Affordable crimp tools for small connectors (Dupont, etc.)

[tooki]

So, as we know, the world of crimping (especially with small connectors) is fraught with "gotchas" and half-truths, as well as inherent complexity.

In an ideal world where each of us had literally unlimited funds (and unlimited workshop space), we'd just exclusively buy first-party terminals and the official tooling for each type. But here in the real world, at least for hobbyists, spending $300-1000 per tool is just not realistic. So I've spent a lot of time over the past few years trying to understand the world of cheap crimping tools, and it's daunting to say the least.

The vast majority of us hobbyists seem to end up with one of a few different tools for "Dupont" pins and other small connectors:
- SN-28B, -BM
- SN-48B, -BM
- SN-01BM, -02-BM, -03BM
- Engineer PA-09

Let's review these all first.

All of these get sold online as being suitable for Dupont, yet in fact none of them truly are. Dupont contacts have the two diagonally meshing insulation crimps which are intended for a circular crimp which does not penetrate the insulation. All of those crimpers, on the other hand, are designed for the "F" type crimp (which resembles an "m") on both the wire crimp and the insulation crimp.

I finally figured out where the SN-28B and SN-48B got their model numbers: they're designed for 2.8mm and 4.8mm wide spade terminals, respectively. (I found this in a big-name toolmaker's catalog, I just forget whose!) The SN-48B is categorically too big for Dupont, etc. The SN-28B's smallest die does work for Dupont, sorta. It always mangles the insulation crimp, making it too wide to insert into the housings without extra work. (Slightly re-crimping the insulation crimp in the wire half of the die will make it work.) But the dies are actually too thick (7mm), so with many Dupont contacts, it's extremely hard to get a proper crimp without mangling some part of the contact.

For Molex KK (and their Chinese clones, the KF2510), the 28B actually isn't tooo bad, since they're designed for F-type insulation crimps. But the dies are still too thick. (For what it's worth, the SN-28B is great for 2.8/4.8/6.3mm spade connectors onto thinner wires, like 24-16AWG (0.22-1.5mm².)

SN-01/2/3BM (and a few others) are sold as D-sub crimpers for various wire gauges. I don't have one of these, but they look like they'd do a better job, having the thinner jaws.

There's also an SN-2549B that's basically an SN-28B with a bit of an SN-01BM grafted on.

The PA-09 is often recommended on here as actually having good dies, but it's non-ratcheting, requires two squeezes (one for wire, one for insulation) and also lacks the round insulation crimp.


For smaller connectors like JST, IWISS (a Chinese crimper brand that is of slightly-better-than-junk quality) released one not too long ago that looks promising, the IWS-3220m.

So what's been lacking for the longest time is a cheap third-party ratcheting crimping tool that actually performs the round insulation crimp for Dupont, and has the correct die thickness for Dupont and these smaller contacts. For years, I and others have searched without luck.

Until about 2 weeks ago.

While prowling around AliExpress, I came across a vendor selling a model number I hadn't run into before, the SN-4228B (TZ-4228B in the picture). And lo and behold, it has a round insulation crimping die for Dupont, and several other openings specifically for smaller connectors:



Unlike the SN-28B, which there are literally hundreds of vendors selling, there's just one selling the SN-4228B at the moment. I've ordered one, so eventually we shall see if it's any good. Coronavirus has made the slow Chinese shipping even slower. I also got little assortment boxes of KF2510, JST XH2.5, and JST SM, as I want to move away from Dupont (except for breadboarding) to something polarized.


And then shortly thereafter, I came across a vendor selling a model they're calling both "SN-ECUBM" and "SN-28BM ECU", and it does indeed look like an SN-28B, but with circular insulation crimps:



I'm debating picking up one of these, too, just for shits and giggles.


Additionally, a seller on the local auction site just had a few new-in-box TE Connectivity (AMP) 169481-1 crimpers for AMPMODU MOD IV contacts at less than 1/6 the retail price. (Albeit without the positioner. It's totally unclear about whether it is supposed to be included or must be purchased separately. Looking at units for sale, with the same part number, some have it, some don't…) Anyway, with AMPMODU MOD IV being yet another of the 0.1" header connectors, I decided to pick it up. What's very odd is that the cross-reference for tool-to-contact compatibility has totally different contact part numbers for this crimper compared to the one they recommend these days. (All in all, TE sells probably somewhere between 5-10 different crimpers for the series.) But since they fit into the same connector housings, I figure they can't be that different. Either way, I'll give it a shot. If it proves to be useless, I can probably sell the crimper for more than I paid for it.

(By the way, if anyone wants one, at the end of the listing, he had another 5 pieces available. Let me know and I can inquire whether they're still available now. They were selling for CHF50 plus shipping.)



Also, here's an overview of existing threads and resources on the topic of such connectors and tools:
Matt's Tech Pages: Common Wire-To-Board, Wire-To-Wire Connectors, and Crimp Tools
Topic: Affordable crimp tools?
Topic: Dupont crimp tools that don't suck?
Topic: Crimping Dupont, VH, XH, PH and KF2510
Topic: reasonable priced , real, crimping tools for molex / JST / Dupont ?
Topic: Crimping tool for PH 2.0mm connector
Topic: Connectors and crimping tools. I just want to be "more standard"
Topic: Which crimp pins for standard .1" "Dupont" headers?
Topic: Dupont crimp tool, high-quality multi-strand and stiff single-strand wire?
Topic: Pin Connectors, Crimpers, decent connections, and the futility of it all...

Edit 2020-05-22: fixed typo, added one more forum topic link.

[knotlogic]

Nice find on the IWS-3220m, SN-4228B, and SN-28BM!  I've been looking at picking up Dupont connectors for breadboards recently but have been stuck on how to crimp the insulation portion properly.  Let us know how the SN-4228B works out?

I was just reading through the first article you linked to (Matt's Tech Pages) a week or so ago.  He mentions a YTH-202B which also has a circular crimp spot.  It's not ratcheting though, and the quality of the jaws in all the pictures I've seen doesn't look great.

And a note on the Engineer PA-09 and the PAD-11/12/13.  The latter is a single frame with a choice of 3 crimp dies.  I have a PA-09 and a PAD-12, and I find after crimping the terminal can be slightly stuck in the PA-09, but so far never in the PAD-12.  I don't know if it's a case of surface finish, or just my particular PA-09.  The PAD-12 is bigger and slightly more unwieldy though, and it doesn't have a flat area at the mouth of the jaws which comes in useful to square up the wings on some terminals before crimping.

[Monkeh]

PA-09 being sticky is pretty normal. A drop of oil helps.

[Neomys Sapiens]

Another non-ratcheting crimp tool which includes a B-crimp is the AMP Super Champ FT (but not the Super Champ 2), and there is a older version of the SUPER CHAMP that has three B-type cavities. The latter one is in my toolkit, as I could not fit a ratcheting crimper in there. I have used them when nothing else was around, for example on TAE plug crimp contacts, which are of comparable size. You have to work very precisely, as there is no enforced closure and no longitudinal guide to the contact, but one can fit them in a rather full toolcase and have a crimper for insulated terminals and a spare wire stripper as well. If I know that I have to crimp, I would rather carry a better crimper.

As previously stated, the Daniels GMT225 is my favourite for this type of contacts. AMP 169347-1 is also nice.

[tooki]

Nice find on the IWS-3220m, SN-4228B, and SN-28BM!  I've been looking at picking up Dupont connectors for breadboards recently but have been stuck on how to crimp the insulation portion properly.  Let us know how the SN-4228B works out?

I certainly will!!

Just to be clear, it’s the “SN-28BM ECU” that’s a new find. A regular SN-28BM will have the regular F-type insulation crimp. (I can’t tell what the difference is between an SN-28B and SN-28BM. In some crimper  numbers, like -03, B and BM are completely different tools. But with the 28 I haven’t seen any difference.)

[ebclr]

The 2 steps models like PA9 ( japan) or IWiSS IWS-2820 ( China ) , are much easier to use than the one-step ones . Especially in very small connectors Like Ph2.

I bought first the one-step model, but after losing a lot of terminals, I bought then the 2 Step ones ( IWS-2820) and I can assure you the 2 steps are much better, you have more controls on the process. On the one step, one little misalignment and you lost a terminal.

On bigger terminal like Dupont, they are similar, But on the small ones the 2 step is a sure way to go






One step model

https://pt.aliexpress.com/item/4000246209070.html?spm=a2g0o.productlist.0.0.5ad45b0c2fxH6F&s=p&ad_pvid=202005220421352525299361195240011377878_3&algo_pvid=e75980bc-1ecd-42dc-a981-57d89d72a8e1&algo_expid=e75980bc-1ecd-42dc-a981-57d89d72a8e1-2&btsid=0ab6f82215901464951786505e528c&ws_ab_test=searchweb0_0,searchweb201602_,searchweb201603_

[thm_w]

I disagree. PA09 are recommended far to often for what they are. If PA09 were $10 and a decent ratcheting pair were $50, I'd see the point of them existing. But its the opposite.

[Monkeh]

The problem with "a decent ratcheting pair" is it might work for one or two crimps with varying results. The PA-09s, and other similar (and cheaper!) tools are much more versatile. With these and some larger Iwiss ones I have, I can crimp everything Big Clive can with that whole array of bits, and dozens more.

[thm_w]

The problem with "a decent ratcheting pair" is it might work for one or two crimps with varying results. The PA-09s, and other similar (and cheaper!) tools are much more versatile. With these and some larger Iwiss ones I have, I can crimp everything Big Clive can with that whole array of bits, and dozens more.

I'm not sure why you'd see varying results. The idea of ratcheting is you get the same crimp result each time. Without it, you have to rely on consistency of grip force.

I do completely see your point of versatility, most people don't want a shelf full of crimpers. But I'd at least want to have a ratcheting pair for my most commonly used connector (JST PH) as that produces the fastest and most consistent crimp, at least for me.

One thing that would vastly improve these cheap crimpers is a spring loaded holder. But you'll only see that on the $500+ units AFAIK.

[Monkeh]

The problem with "a decent ratcheting pair" is it might work for one or two crimps with varying results. The PA-09s, and other similar (and cheaper!) tools are much more versatile. With these and some larger Iwiss ones I have, I can crimp everything Big Clive can with that whole array of bits, and dozens more.

I'm not sure why you'd see varying results. The idea of ratcheting is you get the same crimp result each time. Without it, you have to rely on consistency of grip force.

Varying results between connector families is what I meant. You might have one which works perfectly for XH and KK396, but useless for a KK254 or a VH.. (these being two connectors in each pitch fulfilling essentially the same role)

I do completely see your point of versatility, most people don't want a shelf full of crimpers. But I'd at least want to have a ratcheting pair for my most commonly used connector (JST PH) as that produces the fastest and most consistent crimp, at least for me.

Fair. I use a wide mix, so unless I want more crimpers than screwdrivers..

[SparkyFX]

Unlike the SN-28B, which there are literally hundreds of vendors selling, there's just one selling the SN-4228B at the moment. I've ordered one, so eventually we shall see if it's any good.

My results improved a lot by lowering the tension by one notch for Dupont contacts on AWG 22 and by dropping the pin into a half closed cavity, then the wire.

[tooki]

Unlike the SN-28B, which there are literally hundreds of vendors selling, there's just one selling the SN-4228B at the moment. I've ordered one, so eventually we shall see if it's any good.

My results improved a lot by lowering the tension by one notch for Dupont contacts on AWG 22 and by dropping the pin into a half closed cavity, then the wire.

The point of this thread is trying to get a tool that is designed to correctly crimp the terminals in question, as opposed to how to convince the wrong tool to perform less-poorly.

[tooki]

The 2 steps models like PA9 ( japan) or IWiSS IWS-2820 ( China ) , are much easier to use than the one-step ones . Especially in very small connectors Like Ph2.

I bought first the one-step model, but after losing a lot of terminals, I bought then the 2 Step ones ( IWS-2820) and I can assure you the 2 steps are much better, you have more controls on the process. On the one step, one little misalignment and you lost a terminal.

On bigger terminal like Dupont, they are similar, But on the small ones the 2 step is a sure way to go

That doesn't really make sense. The whole point of the ratcheting crimpers is to reduce variability in the process.

The problem with "a decent ratcheting pair" is it might work for one or two crimps with varying results. The PA-09s, and other similar (and cheaper!) tools are much more versatile. With these and some larger Iwiss ones I have, I can crimp everything Big Clive can with that whole array of bits, and dozens more.

I think it's unrealistic to expect any tool to be ideal for all connector types. At the same time, I also think it's ridiculous how the connector companies make microscopic changes to a terminal type and then require a totally new $500-1000 tool for it. (For the AMPMODU MOD IV/V series, for example, TE sells something like 10 different crimp tools. No one terminal version works in all the tools, and no tool works with all the terminal versions.  )

Anyway, sure, with a non-ratcheting tool, you can probably work with a larger array of terminals, but the results with a given connector type will be less repeatable. (There's a reason aerospace, for example, only allows crimp tools that are calibrated to ensure only precisely the correct force is applied.)

And again, neither of the tools you mentioned performs the circular insulation crimp on Dupont terminals.

[tooki]

One thing that would vastly improve these cheap crimpers is a spring loaded holder. But you'll only see that on the $500+ units AFAIK.

Seriously!!! If someone could make some inexpensive locators to attach to these various cheap crimpers, I'm sure the results could be improved dramatically. It's kinda puzzling that none of the manufacturers has thought to do this as a USP...

[tooki]

By the way, since I suspect a lot of folks don't understand what I'm talking about regarding the circular vs. F-type (m-shaped) insulation crimp, here's a great image of it stolen copied borrowed from Matt's Tech Pages: Common Wire-To-Board, Wire-To-Wire Connectors, and Crimp Tools:



The right terminal is a genuine Mini-PV (the real "DuPont" connector) crimped with the correct tool, the middle is a generic terminal crimped with the genuine tool, and the left is a generic terminal crimped with the PA-09. See how on the right two, the insulation crimp forms a tube around the insulation, hugging it without piercing it? That's what we want (for this terminal type). A tool with the F-type (m-shape) insulation crimp jaw forms the mess on the left: the tips of the insulation crimp wings have been pushed up and down, and then pierced into the insulation.

Here's what those terminals look like uncrimped (again, borrowed from the same page):



See how the insulation crimps are not symmetrical? They need the circular insulation jaw.

So what does the terminal with an F-type insulation crimp look like? Here's an AMPMODU MOD IV:


See how the insulation wings are flat and symmetrical? They're intended to be folded into the insulation, not around it.

[Monkeh]

Anyway, sure, with a non-ratcheting tool, you can probably work with a larger array of terminals, but the results with a given connector type will be less repeatable. (There's a reason aerospace, for example, only allows crimp tools that are calibrated to ensure only precisely the correct force is applied.)

And again, neither of the tools you mentioned performs the circular insulation crimp on Dupont terminals.

Sure, I don't disagree. I've chosen low-cost versatility (okay, the PA-09 isn't cheap but again, Iwiss make a nice enough set which is under half the price) over repeatability. Fair trade-off when time and crimps are not in short supply.

And indeed, I have no tools which can deal with the 'dupont'/Mini-PV style correctly. I try not to use them anyway. One of these days I'll just stock up on some JST RF crimps.

[Neomys Sapiens]

Well, at least the GMT-225 does it right - applying the m-shape crimp to the conductor section and a round crimp to the insulation.

That said, most around here are maybe not so discerning. Substituting 'Dupont' with 'anything that fits on a 0.64'' square post (Pfostenleiste) and has a tab on the closed side, it might have happened even to me. A quick look into a box of such contacts kept ready found both types.

[nctnico]

For the Molex KK254 I ended up buying the official 'service' crimper from Molex (part number 0640160201) which can crimp a whole bunch of other Molex contacts as well. The price is around $125 which isn't insane. I have not managed to find a cheap ratchet crimper which can achieve the same crimp quality and ease of use for Molex KK254.

Also for very small contacts the official tool will be better. I have an IWISS IWS-3220m as well but it just isn't good enough for JST SHD (1mm pitch connector) even though it is advertised for this contact (*). IOW: better use big crimp contacts if you don't have the official tools  because the smaller the contact the more tolerances start to matter.

* Fortunately I managed to find the official tool on Ebay.

[edavid]

Unlike the SN-28B, which there are literally hundreds of vendors selling, there's just one selling the SN-4228B at the moment.

There is now another vendor who has the SN-4228B with free shipping:
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/4000824353015.html

And also one who has the TZ-4228B:
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/4001044611583.html

And then shortly thereafter, I came across a vendor selling a model they're calling both "SN-ECUBM" and "SN-28BM ECU", and it does indeed look like an SN-28B, but with circular insulation crimps:

Do you have the link for that one?

[SparkyFX]

The point of this thread is trying to get a tool that is designed to correctly crimp the terminals in question, as opposed to how to convince the wrong tool to perform less-poorly.

Wouldn't that mean to abolish practically all tools with multiple wire sizes (for one chamber), but a ratchet-release based on distance? Of course there are tolerances to everything and maybe excess is pushed out left and right to accomodate the additional volume, but it would require one tool per wire size and contact type to achieve a perfect result.

What i want to point out is that some of these are actually adjustable, therefore this should be taken into consideration when evaluating them. Imho for mains voltage and high current connections an adjustable crimp tool might impose a safety risk, but for low power signal applications: why not.

[eliocor]

Wouldn't that mean to abolish practically all tools with multiple wire sizes (for one chamber), but a ratchet-release based on distance? Of course there are tolerances to everything and maybe excess is pushed out left and right to accomodate the additional volume, but it would require one tool per wire size and contact type to achieve a perfect result.

You are right: take as an example the nearby to me Molex 63828-2000 : https://www.molex.com/pdm_docs/ats/ATS-638282000.pdf .....
Price? more or less 1000 USD: a different league!

[tooki]

Unlike the SN-28B, which there are literally hundreds of vendors selling, there's just one selling the SN-4228B at the moment.

There is now another vendor who has the SN-4228B with free shipping:
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/4000824353015.html

And also one who has the TZ-4228B:
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/4001044611583.html

And then shortly thereafter, I came across a vendor selling a model they're calling both "SN-ECUBM" and "SN-28BM ECU", and it does indeed look like an SN-28B, but with circular insulation crimps:

Do you have the link for that one?

Oops, I meant to link it in the original post and I guess I forgot! Here you go: https://m.aliexpress.com/item/32775519832.html
It’s one of the “colors”, the other being a bog-standard -48B.

[tooki]

The point of this thread is trying to get a tool that is designed to correctly crimp the terminals in question, as opposed to how to convince the wrong tool to perform less-poorly.

Wouldn't that mean to abolish practically all tools with multiple wire sizes (for one chamber), but a ratchet-release based on distance? Of course there are tolerances to everything and maybe excess is pushed out left and right to accomodate the additional volume, but it would require one tool per wire size and contact type to achieve a perfect result.

What i want to point out is that some of these are actually adjustable, therefore this should be taken into consideration when evaluating them. Imho for mains voltage and high current connections an adjustable crimp tool might impose a safety risk, but for low power signal applications: why not.

Please. Take a look at the pictures I posted to explain the point here. It’s not even about tolerances (though those are also an issue), but that the tools being sold for the purpose literally do not even have the correct SHAPE die. Tolerances are practically irrelevant when the shape and size of the dies are totally wrong.

[SparkyFX]

Wouldn't that mean to abolish practically all tools with multiple wire sizes (for one chamber), but a ratchet-release based on distance? Of course there are tolerances to everything and maybe excess is pushed out left and right to accomodate the additional volume, but it would require one tool per wire size and contact type to achieve a perfect result.

You are right: take as an example the nearby to me Molex 63828-2000 : https://www.molex.com/pdm_docs/ats/ATS-638282000.pdf .....
Price? more or less 1000 USD: a different league!

Don't get me wrong, if there are specifications to meet there is no way around using the crimping tool specified by the contact manufacturer. At work (automotive, apart from prefabbed crimps), there are considerations of durablity, vibration and avoiding water ingress, i wouldn't bother with anything from ebay/ali.

PCB to PCB connections are usually not that high spec'd, what imho matters is doing as many with as low effort as possible.

but that the tools being sold for the purpose literally do not even have the correct SHAPE die. Tolerances are practically irrelevant when the shape and size of the dies are totally wrong.

The ambiguous pictures in those item listings don't help much with the decision if it is the right tool for the job. So yes, thanks for pointing it out. The insulation crimps are simply unfit with the wrong shape crimp tool, take some bodging to get them into a cavity and such. No fun to do hundreds of those.

[daveismissing]

Good thread. Molex (factory)  had some older stype crimp tools where a metal bar dropped across the contact and another where a positioning block swung on a pin. These tools work well, but the newer replacements  with the plastic "table" for alignment-I have not seen anyone figure out yet.
Unfortunately this seems to be the adopted style for all of their hand crip tools.
 

[Mr. Scram]

This thread is relevant to my interests.

[vk6zgo]

By the way, since I suspect a lot of folks don't understand what I'm talking about regarding the circular vs. F-type (m-shaped) insulation crimp, here's a great image of it stolen copied borrowed from Matt's Tech Pages: Common Wire-To-Board, Wire-To-Wire Connectors, and Crimp Tools:

(Attachment Link)

The right terminal is a genuine Mini-PV (the real "DuPont" connector) crimped with the correct tool, the middle is a generic terminal crimped with the genuine tool, and the left is a generic terminal crimped with the PA-09. See how on the right two, the insulation crimp forms a tube around the insulation, hugging it without piercing it? That's what we want (for this terminal type). A tool with the F-type (m-shape) insulation crimp jaw forms the mess on the left: the tips of the insulation crimp wings have been pushed up and down, and then pierced into the insulation.

Here's what those terminals look like uncrimped (again, borrowed from the same page):

(Attachment Link)

See how the insulation crimps are not symmetrical? They need the circular insulation jaw.

So what does the terminal with an F-type insulation crimp look like? Here's an AMPMODU MOD IV:
(Attachment Link)

See how the insulation wings are flat and symmetrical? They're intended to be folded into the insulation, not around it.

Great information!

It seems that it isn't just hobbyists that have this problem.
At my previous job, we had some "custom made" UHF transmitters which used this style of connector in the control circuitry.

Amazingly, the manufacturer in the PRC didn't seem to have the right (or even the wrong) crimper, so soldered the pins onto the ends of lengths of "ribbon cable".

This, in itself, would not be a huge problem, but their soldering was abysmal, causing some horrific intermittents!
We didn't have a crimper either, so had to do the same, but we had a better solder station (& might I say, skills!), & removed that source of strife.

A previous employer had a crimper which was capable of the job, but there was just that one for about twelve people, plus it was pretty much worn out!

[pocketscience]

Would love to hear how you got on. Hobbyist here who's sick of mangling Dupont connectors...

[tooki]

I’m still waiting on the new Chinese crimper. Coronavirus has slowed the already-slow cheap shipping.

The locally purchased AMP Ampmodu MOD IV crimper is a different story: it works perfectly for male DuPont crimps. Female is trickier: most cheap DuPont contacts are on the short side, especially the female ones. If I insert them as far forward as possible, they JUST barely make it through undamaged. The gold plated Chinese female dupont contacts I have are a tad longer and work well.

Additionally, by removing a part from the back, I have been able to make it work with some Molex KK/Chinese KF2510-type contacts. (The cheap Chinese Kf2510 get slightly damaged, growing some wings that have to be snipped. Again because they’re very short. Similar cheap contacts bought from a reputable seller work flawlessly on the modded crimper.

It goes without saying that actual TE Connectivity Ampmodu MOD IV contacts crimp flawlessly on it. But that costs a lot more, with both contacts and housings being more expensive.

[coppercone2]

[coppercone2]

you need a high current ohm meter and to do a tug test and use a crimp micrometer to verify this (its not 'looks good').

if you want gas tight verification then you need probably a helium leak detector and high end epoxy, or at the very least pressure gauges. And those are just static tests.

[tooki]

This is for hobby use. Such testing is neither needed nor feasible. With that said, when matched with the right wire size, the crimps from the AMP tool resist a pull test — the strands fail before the crimp. The same can’t be said for the standard SN-28B. We shall see how the new crimper does.

[coppercone2]

they are important if you want to work with energy storage etc

[tooki]

they are important if you want to work with energy storage etc

Dafuck you talking about? We are talking about small connectors, the kind meant as small signal connectors. I’m not using 0.1” data connectors to connect 1000 lithium ion batteries in a battery wall.

Please, dude, if you have nothing useful to contribute to this thread, just leave.

[coppercone2]

unless its being used to measure a voltage

putting it out there before someone thinks its a good idea to run a BMS sense board with shady crimps trying to stick it to musk. any parameter sense basically

there is no mention of anything related to quality other then 'ratchet tends to work better' and 'looks good', probably because the tooling in the factory is better and its blind luck that such a place tends to make better crimps most of the time then someone making riveted together crap in a factory that probably does not have a caliper in it.

I was hoping someone jumps on the grenade and actually tests one of these things properly to at least determine a good brand in some kind of logical manner. Right now its 'saw it on eevblog, people say it looks good, must be good'.

add this to affordable
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Mitutoyo-Crimp-height-Outside-Micrometer-0-25mm-0-01mm-Made-in-Japan/274059076975?hash=item3fcf31a56f:g:Y7QAAOSw-uddqwfY

You know, if you get a real molex crimper, and you put the crimp in the wrong wire gauge section, it stills looks totally great when it comes out. It's kind of like a gun, the action can be super smooth, it can make a hole and a bang, the recoil can feel good, but if it does not hit the target its useless.

Or, if its aligned correctly, it could kill your shoulder and finger and feel like you are operating a manual meat grinder, and still hit the target.

[tooki]

Go. Away. You’ve completely and utterly missed the entire point of this thread.

Nothing here is at the level you’re talking about. At this stage, it’s at the “are there any crimpers that don’t mangle the hell out of the contact”, not “do these two visually flawless crimps meet a high standard”.

Moreover, you haven’t read the linked sources, since there have been some semi systematic comparisons.

Anyway, stop pissing in our Cheerios and let us have this discussion at the level we need to have it at. Because there is a 0.0000000000000000000000000000000% chance that the kinds of tests you want will be performed by us, since we have no way to do so.

[coppercone2]

yes people can use 2000$ of equipment to test an amplifier but a 70$ crimp micrometer and some dumbells on a wire is too much

hopefully someone will do it

[tooki]

Nobody cares about your whataboutism.

I don’t have a helium leak detector, as it’s hardly a standard piece of electronics test equipment. I don’t even know where epoxy would come into play, as I’ve never read anything about epoxy even in military crimp standards.

Moreover, suppose someone had all the equipment and know how. Would it matter? When a hobbyist buys contacts on eBay or Ali, there is no guarantee the next order will ship identical contacts, or instead those of another manufacturer whose tolerances are different.

Upshot is, you’re being a pain in the ass, for no discernible reason.

[Ranayna]

I just want to throw in my recent experience with crimping JST-XH connectors.

I saw that Amazon hat two different sets of JST inserts, housings and PCB mount connectors, including a crimp tool, where one set gave the name of the crimper, while the other one did not.
Reading this thread, that SN-28B is not really meant to be used for dupont, i stupidly assumed (yeah, yeah, i know  ) that that one would work for JST.

Well, it doesn't :p
The jaws of the SN-28B are just too wide to be used on the JST connector, the front-part gets squished. Having no experience with crimping, it took me some time, many destroyed crimps, and a couple of videos, to realize what my issue was.

There is another set though, with an unnamed crimper. That one turned out to be a SN-01BM, with a much narrower jaw. This fits the connector as it should, and now knowing more about crimping, i got an adequate crimp on the first try.

[tooki]

Thanks for the report!

The JST contacts are even smaller than DuPont, right?

 I’ve considered getting an -01BM (and/or some of the closely related models — there seem to be at least three models claimed to be for D-sub contacts) to see how they fare.

If you have a set of calipers (Messschieber), could you do me a favor and measure the thickness of the jaws of the -01BM? (Ideally, of the wire crimp and insulation crimp individually.)

[Ranayna]

The total thickness of the jaws is about 4mm.
The jaws are made of two metal plates, looking to be equally thick, so the two crimping areas are about 2mm each.

[tooki]

Thanks!

“About” or measured with calipers?

[knotlogic]

It seems Iwiss offers an SN-01BM under their own brand.  According to their own webpage, the total die thickness is 4 mm.  That may not be true for all SN-01BMs though.  I was just browsing though Aliexpress to get an idea of how the 01/02/03BM compare, and I came across one listing for the SN-01BM that describes it as "for 0.25 - 0.5 mm²".  All other instances I've seen say 0.08 - 0.5 mm².

If anyone's interested, the information I have so far after a quick search is:

SN-01BM   0.08 - 0.5 mm²
SN-02BM   0.08 - 0.5 mm²
SN-03BM   0.08 - 0.14 mm²

Each of these three tools have two crimp positions, and I could not find any number on die thickness in Aliexpress listings.  Also, I do not know what the difference is between the 01 and 02.  Note of course, those numbers may only be valid for the specific listings I was looking at.  I suspect there is a lot of copy-paste going on in the distribution channel, and numbers might be mangled, specific model numbers might be applied to differently sourced units, etc, etc.

[nctnico]

I just want to throw in my recent experience with crimping JST-XH connectors.

There is another set though, with an unnamed crimper. That one turned out to be a SN-01BM, with a much narrower jaw. This fits the connector as it should, and now knowing more about crimping, i got an adequate crimp on the first try.

Another good option for JST XH is the TNI-U TU-190-08.

[Ranayna]

I would say 4mm flat. My cheap calipers showed between 4.01 and 3.99, depending on how hard i pushed It essentially fits beween the prongs of the ratchet tool without overlapping.

Googling for the TNI-U TU-190-08 showed a crimper that looks very similar to the SN-01BM.
Looking further though, i found another interesting set with yet another crimping tool:

https://www.amazon.de/Crimpzange-Dupont-Stecker-Steckverbinder-Crimpkontakten/dp/B07QX51F3B/ref=psdc_2076971031_t4_B01M3RVPMS

I find this interesting, since the tool claims to be able to do both JST and Dupont-Style, and one of the pictures shows that the three positions are quite different. Especially the dupont section looks to be designed as menitioned earlier here, wrapping the strain relief around the cable. The modelnumber PR-3254 seems to be manufacturer spoecific though.

[tooki]

Thanks for the reply!

If you look at the other pictures on the amazon listing, it looks like it’s the same jaws as in the SN-4228B I posted about in the original post. (But with nicer handles.)

If mine ever deigns to arrive, I’ll let you know how it turns out! I also ordered an AliExpress JST XH assortment, as well as a JST SM assortment. So eventually I’ll be able to report on how they work. I also have some genuine Molex KK in both 2.54 and 3.96mm, JST XH, JST VH, JST PH, and Molex SPOX coming from Reichelt.

[knotlogic]

If you look at the other pictures on the amazon listing, it looks like it’s the same jaws as in the SN-4228B I posted about in the original post. (But with nicer handles.)

Did something change with one of the vendors?  The link you posted for the TZ-4228B leads to a tool with 4 crimp positions for me, with the innermost one rounded.  And the Amazon one for the Preciva PR-3254 shows 3.

[tooki]

If you look at the other pictures on the amazon listing, it looks like it’s the same jaws as in the SN-4228B I posted about in the original post. (But with nicer handles.)

Did something change with one of the vendors?  The link you posted for the TZ-4228B leads to a tool with 4 crimp positions for me, with the innermost one rounded.  And the Amazon one for the Preciva PR-3254 shows 3.

Oh! You’re right! Sorry, my mistake. Similar, but not the same.

[Ranayna]

Lol, to make the confusion complete:

https://www.amazon.de/Crimpzange-Crimping-Steckverbinder-Stiftleiste-3-1-5mm%C2%B2/dp/B07VGF34KX/ref=psdc_2076971031_t2_B07QX51F3B

This set claims to contain a SN-28B, but that crimper looks like that SN-4228B that tooki linked.

*sigh* What a can of worms this is 

I have to supress the urge to buy another set 
But i have enough JSTs for now, and no real need for Duponts at the moment...

[Jwillis]

You need one for 16AWG .  Check out  IWISS SN Series . SN-28B is for 28-18 AWG  , SN-48B is for 26-16 AWG
I have the  SN-28B and does a really neat job. Think I paid around $40 for mine.

[tooki]

Umm, 16AWG? That’s far afield of the kinds of contacts this thread is about. (I have an SN-48B, too, as well as various other crimpers for larger terminals. But this thread is about the smaller kinds.)

And if you’ve read this thread so far, you’ve hopefully understood that terminal compatibility goes far beyond just matching wire size.

[SparkyFX]

*sigh* What a can of worms this is 

I have to supress the urge to buy another set 

Haha... welcome to the world of "Affordable Crimping tools", i got the set with a "Preciva 1550" in the title and "Preciva 3254" in the picture. It does crimp DuPont contacts according to my expectations (wire sustains some pulling force, contact insert goes effortlessly into the cavity, contact is not bent).

I think some of the offered combinations of tool and contact are the result of algorithms that see buyers buying the same combination and then suggesting to bundle it - maybe never regarding returns/complaints.

[tooki]

FYI, the “1550” in the title is not a model number, but rather part of the phrase “1550 pcs”. They’re saying that the set contains 1550 pieces.

Thanks for the report. Makes me hopeful that the one I ordered will also work well.

[Per Hansson]

I’m still waiting on the new Chinese crimper. Coronavirus has slowed the already-slow cheap shipping.

Thank you for creating yet another post on this matter (no, I am not being ironic!)
I had already read most of the posts you link in your OP and placed an order with IWISS on the 12:th of May.
I am in the same boat as you: waiting for them to arrive, maybe this year!

[tooki]

Well, a miracle happened, and the TZ-4228B arrived yesterday!

Overall, it makes a decent impression. The DuPont jaw is 7mm thick (same as on SN-28B), the other three jaws are 4.5mm thick, in both cases evenly split between wire and insulation dies. The DuPont jaw works, neither mangling nor under-crimping any of the contacts I have. The smaller female contacts end up with the insulation crimp ever so slightly too wide, such that inserting into a housing has a little bit of friction, but it does work. I’ll have to try it with some thinner wire. The gold plated ones, which are a millimeter longer and clearly designed for thicker wire, work beautifully with the 24ga (0.22m²) wire I was testing with. (However, if it were me, I’d have made the wire die only the 2.25mm thick like the other three. I don’t know why they kept it 3.5mm thick, since no DuPont contacts need such a thick wire jaw, and a thinner one would make positioning the cheap smaller female contacts a bit quicker.)

Jaw #2 (going by the numbering on the image in the original post) works perfectly for both variants of Molex KK clones that I have.

I found some JST PH (2.0mm pitch) connectors at work yesterday. Jaw #1 is supposed to be for those. I’ll try it out and get back to you.

In summary: the AMP Ampmodu Mod IV crimper ultimately produces slightly nicer looking crimps, and is definitely superior for very thin wire (since it has jaws specifically for them), and it’s definitely easier to use thanks to the insulation stop it has. But it’s definitely not as flexible on contact compatibility. The insulation stop consumes space that the cheap smaller female DuPont contacts do not have to spare, making it difficult to not crush those without careful positioning. The TZ-4228B does a good job on every small contact I threw at it. Will it meet coppercone2’s standards (or, indeed, military or aerospace standards)? No. But I think we may have a winner for hobby use. At the price, I don’t think it can be beat.

I still have to try it with some D-sub contacts, too.

I’ll also mention that I was able to adjust the dies on the TZ-4228B slightly, so that the anvils align ever so slightly better than how they shipped, and this improved the crimps a tiny bit.

[daveismissing]

Surfing around I have come to the conclusion that Pressmaster are/were likely the original OEM for Molex's tools and likely some Xcelite crimpers that I favour
https://www.pressmaster.se/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/DRB-0805-HD_980.png
https://www.pressmaster.se/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/DRB0505L_00012.png
 

[tooki]

Surfing around I have come to the conclusion that Pressmaster are/were likely the original OEM for Molex's tools and likely some Xcelite crimpers that I favour
https://www.pressmaster.se/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/DRB-0805-HD_980.png
https://www.pressmaster.se/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/DRB0505L_00012.png
 

Yep, that's well-known. But not terribly relevant here, as they violate the "affordable" constraint of this discussion.

(WEZAG and Sargent are other big ODM crimper manufacturers.)

[tooki]

Oh yeah, I also promised updates on the TZ-4228B.

I can happily report that it works great on JST PH (2.0mm), JST SM (the 2.5mm wire-to-wire connectors with flat pins that are commonly used on LED strips), and JST VH (3.96mm).

It does not work particularly well for Molex KK 3.96mm, as those contacts have diagonal/offset insulation crimps (just like Dupont) that demand a round insulation die. The small 2.54mm Molex KK discussed in prior posts have symmetrical insulation crimps that work perfectly in this tool.

So the upshot is that so far, the TZ-4228B is proving to be very versatile. The crimps aren't quite as good as OEM tools would create, but they are still good, and at 1/20th the cost, this is a totally acceptable compromise for hobby use.

I'll also add the observation that the sweet spot for wire size seems to be around 24-22AWG (~0.2mm²-0.35mm²) for the majority of the contacts. This tool's dies simply aren't designed for super thin or super thick wires. Going just from memory, I would suggest that the 4 jaws work best for:
1 (JST PH, XH): 26-24AWG (0.12-0.2mm²)
2 (JST XH, SM; Molex KK254): 24-20AWG (0.2-0.5mm²)
3 (JST VH): 24-18AWG (0.2-0.75mm²)
4 (Dupont): 24-20AWG (0.2-0.5mm²)

In any case the contact needs to be sized to the wire. All the real manufacturers have different size contacts for different wire sizes, but the Ali/eBay vendors often mix and match, and don't tell you which you're getting. For the most part, it seems that the female Dupont contacts are the ones for thin wire, while the male ones (and gold-plated female ones) are the contacts for thicker wire, which I prefer.

[Electabuzz]

I'm sorry, this may be a little off-topic. But as soon as I saw the 3220M.. I just HAD to

[tooki]

I'm sorry, this may be a little off-topic. But as soon as I saw the 3220M.. I just HAD to

I am glad you did! LMAO!!!

[Monkeh]

It does not work particularly well for Molex KK 3.96mm, as those contacts have diagonal/offset insulation crimps (just like Dupont) that demand a round insulation die.

Not all of them - the 2578 and 45570 series contacts have an F insulation crimp. Far as I know they're drop-in, but Molex ask me to put effort into finding actual documentation.

[tooki]

It does not work particularly well for Molex KK 3.96mm, as those contacts have diagonal/offset insulation crimps (just like Dupont) that demand a round insulation die.

Not all of them - the 2578 and 45570 series contacts have an F insulation crimp. Far as I know they're drop-in, but Molex ask me to put effort into finding actual documentation.

That's a very diplomatic understatement!

Anyhow, very interesting! Poking around the product pages also led me to the 7258 series contacts, which seem to be unlisted in the KK parametric search, but exist linked from some of the housings and are still listed as active. (They're another Trifurcon variant.) They, too, have an F insulation crimp. Another such active "ghost" series is 2477, described as "humpback". (It's got the circular insulation crimp).

As for compatibility, as best I can tell, "normal" KK396 housings (series 2139, 3069, 41695) can accept any KK396 contact, including standard (series 2477, 2478, 2578, 8818), Trifurcon (series 6838 and 7258) and MarKK (series 45570), but the Trifurcon-only housings (series 6442) require Trifurcon or MarKK contacts.


I also found references to some obsolete or not-for-new-business series within the KK396 line:
2574 housing with flanges for screw mounting
2878 bifurcated crimp terminals (with F crimp)
1799 right angle terminals
1796 single-sided card-edge housings
1797 bifurcated crimp terminals for 1796
41696 housings (no info)
52213 housings (no info)
52266 housings (no info)
4366 "Dualcon" crimp terminals for 4338
4338 dual-sided card-edge housings
4573 cantilever terminals for 4338

Sources:
https://www.molex.com/pdm_docs/ps/PS-08-50-001.pdf
https://www.molex.com/pdm_docs/ats/ATS-011030003.pdf

[tooki]

Lol, to make the confusion complete:

https://www.amazon.de/Crimpzange-Crimping-Steckverbinder-Stiftleiste-3-1-5mm%C2%B2/dp/B07VGF34KX/ref=psdc_2076971031_t2_B07QX51F3B

This set claims to contain a SN-28B, but that crimper looks like that SN-4228B that tooki linked.

*sigh* What a can of worms this is 

I have to supress the urge to buy another set 
But i have enough JSTs for now, and no real need for Duponts at the moment...

On closer inspection, that die looks really interesting, in that it's thinner on every jaw. That'd potentially make it superior to the SN-4228B.

I bet they bought SN-28Bs and swapped out the die sets on them in the factory or something.

It'd be interesting for someone (*cough* *wink*) to buy and test that model. It won't ship to CH, so I can't.

[Electric Elf]

After reading (almost) all threads on the forum regarding DuPont crimping tools, watching (almost) all videos on Youtube on the topic (e.g. Andreas Spiess) and mostly following tooki's search, I stumbled upon an IWISS crimping tool advertised as DuPont compatible. It is the SN-025. You can find it on their Aliexpress store, but not on the official page.  The price is $29.99.

On the store page there are pictures of the die and it looks like the correct one - part m, part ∩.

(click on the pictures below to see them in full, the links are on imgur)

Anyone else seen/tested these?

[tooki]

I came across that recently, too. (I've been meaning to add more discoveries to this thread, just haven't gotten around to it.)

It looks promising, but… must not order yet another crimp tool! must not order yet another crimp tool! must not order yet another crimp tool!* 🤣 I'm certainly willing to accept donations and then post the results! For science, ya know? 

I am considering it, though, since the largest die opening would work for much larger offset-insulation-crimp connectors like the Molex KK 3.96mm pitch. But even on connectors that work with m-style insulation crimps, I've been finding that doing a circular insulation crimp on them often works better. (I've been using the AMPMODU Mod IV crimper to do Molex KK 2.54mm clones (KF2510, Reichelt PSK, etc) with great success.)


*I'll probably end up ordering yet another crimp tool...

[bsodmike]

Quick suggestion, this works for me. For crimping Dupont connectors, I bought this off Farnell a while back: Multicomp PRO HT-225D
https://export.farnell.com/multicomp/ht-225d/crimp-tool-ratchet-30-18awg/dp/1624832?ost=1624832

It's not hugely expensive either.

[tooki]

Quick suggestion, this works for me. For crimping Dupont connectors, I bought this off Farnell a while back: Multicomp PRO HT-225D
https://export.farnell.com/multicomp/ht-225d/crimp-tool-ratchet-30-18awg/dp/1624832?ost=1624832

It's not hugely expensive either.

Definitely not. HT-225D crimpers have the m-shape insulation crimp, which is categorically incorrect for DuPont pins, as explained earlier in this thread: https://www.eevblog.com/forum/reviews/affordable-crimp-tools-for-small-connectors-(dupont-etc-)/msg3078873/#msg3078873

If theirs actually has the round insulation crimp, then that would make it a very interesting option.

[sleemanj]

Here's a review... is this one of the posters here?

http://tech.mattmillman.com/iwiss-sn-025-another-head-scratching-dupont-crimp-tool-lands/

I was not able to find the bare die, nor even the entire tool with die on either taobao/tmall or 1688 iwiss stores.

( https://iwisstools.1688.com and https://iwiss.tmall.com - well I think they are, or at least could be, "official" stores )
 

[Hydron]

Interesting thread thanks, may give the aliexpress TZ-4228B a go given the affordable price.

I did come across the following on Amazon which made me laugh (I think they might have been better off without the example crimp...):

[bsodmike]

Thanks, I stand corrected!

[bsodmike]

Hey Tooki, Mate, which tool should I get off AliExpress to work with "Mini-PV (the real "DuPont" connector)"??

Even the IWISS SN-48B does the "M" type crimp 🤔

Thanks!

[bsodmike]

Even the IWISS SN-48B does the "M" type crimp 🤔

I found this though "IWISS SN-025 F Crimp Dupont Terminal Crimp Tool AWG 28-18(0.1-1mm²) for Harwin Amphenol MINI-PV Connectors Molex KK 396 Micro Timer Connectors"
https://amzn.to/347OmLM

Thanks!

[tooki]

Hey Tooki, Mate, which tool should I get off AliExpress to work with "Mini-PV (the real "DuPont" connector)"??

Of the cheap tools so far, the SN-4228B, as I explained in multiple posts above.

Even the IWISS SN-48B does the "M" type crimp 🤔

Of course it does, why wouldn’t it? It’s not a DuPont crimper and is rarely sold as one. (Unlike the SN-28B, which also is not a DuPont crimper, but is most commonly sold as one.)

I found this though "IWISS SN-025 F Crimp Dupont Terminal Crimp Tool AWG 28-18(0.1-1mm²) for Harwin Amphenol MINI-PV Connectors Molex KK 396 Micro Timer Connectors"
https://amzn.to/347OmLM

Just a few replies higher is a link to a review of it.

Please, go back and carefully re-read this thread. It contains all the info you’ve asked for.

[tooki]

Interesting thread thanks, may give the aliexpress TZ-4228B a go given the affordable price.

We ordered a few of them at work, as they’ve proven to work pretty well for not only DuPont (which we don’t use toooooo much), but also for Molex KK 254, JST XH, and JST VH, which are all things we are using on a project.

The SN-25B looks interesting, in that its larger round jaws would work for the Molex KK 396 that need the round insulation crimp, but may also work for the JST VH. (All else held equal, I prefer the round insulation crimps.)

I also bought myself an IWS-3220, and it’s OK. The biggest die is not super precise. But it does seem to do small things like XH and PH well. But damn is it easy to pinch your fingers with it!

I need to do a detailed update on the AMPMODU crimper, too.

[Per Hansson]

I’m still waiting on the new Chinese crimper. Coronavirus has slowed the already-slow cheap shipping.

Thank you for creating yet another post on this matter (no, I am not being ironic!)
I had already read most of the posts you link in your OP and placed an order with IWISS on the 12:th of May.
I am in the same boat as you: waiting for them to arrive, maybe this year!

Due to the unique way the Swedish postal service Postnord operates I never did get my crimpers.
So I gave up and ordered them again, Iwiss was even nice enough to upgrade me to TNT free of charge so this time I got them!
Now my intention was never to buy these for crimping KK254, however I had the Molex 08-50-0032 crimps on my table and a few fans needing crimps so I tried it out.
The tool I bought is the Iwiss SN-2549, its die is too wide for KK254 crimps, so if you position it "normally" then it gets mangled.
However if you position it as I show in the later two photos it creates a pretty good crimp I must say!
I also bought a SN-58B but it is so long ago that I don't even remember why anymore

[nctnico]

For Molex KK the official service tool (order number 0640160201) is still in the affordable range at around $135 and it can crimp other series as well.

[cjs]

Well, looks like I'm rather late to the party here, though I bought my crimper well before this thread started. I picked up one that's been mentioned slightly on this thread, the Preciva PR-3254. (It seems to be getting harder to buy; it's been unavailable on amazon.co.jp for more than half a year now, though it seems still to be available on amazon.de. I've never seen it on AliExpress, as far as I can recall.)

Like the TZ-4228B /  SN-4228B, the innermost die is designed for "dupont" connectors:


My first hundred or so connectors had about a 25% success rate, and the second hundred about 66%, but these days I'm doing much better. None of my bad connections appear to be due to the tool itself, but with my skill at correctly positoning the connector in the crimp nest (not so difficult) and the wire in the connector (much more difficult). When the crimp is good you can give the wire a very hard tug and it will not come loose from the connector.

Here's a photo of some early results, an ok (albeit with too much conductor stripped) and an incorrect (mispositioned connector and wire) crimp. (My current work looks better than this, but I don't have any photos handy.)


I've not used this with anything other than dupont as of yet, nor have I used any other crimp tools, so I can't really compare it. (I'm thinking I'll grab a TZ-4228B, though, since they're cheap enough to be worth it to learn a bit more about the differences between crimp tools.) But I am pretty happy with the results of this one, and from the problems and results I've seen others having, I suspect a good part of their issues is that the die is incorrect. For the rest, well, positioning, positioning, positioning.

I've found that with the separate M-shaped conductor punch and round-shaped insulation punch there's a not insignificant "step" from latter to the former, and it can work to push the insulation up to butt against that step at the top of the entry. It doesn't seem to make much difference whether the wire is at the top (against the punch) or the bottom (against the anvil that pushes up on the base of the connector); in both cases the crimp seems to come out the same.

And hey, use your dominant hand to insert the wire, even if you have to turn the crimper around, and even if you have to switch hands to finish the crimp. Surely it can't be the case that most You-tubers are left handed....

(If anybody knows what's wrong with the inline attachment feature that's obviously not working here, feel free to PM me.)

[BlackICE]

I ordered one if these with the connectors kits. I hope it arrives and works OK.

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/4001044611583.html?spm=a2g0s.12269583.0.0.22ec3002WejQlI

[profanum429]

I ended up finding a new-in-box Molex 11-01-0208 for the SL contacts; they are the same pitch and I like the header system with latches and the contacts aren't too bad on price. They seem relatively compatible with plugging into Dupont style, but the overall SL system is pretty good I think.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Molex-11-01-0208-22-24-30-36-AWG-Hand-Crimp-Tool-New-In-Box-Instructions/233847797157?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2060353.m2749.l2649 is the tool I bought; I offered the guy $100 and he accepted so you can probably get them for that or maybe even cheaper. They showed up today and like expected crimp the SL contacts (male and female) perfectly. I'm pretty happy with the purchase especially after fiddling with the usual assortment of SN-whatevers. I figure I'll just stick to SL terminals on future boards; a little big but I'm liking them.

[seanspotatobusiness]

Are the TZ-4228B and SN-4228B the exact same tool?

[Joebeazelman]

I feel your pain. Shopping around for a good set of crimpers is a bewildering experience. There are literally hundreds of brands to choose from with most being rebrands of the same Chinese-made set. It's tempting to just pick the most expensive one because it often tends to be the most popular or highly recommended, such as the Engineer brand.  It doesn’t necessarily, however, guarantee the best value for your money.  I have some tips for selecting a good one along with a couple of recommendations.

You can often discern the quality of the crimpers from the photos. The best crimpers have precision cut and hardened jaws. You can tell by the jaw’s razor-sharp edges and corners and its crisp profiles. The surface finish on the jaws is smooth and even polished in order for the wings to smoothly roll inside the die profile. Cheaper ones are either coated or blued to hide surface defects.

All that said, I have had nothing but stellar results with the iWISS IWS-3220M with JST and Dupont-styled pins. I have the older model with the blue grip.  After trying several cheap and expensive ones, it's the only one that gives me a consistently strong factory quality crimp.  The main issue with all the ratcheting type crimpers is the insertion and alignment of the terminal or pin.  This one is no different, but the narrow jaw width gives you good visibility from both sides. I can only vouch for its performance on JST and Dupont Pins. It’s offered under other brands.  At $23, they are a no brainer:

https://www.amazon.com/IWISS-IWS-3220M-Connector-0-03-0-52mm%C2%B2-Ratcheting/dp/B078WPT5M1/

The best crimpers I have used for larger terminals are the Zhushan VSB series. This is a slept-on crimper! It has a unique design and feels more substantial than crimpers that cost over $100.  The action feels very smooth and effortless in the hand.  At well under $20 a pair, they are a steal:

https://www.amazon.com/Crimping-Zhushan-0-5-6mm%C2%B2-Insulated-Terminal/dp/B08KGD68FN/

https://www.amazon.com/Terminal-Zhushan-0-5-1-0mm%C2%B2-Self-Adjusting-Non-Insulated/dp/B08L7SDYGY/

They offer other models but for some reason, they don’t show up readily on Amazon searches, so you may have to Google to find them.

[tooki]

I feel your pain. Shopping around for a good set of crimpers is a bewildering experience. There are literally hundreds of brands to choose from with most being rebrands of the same Chinese-made set. It's tempting to just pick the most expensive one because it often tends to be the most popular or highly recommended, such as the Engineer brand.  It doesn’t necessarily, however, guarantee the best value for your money.  I have some tips for selecting a good one along with a couple of recommendations.

You can often discern the quality of the crimpers from the photos. The best crimpers have precision cut and hardened jaws. You can tell by the jaw’s razor-sharp edges and corners and its crisp profiles. The surface finish on the jaws is smooth and even polished in order for the wings to smoothly roll inside the die profile. Cheaper ones are either coated or blued to hide surface defects.

All that said, I have had nothing but stellar results with the iWISS IWS-3220M with JST and Dupont-styled pins. I have the older model with the blue grip.  After trying several cheap and expensive ones, it's the only one that gives me a consistently strong factory quality crimp.  The main issue with all the ratcheting type crimpers is the insertion and alignment of the terminal or pin.  This one is no different, but the narrow jaw width gives you good visibility from both sides. I can only vouch for its performance on JST and Dupont Pins. It’s offered under other brands.  At $23, they are a no brainer:

https://www.amazon.com/IWISS-IWS-3220M-Connector-0-03-0-52mm%C2%B2-Ratcheting/dp/B078WPT5M1/

The best crimpers I have used for larger terminals are the Zhushan VSB series. This is a slept-on crimper! It has a unique design and feels more substantial than crimpers that cost over $100.  The action feels very smooth and effortless in the hand.  At well under $20 a pair, they are a steal:

https://www.amazon.com/Crimping-Zhushan-0-5-6mm%C2%B2-Insulated-Terminal/dp/B08KGD68FN/

https://www.amazon.com/Terminal-Zhushan-0-5-1-0mm%C2%B2-Self-Adjusting-Non-Insulated/dp/B08L7SDYGY/

They offer other models but for some reason, they don’t show up readily on Amazon searches, so you may have to Google to find them.

I agree with most of what you say, but I do question your DuPont crimps, since (as this thread explains at length), they are categorically impossible to crimp correctly in a crimper without a circular insulation die, which the 3220M does not have.

[tooki]

Are the TZ-4228B and SN-4228B the exact same tool?

I would assume so. I haven’t seen anyone but Toozo sell it.

[Joebeazelman]

Are taking about the same dupont connectors?  Here is what I consider to be dupont connectors:

" alt="" class="bbc_img" /> 

[tooki]

Are taking about the same dupont connectors?  Here is what I consider to be dupont connectors:

(Attachment Link) " alt="" class="bbc_img" />

Yep. The offset triangular insulation wings require a circular die to crimp correctly. They aren’t supposed to penetrate the insulation.

Perhaps share some good pictures of your crimped contacts?

[TheBay]

I normally don't cheap out on crimp tools, but I needed to do some Dupont and JST connectors and bought a "Preciva" branded crimp tool as I could get it next day on Amazon. All I can say is wow it exceeded my expectations and does a perfect crimp every time.

[gatoruss]

I know this is an old thread, but is the SN-4228B and the TZ-4228B the same device?  Both are offered thru Alliexpress.

[thm_w]

Looks the same to me, the first one even shows "TZ-4228B" in the photos.

It was also asked earlier in this thread.

[sleemanj]

With those SN and TZ from Ali you'll never know what you are getting.  Who knows how many manufacturers there are of them, probably some are great, and some are... not.
 Always be sure to read the customer reviews at the very least.

I stick to my assessment that the Iwiss 2820M are the best bang for buck in hobby crimping, not fancy, and technically "the wrong shape" as described in this thread, but they are cheap, well made, and work reliably with just a little practice.  They are the ones I reach for in my draw, not the couple pairs of different ratchett ones or other manual ones.

[tooki]

With those SN and TZ from Ali you'll never know what you are getting.  Who knows how many manufacturers there are of them, probably some are great, and some are... not.
 Always be sure to read the customer reviews at the very least.

Except with the rarer types like the 4228B and SN-25, which seem to have one, maybe two companies making them.

I stick to my assessment that the Iwiss 2820M are the best bang for buck in hobby crimping, not fancy, and technically "the wrong shape" as described in this thread, but they are cheap, well made, and work reliably with just a little practice.  They are the ones I reach for in my draw, not the couple pairs of different ratchett ones or other manual ones.

I am inherently skeptical of non-ratcheting crimp tools due to the uncontrolled crimp force.

At some point that isn’t now, at 1:20am on a work night, I need to write a proper update. But in a nutshell:
The official AMPMODU MOD IV tool I got for cheap is, by a wide margin, my preferred crimp tool. I use it routinely for DuPont and KK254 crimps, and the results are just gorgeous, with the least effort by far.
Next favorite is the IWISS 3220M. It’s basically an SN-01BM, -02BM, and -03BM (i.e. various size D-sub) rolled into one linear action tool. Of the tools I have, it does the best on JST XH and similar.

I also managed to snag, after having a saved search for years on the local classifieds, a DMC AFM8 military crimped (for machined, circular contacts). A joy to use, for things where a circular contact is available. (So completely irrelevant to this thread. :p )

I picked up a used Molex Mini-Fit Jr. tool. It’s neither intended nor suitable for DuPont. With the locator removed, it can be cajoled into making some VERY nice KK254 crimps, but positioning the contact in the tool to do so is an exercise in frustration.

At my previous workplace, we ordered the $125 Molex KK254, etc. tool mentioned above (64016-0201). It was… bad. Decent handle, but cheap cast dies that did not line up correctly, producing consistently disappointing crimps. And the included clothespin-looking thingie that is supposed to pass for a locator is a joke. It’s fiddlier than just holding the damned contact by hand. We requested an RMA from Digi-Key and they just refunded the money and didn’t even want it sent back.

At my current work, we have a semi-official Mini-PV tool. (Semi-official in that it’s a tool from an expensive manufacturer, made specifically for Mini-PV, but not from Amphenol. I’m quite certain the actual OEM is WEZAG.) Unsurprisingly it works perfectly on the female Mini-PV contacts it’s designed for. It’s very difficult to use it for male mini-PV, however, as the die shape relies on the locator to prevent rotation of the contact, so when not using the locator (for the male pins) it’s fidgety. Real Mini-PV contacts, both male and female, have much wider, more open insulation crimp wings than the Chinese DuPonts. Easier to insert fat insulation into, but harder to crimp without a locator.

[DeKay]

I bought a TZ-4228B and it has been working well for me and the Dupont connectors it is meant to crimp.  However, there is more to life than Duponts, and I wondered if this tool could accept other dies from other vendors.  And indeed it can!  I just bought an SN-02C jaw from here with free shipping and it works perfectly.

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32863408595.html

It seems that the only thing you really need to look for is the "4mm" width of the die where it fits into the jaws of the crimper.  There is another type of die out there for a similar crimper that (if I remember correctly) is 6mm wide at the top of the die.  Stay away from those and you should be golden.

[tooki]

Yeah, as best I can tell, the -4228B is a bog-standard SN-type handle, but with a rare die.

[hitech95]

While looking for some crimping tool I've come up to this post.

Oh yeah, I also promised updates on the TZ-4228B.

I can happily report that it works great on JST PH (2.0mm), JST SM (the 2.5mm wire-to-wire connectors with flat pins that are commonly used on LED strips), and JST VH (3.96mm).

It does not work particularly well for Molex KK 3.96mm, as those contacts have diagonal/offset insulation crimps (just like Dupont) that demand a round insulation die. The small 2.54mm Molex KK discussed in prior posts have symmetrical insulation crimps that work perfectly in this tool.

So the upshot is that so far, the TZ-4228B is proving to be very versatile. The crimps aren't quite as good as OEM tools would create, but they are still good, and at 1/20th the cost, this is a totally acceptable compromise for hobby use.

I'll also add the observation that the sweet spot for wire size seems to be around 24-22AWG (~0.2mm²-0.35mm²) for the majority of the contacts. This tool's dies simply aren't designed for super thin or super thick wires. Going just from memory, I would suggest that the 4 jaws work best for:
1 (JST PH, XH): 26-24AWG (0.12-0.2mm²)
2 (JST XH, SM; Molex KK254): 24-20AWG (0.2-0.5mm²)
3 (JST VH): 24-18AWG (0.2-0.75mm²)
4 (Dupont): 24-20AWG (0.2-0.5mm²)

In any case the contact needs to be sized to the wire. All the real manufacturers have different size contacts for different wire sizes, but the Ali/eBay vendors often mix and match, and don't tell you which you're getting. For the most part, it seems that the female Dupont contacts are the ones for thin wire, while the male ones (and gold-plated female ones) are the contacts for thicker wire, which I prefer.

I mostly "crimp" spade connectors and JST PH and XH for my DIY projects.
Until now I basically used pliers and a point of solder. It worked fine for my needs but I wanted something better. 

After reading the thred I've got the 4228B and the SN-48B.

And here the issues are showing... now I want to say that I'm a complete noob on crimping,
as said before I've used plers until today. 

SN-48: the die is lose, the lower handle is shaking in the lever pins, like if the pins are too long.
Shaking it it makes rattling sound. Something is moving inside one of the handle mold.
I'm not sure If I have to notify the seller that it has probably damaged in shipping...

I've crimped some spade connector I had around and it worked fine. It was quite easy compared to my method.
I did 4 connectors in a row!

Then due to my success I've moved to the to the JST PH....

according to the post I should use the first position of the 4228B.
I've watched and watched again my tool but I cannot find a way to identify on which side the connector goes.
While the bottom die is different in the two section the top one instead seems (to my eye) the same for both section.
So no difference for the insulator crimp and the copper crimp.


Well I have a lot of connectors so I decided to go with try and error...
I did 7 or 8 and none really crimped the wire, only the insulator but only on thicker wires.

I've tried different way to position the metal piece. I've noticed that I have to do 2 separate crimp If I don't want to mangle the part that goes into the plastic housing
I have to do the two steps otherwise the part get smashed.

But even doing so the second one still have no effect on the wiring wings...

Is the tool/die defective or its just me?

Its hard to take a decent picture, but you can see that the wire is not crimped and, that the metal insert is not complelty compressed.

Should I ask for a refund?


EDIT: Ive tried HX too, and also in this case the wings that should crimp the metal parts are not folded.


EDIT 2: I've found something similar to my issue:
https://ae01.alicdn.com/kf/Ab9dbaa7560e340bea85b5f38307838b0T.jpg

[thm_w]

While looking for some crimping tool I've come up to this post.

Since most people are right handed, the tool is designed to be held in your right hand then feed in the crimp with your left hand.
The insulation portion of the crimp die will be larger (so it doesnt crimp it as tight), it should be possible to look at the die to confirm this.
Your die does look as if both halves are even, but, you'd need to look at the other half of the die as well.

https://ae01.alicdn.com/kf/H119bc55a680f434898a55114286b84886.jpg

[hitech95]

While looking for some crimping tool I've come up to this post.

Since most people are right handed, the tool is designed to be held in your right hand then feed in the crimp with your left hand.
The insulation portion of the crimp die will be larger (so it doesnt crimp it as tight), it should be possible to look at the die to confirm this.

https://ae01.alicdn.com/kf/H119bc55a680f434898a55114286b84886.jpg

Yep, got it... I was using it in the right hand!
As stated the bottom die is different, the top one is even on its two part.
I've looked for picture of the die in the web and I've found only one still image in a video.

But I can say that my die dont have the M shape on both No.4 and No.1 positions in the narrow section of the die.
In fact it doesn't has the narrower part at all.

I was expecting something like this but mine are not like that (See attachments for the pictures):


EDIT: added a decent macro photo of my empty crimp.

[thm_w]

Good photos.
Yeah that photo you found (from this site https://mysku.club/blog/aliexpress/86239.html) would confirm the die is defective, they probably used two of the same plates instead of one of plate A and one plate B.
If you can send that photo clearly to the seller, try to get a refund or send you a new die.

[tooki]

Yep, that’s definitely not right. Despite the fact that they ground down the die width properly on both sides, they definitely used two insulation crimp die halves on the top, rather than one conductor die half and one insulation die half.

[hitech95]

Good photos.
Yeah that photo you found (from this site https://mysku.club/blog/aliexpress/86239.html) would confirm the die is defective, they probably used two of the same plates instead of one of plate A and one plate B.
If you can send that photo clearly to the seller, try to get a refund or send you a new die.

Oh I didnt not found that site, but I did found a still image in a YouTube video...
But yes the die is definetly broken.

Yep, that’s definitely not right. Despite the fact that they ground down the die width properly on both sides, they definitely used two insulation crimp die halves on the top, rather than one conductor die half and one insulation die half.

Ok, at the end even if I'm a noob on this topic I'm not that dumb not trying to figure out why the crimp was not working!

Well I'm gonna order a new one from a different supplier lets see what happends!
I'll post an update once I get it!

[hitech95]

So
 yesterday I received the new crimp tool.

I directly tested a JST XH, it was ok at first try.
Both wings folded this time and the cable has been crimped in place.

Small mistake in my end partially crimped the insulation on the mall wings but still fine for me.

The two half of the die now are different.

The only downside is that this crimp is quite harder to push and open... this one was packaged better than the previous.

[gjvdheiden]

Bought the  Preciva PR-3254 from amazon. The dupont went pretty well.

Also tried Molex micro-fit 3.0 0430300038 connectors. You'll have to position the tabs in the crimper, but ok. Guess you could make a fixture in the 3D printer to align it, but just to much trouble for nothing.

Also took a picture of the dimensions mentions in the little booklet. Checked the thickness, they are correct.

[knotlogic]

Just to add another datapoint into the mix:  I purchasd a "Todzo TZ-4228B" off Aliexpress which has the same die as the tool tooki talked about in the first post.  Worked near perfect on the first try.  Perhaps the crimp was a little flat... too much pressure perhaps?  But the tension is adjustable so I think I might be able to dial that down.

[dreamcat4]

tension is adjustable so I think I might be able to dial that down.

don't suppose you can explain how to do that? Sorry i didn't realize this was possible for this tool. (I have one here already). Would be nice to know about

[voltsandjolts]

Adjuster highlighted.

[tooki]

Just to add another datapoint into the mix:  I purchasd a "Todzo TZ-4228B" off Aliexpress which has the same die as the tool tooki talked about in the first post.  Worked near perfect on the first try.  Perhaps the crimp was a little flat... too much pressure perhaps?  But the tension is adjustable so I think I might be able to dial that down.

The flatness is the die shape. Reducing the force may just result in unreliable crimps.

[Dakkahun]

Apparently, at least in Europe, Lidl is selling this week an JST/Dupont crimper set:
https://www.lidl.de/p/parkside-crimpzangen-set-2012-teilig/p100367458
whick looks like this:

[tooki]

Apparently, at least in Europe, Lidl is selling this week an JST/Dupont crimper set:
https://www.lidl.de/p/parkside-crimpzangen-set-2012-teilig/p100367458
whick looks like this:
(Attachment Link)

If that’s accurate, then someone at Lidl was actually paying attention!


Anyhow, it’s not a Europe-wide sale item. It’s not here in Switzerland, at least not yet. They often stagger the specials. If it comes here I’ll definitely take a look!

[Gyro]

Their centre isle never ceases to surprise!

[eliocor]

Just bought one from a Lidl shop (Italy) for 19.99€:


the crimping is rather decent:


P.S.: sorry for the low quality photo: it was made with a smartphone....

[tooki]

It’s impressive that they chose the circular insulation crimp. But like the Toozo, the conductor crimp is unnecessarily huge. And like most of these tools, the length of the conductor crimp is too long. It’s long enough to be damaging the anti rotation flaps, never mind leave a bell mouth on the conductor crimp area.

Could you post some close-ups of the dies from various angles, both open and closed?

[eliocor]

just some better pictures and even better crimping....



Remember: RTFM!! Yes, there is even an IKEA-style manual!

The following close-ups are enough?

[eliocor]

some more pictures

[Ian.M]

You are positioning the pin in the die incorrectly, as the centerline of the die should *NOT* be leaving a mark on the contact crimp section.  The centerline of the die should be close to but not on the insulation grip, and the anti-rotation ears just behind the square box section should be *just* clear of the face of the die so they don't get crimped.  The whole length of the contact crimp should be uniform with no wire insulation under it.

If you are still having problems, please measure accurate thicknesses to the centerline of both sides (not both jaws) of the die  and photo the crimped and uncrimped pins + the prepared wire on a background of graph paper (and tell us its square size).  We should then be able to tell you what adjustments you need to make.

I am glad to see the photo of the whole tool shows the die set installed punch jaw facing up and the die jaw facing down when held.  You need it that way so you can see the end of the wire is correctly positioned in the terminal before crimping and it also aids in positioning the terminal correctly.  Any budget crimper that has the punch jaw on top could probably benefit from swapping its jaws!

Terminology:

• Die - correctly the female (hollow) part of a die set. Commonly misused to apply to both and even adjacent parts!
• Punch or Male Die - the 'sticky out' part of a die set

[eliocor]

just never used the "dupont" connector, so it is sure I'm making some errors

--------------
after some time....
--------------

so, now:


is more correct, right?

[tooki]

just some better pictures and even better crimping....



Remember: RTFM!! Yes, there is even an IKEA-style manual!

The following close-ups are enough?

The inside finish of the dies looks astoundingly good for a $30 tool. Thanks for the pix!

[tooki]

You are positioning the pin in the die incorrectly, as the centerline of the die should *NOT* be leaving a mark on the contact crimp section.  The centerline of the die should be close to but not on the insulation grip, and the anti-rotation ears just behind the square box section should be *just* clear of the face of the die so they don't get crimped.  The whole length of the contact crimp should be uniform with no wire insulation under it.

What do you mean by the centerline in this context? It sounds to me, from context, that you mean the inner edge of the die.

If so, you’re incorrect, insofar as a bell mouth is mandatory on the inlet side of the conductor crimp.

Terminology:

• Die - correctly the female (hollow) part of a die set. Commonly misused to apply to both and even adjacent parts!
• Punch or Male Die - the 'sticky out' part of a die set

Amohenol and TE call them the “crimper” (F) and “anvil” (M).
Molex calls them “punch” (F) and “anvil” (M).

“Dies” in general refers to the set of both, see e.g.
https://www.amphenolrf.com/library/download/link/link_id/599178/

See e.g.
TE: https://www.te.com/content/dam/te-com/documents/application-tooling/global/Where%20Form%20Meets%20FunctionA-1-1773838-7.pdf
Molex: https://www.molex.com/content/dam/molex/molex-dot-com/products/automated/en-us/commercialcrimpbookpdf/638/63800/TM-638000029-001.pdf
Amphenol (née FCI née DuPont née Berg): https://mm.digikey.com/Volume0/opasdata/d220001/medias/docus/927/HT-0095.pdf

[tooki]

just some better pictures and even better crimping....

There’s a lot wrong there:
- insulation trapped in conductor crimp 👎 👎
- anti-rotation ears damaged 👎
- excessive bell mouth 👎

--------------
after some time....
--------------

so, now:


is more correct, right?

Eh…
- anti-rotation ears intact 👍
- no bell mouth at all 👎
- contact was rotated during crimping, resulting in indentation on one of the conductor crimp wings 👎
- not enough insulation visible past the insulation crimp 👎

These posters from major crimp terminal manufacturers should give you an idea of what to strive for:
JST: https://www.digikey.ch/en/pdf/j/jst-sales-america/jst-crimpchart
Molex: https://forum.digikey.com/t/molex-quality-crimp-posters-multiple-languages/4442
TE: https://www.te.com/content/dam/te-com/documents/application-tooling/global/65780-4_Crimp%20Quality%20Poster.pdf

The Amphenol datasheets for the original Mini-PV tools shows it specifically for this type of contact (see attachments), sadly at low resolution. However, I doubt the Lidl tool is designed precisely enough to actually be capable of meeting all the specifications (especially a back and front bell mouth). https://mm.digikey.com/Volume0/opasdata/d220001/medias/docus/927/HT-0095.pdf (female)
https://mm.digikey.com/Volume0/opasdata/d220001/medias/docus/1116/HT-0102.pdf (male)


Also, what gauge of wire are you using? It looks like it might be a bit on the thin side for these contacts.

[eliocor]

As I wrote, it was the first time I crimped "dupont" contacts and I do (didn't) know their specifications....
I have almost crimped only Moles 560023 terminals (just for prototyping).
Regarding the type of wire used: I used some scrape wire from telephonic RJ cable but I do not know its specifications

[Ian.M]

I'd bet that you need the official tooling, as recommended by the genuine connector manufacturer, to get proper bellmouths at both ends of the conductor crimp.   Those of us with shallower pockets using cheaper tools are doing well to get a conductor crimp that's uniform for its whole length, and without excessive distortion.  Cheap sets of dies made by wire EDM cutting consisting of pinned together sections are almost invariably only going to give you straight crimps. 

On the terminology;  Why am I not surprised that sections of the electronics industry have done their own thing, the opposite way round to the rest of the metal forming industry?  @Tooki: Thank you for making me better informed.

As to wire size - if the tool or its instructions, or the contacts datasheet give a size range, stick to it, however for cheap tools that at best give a vaguely marked size on the jaws, its 'suck it and see', and check it passes a pull test.   If you are buying wire from a reputable supplier, it should meet its specs, including cross section area (CSA), but from dubious suppliers, you'll often get less copper than you expect, and sometimes far less!  Salvaged wire is down to you, does it look right compared to the good stuff, and if its critical, one may have to break out the micrometer, measure enough strands to get an average, count the strands and calculate the total CSA to be certain.

[coppercone2]

bought the real molex tool for $120

people with the proper tools, you are not alone

[eliocor]

My wire choice was just to test the crimper: I do not exactly know gauge and strip size for "dupont" contacts.
The exact opposite was for the Molex 560023 terminals: I used the original crimper (IIRC > 800€) and the suggested wires and strip size. Otherwise I let a third party to prepare the cable/connectors for me.

But for home usage, I think even the Lidl ones can be good enough.... Once one learns how to do it.
Unluckily I have seen no videos with such details/quality like the pictures I have posted: I know it is not so easy to do macrophotography videos, but I'd like too find some good quality tutorials 

[tooki]

bought the real molex tool for $120

people with the proper tools, you are not alone

Which one? 0640160201?

We got one of those at my old job and it was so lousy we submitted an RMA to digikey. (They actually just refunded it, but didn’t want the tool back.) See the attached photo: the misalignment of the smallest jaw isn’t parallax error in the photo, it was actually off by that much. Useless.

[elnoob]

just some better pictures and even better crimping....



Remember: RTFM!! Yes, there is even an IKEA-style manual!

The following close-ups are enough?

The inside finish of the dies looks astoundingly good for a $30 tool. Thanks for the pix!

What do you think about crimping quality of this tool?
I’m choosing between TZ-4228B and this tool from Lidl. For me TZ-4228B made a better crimping when I looked at photos.

[elnoob]

BTW I’ve found another crimping tool called SN-2 on AliExpress - a seller claims that it’s specially for DuPont connectors:
https://aliexpress.com/item/1005002629846509.html

[Ian.M]

AliExpress sellers claim *anything*!

The die position vs contact type drawing shows an appropriate (rounded) shape for the DuPont wrap-around insulation crimp, but the closeup photo of the SN-2 tool shows the characteristic hump of a F-type fold-in insulation piercing crimp, unsuitable for DuPont.  Which they actually ship (or something completely different) is anyone's guess and may vary from week to week!

[wraper]

BTW I’ve found another crimping tool called SN-2 on AliExpress - a seller claims that it’s specially for DuPont connectors:
https://aliexpress.com/item/1005002629846509.html

You can find "Dupont" in the title of nearly all of small connector crimpers. And 99% of them are not actually compatible. That's what this thread is about.

[elnoob]

BTW I’ve found another crimping tool called SN-2 on AliExpress - a seller claims that it’s specially for DuPont connectors:
https://aliexpress.com/item/1005002629846509.html

You can find "Dupont" in the title of nearly all of small connector crimpers. And 99% of them are not actually compatible. That's what this thread is about.

That’s for sure!
At the moment, I’m choosing between TZ-4228B and the one from Lidl - don't know which one is better.

[tooki]

Hard to say. Maybe eliocor could do some tests using a known type of wire (I’d suggest 24AWG/0.25mm² stranded, with standard PVC insulation of around 1.5-1.8mm insulation diameter), now that he’s had the Lidl tool for a while and has more experience using it?

[eliocor]

after the 6th of January I will be able to make such tests (even with a SN-4228B lent by a friend).
Any suggestion on how much (mm) the wire must be stripped?

[tooki]

Harwin M20 (which seems to be the closest to no-name Chinese) says 3.5mm ±0.5mm (so 3.0-4.0mm)
Amphenol Mini-PV says 3.81-4.31mm.

I set my strippers to 4mm and call it a day.

[AndyOoo]

Found what seems to be a new crimp tool SN-2054 on AliExpress .

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005006272524168.html

The die has a slot with the correct shape for DuPont Connectors.

Only seems to be sold by one seller and I haven't been able to find the die sold on its own.

 

[elnoob]

after the 6th of January I will be able to make such tests (even with a SN-4228B lent by a friend).
Any suggestion on how much (mm) the wire must be stripped?

Hi!
How tests are going? Which tool is the winner? 

[throbscottle]

Joined the forum just so I can reply to this thread!

Been banging my head for a while trying to find suitable crimpers for "DuPont" terminals, since I got fed up with my 2 tool method (a bad tool to get the closure shape, followed by a very bad tool to get the pressure!) of a few years use. So thanks to you lot and I'm very glad you've covered the subject so well.

I was pretty close to ordering an IWISS SN-025, but started looking at the CINLIN ones since I've got a 4-side ferrule crimper by them I'm pretty happy with and their kits make a better match with my other terminals. Couldn't decide if they would be any good, or just shiny (extra cautious because of just how bad my existing tools are).

Anyway, I've just ordered the Precivia PR-3254 kit off Amazon - handy because you get the kit and I was considering using JST for a while now, so that's a neat introduction to those. Oh and of course rainbow ribbon cable is soooo pretty! (make a change from the salvaged grey IBM stuff I've been using!).

So I just wanted to say thanks for all the posts on here, you have resolved my a big chunk of my problem! (And I will update with photos when I've given it a go)

[throbscottle]

Results - I have been able to crimp all the open barrel terminals I own except the larger ring ones which I didn't try. The large spade connector is actually too big for the tool but still went in with some encouragement. It made ridges on the back though. See photos:

I feel encouraged to get a set of jaws for the larger terminals to replace the ones in my really bad crimper!

[tooki]

Thanks for trying, but can you take some better pictures? Those have such extreme anti-noise processing that it’s impossible to make out any detail whatsoever. Most likely you need to use a LOT more light.

Also, take a photo of the uncrimped DuPont contacts you are using. I can’t tell for sure due to the aforementioned lack of detail, but I suspect you may be crimping down the anti-rotation ears.

[throbscottle]

Ok here you go. Been busy with a 9 day work week. Uhg.

The 2 pairs of terminals are the Dupont and JST ones that came with the tool, attached to the ribbon cable that also came with the tool, which I stripped with my thumbnail sat on the sofa with it just unpacked, so it's not the best! Straight in the tool, no adjustment, not careful with the alignment - so they're not bad, considering.

The other terminals were all done with the middle hole. The big spade is actually too big for the tool so there was a bit of judicious pre-bending with skinny pliers on that one. Still came out ok! (But thicker wire would have been a problem)

I took some pictures to show the "very bad tool" (labelled "bad tool") mentioned in my first post. You can see it has squashed the conductor crimp down to the sides of the actual wire, so it grips the edges but the bit in the middle is un-crimped. It's made flanges on the back where it's pulled the wings down. I used to solder these until I got another tool which wouldn't close enough but at least formed the crimp correctly, so I'd use that first then put it through the very bad tool.

To be honest the new Preciva one also makes slight flanges on the back, but only with the Dupont terminals, and does it slightly worse with the very cheap ones I already had. So I think it's down to the quality of the terminals rather than a problem with the tool. Anyway they come out nicely in all other respects.

I reached the attachment limit. See next post for "bad" tool pics

[throbscottle]

Right, here are the pics showing the truly awful tool I got years ago, and it's results.

[tooki]

Yeah, that’s subpar even for an SN-28B. But it’s really hard to condemn the tool when used for terminals it wasn’t designed for. We’d need to see it used for the 2.8mm spade terminals the SN-28B was designed for.

A little bit of flashing (the “flare” on the back) is OK. Too much is indicative of an overcrimped terminal. This is far more likely the tool, not the terminal.

Tools like this one, the iwiss SN-25B, and the Toozo mentioned above are all steps in the right direction, but I wish some Chinese toolmaker would just buy a real Harwin M20 crimp tool and clone it.

[Ian.M]

Looks like your SN-28B could do with aligning its jaws!  Slacken off the screws that hold them and try to move one jaw relative to the other to get an even gap on each side of the die when fully closed.  Its a bit of a compromise because of the three die positions. Tighten the screws again and see on the next crimp if the ridges are reduced or at least more even.

[watchmaker]

I just received my Preciva and used it on some Iwiss Dupont connectors.  I need experience.

Crimping these is not as easy as crimping 14g wire!  It is fussy.

After about 6 terminals, I am getting close.  My main issue is that the insulation ears of the connectors are too wide to fit into the die, I have the partially close them.  This does make it easier to hold the assembly in the crimper.  The connectors do fit into the housing at least.

[tooki]

I just received my Preciva and used it on some Iwiss Dupont connectors.  I need experience.

Which you’ll get. Buy a strip of 1000 terminals on AliExpress for a couple of bucks. Spend a meditative half hour at a time bending them off the strip (or cutting the strip into little bits to give you something to grip, as some people like to do). Then you have cheap material to practice with. I recommend 24AWG wire: inexpensive crimpers often don’t crimp tight enough for 26AWG or thinner wire, and 22AWG or thicker usually has insulation so thick that insertion becomes difficult. (Luxury option: get 22AWG or 24AWG wire with thin mPPE insulation, which is easier to insert.)

Get a feel for the right length of insulation to strip, which is about 4mm. The exact optimal length varies slightly by contact manufacturer, but whatever it is, you only have a tolerance of 0.5-1mm, so you need to strip accurately.

Crimping these is not as easy as crimping 14g wire!  It is fussy.

Definitely! The smaller, the fussier. The tiniest I’ve crimped so far is a 1.2mm pitch Hirose DF57H, which supports only AWG 28-30 for hand crimping. Now those are fussy little bastards… (And that’s fussy with the $$$$ original tool. I can’t even imagine trying to do those on a Chinese tool…)

After about 6 terminals, I am getting close.  My main issue is that the insulation ears of the connectors are too wide to fit into the die, I have the partially close them.

Yeah, not only do the dies of practically all tools except the originals lack the wide “ramps”* to feed wide insulation wings into the die, but it’s common for the insulation wings to get splayed even wider than they’re supposed to when vendors roll up lengths of contact strips.

*see attached photo I nicked from Matt Millman’s site, showing the dies of an original DuPont tool. You can see how the jaws begin with a very shallow angle at the bottom, and then make a sharp transition to nearly vertical, almost parallel jaw shape with the half-circle at the top. Genuine Mini-PV contacts have extremely wide insulation wings, much wider than Chinese DuPont, so this shape is essential for them.

… I have the partially close them.  This does make it easier to hold the assembly in the crimper.  The connectors do fit into the housing at least.

If you get your wire stripping length well-controlled, with some practice you should be able to hold the contact in the tool with one ratchet click, then insert the wire to the right depth.

FYI, in your last photo, the wire was inserted too far. The insulation should not touch the conductor wings — there must be a gap. Otherwise you cannot tell if insulation has become entrapped in the conductor crimp itself.

[watchmaker]

Thank you for the feedback Tooki.  I did not know about the insulation length.  It seems "wrong" to make such a short piece of conductor, but it is what it is.

Also, thank you for the heads up about the dies not being wide enough for the ears.  It is good to know that issue with the insulation ears is not just me.

I have carbide sub MM endmils and may modify the die.  But before I do that, I have to get to a point where closing the ears to hold the wire in place before crimping is no longer necessary.

PS: A lot of individual skills have to be mastered in this line.  While I hope people considered me kind and generous, I think somewhere along the way I lost the appreciation that neophyte watchmakers have to learn how to manipulate tweezers and not flip parts. It is interesting to be back to square one.

[tooki]

Thank you for the feedback Tooki.  I did not know about the insulation length.  It seems "wrong" to make such a short piece of conductor, but it is what it is.

How do you figure? That’s not a particularly short strip length, neither for soldering into a PCB nor for many types of crimp contacts. These are small connectors used with small wire, so it stands to reason the strip length is proportional. Modern connector designs (for the same sizes of wires and same or similar connector pitch) actually use much shorter strip lengths with much tighter tolerances. JST XH, for example, needs a 2.0±0.3mm strip length if memory serves me correctly. (What’s not obvious/intuitive about this: this can mean needing to get better wire strippers. Typical automatic wire strippers like a Stripax tend to leave a somewhat ragged insulation end. No big deal for many applications, but for small contacts like DuPont it can begin to be problematic, and for really small-tolerance ones like XH, the raggedness of the insulation strip can easily exceed your entire tolerance.)

Because of how DuPont contacts are retained in the housing, an excessively long “brush” of wires sticking out of the conductor crimp will interfere with the contact retention latch.

In contrast, on contacts like JST XH or Molex KK, excess brush just tucks under the contact spring harmlessly.

Also, thank you for the heads up about the dies not being wide enough for the ears.  It is good to know that issue with the insulation ears is not just me.

I have carbide sub MM endmils and may modify the die.  But before I do that, I have to get to a point where closing the ears to hold the wire in place before crimping is no longer necessary.

PS: A lot of individual skills have to be mastered in this line.  While I hope people considered me kind and generous, I think somewhere along the way I lost the appreciation that neophyte watchmakers have to learn how to manipulate tweezers and not flip parts. It is interesting to be back to square one.

If you have a machine shop, I’d first spend time making a contact locator and wire stop than modifying the dies (other than smoothing the inside of the dies, which makes them work better). A simple locator for female contacts is made by milling (or accurately 3D printing) a piece of metal or plastic into which you press a male header pin. The locator bolts onto the crimp tool by using a longer bolt on the lower jaw.

(Of all the crimp tool designs I’ve used so far, my favorite, hands down, is the WEZAG design with an insulation stop rather than a wire stop per se. It ensures the contact is in the right place, even without a locator, and allows for some slop in strip length while absolutely ensuring the insulation ends right in the gap between the insulation wings and conductor wings. But I don’t know how one could retrofit this system onto an existing tool, since it requires a spring-loaded sheet metal piece between the dies for the conductor crimp and insulation crimp.)

[watchmaker]

Remember, I am coming from terminal strips, 10 watt resistors and tubes.  Make a secure physical connection by wrapping the wire completely around the lug, squeeze w/ needle nose, and THEN solder.  It was also the day when we thought we could afford to be profligate.

There is a lot for me to learn and get used to.

[shabaz]

Just to add one more to the list in case it's not been mentioned: the AMP 90202-2 is frequently available at low-cost used on eBay. I got mine for about 15 GBP.
It works well for hobby purposes with 2226TG sockets (I've not tried any other sockets with it) which are used for 0.1" header pins. I think it would not be usable with any of the JST connectors. The photo shows it with thick wire, but I have also used it with thin (perhaps 28-30 AWG) stranded wire (which can be folded over if desired. The tool has separate settings for think and thick insulation, and for thin and thick conductors. Afterwards for single wires, I just heat-shrink it (unless it's going into a SIL or DIL plastic shell).

[tooki]

Just to add one more to the list in case it's not been mentioned: the AMP 90202-2 is frequently available at low-cost used on eBay.

Great tip!! Looks like that’s an old high-end model for AMPMODU MOD IV, so I’m not surprised it works well — my MOD IV crimper is also the one I’ve had excellent results with. Yours is adjustable, so it should be possible to do even better with it by adjusting for the exact contacts you use.

[maralb]

Just to add one more to the list in case it's not been mentioned: the AMP 90202-2 is frequently available at low-cost used on eBay. I got mine for about 15 GBP.
It works well for hobby purposes with 2226TG sockets (I've not tried any other sockets with it) which are used for 0.1" header pins.

The link to the 2226TG terminals suggests another crimptool:

MULTICOMP PRO HT-225D which can be found at Amazon for about €27. Would that be a nice candidate for crimping Dupont terminals?

HT-225D

HT-225D Amazon

[shabaz]

Hi,
By chance I have tried that tool. The results are usable, but definitely not as good as the AMP tool.
If you can't get hold of the AMP tool on eBay for a decent price, then the HT-225D can work, but notice in the photo the slight differences. It's still a pretty strong crimp, but the proper tool shouldn't bite into the insulation like that as far as I'm aware, plus it's a little harder to use the HT-225D compared to the AMP tool which holds the crimp better.
Also, the HT-225D tool has no configurability for conductor or insulator thickness.
The other tool in the photo (PA-09) is no good for these size crimps. I find it impossible to make a tight crimp (even when using a lot of force!) whereas with the other two tools, the wire isn't going to come out, it will break first elsewhere.

[Okto47]

Am I too wary at private crimping ?
As I never accepted crimps without bellmouth or if not completely closed ( legs doesn’t support each other) or if not looking  gas tight .

About round isolation crimps , it’s not much work to rework that at jaw , isolation side is not that complex and the jaw thickness is easy to rework too. . (For many jaws exist a wire cut edm version at AliExpress ~9$ , could separate strand and isolation side which makes rework even easier but need to make good bellmouth too . A lot more work but still possible are the jaws for crimping machines from AliExpress. If you have the exact geometry and a good friend as tool maker that’s another option , but wire eroding and polishing is really a lot of work , way too expensive as official order ).

What does you say about 0.8mm pitch crimps without original tool ? Was too scary , never did them .
Wouldn’t it be better to solder them in a way that solder doesn’t soak up wider as isolation crimp and using heat resist isolation and not maximum current ?

[watchmaker]

I am also newto crimping.  With help from this thread, I am learning.

I wanted to repurpose a Siglent scope lead for use as permanent lead in my curve tracer. The conductor was less than 1/2 mm.

Using magnification, the Preciva and Iwiss Dupont connectors, I was able to crimp two leads, while also crimping the foam.  Of course, I shrink tubed it and hotglued where the lead exits the housing.

[maralb]

Hi,
By chance I have tried that tool. The results are usable, but definitely not as good as the AMP tool.
If you can't get hold of the AMP tool on eBay for a decent price, then the HT-225D can work, but notice in the photo the slight differences. It's still a pretty strong crimp, but the proper tool shouldn't bite into the insulation like that as far as I'm aware, plus it's a little harder to use the HT-225D compared to the AMP tool which holds the crimp better.
Also, the HT-225D tool has no configurability for conductor or insulator thickness.
The other tool in the photo (PA-09) is no good for these size crimps. I find it impossible to make a tight crimp (even when using a lot of force!) whereas with the other two tools, the wire isn't going to come out, it will break first elsewhere.

As it didn't break the bank, I bought a HT-225D from Amazon. I noticed the insulation crimp slot isn't rounded but has a slight nn shape. The crimping results with a Dupont terminal are not bad at all but the tabs from the terminal are cutting the wire insulation slightly due to the nn shaped slot.

I bought an AMP AMP 90202-2 crimp tool from Ebay as well. Waiting for that one to arrive. Hope I made a good choice; some of them offered at EBay have had a life so to say.....

[Okto47]

Not inserted horizontal or does the plier twist  it ?
Without that twist it wouldn’t look bad (of course the isolation crimp is no O)

I always readjust after closing halfway / before wire goes in , but at some even that won’t help .

[shabaz]

Looks like the side tabs are causing it to twist. I dont have a complete answer, but as a workaround, I only use sockets (not pins), I.e. type 2226TG are excellent and cheap and have no tabs sticking out. When pins are needed, I'll often stick a pin from a pin header inside the socket. Not ideal, but means I only keep a bag of the 2226TG sockets around. I keep plenty of pin headers and can pull a pin out of if required. Hope that helps!

[maralb]

I don't think it is much twisted. It looks like it due to the angle of photography.

Another picture of the same crimp.

[Okto47]

Yeah , at first picture I thought it were twisted and off-centre , but was just  viewing angle / resolution / open barrel .

Thought it’s not only against loose strands or to use whole cable cross section  , thought it’s better  if the legs are closed by profile design , so that they can support each other - become more stable - can’t give back as locked into each other - stay gas tight after crimp.

But not easy without original jaws, I know.
Thought the AMP you ordered will fit better at that point.
Had a look at it too , but found at moment only offers with high shipping costs & tax to EU and already have that much jaws.

[maralb]

I received my AMP 90202-2 crimp tool from EBay today.

This is the very first Dupont crimp I made with it. Although I inserted the wire slightly too far the crimping quality is not bad at all. I would like to say it is great. The AMP crimp tool is rather big and heavy which makes  the handling a bit clumsey.

The tabs grabbing the wire insulation are how you want them too see. Happy with it and thank you shabaz for the tip regarding the AMP90202 tool. It is a good option for Dupont terminals.

[shabaz]

Thanks for the photo, great to see the result! You're right, it's a large tool, I find it easier to hold by one handle, and just push the other end against chest, so that one hand is free to support the wire.

The insulation is usually separated by a thin metal barrier (i.e. when using the tool, without the wire, click it once or twice to just get the crimp held, and then insert the wire, because a metal barrier (with a narrow slot) will have dropped into position after the first click.

Then, the insulation can't get into the conductor-crimping portion of the tool, because the slot only allows the stripped portion to pass through.