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8116A Code 42

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MarkL:
I didn't provide test conditions, sorry my bad.  You should measure U33 and U37 with burst off and with waveforms off.  The idea is to create static conditions to make it easier to look for unusual voltage levels.  I think burst/waveforms off will do it, but I'm not going to be able to get my 8116A on the bench for a week or two to verify.

You could also do these measurements with your oscilloscope.  That way if I'm wrong and something is still switching, you can see the high and low levels.  Unlike the analog circuitry, the counter section is digital so precision voltage measurements are not that important.

To simplify, you're looking for:

  Typical (simplified):
    1 = HIGH = -0.90V
    0 = LOW  = -1.75V
    Swing = 0.85V

Unused ECL inputs may be left open or tied to anything <= -1.75V for logic LOW, or tied to -0.7V for logic HIGH.  There are some exceptions to this for specific chips, but not these.

Check power on U33 and U37: ECL Vcc pins 1, 16 should be 0.0V (GND), and Vee pin 8 should be -5.2V.

In the results you posted, I think you are mixing up mV and V and decimal point placement in several places.  Please be accurate and indicate units for sharing results.

Mick B:
Looking over my last post there are some decimal points in the wrong place. I will be more diligent. dyslexia sucks.
Setup. amp. 100mv, offset-0, no frequency, mode Normal.
Pins 8 VEE on both IC's is -5.19V Pins 1 & 16 VCC are 0v
IC-37
Input pins
A4. -2.55V
A5. -2.44V
B6. -0.82mv
B7. -0.77mv
D10. -5.19V
D11. -2.63V
C12. -1.84V
C13. -1.81V   
Output pins
A2. -3.12V
B3. -3.12V
D14. -0.80mv
C15. -3.71V
      ___
C9. out=0

IC. 33
Input pins
A4. -3.12V
A5. -1.75V
B6.   58mv drops to 0v
B7. -3.12V
C10. -3.12V
C11. -0.80mv
D12. -0.96mv
D13. -0.76mv
Out pins
A2. -0.78mv
B3. -0.95mv
C14. -0.75mv
D15. -0v
      ___
D9. out -3.12V

These voltages look almost like the last ones and nothing switching.
used my scope this time. for anyone interested here are the datasheets.

MarkL:
Those are some very strange voltage readings.

I measured U33 and U37 on my unit.  Here is a comparison, organized differently.  There was no switching observed on the measured pins.  Temps: U33 is 54C, U37 is 51C.

Good unit settings:
  1kHz, no waveform selected, normal mode (burst off), output on

All readings in V and grouped by gate

Pins:
  (I)  - input
  (O)  - output
  (O-) - inverted output

U33 MC10104 - Quad AND
   Pin     Good     Broken
  ----    ------    ------
   4(I)   -0.774    -3.12
   5(I)   -0.756    -1.75
   2(O)   -0.771    -0.00078
 
   6(I)   -1.75      0.058 drops to 0
   7(I)   -0.774    -3.12
   3(O)   -1.77     -0.00095
 
  10(I)   -0.774    -3.12
  11(I)   -1.87     -0.00080
  14(O)   -1.75     -0.00075
 
  12(I)   -0.93     -0.00096
  13(I)   -0.735    -0.00076
  15(O)    0         0
   9(O-)  -0.773    -3.12
 
 
U37 MC10103 - Quad OR
   Pin     Good     Broken
  ----    ------    ------
   4(I)   -2.10     -2.55
   5(I)   -0.465    -2.44
   2(O)   -0.777    -3.12
 
   6(I)   -1.77     -0.00082
   7(I)   -0.773    -0.00077
   3(O)   -0.781    -3.12
 
  10(I)   -5.13     -5.19
  11(I)   -2.08     -2.63
  14(O)   -0.726    -0.00080
 
  12(I)   -0.77     -1.84
  13(I)   -1.75     -1.81
  15(O)   -0.774    -3.71
   9(O-)   0         0

First, please confirm your readings above before we go chasing anything.  The I/O pins at or near 0V are a problem (I count 10 of them), with the exception of the unconnected outputs U33.15 and U37.9.  Several pins in the 3V range should also not be.

What exactly do you mean "58mv drops to 0v" ?

MarkL:
So, it turns out that the burst section is dependent on the last settings made to it, and those settings remain even if the unit is put back into normal mode.  And sometimes there is still clocking present on some of the pins.

In an attempt to get things as static as possible, I put my unit in external burst mode (E.BUR), which makes everything wait until it gets an external trigger.  And I also made note of the burst count setting since that may matter.  Some of the pins changed state from my previous post and I have updated my readings below.

I think there are bigger problems given the ECL logic levels in your unit, but I wanted to make sure we're looking at a consistent comparison before going further.

Good unit settings:
  1kHz, duty 50, no waveform selected, burst 14 cycles, external burst
  mode, output on

All readings in V and grouped by gate

Pins:
  (I)  - input
  (O)  - output
  (O-) - inverted output

U33 MC10104 - Quad AND
   Pin     Good     Broken
  ----    ------    ------
   4(I)   -1.72     -3.12
   5(I)   -0.756    -1.75
   2(O)   -1.77     -0.00078
 
   6(I)   -1.75      0.058 drops to 0
   7(I)   -1.72     -3.12
   3(O)   -1.77     -0.00095
 
  10(I)   -1.72     -3.12
  11(I)   -1.87     -0.00080
  14(O)   -1.75     -0.00075
 
  12(I)   -0.93     -0.00096
  13(I)   -0.735    -0.00076
  15(O)    0         0
   9(O-)  -1.72     -3.12
 
 
U37 MC10103 - Quad OR
   Pin     Good     Broken
  ----    ------    ------
   4(I)   -2.10     -2.55
   5(I)   -2.09     -2.44
   2(O)   -1.72     -3.12
 
   6(I)   -1.77     -0.00082
   7(I)   -1.77     -0.00077
   3(O)   -1.75     -3.12
 
  10(I)   -5.13     -5.19
  11(I)   -0.470    -2.63
  14(O)   -0.726    -0.00080
 
  12(I)   -0.77     -1.84
  13(I)   -1.75     -1.81
  15(O)   -0.774    -3.71
   9(O-)   0         0

Same questions:

First, please confirm your readings above before we go chasing anything.  The I/O pins at or near 0V are a problem (I count 10 of them), with the exception of the unconnected outputs U33.15 and U37.9.  Several pins in the 3V range should also not be.

What exactly do you mean "58mv drops to 0v" ?

Mick B:
Hay, Mark. Settings MODE= EBUR@ 14.BUR Amp. 999mv frequency is 1K. off Output= on WID = 10.0 ns Offset =0 Duty 50%
what I meant by PIN 6 on U33 it went from 58mv and dropped to 0. It is NOW holding steady at 47mv.
 Using the same format as yours, more or less.

Pins:
  (I)  - input
  (O)  - output
  (O-) - inverted output

U33 MC10104 - Quad AND
   Pin     Good     Broken
  ----    ------    ------
   4(I)   -1.72      -3.13
   2(O)   -1.77     -0.785
 
   6(I)   -1.75      -0.047
   7(I)   -1.72      -3.13
   3(O)   -1.77     -0.950
 
  10(I)   -1.72     -3.12
  11(I)   -1.87     -1.75
  14(O)   -1.75    -1.75
 
  12(I)   -0.93     -0.972
  13(I)   -0.735   -0.776
  15(O)    0         0
   9(O-)  -1.72     -3.12
 
 
U37 MC10103 - Quad OR
   Pin     Good     Broken
  ----    ------    ------
   4(I)   -2.10     -2.70
   5(I)   -2.09     -2.70
   2(O)   -1.72    -3.13
 
   6(I)   -1.77      -0.952
   7(I)   -1.77      -0.785
   3(O)   -1.75     -3.12
 
  10(I)   -5.13      -5.26
  11(I)   -0.470    -2.65
  14(O)   -0.726   -0.784
 
  12(I)   -0.77      -1.85
  13(I)   -1.75      -1.82
  15(O)   -0.774   -3.70
   9(O-)   0            0

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