Getting new HF rig--are used HF rigs a good value?

[medical-nerd]

Hiya

I use ebay - I just take my time and wait for a reasonably priced transceiver to be advertised and set myself a realistic limit to my bid - usually about 2/3 of
the second hand asking price on ebay and elsewhere.

You also have to decide whether digital modes will interest you in the future - its slightly more complicated with older transceivers.

This has its disadvantages if you become a fanboy of a certain manufacturer - I look for transceivers I could never afford but always wanted.


An easier approach would be one of the new QRP fully digital rigs and all a PA if required - this would be less than half the price of a 2nd hand transceiver.


Cheers

Steve
M0OYR

[cdev]

Hiya

I use ebay - I just take my time and wait for a reasonably priced transceiver to be advertised and set myself a realistic limit to my bid - usually about 2/3 of
the second hand asking price on ebay and elsewhere.

You also have to decide whether digital modes will interest you in the future - its slightly more complicated with older transceivers.

This has its disadvantages if you become a fanboy of a certain manufacturer - I look for transceivers I could never afford but always wanted.


An easier approach would be one of the new QRP fully digital rigs and all a PA if required - this would be less than half the price of a 2nd hand transceiver.


Cheers

Steve
M0OYR

I was just coming here to make a similar suggestion. Some of these QRP rigs also seem likely to make decent general coverage receivers and they are cheap, too.

I am constntly amazed by how much some sellers want for these old boat anchor rigs. The prices are sometimes as high as they would have cost brand new.. 30 years ago.. I remember some of those prices.

[bob91343]

It's the old supply amd demand story.  If you have something to sell, it's reasonable to try to get as much as possible.  If someone comes along willing to pay your price, the market for the item has gone up.

Getting upset over this is a waste of energy.  You can ask $1500 for an S-38 receiver and if someone has that much to burn, there goes the neighborhood.  Asking prices have an influence on the market but actual sales have a stronger effect.

Meanwhile, technology advances and the older stuff may or may not get cheaper.

So the answer to the OP is yes and no, it depends.  As has been famously stated, quality is remembered long after price is forgotten.  Don't worry too much about value; the years of pleasure you might get overshadow it.  It's only a hobby, after all.

[wizard69]

The best thing you can do is to not pay the high prices for used electronics.   There is demand but often I think that is due to people scarred of new technology.   Supply might be an issue with some models at this point in time but that has little to do wit the high prices of used ham gear which has been high for decades now.

As an aside, a few years ago I was at a ham fest and walked buy a guy with a transceiver he had reconditioned with an excessive price tag on it.   It was a rather old machine which in and of itself is not a problem, the problem was with a machine price tag almost as much as new radio of similar capability.  That is just silly for a 30 year old radio.   So I walked on.

To put it in black and white if I can't get at least 50% off the new price, there is no sale coming for used electronics.    That is for relatively recent old stuff, if it is more than a decade old 10 cents on the dollar often makes better sense.   there may be cases of rare equipment that forces you to reconsider value but if we are talking equipment that is mainstream with several manufactures supplying the same thing, I don't feed the monster.   Lets face it even though the number of suppliers has shrunk we still have plenty of radios to choose from.

Getting a new (to me)  hf rig. Used to do ham stuff maybe 30 years ago, and re-starting the hobby. I have most of my modest steup figured out. There is the question of the transceiver itself. I like the idea of an icom 7300--but it looks like most internet outlets are out of stock. As I look at used rigs, some of them pretty old, it seems like the used rigs are overpriced compared to the value equation of the 7300. Right now I am only interested in CW at 40 meters, so I don't necessarily need something complicated, but maybe I would regret getting a minimal rig if I decide to expand what I am doing. I don't have my finger in the pulse of old hf rigs and what they are worth, like I am with computer gear.

After at least 30 years of looking at want ads and craigslist when I want another computer, I think the sellers have an exaggerated idea of what their older stuff is worth and I almost always build a new computer. I am wondering if its like this with ham gear--the sellers have an inflated idea of what the used gear is compared to what is available new. I don't at all mean to be provocative here, just kind of feeling my way around hf stuff and wondering what the landscape looks like. BTW, I am thinking a 100 watt rig is the power for me. I had a yaesu 757gx back in the day--and I saw one of those used on ebay for $800--that struck me as a bit much. I am more comfortable fixing tube hear, so if I get an older solid state rig, is it common to replace all the electrolytics? I saw a cap kit on ebay for an older hf rig. Thoughts?

[Kerlin]

Recommend a TS440SAT, known as the last good non menu driven radio.
Japanese made and reliable.
Good performance and easy to work on, uses standard parts, simple to fix.  Some mods have been sorted for it, plenty on the net.
Full service manual available on the net, what are you going to do if your new pricey SDR radio fails - good luck, you'll need plenty of it, and where are you going to get the equipment parts and firmware to repair it, I had a generic one fail its now useless.
I got a TS440SAT with the dot problem and just fixed it, if you are a real radio tech its easy to fix. Just remove the the five or so bits around there and scrap away the glue - done, easy. Step by step video on you tube. I think most have already been done by now anyway.

Great for surfing the HF bands, is very pleasant to use, has Vacuum Florescent Display (VFD) and extra smooth big tuning knob, also keyboard if you want to use it.

Maintained its value over the years, price hasn't moved since I bought it. Sure better than buying a toy one from you know where!

[bob91343]

I have a 440 and it hasn't blinked an eye since I got it.  Reliable, powerful, easy to operate, stable, and has the famous 'Kenwood audio'.  I A/B it with my TS-940S and the other guy can't tell the difference.  The '940 has a slightly better receiver and built in power supply.

[bd139]

I wouldn’t buy a new one. As mentioned if you buy a second hand one you probably won’t lose any money on it if you don’t like it and sell it.

The Yaesu FT-450D is a good bet if you ask me. It turns up cheap, has general coverage receive, transmits on everything up to 6m, has built in ATU and importantly has a fairly decent DSP system built in so you don’t have to spend on filters like some older radios. I used it to learn CW on and it was pretty good for an HF radio and built like a tank. It’ll kick out 100W if you need it.

If you are just using CW though, you don’t need a lot of transmit power despite what everyone says. I found the Yaesu FT818 to be excellent as well with a CW filter installed and that thing is a Swiss Army knife radio as it does 2m, 70cm and airband etc. Also very portable.  I was regularly making contacts on that with 4W output.

I eventually settled on an Elecraft K2 kit though. That was designed with CW operation in mind. Again a good buy if you get a cheap one that wasn’t assembled by an idiot. That’ll run rings around most of the other radios.

Worth noting that older radios are more likely to require servicing and may have already been serviced by someone who has no idea what they are doing. Buyer beware.

[joeqsmith]

CDEV get into a political, medical or religious discussion?    Ban for life?  Just curious.  Site does seem to take out some long standing posters from time to time.

[Kerlin]

I haven't seen any service manuals for the for the FT450 so how to service it ?  Is the FT450 surface mount, I handle surface mount every day but in that case I have a manual and spares available.
I have put an external BHI DSP on my TS440SAT.

[Halcyon]

CDEV get into a political, medical or religious discussion?    Ban for life?  Just curious.  Site does seem to take out some long standing posters from time to time.

Not that it's relevant to this thread, but the decision to ban legitimate users isn't make lightly. One of two things happened in this instance, either he ignored repeated warnings to stop breaching the (rather flexible) rules of this forum or he requested that his account be banned.

[bd139]

I haven't seen any service manuals for the for the FT450 so how to service it ?  Is the FT450 surface mount, I handle surface mount every day but in that case I have a manual and spares available.
I have put an external BHI DSP on my TS440SAT.

Service manual https://media.sm7iun.se/2019/10/FT-450_serv.pdf

All surface mount other than some of the higher power parts in the PA chain. Parts orderable directly from Yaesu still.

[joeqsmith]

CDEV get into a political, medical or religious discussion?    Ban for life?  Just curious.  Site does seem to take out some long standing posters from time to time.

Not that it's relevant to this thread, but the decision to ban legitimate users isn't make lightly. One of two things happened in this instance, either he ignored repeated warnings to stop breaching the (rather flexible) rules of this forum or he requested that his account be banned.

Relevant only in that while reading the thread to get some context, I noticed they had recently participated and became curious about the details surrounding their ban.  I attempted to search their posts but didn't see anything egregious and thought I would pose the question.