Reliable Soldering Station for "Pseudo-Hobbyist"?

[FluidParadigms]

BLUF:
Given all the price hikes, supply problems, etc, etc in the last few years: In 2023, is the Pace ADS200 still the go-to step up from the FX-888D? JBC CD-1* models? Ersa? Metcal? I need something that's "buy once, don't worry about it for the next 10+ years". Are there better options out there that would be just as reliable? I know enough about soldering stations to know that I really don't know anything about soldering stations, so I offer the question here.

Wall 'o Text Explanation:

I've been lurking 'round the forum and yt channel for a while. I've searched this forum/google/reddit/etc. but haven't found a good solution. Maybe this has already been addressed, but if so, I can't find it.

Where I find myself is that don't do much hobbyist stuff anymore, but do a fair number of repair jobs on the side. Most of the stuff is audio-related and ranges from fine circuitboard work to desoldering crusty old volume pots from a guitar or amp or something.

The issue I'm running into is that my trusty FX-888 seems to have a hard time pumping enough heat quickly enough into some of these parts, so I'd like something with higher wattage / better thermal performance.

What I'm looking for is something of good quality that I won't have to bother upgrading again for the foreseeable future. Something that'll be totally reliable if I go 6 months without touching it and then have to do several repair jobs in a row. Something that has readily-available tips without some crazy lead time if I'm in the middle of a project 5 years from now and need a new tip or part or whatever at the drop of a hat. Then again, I don't need all the features that you'd need on a production line or anything like that (like quick-change tips, programmable temps, etc).

Also (obviously) I'd like something that won't be catastrophically expensive, but you gotta pay to play I suppose. +/- a few hundred $ is not a huge deal if it's something I'll keep for many years. I don't expect to burn through all that many tips, so wouldn't think tip price would be an issue? I could be totally wrong, though.

I've seen a lot of information out there, but a lot of it seems to be old - I'm not sure if that means outdated, though. Also, it seems like the new hotness (pun intended) out there is the Chinese OEM/rebadge/clone/etc. As much as I'd like to, I don't have the time or energy or motivation to add "soldering iron project" to my hobby list. As fun as it'd be to design my own temperature controller and build a DIY soldering station, I just can't. Nobody seems to be talking about anything else, though. 

Surely I'm not the only one in this position? Maybe I'm massively overthinking things? Maybe some/most/all of my assumptions are bad? I'm just at that point in my life where I just don't have the "human bandwidth" to keep a constant string of DIY projects going (including hours/days/months of internet research). Maybe I'm just getting old...

[TomWinTejas]

What is your budget?  There will be very different answers for $150 vs $1200.

[FluidParadigms]

Oh, sorry! Derp.

That's part of my dilemma. From the research I've done, it seems like my starting point should be in the $400-500 range (US), but since I'm not dying to get it right now, my budget is flexible. If the difference between "pretty good" and "really good" is a few hundred dollars or whatever, I'm cool with that. I can be patient and save up some more.

With most products I've seen, it seems like there tend to be fairly well-delineated price brackets that correspond to features/quality/etc. I'm not seeing that in soldering stations, though maybe (probably) I don't know what to look for. There are some units by seemingly well-respected brands that I've only seen a few recommendations for. The Metcal MFR-1110 seems like it'd be a competitor to the ADS200, but I only ever see the Pace compared to the JBC. No one seems to mention any of the Ersa units either. Is it because Dave only compared the ADS200 against the JBC in his video?

Edit: Also on the topic of budget, I know I could probably save some cash by getting something used, but I currently don't have the time or energy to spend a bunch of time combing ebay or craigslist or whatever. I'd prefer to just buy something new from a reputable supplier and call it a day.

Also edit: I suppose getting a used unit is fine if it's one of those situations like "There are tons of used ones out there because they're rock solid and will never fail you." As long as I don't have to shop for something for weeks/months/+ to find a good deal.

[helius]

Metcal is partly in the "rock solid" category, although it would be an overstatement to say they never fail. The 13.56 Mhz MX500 units are very reliable and that is why they go for such high prices used. The MFR-1100 are 455 kHz induction so a totally different system but from my experience they are also very reliable. Those ones are in lower demand and go for lower prices used.

The thing to watch out for with Metcal is that the 455 kHz system can use both "cartridges" and "tips". The tips do not have the induction coil in them. The coil is a separate assembly in the handpiece. My experience is that the coils are not very well potted and can break apart so you need to watch out for that. The cartridges, on the other hand, are a single solid assembly and would not be subject to that problem.

Why is the ADS200 compared to JBC and not Metcal? Your guess is as good as mine, although as an induction system, Metcal stations cannot vary the temperature setpoint. The temperature is controlled by the cartridge or tip based on the composition of a metal slug using the Curie effect. The part number will have a digit or letter suffix indicating the temperature range at which it regulates. Pace and JBC both use servo temperature feedback and you have more control over tip temperature that way.

Ersa, like JBC, is in Europe but doesn't have as large a dealer network in other continents so many will not have seen them.

[thm_w]

If your issue is thermal capacity, the common solution is either Metcal or JBC.
You can watch SDG's videos: https://www.eevblog.com/forum/other-blog-specific/the-sdg-electronics-soldering-station-comparisonshootout-thread/

MX5000 or 5200 units can be had on ebay for under $400, within your budget.
MX500 is fine, but its 40W compared to the 80W of the above units.

[FluidParadigms]

Thanks, folks. I think I'm pretty sold on the Metcal stuff. Performance-wise, it seems like everyone agrees that they're a level above the resistance-based irons. (Unless I'm misunderstanding what I'm seeing.) I can't imagine being bothered all that much by the set temperature. Maybe one or two "gets hot" cartridges for delicate work and one or two "gets really hot" cartridges for general purpose work?

Another thing I found interesting is that (amazingly) the cartridges are sold on Amazon (by Amazon), and have been for a long time. They also look to be sold by Mouser/Newark/McMaster, which is nice. The only place I've seen JBC tips is TEquipment, but maybe I'm not looking in the right places.

I'm curious about the Thermaltronics irons. If I understand it correctly, Metcal's Curie-point patent expired and the CEO jumped ship and started a company to sell basically the same product at a lower price? Usually with that sort of thing I'd expect more people to be saying, "No reason to spend the extra on a Metcal - just get a Thermaltronics."

And yeah, I was kind of shocked at how many sold listings I saw on eBay for the Metcal stuff. From what I've seen, people on the internet are always saying "Oh sure, you can pick up an XYZ used for practially nothing!", or "I found a ____ on Craigslist for $50", but most of them apparently live in an alternate dimension from me. I'm pleasantly surprised that that's not the case for Metcal irons. 

[thm_w]

Amazon sells thermaltronics tips for a very good price, which are compatible with metcal, I don't think they have cheap official tips. From my and others experience the quality of their tips is as good as Metcal.

Thermaltronics does not make a 80W PSU and they don't have quite as nice of a handle, but otherwise yeah there is not much reason to go one or the other.

[Thomas]

...
The thing to watch out for with Metcal is that the 455 kHz system can use both "cartridges" and "tips". The tips do not have the induction coil in them. The coil is a separate assembly in the handpiece. My experience is that the coils are not very well potted and can break apart so you need to watch out for that. The cartridges, on the other hand, are a single solid assembly and would not be subject to that problem.
...

Agreed. I would stay away from the MFR-1120 kit. I think that's the only one using tips, along with the MFR-H2-ST2 handle.
I bought a MFR-1110 many years ago and have been happy with it.

[FluidParadigms]

I think I might go ahead and keep an eye out for a used 5200. Worst case, it looks like the 5210 kit is $650 brand new. Expensive, but not the end of the world.

I was looking at parts and noticed something odd... Are the Metcal workstands made of plastic??

[thm_w]

5000 or 5200 are good. 5200 just lets you use both ports at the same time.

The stands are a mix of metal and plastic, some photos:
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/reviews/dyi-thermaltronicsmetcal-sleep-stand-mod-question/

[gerryc89]

This is little blasphemous but i have acquired a jbc clone, it is a sugon a3, the name is ridiculous, sugon in Italy sounds like "sugo" that mean sauce  , it can be purchased under 90 euros, is possible to have 3 iron sizes, i have the middle one. It perform like the original, also the tips are made of good material, and you can use the geniune jbc if you want. the standby function work very well, reach the temp in 2-3 seconds when remove the iron from the stand. The heat transfert rate of this iron is very impressive, you can set the temp on 330 340 degree and you can solder almost everything without create problems of overtemperature on pcbs and components. The tip doesn't stuck on massive gnd pads or very high layer numbers pcb's, is real another world, obvius jbc is jbc but for this price is a very good product.
Gerry

[Wallace Gasiewicz]

Edsyn is a relatively unknown USA made soldering system.
The Edsyn in our radio repair shop that is on all the time is the only one we have been unable to break after many years.

There are all sorts of models.    https://www.edsyn.com/category/ST.html

This guy is a distributor and sometimes has rebuilt units that are  inexpensive.   https://www.eaesales.com/

This is an "Industrial Strength" soldering iron.

[ryanscott6]

I went from a FX-951 to a Aixun t3a with a few genuine JBC tips and it's been great.  I like the tips a bit better than Hakkos and it's super fast heating up.

[Prizmatic]

Metcal or Thermaltronics. I'm just a hobbyist, mostly RF and vintage equipment repairs and ran 2 stations to cover fine and heavy soldering. I got curious about the generally positive reviews and flexibility of RF iron systems (plus freeing up some bench space) and took the plunge. I bought a Thermaltronics and haven't looked back. No messing around, even the relatively fine tips can dump an impressive amount of heat quickly into a joint, the larger tips are overkill unless you want to solder large components to heavy ground-planes quickly. The tips though expensive have proven to be more durable than my other irons, and the ergonomics are great.

If you go down this route I recommend talking to the supplier to discuss your needs, in particular metcal/thermaltronics tip cross-compatibility and the working temperature of the tip ranges. Oh, and don't go silly buying a variety of tips, you'll likely find 3 or 4 tip types will comfortably do 99% of the soldering work you do. HTH.

[thm_w]

(1)  Prices are on the rise.  Be careful how you vote.
(2)  Ever notice you can't buy repair parts for your new solder station?
(3)  Notice how many (foreign) fly-by-night suppliers appear - disappear and then re-appear under another (goofy) name?     
 No more fancy solder stations for me.  I use a plain pencil iron and connect it to my variac.                                                                                                                                                                                                                               

What repair parts specifically? The point is these stations rarely fail.

We are not talking about low cost foreign suppliers here, but even if we were, I have 4 of T12 clone units running at work for years, none of them have failed, and even if they did I'd only be out $50.

[unknownparticle]

Take a look at Ersa soldering stations, German technology and quality and they have a wide range of units to suit most pockets.

[shapirus]

Whatever you decide on, make sure it is a system that has a good selection of tips, preferably not too expensive ones and such that are going to fit all your needs, from small stuff to thick wires and terminals, meaning the solution should be powerful enough, probably of those 135W variants. It is a good sign if the tips are produced by many manufacturers and the Chinese have already cloned them: it means they won't quickly become unavailable if/when they are discontinued. It also offers you a choice between cheap and quality.

[mastershake]

the t420d so far have been bulletproof for us in daily use every day full days the guys are using them for repairs. we have even had a few who replaced their aging jbc genuine stations with a new 420. they can be had for around 300-340 shipped if you look around (depends on the handle choices) i LOVE having the 245 and 210 in one but i was used to it before getting my own 420.

otherwise the t series are really awesome for the money

now IF you want brand name then of course jbc or metcal.

i also own both of those brands and i find myself using the 420 most of the time mainly due to my selection of tips and the cost of replacement ones. i also have the 115 handles for them for when i want a really small tip. for me aixun support has been GREAT they even just sent a replacement 2408 out to me for free and told me not to send the old one back because i had an issue with one ( we have more then 6 now in the shop and this is the only one that had an issue typically we use them for iphone batteries and to inject small voltage during repairs). along with now the small uv lamps i ordered in a handful of them and they work well the fan is a but useless though on them. the guys say they like them.

[fkfaraz]

get the metcal and never looked back

[BlackICE]

I used to use a Weller Wes 50 and later got a Weller 1010 na. After I started reading this formum purchased ksger t12. After I fixed the possible electrocution problem, it heats up faster and has a standby function that works and it has a better handle to tip distance, better heat transfer for larger parts and also much easier to change the tips. So overall I would say for about the $50 I spent for the base unit and numerous more dollars on genuine Hakko tips it works great. Your needs seem greater than mine as far as heat capacitie so I understand look for something better. If I didn't already have a solution that I feel works adequately for me I would look at JBC or metcal. Although very pricely

[Hydrawerk]

"buy once, don't worry about it for the next 10+ years".

Aren't you from USA? You should probably buy the PACE ADS200. They have quite basic cheap tips especially in USA. Special shape tips are expensive, though. Heating performance is good but not especially great. I have an ADS200 at home and I am happy with that.

ERSA is expensive and outdated. Weller has some cartridge soldering irons, but I am not sure what they are like. Weller base stations are made of plastic.
JBC is overengineered but has a great heat performance. Some base stations are made of metal I think. I use it at work.
I do not like stations with fixed temperature like Metcal or Thermaltronics... But other people like them...
Hakko FX-951 is just weird and made of plastic... The handle looks strange...

[Hydrawerk]

JBC overengineering... But soldering tips have a great performance because they are expensive.
https://youtu.be/PjEYI5WsLBI

I prefer the ADS200 internal construction. Soldering tips are cheaper and a bit worse in performance...
https://youtu.be/TGaTJmuy21U

[Hydrawerk]

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/reviews/newest-pace-ads200-production-station-(a-jbc-killer-at-$239)/msg4083160/#msg4083160

[thm_w]

Aren't you from USA? You should probably buy the PACE ADS200. They have quite basic cheap tips especially in USA. Special shape tips are expensive, though. Heating performance is good but not especially great. I have an ADS200 at home and I am happy with that.

ADS200 price shot up. It makes sense at $200 but not $400.

There is an "edit" button if you want to add information to your post.

[Hydrawerk]

Well, you can always buy a JBC soldering station. It is expensive but it will work well for some 10+ years probably. The tips are expensive but I like them. I use them at work. I like that you can turn them around.