Whats a good solder sucker?

[CustomEngineerer]

never had much luck with one-shot suckers.

after you play around with junk long enough, you finally decide to get serious.  I searched ebay for a used pace unit like the 'mbt'.  could not be happer.

for a bit less money, there is the hakko 'gun' solder sucker that is powered.

you really want powered.  eventually you ruin pads waiting to spring that one-shot sucker many times to get trouble holes clean.

this is an area it does NOT pay to cheap-out.  a ruined board is worth the cost of one pace desoldering unit, to me.  buy it once, get the accessories (filters, hoses) and you are set for many years.  a hobbiest can live with that unit for the rest of his life since its industrial quality.

I've never been any good with the suckers either. Most probably because my hands aren't steady enough so I tend to lift the sucker slightly when I start to press the button. Tried a soldaput but still had the same issues. Finally got the Hakko FR-300 desoldering gun, what a difference.

[sleemanj]

Notch the tip of a sucker on one side so you can slip the (fine) iron tip under the notch and thereby melt the solder with the sucker already in place and ready to go.  Works wonders.

[joeqsmith]

Had a good thread on this if you take the time to search.   I posted a clip of how I use mine. 

[kwass]

Engineer SS-02

https://www.amazon.com/Engineer-SS-02-Solder-Sucker/dp/B002MJMXD4

Has a soft silicone tip that seals around the joint to increase suction. Works really really well, running circles around most of the normal suckers with the teflon tip. I don't even bother pulling out my desoldering gun anymore unless I have to suck off a lot of joints. However, it is a bit small, so if you have large hands you may struggle a bit with it.

I have one of these too and use it when I don't want to wait for my Hakko to warm up.  You can buy it from Adafruit for a lot less: https://www.adafruit.com/products/1597

[kwass]

Had a good thread on this if you take the time to search.   I posted a clip of how I use mine. 

This really bothers me,  the very idea of using a classic HP calculator as a soldering prop!

[linux-works]

before you decide, see if you can rent or borrow a powered/heated sucker.

all I can say is that I almost look forward to having to use mine.  it works so well its *almost* fun.  I'd never say that about the manual ones; those are more hope-and-pray types.

if its midnight and I'm in the field and something needs work 'or else' and the blue plungers are all I have, I'd try using it, but if I'm in a sane lab and I want the job done right, I would always opt for the proper tool; and a heated pumped sucker is always better than the passive manual kind.  always, without exception.  those blue toys win only on cost, but a ruined board and your time is worth a lot more.

I happen to believe strongly in good tools.  its a sentiment many forum members share.  give the powered ones a try before you 'blow them off' (lol).

[veedub565]

Thanks for all the replies, never expected so many ! I'll have a look through the links.

Mostly I tend to use wick for desoldering, either through hole or SMD, but in this case I have large quantities of solder to remove from some chunky terminal posts. It would take forever with wick (not to mention expensive)

A powered one would be nice, and maybe longer term I'll look at getting one, I like the Hakko desoldering gun as I already have a Hakko FR803 rework station which is excellent. For the time being though and just for this one job I'm after something.. not cheap especially, but reasonably priced that will do the job.

ESD isn't really an issue in this case, but I have worked in places that are very strict on things like that. They tended to have a mains powered sucker from people like Oki or Metcal maybe.

[GreyWoolfe]

Or the ZD-985, around 80USD.

+1 for the ZD-985.  I have tried to use solder suckers in the past and didn't like them.  I still use wick, but if I am going to solder, I turn on the ZD-985 also. Not that I have ever soldered IC sockets in backwards   The powered tool took some getting used to but I had junk boards to screw up learning how to use it.

[m98]

'works fine' until you ruin pads.
just try one of the motordriven ones.  if you have not used one, you cannot really comment about how much better they are.
this hobby or field has costs.  if you cheap-out, you get lesser results.  I've ruined my share of boards by using substandard tools.
for super simple work, the junk may get you by, but they really are toys.  once you use real gear, you never want to go back.
just save your money until you can buy the proper tool.  a job worth doing is worth doing well, etc etc.

Before you try discredit me on my tool choices, know your point. I know the difference, and have the right tools where I need them. But for desoldering, the simple solder sucker does its job well in most cases, and where it fails, I just use desoldering braid. Until you work as a repair technician electronics service industry, or want to reuse parts from old boards as a hobbyist, I can't imagine where you'd need such a desoldering station. Especially because THT components aren't used that frequently in newer designs any more, apart from connectors.
But as I said, frequently work on 4+ layer boards with massive ground planes, never damaged a pad, never had too much problems desoldering components. You just need the real right tool, a decent, high power soldering station.

(for the record, I used to think like you and I owned various suction pump things; but once I found a used motor-based vacuum unit, it was almost life-changing; that's how good it was and now I don't fear doing any rework that needs solder removal.)

Sounds like an Apple ad.

[janoc]

@linux

I have both normal manual solder sucker(s) and an electric desoldering gun. The only times when I have managed to lift pads it was with the gun. The cheaper ones are usually not that well regulated and have to run hot so that the solder doesn't clog the nozzle constantly (not fun to clean up!). And a hot nozzle pressed over a pad is what makes the board to delaminate. That rarely happens to me with a manual sucker. So I am powering up the gun only when I have a lot of desoldering to do - like when replacing capacitors in a power supply. Otherwise the manual pump is just fine.

Of course, if you have an expensive, brand name tool that could be different, but then we are also talking order of magnitude price difference. Not a fair comparison, IMHO.

@kwass

Yeah, Adafruit is cheaper - if you are in the US. If I have ordered it from there I would have to pay international shipping + possibly VAT, so the 20 something euro I have paid for it on Amazon (from a French vendor) was not that bad deal.

[linux-works]

if you are not in a hurry, it pays to wait for that good condition name brand powered unit on ebay.

I often buy in advance, knowing I'll need something later and so when I find a good deal, I'll grab it.  others are more of a just-in-time buyer and won't buy until they need it, but you don't get the good bargains that way.

I got 2 metcal irons at absurdly low prices by just waiting about a month, on ebay.  the pace mbt I have was more like 2 or 3 months, so that did take a while.  but I was picky and wanted a cosmetically clean unit.  if that does not matter, there are good deals every week.

new prices are absurd for non-pro users.  but the used market is quite approachable.  this hobby costs.  to do any tools-based hobby (automotive, you name it) you need good tools.  I think most of us can agree on that.  and so, invest in good tools ONCE, they'll last many years (decades, often) and over time, they justify themselves.

I was not kidding when I almost look forward to having to rework a board.  I think nothing of removing many things on a board that I would not have done before I had powered suckers.  truly, it went from a dreaded chore to a 'ok, lets do this!' kind of job.  if that sounds 'apple' (lol!) well, so be it.  again, many here really love the feel and action of a good tool that is well thought out and does its job with grace.  its an enjoyable experience to use high end tools.  and for a few hundred dollars, this is not bank-breaking for most people who want to get into this hobby or field.

if we were talking $2k, that would be absurd for most home users.  but $200 or so, for a dirty but running unit?  that's not bank breaking.  if it saves a few boards from ruin, that really does sound like a fair trade to me.

[Alexei.Polkhanov]

This discussion seem to run around two options:
1. Solder sucker, MANUAL, spring loaded. $20-50
2. Desoldering gun, comes with soldering station, special nozzles and maybe a ventury pump + shop air or bench-top compressor.

I cannot find third, IMHO viable, option:
Ventury pump with shop air and chamber with filter for sucked solder.. So it would be like Solder sucker, but shop air powered. Where do I get one?

[Gary.M]

This discussion seem to run around two options:
1. Solder sucker, MANUAL, spring loaded. $20-50
2. Desoldering gun, comes with soldering station, special nozzles and maybe a ventury pump + shop air or bench-top compressor.

I cannot find third, IMHO viable, option:
Ventury pump with shop air and chamber with filter for sucked solder.. So it would be like Solder sucker, but shop air powered. Where do I get one?

So if I want powered desolder capability which used Pace unit would be recommended via Ebay,  and what target price is possible?


Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk

[KL27x]

this hobby costs.

You keep on saying this, but ??
This hobby is what you make of it. For 3 years of learning and tinkering and generally having fun, I think the most I ever spent, cumulatively, was around $150.00. Including cost of all my components and wire and hand tools. I still have a lifetime supply of pnp and npn TH transistors, from these early days, lol.

After 2 years of using a Radio Shack iron with bare copper tips, I finally upgraded. I had so many fond memories with that stupid iron, I couldn't even bear to throw it away. I finally sold it along with some breadboards and other hobbyist bits, for the princely sum of $10.00 shipped, so that someone else could enjoy it. 

I still remember the first piece of "expensive" equipment I bought after 3 years (and well after I had started earning positive income from what was now a little more than a hobby). It was a Saleae Logic at a whopping $100.00. At the time, this WAS expensive for me. So much so, that I believe Turbo Tax is still depreciating this piece of "valuable equipment" off my taxes, lol.

9 months after that, I bought my first 330.00 scope.

Today, I throw away $100.00 equipment that sucks and is not worth the space. My cheap desoldering station is exempted, because it is also a hot air station, but the desoldering gun/hose is in the closet. If it weren't for the hot air, the desoldering station would have found the bottom of a garbage bin. And it's not that is doesn't work. Because it works, GREAT. At one specific thing. Of which I do not have that big of a need, in order to justify the time it takes to turn the thing on, to keep it clean, and the space the stupid hose takes up, draped all over the place.

The one place I disagree with Linux, is that IMO solder suckers can do just as good a job as a station, provided proper usage and proper tool. The ONLY benefit of the station is that it is faster in a batch process of many similar parts. This is the only time I would personally bother to take a good quality desoldering station out of the closet, set it up, and then put it away when I'm done. Same as the way one of my clients uses their Aoyoue.... which mostly sits on a storage shelf away from the main action. If you can't figure out how to use a solder sucker, then you just need to pony up and buy a "real tool," of course.


If you have actually ever learned to use a solder sucker, and you have used a GOOD one, and you (as a hobbyist) still have a desoldering station on your bench, I contend that you have TOO MUCH BENCH SPACE. And as we all know, this is IMPOSSIBLE. So you are either doing specialized repairs (as a business enterprise or hobby of restoring old equipment?) or you are a different kind of hobbyist. The hobbyist that collects equipment to display on a bench. Or you have never learned to use a GOOD solder sucker.

There is no way a desoldering station can provide as much peak vacuum suction as a good sucker. There is no way you would need more total air flow/suction that a good sucker can provide. There is no way you cannot provide as much heat as needed to a part, if you were able to solder it in the first place. Your soldering iron is the same as it always was, and there's a knob on it to turn up the heat. There is no way a desoldering station can do a better job or do anything that a solder sucker can't do... except for speed in a batch process.



 

[MarkF]

I don't see the need for a high priced solder vacuum system unless you're going to make a career reworking PCBs.  For occasional rework needs, a manual spring loaded solder sucker should meet your needs.

This hobby does NOT have to break the bank!  You just need to define your needs and how often you will use a piece of equipment.

[nanofrog]

This hobby does NOT have to break the bank!  You just need to define your needs and how often you will use a piece of equipment.

Exactly. 

There are things that spending a fair bit of money on makes sense, such as a decent soldering station (i.e. tools used extremely often). But for rare to occasional needs such as desoldering, a decent manual sucker + quality wick are sufficient (aside from a decent iron, the trick is in the technique IMHO).

[linux-works]

This discussion seem to run around two options:
1. Solder sucker, MANUAL, spring loaded. $20-50
2. Desoldering gun, comes with soldering station, special nozzles and maybe a ventury pump + shop air or bench-top compressor.

I cannot find third, IMHO viable, option:
Ventury pump with shop air and chamber with filter for sucked solder.. So it would be like Solder sucker, but shop air powered. Where do I get one?

So if I want powered desolder capability which used Pace unit would be recommended via Ebay,  and what target price is possible?

I own one like this:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/PACE-MBT-SENSATEMP-MODEL-PPS-75A-SOLDERING-STATION-/191905621342

and then you'd need to get the handle part and some spare filters/hoses.  that mbt unit is an older one, so it will be less costly to buy used and its still quite a good, strong unit and there are lots of spare parts for it.

I don't know what the handle and parts tend to cost as I got a pkg deal when I bought mine.  the handle unit is the main wearing unit, so perhaps that's the part you want to buy new or buy in clean condition.  the base unit's cosmetics won't matter much.

here's one that is not expensive and comes with all parts (supposedly)

http://www.ebay.com/itm/PACE-MBT-SR-2-SOLDERING-STATION-WITH-IRON-/361599714626

as for the comments someone posted about using this 'only occasionally', that highly depends on what you do.  even if I use mine only once a month, I still find it useful to leave on the bench.

I'm not sure how common this is, but for me, the 'oh DAMMIT!' factor is worth quite a lot to me.  if I save one pcb that I really needed to save, that could justify the entire price of a $300 setup to me.  just to save my aggrivation and wasted time (maybe even on a one-off board) it could be worth it to me.   analog: in some areas of the country, you only need air conditioning a few times a year.  but people will often still opt to install it.  on those HOT days, yes, its worth having, even if only used a few times a year.

quality of life issue.  yes, I'm serious.  if my tools fight me, I'm annoyed.  if they do the work for me, I'm all smiles.

I love good tools.  they make my life better.  and I'm not about to apologize one bit for that!

[KL27x]

I love good tools.  they make my life better.  and I'm not about to apologize one bit for that!

I agree. For the 99.5% of the time I am doing anything on my bench where I do not need to desolder multiple through hole parts at a time, the desoldering tool just gets in the way and takes up valuable space. Which could be used for either.... other quality tools I actually use more often and which have no super compact, cheap, and equally effective alternative which takes up no space... or more space for my project!

The difference between you and I is that I can do all of those things you just mentioned with a solder sucker, equally well if not better, and without any struggle. I can't do it with just any solder sucker. Some will have every problem you listed. But some suckers ARE a good, quality, well-engineered tool.

The OP summed it up in the first post.

Can anyone recommend a good, manual spring plunger type solder sucker? In the past I've used some that were rubbish, and others that were brilliant. Both looked the same (at first glance anyway) so makes it difficult to try and pick a good one online.

Unreservedly, I will call the Soldapullt 3 the most brilliant and well-engineered solder sucker I have ever touched.

Reason most major electronics distributors carry a Soldapullt or an OK Industries DP-100 clone is because they work. Lots of people are out there trying to make a better (or at least cheaper) mousetrap. You can take your chances, but you won't know until you've tried an Edsyn.

[GreyWoolfe]

The only reason I have the ZD-985 is because SWMBO asked what I wanted for my birthday 2 years ago.  Thus, if I only use it occasionally, that's fine, I didn't spend the money.  SWMBO indulges my odd Christmas and Birthday gift suggestions even if they cause an eye roll.

[linux-works]

The difference between you and I is that I can do all of those things you just mentioned with a solder sucker, equally well if not better, and without any struggle.

I'm trying to remember when I got my first blue plunger.  I was probably in my teens.  I'm over 50 now, so I have had my blue wonder all that time, and yes, it has worked more times than it has not.  I didn't get to use the powered types until very recently, in fact, so I'm a new convert, so to speak.

I hated that blue plunger (real brand, this was before ebay days, lol).  I never thought it to be any kind of elegant solution.  low cost and accessible, so I had one as a teen and lived with it for many decades.  I knew of the powered types but before ebay days, you did not have easy access to commercial used gear like that (short of hamfests and such).  the fact that you can easily buy top-name gear for fractions of its 'new' price today, that's a game changer.  and that's exactly why I bought that really nice unit; it was at the price point I was comfortable with and way below that unaccesible retail price.

oh, and I saw the thread title, and that's why I was bringing up the powered types of desoldering units.  thread title is 'Whats a good solder sucker?' and so I felt quite ok talking about the desktop powered heated hose-and-filter kind.  it belongs in the decision tree.

[alexanderbrevig]

A good solder sucker?
I was expecting someone to state the obvious; your mom. 

[HighVoltage]

Engineer SS-02

+1
By far the best one I have ever used.
Made in Japan, really sturdy and high quality.
And small to put away.
I think I paid a little over Euro 20, imported from Japan

[KL27x]

I've never been any good with the suckers either. Most probably because my hands aren't steady enough so I tend to lift the sucker slightly when I start to press the button. Tried a soldaput but still had the same issues. Finally got the Hakko FR-300 desoldering gun, what a difference.

If you ever have need of one, in the future, try this.

Place the nozzle on the board against the edge of the joint. Tilt the sucker to lower over the component lead. Apply iron to the joint.  Lower the nozzle of the sucker down until it is pressed against the iron. The little dent in the nozzle that will eventually form (and/or you cut out with a knife) will wedge around the tip of the soldering iron... So there's really nowhere for the sucker to slip. You're pressing it down towards the iron and the board. Let alone, the exposed component lead is not going to let the sucker move much, anyhow.

I knew of the powered types but before ebay days, you did not have easy access to commercial used gear like that (short of hamfests and such).

I remember these days, too. And I remember being intrigued when a friend acquired one, used, at a hamfest for multiple hundreds of dollars. I immediately imagined that it would suck solder right off a board, like solderwick. Or that it had some more generalized purpose than pulling lots and lots of thru hole components off a board. Nope. It's a thru hole component-salvager's wet dream, essentially. Not so exciting for those without such a fetish.

[Ian.M]

The problem with externally pumped vacuum desoldering tools is getting enough vacuum at the nozzle quickly enough. You need a pulse of strong vacuum, not a continuous lower flow as the airflow cools off the joint, making it far more difficult to desolder cleanly.

Its further hindered by the need for a filter to trap solder dross and flux fumes that would gum up the works, as the 'dead' volume of the filter must be evacuated before you get acceptable suction at the nozzle.  If it uses a large diameter vacuum hose that is no longer than necessary, and a large orifice solenoid valve, dumping into a vacuum reservoir with at least an order of magnitude greater volume than the hose and handpiece, you can get comparable results to a hand operated plunger type sucker maintained in good condition.

However all the budget systems and the couple of pro grade systems I've encountered usually failed to achieve enough tip vacuum with sufficient heat transfer to be as effective as a hand sucker used by an experienced operator, and the longer dwell time required increased the risk of pad damage.  There's also the consumables cost - even if the filter chamber uses a cheap wire wool catch pad backed by a wad of ceramic fibre for a filter, you've still got the cost of bits.  The combination of abrasion on the corner between the bore and the face, the impossibility of keeping the bore properly tinned and fast flowing solder invariably result in more rapid plating breakdown than one would expect for a similar size soldering iron bit used at the same temperature.   I've had a sucker bit suffer wetting failure in under 1000 operations, and I was taking care to keep it tinned, wiped and wasn't leaving it idle at temperature.

[D3f1ant]

Those 'Engineer' brand suckers are very good, but I'm on the side of using a powered sucker when you have more than few holes to do or when there are large thermal mass connectors involved. I find those almost impossible with a one shot sucker.