Author Topic: Splicing very short AL wires  (Read 2102 times)

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Online coppercone2

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Re: Splicing very short AL wires
« Reply #25 on: October 04, 2024, 02:17:38 pm »
the key is to get the aluminum soldering flux that works

I had nothing but problems but someone at work left and they gave me a remains of a jar that wow it soldered foil like copper (NO BS LIKE mineral oil)

this one looks correct from memory, I would have to go to my shop to check but the container looks right, and my leg hurts right now
https://www.amazon.com/STAY-CLEAN-FLUX-4-OZ/dp/B008FM5JXI
but I have a tiny 1oz bottle. hmm
 

Offline soldarTopic starter

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Re: Splicing very short AL wires
« Reply #26 on: October 04, 2024, 03:12:26 pm »
The problem is not only making electrical contact with aluminum but also that there are just a few mm showing and very fragile and quite inaccessible. It's not like I have a long end and can easily handle it. I cannot easily hold, scrape, etc.  I can hardly get in there. If I handle it any more it's going to break and that will be the end of it. Which may be a good thing.
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Offline hanakp

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Re: Splicing very short AL wires
« Reply #27 on: October 04, 2024, 05:02:28 pm »
Like I wrote earlier, forget brushing, oil etc. Just get aluminium flux with hydrofluoric acid, then it will solder almost like copper wire.
 

Offline Psi

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Re: Splicing very short AL wires
« Reply #28 on: October 07, 2024, 08:35:31 am »
Has anyone tried pointing a TIG torch at some aluminum electronics just with the gas on, then cleaning and soldering the aluminum part?  Does it work well?
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Offline 5U4GB

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Re: Splicing very short AL wires
« Reply #29 on: October 07, 2024, 12:03:48 pm »
I've never tried it at this (tiny) scale but could you try brazing, a.k.a. "aluminium welding", it?
 

Offline soldarTopic starter

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Re: Splicing very short AL wires
« Reply #30 on: October 07, 2024, 01:58:32 pm »
At this point it does not seem to me there is any practical way of soldering or brazing worthwhile for this unimportant project.

I am thinking I might try to find the tiniest screw terminal I can find, epoxy in place with the screw loose, and once it is held firmly in place tighten the screw. I think trying to tighten the screw with the terminal loose would most probably result in a broken AL wire.

I also think epoxy is safer then hot glue which is really not so rigid.

I could even solder a thin copper wire to the screw terminal.
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Offline mikerj

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Re: Splicing very short AL wires
« Reply #31 on: October 07, 2024, 02:03:03 pm »
... and keep rubbing and scratching it into the surface till it takes.  ...
It pretends to be absorbed, but easily bounces off. Tin, however, is thoroughly wetted.

You can solder by dipping in molten zinc, but I have not done this, although I know that this is the standard method for soldering aluminum twists of several wires.

All I can say is you are doing it incorrectly.  Like Ian I have made strong, well wetted connections to Al with regular rosin cored flux, it's all in the technique.  If you have ever used the Al brazing rods it's a very similar method, abrading the oxide layer through the molten pool to allow the solder to wet the raw Al.
 

Offline Greybeard

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Re: Splicing very short AL wires
« Reply #32 on: October 07, 2024, 07:01:50 pm »
Like I wrote earlier, forget brushing, oil etc. Just get aluminium flux with hydrofluoric acid, then it will solder almost like copper wire.
I would never use anything containing hydrofluoric acid.
It's highly dangerous!
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydrogen_fluoride
Quote
Hydrogen fluoride is an extremely dangerous gas, forming corrosive and penetrating hydrofluoric acid upon contact with moisture. The gas can also cause blindness by rapid destruction of the corneas.
...
Health effects
...
Hydrogen fluoride is highly corrosive and a powerful contact poison. Exposure requires immediate medical attention.
It can cause blindness by rapid destruction of the corneas. Breathing in hydrogen fluoride at high levels or in combination with skin contact can cause death from an irregular heartbeat or from pulmonary edema (fluid buildup in the lungs).
 

Online jpanhalt

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Re: Splicing very short AL wires
« Reply #33 on: October 07, 2024, 07:30:44 pm »
I would never use anything containing hydrofluoric acid.
It's highly dangerous!

Then don't.  Presumably, you understood that your reference was to the pure gas.  Most people probably know that (EDIT: the flux) reference is to HF in dilute solution.  In such instances, it has many uses.  In the US, for example, Whink Products sells a rust stain remover for sinks and toilets in grocery stores (https://web.faa.illinois.edu/app/uploads/sites/6/2021/05/WHINK-Rust-Stain-Remover.pdf ).  It also works on blood stains on clothes, if all else fails.

(It looks like Whink was acquired by Rustoleum.  I don't know whether current products are the same.)
« Last Edit: October 08, 2024, 12:12:16 pm by jpanhalt »
 

Offline tooki

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Re: Splicing very short AL wires
« Reply #34 on: October 08, 2024, 07:18:49 am »
(It looks like Whink was acquired by Rustoleum.  I don't know whether current products are the same.)
On the product page, in the Technical Information tab, there is the download for the technical data sheet: https://www.rustoleum.com/-/media/6111FC40699C4F82811A045EFD907995.pdf

It still lists HF as the active ingredient.

It also lists Bitrex as an ingredient, which makes total sense from a safety standpoint, but man do I hate Bitrex in cleaning products, because of how Bitrex residues then spread everywhere and ultimately end up on your fingers, and then face. (In the case of this product, the relevant situation would be carpets, since all the other applications involve thorough rinsing.)

I once made the mistake of using alcohol that was denatured with Bitrex to clean my bathroom. It took weeks to get that damned bitterness gone. It’s actually a fascinating way to demonstrate how bacterial/viral cross-contamination works…
 

Offline Greybeard

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Re: Splicing very short AL wires
« Reply #35 on: October 08, 2024, 11:32:13 am »
https://www.anmeldestelle.admin.ch/dam/chem/de/dokumente/infoblatt-flusssaeure.pdf.download.pdf/infoblatt-flusssaeure-de.pdf
Google translation:
Quote
Federal Department of Home Affairs EDI
Federal Office of Public Health FOPH
Consumer Protection Division
Market Control and Advice Section
3003 Bern / Switzerland
Bern, June 26, 2012

Exercise extreme caution when handling hydrofluoric acid!

Hydrofluoric acid, also known as hydrofluoric acid, is the aqueous solution of hydrogen fluoride (HF). Hydrofluoric acid is a colorless, pungent-smelling liquid. It has a strong corrosive effect on the skin, mucous membranes and the conjunctiva of the eyes.

Effects of contact with hydrofluoric acid:
Hydrofluoric acid has a corrosive effect and is quickly absorbed by the skin and immediately penetrates into deeper layers of tissue. This can attack deeper layers of tissue and bones without the skin appearing to be visibly injured externally. Skin burns are painful and lead to ulcers that are difficult to heal; at low concentrations, pain often only occurs hours after the first contact.
In addition to the corrosive effect, the toxicity contributes to the danger of hydrofluoric acid. The fluoride ions block calcium and magnesium metabolism and inhibit important
enzymes, which leads to acutely threatening metabolic disorders that can even be fatal with multiple organ failure.
Inhaling hydrofluoric acid vapors can lead to burns in the lungs with the formation of pulmonary edema and can be fatal within a short time even at low concentrations (50-100 ppm).

Proven antidotes:
Deeper penetration can be counteracted by injecting the damaged tissue with calcium gluconate solution.
It is therefore recommended to put together a “hydrofluoric acid” emergency kit and keep it ready in the first aid room: calcium gluconate ampoules (10% solution), calcium gluconate solution (1%), calcium gluconate gel or calcium effervescent tablets, tube-mouth ventilator for artificial ventilation.
See also www.toxi.ch  German  For doctors / pharmacists  Treatment plans for
various noxious substances (information sheets) and antidotes  Hydrofluoric acid
Always observe the following points:
 When transporting or sending the product, you must always ensure
that the container is well closed and securely packaged.
General information on dangerous goods by post can be found at
www.post.ch  Logistics  National distribution  Parcels  Dangerous goods
 When handing over, always inform the customer about the dangers, protective measures,
rules of conduct and disposal.
Typical labeling of hydrofluoric acid (from 1%) according to GHS
Danger

Protective measures and rules of conduct

Keep locked up.
Keep the container tightly closed in a well-ventilated place.
If it comes into contact with eyes, immediately rinse thoroughly with water and consult a doctor.
Wear protective gloves made of butyl rubber and protective clothing when working.
In the event of an accident or if you feel unwell, seek medical attention immediately.
Only hand over to qualified persons who are authorized to receive the product!
Secure containers in suitable containers during transport (including within the company)!
Store and handle only in the manufacturer's original bottles!
Handle only in a fume hood and, if possible, in closed equipment.
Eyewash and emergency showerhead required in the immediate vicinity of the workplace.
Keep calcium gluconate preparations ready directly at the workplace.
Preventive skin protection required!
First aid: Medical treatment is always required after hydrofluoric acid injuries!
General
measures:
If you notice liquid on your clothing or skin when working with hydrofluoric acid, you should act as if the liquid were hydrofluoric acid.
Contact with clothing:
Take off clothing immediately and wash it with plenty of water.
Be sure to use suitable protective gloves and avoid any skin contact. Skin contact:
Immediately rinse affected areas of skin with plenty of water, then repeatedly apply calcium gluconate gel and massage in until the pain subsides. Once the pain is gone, continue to massage with the gel for another 15 minutes and seek medical attention immediately.
Eye contact:
Rinse under running water with the eyelid open for 10 minutes,
then apply a sterile protective bandage and seek medical attention immediately.
Ingestion:
Immediately rinse mouth thoroughly (do not induce vomiting), then have the patient drink 1% calcium gluconate solution and seek medical attention immediately.
Calcium, magnesium supplements or milk (or water if necessary) can also be administered.
Inhalation:
Take the casualty out into the fresh air and immediately notify a doctor.
If breathing stops, only use artificial respiration if possible (observe self-protection!). In case of more severe effects (strong coughing, skin burns larger than the size of the palm of your hand, swallowing soluble fluorides or solutions containing hydrofluoric acid), an emergency doctor must be called: Emergency number: 144 Toxicological Information Center: 145 Classification of H-phrases Acute Tox. 2 H330 Fatal if inhaled Acute Tox. 1 H310 Fatal if in contact with skin Acute Tox. 2 H300 Le

Sorry for the loss of text structuring.
 


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