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Share your thoughts:Why are some brands more popular on specific instruments?
bsgd:
Okay, so this is an open discussion about why some brands are much more popular on some specific instruments, considering all the instrument 'evolution' during the past 40 or 50 years.
For instance, lets talk about multimeters. Fluke handheld multimeters have always been more desirable than HP/Agilent ones. On the other hand, I have noticed that HP/Agilent benchtop meters are more desirable and also reach higher prices on the used market.
Why is that? Is it just a matter of quality? Is it just because some companies have a much longer story on developing a specific type of instrument and so they share much more time proven robustness/accuracy/quality?
I have this 'thing' for old gear, and I have been looking for this stuff on ebay for some time now, and I noticed you can get some instruments from some well known brands for almost nothing while other kinds of instrumets might cost a small fortune.
What brands do you prefer for each instrument type?
amspire:
There are several reasons for the popularity of instruments from companies like HP/Agilent, Fluke and Tektronix.
A huge issue is availability of user and service manuals.
There are many companies that have a policy of supplying service manuals only to Authorised Repair centers. This means that modern microprocessor controlled instruments can be near impossible for a hobbyist to repair, however good the instrument is.
Companies like Fluke and HP have a long time reputation of leadership and quality, of rigorously meeting advertized specifications, of longevity, of spare parts availability.
I think some companies are very protective and insular as if they are scared their good ideas will become know. HP was always extremely proud and open about its good ideas, and they published them in the HP Journal. This means that with many HP instruments, you can not only get the service manual, but you can get a well written explanation of some of the refinements in the way the instruments is designed. So when there is a custom IC, you are often able to find detailed description of that custom IC.
All these companies have very informative service manuals often including a section explaining how the instrument works, which is far better then companies who provide minimal service information.
Many companies seem to want instruments over 10 years old to just go away. It is amazing how many companies who made extremely fine instruments will have websites that are completely purged of the slightest mention of the old instruments. To me this is a total lack of pride and respect for the history of their company - if they don't respect themselves, why should anyone else. They may have a great instrument today, but next year they will have a new model, and they will want to forget about this years instrument as much as possible.
Richard
EEVblog:
--- Quote from: bsgd on January 24, 2012, 11:01:49 pm ---Okay, so this is an open discussion about why some brands are much more popular on some specific instruments, considering all the instrument 'evolution' during the past 40 or 50 years.
For instance, lets talk about multimeters. Fluke handheld multimeters have always been more desirable than HP/Agilent ones. On the other hand, I have noticed that HP/Agilent benchtop meters are more desirable and also reach higher prices on the used market.
Why is that? Is it just a matter of quality? Is it just because some companies have a much longer story on developing a specific type of instrument and so they share much more time proven robustness/accuracy/quality?
--- End quote ---
In the case of Fluke, it's a combination of a lot of things.
They pioneered the handheld DMM, and it of course helped that they were designed and build well, and had a novel feature like TouchHold. But they also had extensive industry marketing back in the 80's, cleverly seeding the brand as THE meter to have with various full page ads blasted at you for years on end. And bingo, 20-30 years later they still have the same rep that will take some beating.
Dave.
alm:
If you look at current products, a lot has to do with being an established brand. For example, Fluke has made good quality handheld DMMs for a long time, while Agilent only (re)entered the market a few years ago. Agilent has been making bench DMMs almost since they were invented. Fluke only introduced a competitor for the industry standard 34401A (introduced around 1990) about five years ago (8845A/8846A), they had no 'affordable' 6.5 digit DMM before that. For a number of years, their only bench DMM was either the 5 digit Fluke 45 or an exotic rebranded Agilent DMM.
Not sure why older Fluke bench DMMs would be worth less, the Fluke 8840A usually seems to be more expensive than its contemporary HP 3478A. Not sure about the Fluke 8000 series, they don't sell for much, but they're usually fairly low spec. Not sure how their prices compare to similar HP DMMs like the 3466A and 3465A.
Tek has long be the scope brand to buy. HP scopes often had inferior triggering and bad usability on the front panel controls. They had by far the most advanced CRT technology. Now their advantage has disappeared since CRTs are obsolete, and they're just one of the big three.
For used equipment, availability of parts and documentation probably plays a major role. You can either buy a piece of Schlumberger equipment and spend a lot of time tracking down a manual, or buy HP and download the manual straight from Agilent's website.
bsgd:
--- Quote from: amspire on January 24, 2012, 11:45:50 pm ---Many companies seem to want instruments over 10 years old to just go away. It is amazing how many companies who made extremely fine instruments will have websites that are completely purged of the slightest mention of the old instruments. To me this is a total lack of pride and respect for the history of their company - if they don't respect themselves, why should anyone else. They may have a great instrument today, but next year they will have a new model, and they will want to forget about this years instrument as much as possible.
Richard
--- End quote ---
This is very true and something I didnt really think about. But makes a LOT of sense. Coming to think of it, yes, I do buy instruments from companies that have a long support history and which I know I will be able to get repaired in the long run.
--- Quote from: EEVblog on January 24, 2012, 11:55:29 pm ---
--- Quote from: bsgd on January 24, 2012, 11:01:49 pm ---Okay, so this is an open discussion about why some brands are much more popular on some specific instruments, considering all the instrument 'evolution' during the past 40 or 50 years.
For instance, lets talk about multimeters. Fluke handheld multimeters have always been more desirable than HP/Agilent ones. On the other hand, I have noticed that HP/Agilent benchtop meters are more desirable and also reach higher prices on the used market.
Why is that? Is it just a matter of quality? Is it just because some companies have a much longer story on developing a specific type of instrument and so they share much more time proven robustness/accuracy/quality?
--- End quote ---
In the case of Fluke, it's a combination of a lot of things.
They pioneered the handheld DMM, and it of course helped that they were designed and build well, and had a novel feature like TouchHold. But they also had extensive industry marketing back in the 80's, cleverly seeding the brand as THE meter to have with various full page ads blasted at you for years on end. And bingo, 20-30 years later they still have the same rep that will take some beating.
Dave.
--- End quote ---
First, Dave, thank you for creating the blog, forum and website. You are the person that encouraged me to start building my own lab! Thanks!
Yes, I guess industry does play a major role in this game. If something is considered an industry standard, it must be very good to survive such harsh environmet. I work in a pretty big industry and I know these instruments must be very well built to survive.
Interesting fact: I have an Agilent HP 6632B power supply. The very same day I got it (brand new!) I managed to drop it 5 meters until it hit a hard ganite floor. Aside from a few scratches and dents, it survived nicely!
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