Z) i'm thinking if there's possibility to convert it to portable battery powered device. lets see.. i've replaced few encoders of it few years ago there are threads for this, this device has sentimental value to me. if one thing that got me into eevblog, its this DS1052E. quickly turning it on and testing before dismantling it, i still miss how quick and responsive the GUI is making DS1054Z feels like crap. cheers.

[WDC]

I'm sure you're well aware, but there's a number of how to videos on hacking the 1052, 1054 and converting them to 1102.  According to the attached it's a software upgrade  which sounds easy enough 

EEVblog #70 - Turn your Rigol DS1052E Oscilloscope into a 100MHz DS1102E (Hack)

Good luck,

[exider]

I had same problem with my display. The display sometimes did fix itself other times it didn't.
I had disassembled the scope and found out that, on one of the pins of the
lcd connector there was a micro crack in the solder. You can't see it with the naked eye. You have to use microskop to see it.

If you have same problem try resolder the pins very carefully.

[WDC]

Thanks for taking the time to reply and your fix is noted.  As for me, I purchased the above referenced LCD screen off eBay and it was a straightforward replacement after which the scope fired right up, good as new.  This is a pretty rudimentary repair for anyone having the same problem.

All the best and again, thanks for the response.
Will

[WDC]

For anyone following that needs to make this repair.  The screens are the following "TIANMA TFT LCD SCREEN 5.6" TM056KDH02" and there are a heap of them on eBay.  Good luck