EEVblog Electronics Community Forum
Electronics => RF, Microwave, Ham Radio => Topic started by: cdev on July 08, 2020, 02:49:47 am
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I would like to build some test PCB boards for testing individual compnents in a controlled impedance way, testing self resonsnce, etc.
Also, how you made them.
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Hi,
You can the board I use in this picture:
(https://www.eevblog.com/forum/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=238558.0;attach=974880;image)
In the top left of the board, there are three 3 \$\Omega\$ resistors in parallel, This is to make a low inductance 1 \$\Omega\$ standard.
This is from this thread:
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/projects/high-bandwidth-current-injector-for-impedance-measurements/msg3026052/#msg3026052 (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/projects/high-bandwidth-current-injector-for-impedance-measurements/msg3026052/#msg3026052)
Also look at this thread:
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/projects/shunt-measurement-of-capacitor-esr-and-resonance-frequency-with-a-vna/ (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/projects/shunt-measurement-of-capacitor-esr-and-resonance-frequency-with-a-vna/)
Forum member, graybeard, does some component measurements with a VNA.
Regards,
Jay_Diddy_B
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HP has a nice app note on the subject:
https://www.electro-photonics.com/images/products/AN1287-9.pdf (https://www.electro-photonics.com/images/products/AN1287-9.pdf)
Also check out Henrik Forsten's blog:
https://hforsten.com/trl-measurements-with-homemade-vna-and-open-source-software.html (https://hforsten.com/trl-measurements-with-homemade-vna-and-open-source-software.html)
Here he walks through the measurement of a surface-mount capacitor's S parameters. The results are a remarkably good match to the data sheet.
Even if your VNA only supports the basic OSLT cal, you can still play with TRL and others using scikit-rf and python.
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I was attempting to make a jig for testing some crystals. This is what I ended up with:
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/rf-microwave/fun-with-crystal-filters/msg3076877/#msg3076877 (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/rf-microwave/fun-with-crystal-filters/msg3076877/#msg3076877)
Simple series and parallel jigs:
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/projects/20db-rf-attenuator-seeking-feedback-to-improve/msg2974530/#msg2974530 (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/projects/20db-rf-attenuator-seeking-feedback-to-improve/msg2974530/#msg2974530)
Demo of measuring a part with one of these jigs using a cheap NanoVNA.
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/projects/20db-rf-attenuator-seeking-feedback-to-improve/msg2976830/#msg2976830 (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/projects/20db-rf-attenuator-seeking-feedback-to-improve/msg2976830/#msg2976830)
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One of member rf-messkopf's fixtures. He was very helpful in getting my home made standards sorted out and has a good website you may want to check out.
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what bandwidth? i've made one "out of the" world class real (semi processed) wood quality + fiber FR4 hybrid test fixture, maybe good up to a GHz or two... edit: updated version on later attachments...
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If you can push up to a high enough frequency, TRL is the way to go for any custom jig-specific calibration. Downside is that you need a line that is a quarter wavelength or so long, so it is not really realistic under a few GHz.
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@joeeqsmith
I notice you are using toroids to couple to your crystal test fixture. Do you just calibrate the test with the balun? do you use a resistor of the appropriate value for the load? (50 ohms, 200 ohms, ?) what kind of resistor do you use thats non-reactive?
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@mechatrommer
Good idea to place them all together one way or another. So they are not lost immediately! (they would be on my desk right now)
Thats a major worry of mine, if I don't make some good way to keep them together.
I'm concerned about making a calibration standard where all of the needed components are right together.
I can easily see myself losing individual tiny SMA ones. So I think I am going to make up my own.
Unfortunately, it seems most of my SMA hardware is likely some other metal than gold :{
Seems that I should buy some real gold plated SMAs for my standard-making, though.
what bandwidth? i've made one "out of the" world class real (semi processed) wood quality + fiber FR4 hybrid test fixture, maybe good up to a GHz or two...
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Your software is much much nicer on the eyes than the nanovna software
Showing my low frequency SOLT and fixture for GHzish experiments.
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/rf-microwave/nanovna-custom-software/msg2638257/#msg2638257 (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/rf-microwave/nanovna-custom-software/msg2638257/#msg2638257)
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@joeeqsmith
I notice you are using toroids to couple to your crystal test fixture. Do you just calibrate the test with the balun? do you use a resistor of the appropriate value for the load? (50 ohms, 200 ohms, ?) what kind of resistor do you use thats non-reactive?
Yes it is calibrated with the two impedance matching transformers. Yes, I calibrate with some resistance but then verify with other parts. ALL parts are reactive but at DCish where I am workin, its not really a factor. There's a fair bit of detail posted in that thread with the 20dB attenuators where I show some really crude builds for a reference.
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I designed a component testing jig using a ZIF socket. There are also spots for other components as well. I used it up to about 200 MHz with good results and 400 MHz with decent results, the limitations being the standards you can fit in a ZIF socket.
https://github.com/profdc9/VNA/tree/master/fixture
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This fixture is only $60 from aliexpress:
https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256802374699500.html (https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256802374699500.html)
(https://ae01.alicdn.com/kf/H94f760bd7bac43ffbcea7613cb413e71u/SMD-Mount-Element-Thimble-Test-Fixture-Piezoelectric-Ceramic-Wafer-Jig-LCR-Bridge-Test-Clip.jpg_.webp)
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Those fixtures are configured for LCR meters, so they've got the interface for it and probably a lot less bandwidth than you'd want for RF characterization. While proper fixtures are normally quite expensive, every so often you can find someone clearing out an RF lab with a bunch of custom fixtures for sale - may not be perfect for the parts you're thinking of, but probably cheap and designed for high bandwidth.
If I were trying the same, the PCB route seems like the best option. It will be the closest to the configuration in circuit and you can build your reference planes on the same material/process, plus SMA PCB connectors are super cheap, so it's easy to just make a few boards and solder in parts under test.