QuoteI guess it carries weight within the inner circle but to me, I equate with someone with a high degree as a nutritionist referring to themselves as a Dr.
In fairness, if they have a Doctor's degree in their subject, they are entitled to use it.
After all, we have Doctors of Divinity, Political Science, & so on.
Some years back, there were often Youtube videos of CB high power "shoot outs".
It seems they don't measure power at all at these events, but instead, measure the level of signal received by a receiver some distance away.
I suppose that is fair, as someone with a functional antenna would then be rewarded for that.
Another thing which probably makes for a "level playing field" is if they are all equally deluded about their alleged power levels!
QuoteI guess it carries weight within the inner circle but to me, I equate with someone with a high degree as a nutritionist referring to themselves as a Dr.
In fairness, if they have a Doctor's degree in their subject, they are entitled to use it.
After all, we have Doctors of Divinity, Political Science, & so on.
As the ham can call themselves what ever they like and as the owner of this forum has stated you are free to call yourself an engineer. All three cases demand the same respect. Just very little.
QuoteSome years back, there were often Youtube videos of CB high power "shoot outs".
It seems they don't measure power at all at these events, but instead, measure the level of signal received by a receiver some distance away.
I suppose that is fair, as someone with a functional antenna would then be rewarded for that.
Another thing which probably makes for a "level playing field" is if they are all equally deluded about their alleged power levels!
As long at the rules are clear, I don't see a problem and hardly consider it a scam. Thing to do would be buy a smaller one and measure it.
... I think the "scam" is not in the contest, but in the power output claims of those who produce such amplifiers. ...
...Actually, none of them are very good but I am guessing more stable than that ham with his hot water tank load...
When... I think the "scam" is not in the contest, but in the power output claims of those who produce such amplifiers. ...
Rather than stating it's a scam, you should post some data backing it up. .... Oh right ....
When... I think the "scam" is not in the contest, but in the power output claims of those who produce such amplifiers. ...
Rather than stating it's a scam, you should post some data backing it up. .... Oh right ....
I think that's fair. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.... but I am not sure that this is really an extraordinary claim.
As to power, I saw a video of one of these amp builders in the states probably within the last year putting like 20 watts into one of those amplifiers and getting 1200 watts "BIRD" out.
Running on 14 volts and drawing 50 amps.
I would say that is a "happy" bird meter.
When... I think the "scam" is not in the contest, but in the power output claims of those who produce such amplifiers. ...
Rather than stating it's a scam, you should post some data backing it up. .... Oh right ....
I think that's fair. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.... but I am not sure that this is really an extraordinary claim.
As to power, I saw a video of one of these amp builders in the states probably within the last year putting like 20 watts into one of those amplifiers and getting 1200 watts "BIRD" out.
Running on 14 volts and drawing 50 amps.
I would say that is a "happy" bird meter.
A pretty decent video on power measurement. The trusty Bird is even shown.
Quote
I would say that is a "happy" bird meter.
Or, thinking at it from a continuous operation rather than looking at the duty cycle. It would be fun to play with one. I could do an unboxing video and blab about how good it is for a half hour as I personally don't have any way to test one.
The manufacture's specs for the Bird meters is clear. When the ham and CBers start calling them the gold standard and making claims about numbers without considering the errors, I laugh. There's no getting around that.
When... I think the "scam" is not in the contest, but in the power output claims of those who produce such amplifiers. ...
Rather than stating it's a scam, you should post some data backing it up. .... Oh right ....
I think that's fair. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.... but I am not sure that this is really an extraordinary claim.
As to power, I saw a video of one of these amp builders in the states probably within the last year putting like 20 watts into one of those amplifiers and getting 1200 watts "BIRD" out.
Running on 14 volts and drawing 50 amps.
I would say that is a "happy" bird meter.
Yeah, 171% efficiency is a fairly ambitious claim!
That said, RF amplifiers of around that sort of CW power level are quite readily realisable at UHF in a size you could fit into a car.
HF ham "linears" are made with similar ratings, so it is possible at 27MHz (& even below), although the linears usually need 100W drive.
Powering either such device is another question, as they are not designed for mobile use & normally have dedicated mains operated power supplies.
At a realistic 80% efficiency, the 14v source would have to supply 107 amps.
The claims I was referring to are of much higher power levels----the CB "shootout" guys often claim 10kW to 20 kW!
These things are crammed into long suffering vehicles, with hotted up V8 engines which seem to have, as their sole purpose, driving multiple heavy duty alternators.----I'm not sure if the vehicles are even driveable!
Even with all that effort, I am still dubious about their claims.
I have never seen any data backing up those claimed figures, so to me, they are in the same realm as the audiophile nonsense.
When... I think the "scam" is not in the contest, but in the power output claims of those who produce such amplifiers. ...
Rather than stating it's a scam, you should post some data backing it up. .... Oh right ....
I think that's fair. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.... but I am not sure that this is really an extraordinary claim.
As to power, I saw a video of one of these amp builders in the states probably within the last year putting like 20 watts into one of those amplifiers and getting 1200 watts "BIRD" out.
Running on 14 volts and drawing 50 amps.
I would say that is a "happy" bird meter.
Yeah, 171% efficiency is a fairly ambitious claim!
That said, RF amplifiers of around that sort of CW power level are quite readily realisable at UHF in a size you could fit into a car.
HF ham "linears" are made with similar ratings, so it is possible at 27MHz (& even below), although the linears usually need 100W drive.
Powering either such device is another question, as they are not designed for mobile use & normally have dedicated mains operated power supplies.
At a realistic 80% efficiency, the 14v source would have to supply 107 amps.
The claims I was referring to are of much higher power levels----the CB "shootout" guys often claim 10kW to 20 kW!
These things are crammed into long suffering vehicles, with hotted up V8 engines which seem to have, as their sole purpose, driving multiple heavy duty alternators.----I'm not sure if the vehicles are even driveable!
Even with all that effort, I am still dubious about their claims.
I have never seen any data backing up those claimed figures, so to me, they are in the same realm as the audiophile nonsense.
I have personally seen the "CB shootout" or "keydown" performed many years ago.
It involved a tape recorder placed between the vehicles - usually suburbans.
The "competitors" then get on their radios and scream into them...
They have the bird meters at the front where the radio is often built into a console.
Some of them are done quite nicely. The goal being to see those bird meters moving!
As to the power.... I saw corona coming off the antennas. I am betting they are up there in terms of power.
The vehicles are driveable but mileage was already bad on a suburban, and even worse with that setup.
If you want to subject yourself to high levels of RF, go to a keydown...
Years ago we had a "shootout" champion show up at the radio shop. He turned on his radio to demonstrate.
Upon seeing the corona and sparks from his antenna, apparently all the observers ran inside. Pretty funny.
He had a special mounting on the front of his engine that supported several high amp alternators (six,I think), extra batteries also.
Yea, these vehicles are drive able. Maybe you could charge your Tesla from one of them???
Never been to one but I believe from all reports that Shootouts are usually staged in a spot where there is a clear line of sight to a receiving device A radio, with attenuators. Results are the S meter reading. Accuracy is not important, relative signal strength is what is measured.
There are lots of amps that run on 14 volts that are used by CBers. A lot of them have huge gain that is not allowed in HAM equipment.
New solid state amps use 50 V supplies.
A lot of CB amps used in base stations use commercial transmit tubes. With the required high volt power supplies. Scary Stuff.
Often a low power radio is fed into a linear and then that linear into still another bigger linear.
I know one guy who uses commercial hard line to his antenna.
Some even have three phase power to their shacks.
Some use a big Henry as a "Driver" for their final amp. Go Think!
Some of them are done quite nicely. The goal being to see those bird meters moving!
When... I think the "scam" is not in the contest, but in the power output claims of those who produce such amplifiers. ...
Rather than stating it's a scam, you should post some data backing it up. .... Oh right ....
I think that's fair. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.... but I am not sure that this is really an extraordinary claim.
As to power, I saw a video of one of these amp builders in the states probably within the last year putting like 20 watts into one of those amplifiers and getting 1200 watts "BIRD" out.
Running on 14 volts and drawing 50 amps.
Yeah, 171% efficiency is a fairly ambitious claim!
...
Powering either such device is another question, as they are not designed for mobile use & normally have dedicated mains operated power supplies.
At a realistic 80% efficiency, the 14v source would have to supply 107 amps.
... extra batteries also.
..
Never been to one but I believe from all reports that Shootouts are usually staged in a spot where there is a clear line of sight to a receiving device A radio, with attenuators. Results are the S meter reading. Accuracy is not important, relative signal strength is what is measured.
Edit: here are some more of their amps, some of these ore 14 Volt Supply
https://www.angelfire.com/crazy/bonacheeta/amps_and_pricing.html
Not intended to be used on the 11 meter band,
Doing so is a violation of FCC rules and regulations!!!