Author Topic: How much security is needed for windows 10?  (Read 3849 times)

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Offline Beamin

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How much security is needed for windows 10?
« on: August 24, 2021, 09:56:44 pm »
It used to be I would run an anti virus and two spyware tools but on win10 it seems like keeping it up dtaed and all security is on is all you have to do.

I still dont trust it though I will put up my bitcoin charts; bowlinger band MA etc on it but I trade through my phone with 2 factor because I dont trust the PC with all the ransomware attacks
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Offline Zucca

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Re: How much security is needed for windows 10?
« Reply #1 on: August 25, 2021, 11:57:34 am »
if you care about security adn privacy

format c:

install linux.

It will not solve the problem just mitigate it by a ton
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Can't love what you don't know. Zucca
 
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Offline PKTKS

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Re: How much security is needed for windows 10?
« Reply #2 on: August 25, 2021, 12:24:09 pm »
PS> alas. such topic belongs to Gen.Computing-> Security

That is partially true.

While anything MS (aka MerdSoft)  is by default unreliable...

*NIX  or Linux is by default reliable just for the most simple fact that you have not only access to the code but also a wide plethora of options to choose.

MS is like a blackbox. How much secure is a blackbox to put your hand inside ? (think of that putting your life data and privacy..)

Linux  diverted a lot  from best *NIX practices..

POTTERIX  BUNTUS and other diverted "products" are considerably less secure and troublesome than real *NIX faithful alternatives..  their goal is also business not best practices.

If you care about security choose a distro close to *NIX  like:
- Slackware
- FreeBSD
- OpenBSD

The last one is  the only one I ever recommend  for safe sites.

Nothing has been subverted or diverted from the book.
The best most competent folks about that.

Go OpenBSD.

MerdSoft is pure shit wrapped in a fancy colorful GUI

Paul


« Last Edit: August 25, 2021, 12:27:39 pm by PKTKS »
 

Offline jmelson

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Re: How much security is needed for windows 10?
« Reply #3 on: August 25, 2021, 05:15:41 pm »
if you care about security adn privacy

format c:

install linux.

It will not solve the problem just mitigate it by a ton
Yes!  I have a web server directly on the net, and I have constant attacks from hackers.  I had a successful break in about a decade ago, and then learned how to secure the system.  Only have one user account that allows external login, use a difficult password, and run denyhosts to watch for ssh login attempts and block them by IP address.  Then, the new thing is Russian hackers creating bogus user accounts on my web store.  That's not a security problem, just a management annoyance.  So, I get hundreds of login attempts a day, but zero success in getting in.  Why do these pathetic idiots even try?

Jon
 

Offline Red Squirrel

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Re: How much security is needed for windows 10?
« Reply #4 on: August 25, 2021, 05:21:46 pm »
I second the Linux post, but if you absolutely need Windows for something like games, I would just put that on a separate vlan, and block all the MS IPs at the firewall and block that machine from accessing the rest of the network.

In fact I do the same for Android, phones are basically spy devices and who knows what the hell they're doing in the background.  My wifi is on a separate vlan that has little to no access to my main network.

At one point I was experimenting with blocking all the Google IPs but the issue is the phone complains that the wifi has no internet and keeps nagging me about it, and it also breaks the ability to access local web resources.  I wish they would get rid of that "Feature".  It gives me lot of trouble with my drone too because of that.
 

Offline PaulAm

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Re: How much security is needed for windows 10?
« Reply #5 on: August 25, 2021, 08:39:27 pm »
Quote
In fact I do the same for Android, phones are basically spy devices and who knows what the hell they're doing in the background.  My wifi is on a separate vlan that has little to no access to my main network.

I run a bandwidth monitor on my net and every once in a while one of the phones goes a bit rogue with a constant ~10KB data stream through the night.  A reboot clears that; only Google knows what's going on.
 

Offline bd139

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Re: How much security is needed for windows 10?
« Reply #6 on: August 25, 2021, 10:12:45 pm »
Oh this thread gonna be a shit show.

Use windows 10. It’s fine. Keep updates turned on. Keep your AV (use built in windows defender) up to date. Don’t download software from torrent sites. Don’t install any old shit you see on the internet. Keep at least two offline backups. Job done.

Linux won’t buy you anything. The security model on linux desktops is far far far worse. At least Microsoft bothers with a MAC framework. If your Firefox process is rooted by a zero day on linux they have all the data in your home directory and can write to .profile. Game fucking over.

In case someone thinks I’m anti Linux I am responsible for managing a metric shit ton of Linux infrastructure and writing software that runs on it. On the server yes. On the desktop hell no.

Security = hygiene. Doesn’t matter what platform.
« Last Edit: August 25, 2021, 10:19:30 pm by bd139 »
 
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Offline Red Squirrel

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Re: How much security is needed for windows 10?
« Reply #7 on: August 25, 2021, 10:30:27 pm »
If your Firefox process is rooted by a zero day on linux they have all the data in your home directory and can write to .profile. Game fucking over.

Same in Windows though.  If you hit a "drive by virus" website you basically have your entire system compromised.   Yeah you can chance only redoing your profile and hope the virus did not use any form of privilege escalation exploit but you may as well just format and reinstall at that point since you're basically starting over anyway.   

Linux is not that much better in this regard either, but at least the OS itself is not acting as a trojan spying on you and constantly calling home.   Suppose you could run Firefox within a chroot jail though but that's a pain to setup.  I don't get why it's not like that by default really.   
 

Offline Halcyon

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Re: How much security is needed for windows 10?
« Reply #8 on: August 25, 2021, 10:55:12 pm »
With anti-virus, the built-in Windows Defender actually does a decent job. There isn't really a need for a third-party virus tool any more, unless you have specific needs that Windows Defender doesn't address.
 

Offline bd139

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Re: How much security is needed for windows 10?
« Reply #9 on: August 25, 2021, 10:59:47 pm »
If your Firefox process is rooted by a zero day on linux they have all the data in your home directory and can write to .profile. Game fucking over.

Same in Windows though.  If you hit a "drive by virus" website you basically have your entire system compromised.   Yeah you can chance only redoing your profile and hope the virus did not use any form of privilege escalation exploit but you may as well just format and reinstall at that point since you're basically starting over anyway.   

Linux is not that much better in this regard either, but at least the OS itself is not acting as a trojan spying on you and constantly calling home.   Suppose you could run Firefox within a chroot jail though but that's a pain to setup.  I don't get why it's not like that by default really.

Actually no you’re wrong. Read up on Application Guard. https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/security/threat-protection/microsoft-defender-application-guard/md-app-guard-overview

But if you are owned by something, the only right outcome is to burn the whole machine to the ground software wise and start again.

As for the telemetry, yep.

In linux, SELinux should be enabled on desktops and Firefox should be only allowed to write to its cache directories and downloads directory. But freedesktop and associated projects are totally clueless on this because it gets in the way of redesigning gnome every three hours.
« Last Edit: August 25, 2021, 11:02:15 pm by bd139 »
 

Online magic

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Re: How much security is needed for windows 10?
« Reply #10 on: August 26, 2021, 11:38:57 am »
OpenBSD sandboxes Firefox by default so that could be an option too :D
 

Offline bd139

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Re: How much security is needed for windows 10?
« Reply #11 on: August 26, 2021, 12:12:43 pm »
Yes that and pledge(2) is a winner. Need more of that.
 

Offline PKTKS

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Re: How much security is needed for windows 10?
« Reply #12 on: August 26, 2021, 04:00:33 pm »
OpenBSD sandboxes Firefox by default so that could be an option too :D

It is meant for security.. 

If your site is wide open to internet best option is OpenBSD.
It has all the servers configured reliable from scratch.

Although I run my workstations since 90s with  XWindows and Firefox without major issues at all as mentioned above...  since 90s Slackware distros are very well put.

MerdSoft is a shit show by default it does not need any further help
Alas .. POTTERIX follows the same way.. mimics look and feel and buz  shitshow model.

Stay way from that stinky shit you will be fine

Paul
 

Offline bd139

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Re: How much security is needed for windows 10?
« Reply #13 on: August 26, 2021, 06:06:24 pm »
Dude we have 9000+ windows desktops.

The problem is the users not the technology.

No magic OS decision is going to save you from humans.
 
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Offline Beamin

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Re: How much security is needed for windows 10?
« Reply #14 on: August 29, 2021, 09:55:26 pm »
Dude we have 9000+ windows desktops.

The problem is the users not the technology.

No magic OS decision is going to save you from humans.

I have linux on a pi I run sometimes but honest;y now that I'm older I just want to install a program and have it work, the first time. With linux there is always 10 extra steps that are not intuitive if you arent a regular linux user. When I was a kid this was great and I would learn stuff, but right now I can't be bothered with it, computers just arent that fun anymore... unless you are doing SDR but even then the computer is 2nd to the fun part.
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Offline ebclr

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Re: How much security is needed for windows 10?
« Reply #15 on: August 30, 2021, 03:20:48 am »
I'm a lucky guy using MS windows 10, for years  without any kind of problem ( at least that I know), Also use Linux, and have a place for both
 

Offline Beamin

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Re: How much security is needed for windows 10?
« Reply #16 on: August 30, 2021, 05:15:24 am »
I'm a lucky guy using MS windows 10, for years  without any kind of problem ( at least that I know), Also use Linux, and have a place for both

Do you by chance use the camera to look at your face to log in? My computer updated recently and it cant turn on the camera anymore. Does anyone know a way to turn on the cam and take a selfie? Some banks require this so they can compare to your drivers lic. I have a surface book BTW, the one with detachable keyboard/tablet mode I never use. Even though its made of metal feels like I'm going to break the thing.
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Offline Bassman59

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Re: How much security is needed for windows 10?
« Reply #17 on: August 31, 2021, 04:38:52 am »
I'm a lucky guy using MS windows 10, for years  without any kind of problem ( at least that I know), Also use Linux, and have a place for both

Do you by chance use the camera to look at your face to log in? My computer updated recently and it cant turn on the camera anymore. Does anyone know a way to turn on the cam and take a selfie? Some banks require this so they can compare to your drivers lic. I have a surface book BTW, the one with detachable keyboard/tablet mode I never use. Even though its made of metal feels like I'm going to break the thing.

Windows 10 has a camera app, similar to Apple's PhotoBooth.
 

Offline Bassman59

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Re: How much security is needed for windows 10?
« Reply #18 on: August 31, 2021, 04:41:28 am »
I'm a lucky guy using MS windows 10, for years  without any kind of problem ( at least that I know), Also use Linux, and have a place for both

My only problem with my Win10 box (quad Xeon, 48 GB RAM) is that it takes a ridiculous amount of time to boot from a cold start, even after a proper shutdown. As in, it takes minute to start. And then when I log in I see 100% activity on the hard disk, and that just makes everything painfully slow until that stops doing whatever the hell it's doing.
 

Offline ebclr

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Re: How much security is needed for windows 10?
« Reply #19 on: August 31, 2021, 04:49:03 am »
Try using nvme SSD ( Samsung 970 pro ), mine takes less than few seconds
 

Offline ebclr

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Offline DiTBho

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Re: How much security is needed for windows 10?
« Reply #21 on: August 31, 2021, 08:52:08 am »
My only problem with my Win10 box (quad Xeon, 48 GB RAM) is that it takes a ridiculous amount of time to boot from a cold start, even after a proper shutdown. As in,

In my office, the computer usually takes up to 15 minutes to boot,  but that's not a problem, it's a bonus: I have the time to go to the bar, drink a cup of hot coffee and have some nice word with the two beautiful Russian secretary girls working upstairs.

I love my slow computer for this, I won't replace it for no reason :D
 
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Offline bd139

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Re: How much security is needed for windows 10?
« Reply #22 on: August 31, 2021, 09:01:43 am »
Correct priorities there  :-+
 
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Offline PKTKS

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Re: How much security is needed for windows 10?
« Reply #23 on: August 31, 2021, 10:45:07 am »
My only problem with my Win10 box (quad Xeon, 48 GB RAM) is that it takes a ridiculous amount of time to boot from a cold start, even after a proper shutdown. As in,

In my office, the computer usually takes up to 15 minutes to boot,  but that's not a problem, it's a bonus: I have the time to go to the bar, drink a cup of hot coffee and have some nice word with the two beautiful Russian secretary girls working upstairs.

I love my slow computer for this, I won't replace it for no reason :D


Jezzuusszzzz   ...  WTF is ET phoning home...

15 minutes to boot ?  WTF is that ?

My workstations are *ALL*  systemd free.
They boot an INIT SystemV  the very old fashioned way.

All checks are made in run level 1
disks are safely checked and run level 3 enters only after all passed OK

Run level 3 starts about 3 minutes after and put server mode in a minute long..
If ALL ( i mean it all ) goes 100% pass OK XWindows took over in 15 seconds flat.

And I am always wondering how to save 5 or 10 seconds... every boot.

Jezzus WTF is ET doing in your life...
Paul
 

Offline DiTBho

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Re: How much security is needed for windows 10?
« Reply #24 on: August 31, 2021, 12:11:39 pm »
It was difficult to get such a bad-result without the IT department thinking it was done on purpose

And I am always wondering how to save 5 or 10 seconds... every boot.

anyway, I am always wondering how to add 1 minute to every boot, so I can justify more time at the bar with girls  ;D
 
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