EEVblog Electronics Community Forum
Products => Other Equipment & Products => Topic started by: DC1MC on April 14, 2021, 07:36:38 pm
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This topic pertains to the $subject, low cost (10EUR) cards that were avalable from the ebay seller smokeli.
https://www.ebay.de/itm/High-Precision-10-V-Reference-Analog-Devices-AD587JN-AD7535JN-5x-OP177/154410695222 (https://www.ebay.de/itm/High-Precision-10-V-Reference-Analog-Devices-AD587JN-AD7535JN-5x-OP177/154410695222)
[url=https://www.ebay.de/itm/High-Precision-10-V-Reference-Analog-Devices-AD587JN-AD7535JN-5x-OP07CJ/154410692288]https://www.ebay.de/itm/High-Precision-10-V-Reference-Analog-Devices-AD587JN-AD7535JN-5x-OP07CJ/154410692288[/url]
He also has on his alternate account, the matching connectors:
https://www.ebay.de/itm/96pol-Federleiste-Buchsenleiste-90-gewinkelt-3-reihig-female-ERNI-004516/124355155637 (https://www.ebay.de/itm/96pol-Federleiste-Buchsenleiste-90-gewinkelt-3-reihig-female-ERNI-004516/124355155637)
There are a number of variants, some of them had AD587KN, others AD587JN, personally have 2 with AD587KN.
The most important components are socketed and can be harvested "as-is", but the idea is to reverse the board and see if we can use it in the current configuration.
So enjoy the top/bottom pictures and the first blood power of a board.
Cheers,
DC1MC
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Intial examination:
The logic on the board is fully combinational, no pesky clocks or other noise inducing signals.
The value of the 16bit BCD inputs are latched via IC2 and IC3 (74HC573A Octal TransparentD-TypeLatchesWith 3-State Outputs) and displayed on the front 4 digit 7-segment display, via the decoder ICs 7-9 (HEF4511BT BCD to 7-segment latch decoder drivers).
Also the input values are entered in a BCD to binary converter EPROM IC14 (M27C1024 64KBx16 UV EPROM), the outputs go into IC15 (AD7535JN 14bit DAC with parallel inputs ) that uses as reference IC16 (AD587KJ or JN 10volts precision reference).
On the board are a large number of precision OP, either OP07 or OP177, some relays and a mystery EPROM, IC1 (M27C128 16KBx8).
On the front panel there are two 2 positions, non-retaining switch ( Ein - 0 - Ext ein) and (Aus - 0 - Setz), most likely switching the reference with some external one.
Recommended BCD switches:
https://www.ebay.de/itm/Kodierschalter-0-9-BCD-Codierschalter-Vorwahlschalter-Pushweelswitch-1-Stuck/312231336643 (https://www.ebay.de/itm/Kodierschalter-0-9-BCD-Codierschalter-Vorwahlschalter-Pushweelswitch-1-Stuck/312231336643)
So much for now, lots of things TODO.
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Power (before pinout):
+5V - Over C2 (Tested OK)
-15V - Over C4 (Not-tested!!!, polarity OK, actual value TBD).
+15V - Over C6 (Not-tested !!!, polarity OK, actual value TBD).
Fun (?!?) fact: in my board the line on the capacitor body signifies (-) but fortunately the correct polarity is printed on the PCB silk mask.
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The same BCD switches from Aliexpress, just ordered!
Still awaiting the boards .... :box:
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Hi,
I have two of the boards and I've dumped the EPROMs. The BCDBIN (27C1024) has identical contents on both boards (as expected) and contain a lookup table. The mystery EPROM (27C128) is different on both boards. They are essentially blank (filled with &00 not &FF) except for a few bytes which are possibly some sort of addressing for the card? Binary files below.
McBryce.
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Interesting! Only 2 Bits difference. Let's see what the other board owners report.
btw: what are you using for the EPROM read-out? I do not have anything for this but it's never to late.
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My recommendation depends on how often you would use it. I have a Batronix BX48. It's bullet-proof and can program almost anything you throw at it, but it's relatively expensive. However, I use it almost daily as my main interest is vintage computer repair / restoration. For casual use there are much cheaper solutions, such as the TL-866 which I would also highly recommend.
McBryce.
https://www.batronix.com/versand/programmiergeraete/BX48/batego-II.html (https://www.batronix.com/versand/programmiergeraete/BX48/batego-II.html)
https://www.ebay.de/itm/TL866A-Great-Speed-in-circuit-Programmer-USB-EPROM-EEPROM-FLASH-BIOS-AVR-AL-PIC/402699959557 (https://www.ebay.de/itm/TL866A-Great-Speed-in-circuit-Programmer-USB-EPROM-EEPROM-FLASH-BIOS-AVR-AL-PIC/402699959557)
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Thanks everybody for your contribution, now the bit two tasks are waiting ;)
- Connector pinout !!!
- Analog part schematic, what are all the OP doing ?
If something's left in WE, I'll try the pinout, at least to start it.
Cheers,
DC1MC
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It's 40 years ago when I built my last EPROM programmer for a Z80 based OEM system (U880 in East Germany) and wrote the assembler code.
I think the 2nd one is enough for my needs. Thanks for the link! I ordered one but it takes time on the slow boat from china :=\
First idea was that the code line is a serial number of the board but than I saw that the datas are at different addresses in both EPROMs.
Hope my boards arrive today but DHL is like the weather, the forecast is never correct.
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Thanks everybody for your contribution, now the bit two tasks are waiting ;)
- Connector pinout !!!
- Analog part schematic, what are all the OP doing ?
If something's left in WE, I'll try the pinout, at least to start it.
Cheers,
DC1MC
I have already started on some of the pinout, but I still need to find out how the connector pins are normally numbered. There's no pin numbers on the physical connectors I have.
McBryce.
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May be the following link helps with the connector.
https://www.erni.com/fileadmin/user_upload/Downloads/Products/DIN_41612/ERNI-DIN41612-IEC60603-2-d.pdf (https://www.erni.com/fileadmin/user_upload/Downloads/Products/DIN_41612/ERNI-DIN41612-IEC60603-2-d.pdf)
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I found the shorter version just for that connector. I'll use the numbering they supply here (1 to 32 with rows ABC).
McBryce.
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DHL is better than expected. My boards arrived.
Attached first shots for your entertainment.
Seems to be a multilayer PCB with ground and power supply in the middle?
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DHL is better than expected. My boards arrived.
Attached first shots for your entertainment.
Seems to be a multilayer PCB with ground and power supply in the middle?
Welcome to the (very exclusive) club :-+ !!!
Let's make the roll call, who has the boards and read the topic still ?
Cheers,
DC1MC
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DHL is better than expected. My boards arrived.
Attached first shots for your entertainment.
Seems to be a multilayer PCB with ground and power supply in the middle?
Welcome to the (very exclusive) club :-+ !!!
Let's make the roll call, who has the boards and read the topic still ?
Cheers,
DC1MC
Me, but I didn't have enough time to look at the boards any further yet.
McBryce.
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Sorry it takes some time to start. Real life implications during f@%&ing shutdown with 3 kids at home
and full time job give me only short interrupts for my bench. :--
(nach dreizehn Monaten zweifelt man immer mehr an der Fähigkeit unserer geilen Regierung)
Has someone ask the seller where the boards come from?
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Unfortunately, he doesn't ship to UK
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Waiting for my boards & connectors.
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Unfortunately, he doesn't ship to UK
Fortunately, in my case - since I have some standards and don't need another :)
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For those who are as
anal OCD as I am, I made this sheet to help on pinout reverse engineering. The connector picture is of the mating connector, not the connector on the populated PCB.
McBryce.
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It seems that all boards are sold. That‘s good because I couldn't suppress my wish to buy more boards.
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Not going to have much more time today, so here is my Pinout info for today.
McBryce.
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Not going to have much more time today, so here is my Pinout info for today.
McBryce.
Lets add something extra, maybe next time we can have some common editable format, let's kill all the low hanging fruits:
A B C
01 xxxxxxx xxxxxxx xxxxxxx
02 xxxxxxx xxxxxxx xxxxxxx
03 xxxxxxx xxxxxxx xxxxxxx
04 xxxxxxx xxxxxxx xxxxxxx
05 xxxxxxx xxxxxxx xxxxxxx
06 xxxxxxx xxxxxxx xxxxxxx
07 xxxxxxx xxxxxxx xxxxxxx
08 xxxxxxx xxxxxxx xxxxxxx
09 xxxxxxx xxxxxxx xxxxxxx
10 xxxxxxx xxxxxxx xxxxxxx
11 -15V -15V -15V
12 -15VX -15Vx -15Vx (IC20 - OP07)
13 +15V +15V +15V
14 +15VX +15Vx +15Vx (IC20 - OP07)
15 GND GND GND
16 GND GND GND
17 +5V +5V +5V
18 +5V +5V +5V
19 xxxxxxx xxxxxxx xxxxxxx
20 xxxxxxx xxxxxxx xxxxxxx
21 xxxxxxx xxxxxxx xxxxxxx
22 xxxxxxx xxxxxxx xxxxxxx
23 xxxxxxx xxxxxxx xxxxxxx
24 xxxxxxx xxxxxxx xxxxxxx
25 xxxxxxx xxxxxxx xxxxxxx
26 xxxxxxx xxxxxxx xxxxxxx
27 xxxxxxx xxxxxxx xxxxxxx
28 xxxxxxx xxxxxxx xxxxxxx
29 xxxxxxx xxxxxxx xxxxxxx
20 xxxxxxx xxxxxxx xxxxxxx
31 xxxxxxx xxxxxxx xxxxxxx
32 xxxxxxx xxxxxxx xxxxxxx
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It seems that all boards are sold. That‘s good because I couldn't suppress my wish to buy more boards.
There are just a few connectors left, if you need them now is the time to get them.
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Ok, here's the editable version with all I have so far (plus your notes too).
I wouldn't be too worried about the availability of the connector, they are relatively easy to find:
ERNI - https://www.ebay.de/itm/96pol-Federleiste-Buchsenleiste-90-gewinkelt-3-reihig-female-ERNI-004516-/124355155637 (https://www.ebay.de/itm/96pol-Federleiste-Buchsenleiste-90-gewinkelt-3-reihig-female-ERNI-004516-/124355155637)
Amphenol - https://www.ebay.de/itm/4x-Amphenol-Federleiste-Buchse-96-polig-90-C143-012B-96S-NOS/324247782999 (https://www.ebay.de/itm/4x-Amphenol-Federleiste-Buchse-96-polig-90-C143-012B-96S-NOS/324247782999)
McBryce.
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Here's my update version and some notes at the end:
A B C
01 A2K_00 A2K_01 A2K_02
02 A2K_03 A2K_04 A2K_05
03 A2K_06 A2K_07 A2K_08
04 A2K_09 A2K_10 BCD_00
05 BCD_01 BCD_02 BCD_03
06 BCD_10 BCD_11 BCD_12
07 BCD_13 BCD_20 BCD_21
08 BCD_22 BCD_23 BCD_30
09 BCD_31 BCD_32 BCD_33
10 A2K_11 xxxxxxx xxxxxxx
11 -15V -15V -15V
12 -15VX -15Vx -15Vx (IC20 - OP07)
13 +15V +15V +15V
14 +15VX +15Vx +15Vx (IC20 - OP07)
15 GND GND GND
16 GND GND GND
17 +5V +5V +5V
18 +5V +5V +5V
19 xxxxxxx xxxxxxx xxxxxxx
20 xxxxxxx xxxxxxx xxxxxxx
21 xxxxxxx xxxxxxx xxxxxxx
22 xxxxxxx xxxxxxx xxxxxxx
23 xxxxxxx xxxxxxx xxxxxxx
24 xxxxxxx xxxxxxx xxxxxxx
25 xxxxxxx xxxxxxx xxxxxxx
26 xxxxxxx xxxxxxx xxxxxxx
27 xxxxxxx xxxxxxx xxxxxxx
28 xxxxxxx xxxxxxx xxxxxxx
29 xxxxxxx xxxxxxx xxxxxxx
20 xxxxxxx xxxxxxx xxxxxxx
31 xxxxxxx xxxxxxx xxxxxxx
32 GND_12V GND_12V GND_12V
NOTES:
- The LE signal of the BCD inputs is not on the connector, is a NOR output (IC4 74HC32), it could be that the data outputs of the 2K EPROM are used to do some switching.
- Interesting to see how the relays are controled, therr is this beefy ULN Darlington array.
- Is U20 the final amplifier for the output or is special put for the DAC reference voltage ?
Cheers,
DC1MC
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While rearranging my stuff, I found a bunch of the Erni connecters.
Male & female, straight & 90 degr bended, used.
If anyone is interested, please contact me by PM.
Regards,
Frans
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I will start these days with the analog part behind the DAC (analog side).
For our convenience I try to model it in Multisim. Seems to be standard design following data sheets.
I will use my board with the DIP OPs since they are easier to lift for testing because I want to avoid any kind of damage to the OPs.
But plz don't expect a finalized schematics this week. It will take time due to real life impact.
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I will start these days with the analog part behind the DAC (analog side).
For our convenience I try to model it in Multisim. Seems to be standard design following data sheets.
I will use my board with the DIP OPs since they are easier to lift for testing because I want to avoid any kind of damage to the OPs.
But plz don't expect a finalized schematics this week. It will take time due to real life impact.
There is absolutely no hurry, I'll try the rest of the digital and connector part and maybe power it on in the WE.
Cheers,
DC1MC
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Thanks for the hints and the research.
Here are some of my almost empty eproms.
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Thanks for the hints and the research.
Here are some of my almost empty eproms.
Thanks for your contribution, if the 2KB memory is used as a PAL to do some selections, the comparisons of them will be telling us about what they're doing. Soon I'll statz deeply in the digital part, there is some combinatorics logic that I want to decode, because the signal to strobe the BCD inputs in the latches is generated there.
Cheers,
DC1MC
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Do we all have the same board revisions? My both are K3/EEB1081/2.
I'm awaiting my EEPROM reader but this will take some weeks.
For easier contribution to the connector layout the table of DC1MC as EXCEL.
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Do we all have the same board revisions? My both are K3/EEB1081/2.
I'm awaiting my EEPROM reader but this will take some weeks.
That's the number on both of mine.
McBryce.
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Do we all have the same board revisions? My both are K3/EEB1081/2.
I'm awaiting my EEPROM reader but this will take some weeks.
For easier contribution to the connector layout the table of DC1MC as EXCEL.
Mine are the same revision as well :-+ !!!
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And so ar mine.
Frans
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Guess what just arrived in ^-^
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To complement the BCD switches, I've got this:
https://www.ebay.de/itm/164595954992 (https://www.ebay.de/itm/164595954992)
and this:
https://www.ebay.de/itm/164175322203 (https://www.ebay.de/itm/164175322203)
I already have the green perfboard where I'll solder the connector and some machined pin bars to make a little socket for the switches.
This WE I was conscripted by the SWMBO for garden work :(, but I intend to finish the digital part next week, any news on the analog part ?
Cheers,
DC1MC
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My EPROM reader arrived earlier than expected. Attached the both files, no suprises.
A lonely "20H" and one line of code.
Unfortunately my family wants the reactivation of my 3D printer but after standing in the corner for 2 years it needs a lot of efforts.... :phew:
I'm in the "change every single part" mode .... |O Maybe I should check the PSU now since all dry runs work but not real printing.
So the ref boards have to wait on my bench a little bit longer.
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[attachimg=2]Annotated ref board.
Vectored image.
updated
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Any working example or prototype?
Unipolar or bi-polar?
BCD switches seem logical as does the ERNI connector replacement, however
the latter not strictly necessary.
All V-supply pin rows are inter-connected which leaves only one in actual use.
Is your plan to connect the memory directly to the BCD switches or via the ERNI
connector?
Or the use of a breakout assembly?
Frans
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Some unexpected health problems popped up, so for the moment here is a picture with the (unfinished) BCD connectors, one of the resistor networks that I've mentioned in a previous post and a Kikad project where I've traced the minimum to load the latches with the BCD values (the signal is LE).
Cheers,
DC1MC
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Updated Board picture.
Frans
Edit: added picture
Note: female breadboard wires are a perfect fit on the 90 degr add-on connector.
They fit nicely next to each other, rows & columns.
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Abandoned by TS?
Misjudged purpose & means?
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Sorry friends, was away for a while because job & family and some other things from real life killed a lot of bench time :-//
I started again with the analog part outgoing from the Vref-IC. Little bit strange, Vref-out goes to a relays and via the connector outside or backward to OP18.
One question: it seems that the connector counting of DC1MC is wrong?
Looking from the board onto the connector (left hand - as in the provided photos) I see the marking and than p.a. DGND is in row 18 and Vdig(5V) in row 15/16.
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I was wondering whether this topic would come alive again.
My impression was that the topic starter left this subject become an orphan.
So DC1MC, what about it?
Frans