EEVblog Electronics Community Forum
Products => Test Equipment => Topic started by: echen1024 on December 30, 2013, 04:41:16 am
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And we thought the Rigol ones were bad. 1:11 minutes of pure cringe. BTW, anyone happen to have the video where the Agilent Land Cruiser runs over the Tek?
High Definition Oscilloscopes - Who's doin' that (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XGh1cZ4bRrU#ws)
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This is very, very stupid. And somehow it made me smile. Hmm......... must be the caffeine. Yeah, that's it, not my retarded sense of humor or anything silly like that. Caffeine. (http://www.picgifs.com/smileys/smileys-and-emoticons/coffee/smileys-coffee-578570.gif) :scared: :scared: :scared:
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wow. That is kind of scary.
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And we thought the Rigol ones were bad. 1:11 minutes of pure cringe. BTW, anyone happen to have the video where the Agilent Land Cruiser runs over the Tek?
I think it's pretty good!
That Tek video was taken down by the owner.
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We really need a projectile vomiting and explosive diarhhea icon....
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We really need a projectile vomiting and explosive diarhhea icon....
Who's doin that? :-DD
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I actually like that.
Don't know what half the things he says mean,
but hey, it's catchy. :clap:
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And, most importantly,
they have got us talking about it,
As they say, any publicity is good publicity.
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I just pooped a little...
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We really need a projectile vomiting and explosive diarhhea icon....
Not exactly with projectile though ....
(http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/images/smilies/vommit.gif)
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Ads like this always show a bit how a marketing department views the company's customers. And LeCroy apparently thinks their customers are stoned, grinning dudes in lab coats, dancing around oscilloscopes, and not being able to read the brand name on the oscilloscope so having to repeat one silly question.
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Just give me clear and honest specs about your product. Now, "who's doin' that" anymore?
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While Tektronix low end scopes are absolute shit nowadays, I still think that they have the nicest marketing videos.. Relatively subtle, not all that pushy and intent on destroying their competitors like Agilent, but still not stupid like Rigol or Lecroy.
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It's black and looks like a microwave - 5 seconds was enough to know who was doing it.
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"4096 levels onscreen" - really? Are they using antialiased plotting on single-shot waveforms?
I think we need a review & teardown - if they put out ads like that, I can't see they'd hae a problem with Dave's "unique" style...
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"4096 levels onscreen" - really? Are they using antialiased plotting on single-shot waveforms?
I think we need a review & teardown - if they put out ads like that, I can't see they'd hae a problem with Dave's "unique" style...
Oh dear. Dave's unique style would be hilarious. They would never send him anything again.
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"4096 levels onscreen" - really? Are they using antialiased plotting on single-shot waveforms?
I think we need a review & teardown - if they put out ads like that, I can't see they'd hae a problem with Dave's "unique" style...
to show 4096 levels you need a vertical resolution of 4096 pixels.... Not even a 4k display has that!
So they are lying.
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I guess they are refering to DPO-style color grading :)
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Stupid marketing aside, that's one sexy looking scope. The black looks lovely.
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Good luck discriminating 4096 colors with our uncalibrated human eye.
It's all vaporware.
If they would have said we have a 12 effective bits signalpath (they may have a 12 bit adc, but how many are noise ? 2?3? 4? More ? How low noise are the probes ... Or the frontend ? Great we have a 12 bit adc but or active probes don't go beyond 5 bit, the rest is amplifier noise...) i would have said : well done!
With this flashy video i have learned nothing , wasted 1:11 minites of my life , and am wasting more harping on about it.
There wasn't even a closeup shot of a real signal captured. They hooked up their cali rator output, hit stop button removed probes and shot their stupid video.
I am NOT impressed.
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"4096 levels onscreen" - really? Are they using antialiased plotting on single-shot waveforms?
I think we need a review & teardown - if they put out ads like that, I can't see they'd hae a problem with Dave's "unique" style...
to show 4096 levels you need a vertical resolution of 4096 pixels.... Not even a 4k display has that!
So they are lying.
The display is WXGA, so vertical resolution is 768 pixels.
The 'engineer' actually says "4096 quantization levels. On the screen". I imagine the marketing weasels will argue that they are capturing 12-bit data, any specified subset of which can be displayed on screen, and they didn't mean 'we can show all 4096 possible levels at once'.
As for "who's doing that?", didn't Agilent launch the 12-bit Infiniium 9000 H-Series scopes a year ago? Also, Pico have had 12-bit (and indeed 16-bit) oscilloscopes for years, and since they are USB scopes which use a PC display, they are also capable of HD display.
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Those extra bits could come in handy if looking at FFT spectrum... or if want to zoom in on a part of the vertical part.
Not sure I would pay premium to get this feature though :-//
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Good luck discriminating 4096 colors with our uncalibrated human eye.
It's all vaporware.
If they would have said we have a 12 effective bits signalpath (they may have a 12 bit adc, but how many are noise ? 2?3? 4? More ? How low noise are the probes ... Or the frontend ? Great we have a 12 bit adc but or active probes don't go beyond 5 bit, the rest is amplifier noise...) i would have said : well done!
With this flashy video i have learned nothing , wasted 1:11 minites of my life , and am wasting more harping on about it.
There wasn't even a closeup shot of a real signal captured. They hooked up their cali rator output, hit stop button removed probes and shot their stupid video.
I am NOT impressed.
This is LeCroy we are talking about. Nothing out of them is all that impressive. God, $9000 starting price? I'd get the scope you have, the Agilent 7000 series. I don't feel that we can actually tell the difference between 12 bits of vertical resolution. In order to display the full 12 bits, you would either need a more than 4k screen, or so many levels of intensity grading that we can't even tell the difference. So unless they find a way to NIST calibrate our eyes first, I think that this scope won't exactly be a hit.
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Just a little comment:
I don't feel that we can actually tell the difference between 12 bits of vertical resolution
The vertical resolution is important if you go for signal-processing. If you want to FFT your time-domain-signal for example.
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Just a little comment:
I don't feel that we can actually tell the difference between 12 bits of vertical resolution
The vertical resolution is important if you go for signal-processing. If you want to FFT your time-domain-signal for example.
Well then spend a little more and go buy a MDO or spectrum analyzer.
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to show 4096 levels you need a vertical resolution of 4096 pixels.... Not even a 4k display has that!
Or simply use the Zoom and Pan touch function.
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to show 4096 levels you need a vertical resolution of 4096 pixels.... Not even a 4k display has that!
Or simply use the Zoom and Pan touch function.
That works as well... forgot about the ubiquitous zoom function...
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Just a little comment:
I don't feel that we can actually tell the difference between 12 bits of vertical resolution
The vertical resolution is important if you go for signal-processing. If you want to FFT your time-domain-signal for example.
Well then spend a little more and go buy a MDO or spectrum analyzer.
I don't know the meaning of MDO (and google doesn't either). But, as for a spekki if you want to watch a single-event in frequency-domain, a classic spectrum-analyzer is not helpful. The combination of scope-trigger-fct. and signal-processing can be important for a couple of applications.
If you don't need it, don't buy it. :-//
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I quite like the advert. At least it's short & gets people talking...
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I don't know the meaning of MDO (and google doesn't either).
It is the abbreviation for a Mixed Domain Oscilloscope
like the MDO4000 series from TEK
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Thanks :)
I didn't know something like this existed.
But that's basically a 2 in 1 solution like a Scopemeter?!
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Here's a Lecroy video about the 12 bit with some examples - not sure who the video is aimed at, but anyway skip to ~4m for examples of 8 bit vs 12 bit; But I'd prefer a 12 bit over 8 bit any day if given the option to buy one! (and the cash) One Lecroy video I saw you can spin the screen 90 degrees into portrait mode, which would probably make your 12 bit waveform look better - other than that you'd have to use zoom and pan.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GlEJpDDQW2I#t=346 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GlEJpDDQW2I#t=346)
[edit]
Other HD vids here..
http://teledynelecroy.com/support/techlib/videos.aspx?DocGroupId=23 (http://teledynelecroy.com/support/techlib/videos.aspx?DocGroupId=23)
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But that's basically a 2 in 1 solution like a Scopemeter?!
No it's not a simple 2 in 1 solution like to combine
a scope with an arbitrary waveform generator in one box.
With a MDO you can work with the two domains
time and frequency at a time-correlated base.
There is an good example video on Alans YouTube Channel
Debug Transient EMI signal with a Mixed Domain Oscilloscope (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AhXEI3ihEFI#)
Quick 5 minute Tektronix Mixed Domain Oscilloscope MDO4000 Demo (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x1oe45DP1_4#)
and Daves review
Tektronix Mixed Domain Oscilloscope MDO4000 Review - EEVblog #199 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2gImgpxrchI#ws)
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Here's a Lecroy video about the 12 bit with some examples - not sure who the video is aimed at, but anyway skip to ~4m for examples of 8 bit vs 12 bit; But I'd prefer a 12 bit over 8 bit any day if given the option to buy one! (and the cash) One Lecroy video I saw you can spin the screen 90 degrees into portrait mode, which would probably make your 12 bit waveform look better - other than that you'd have to use zoom and pan.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GlEJpDDQW2I#t=346 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GlEJpDDQW2I#t=346)
[edit]
Other HD vids here..
http://teledynelecroy.com/support/techlib/videos.aspx?DocGroupId=23 (http://teledynelecroy.com/support/techlib/videos.aspx?DocGroupId=23)
I see now. I however, do need help understanding when this is helpful. From what I see, most of what was demonstrated wa not a use of the 12 bits, but mainly a lower noise floor. The clearest advantage I see is the measurement accuracy.
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While Tektronix low end scopes are absolute shit nowadays, I still think that they have the nicest marketing videos.. Relatively subtle, not all that pushy and intent on destroying their competitors like Agilent, but still not stupid like Rigol or Lecroy.
When you want to sell obsolete technology, you need good marketing department... BTW that LeCroy guy is adorable.
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You have probably seen these commercials. They are from 2011.
What to do with your old oscilloscope (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=02prSelBgb8#ws)
What to do with your old oscilloscope- part 2 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ChQw07k8GbI#ws)
What to do with your old oscilloscope- part 3 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nFND-WglHwU#ws)
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BTW that LeCroy guy adorable.
Either he did ride the short bus to school or he got some bad weed in Colorado.
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BTW that LeCroy guy adorable.
Either he did ride the short bus to school or he got some bad weed in Colorado.
Probably the short bus. Perhaps he was visiting Agilent's cal lab and they decided to give him some weed for the promotional video they knew was coming up...
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No it's not a simple 2 in 1 solution like to combine
a scope with an arbitrary waveform generator in one box.
With a MDO you can work with the two domains
time and frequency at a time-correlated base.
Thank you for the Videos.
Now I understand what they mean with "Mixed domain". That's a TEK-only Marketing-Term, isn't it?
I used similar Instruments (especially Analyzer with Spectrogram), but without a scope... RF only. A syncronized scope-channel may come in quite handy.
Btw, I tested some these big LeCroy scopes some time ago, they are quite good despite the rather cheesy spot ;)
But that are not the typical Hobby-Scopes. If you want that, you have an application that demands it.
Meaning: 12 Bit are nice. For several applications with post-processing of the waveform it may be a killer.(*) But most of the application of a scope don't demand them, 8 Bit are OK. In the marketing (as always) they boost the importance as world-moving or whatever ;)
(*)Of course depending on the analog performance of the front-end. Who needs a 24Bit ADC if the first 20 are noise? ;)
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Thanks for posting the link to the video. Whoose doing that, Agilent as well.
The increased resolution can be useful for looking at low level signals in the prescence of larger ones assuming that the display can be made to expand just part of vertical range.
The rate of A/D converter development is so fast that I think that in a few years 12 bit Oscilloscopes will become the norm.
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And the pothead shows up again! I love how the oscilloscope is displaying a whole bunch of signals without anything plugged in.
(http://i.imgur.com/1v19FK0.png)
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Who's buyin' that? :palm:
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I love him.
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While Tektronix low end scopes are absolute shit nowadays, I still think that they have the nicest marketing videos.. Relatively subtle, not all that pushy and intent on destroying their competitors like Agilent, but still not stupid like Rigol or Lecroy.
When you want to sell obsolete technology, you need good marketing department... BTW that LeCroy guy adorable.
Of course you do. Danaher starves companies of R&D and gives their managers big bonuses and sales departments big budgets.
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You have probably seen these commercials. They are from 2011.
What to do with your old oscilloscope- part 3 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nFND-WglHwU#ws)
This one actually made me laugh. By far not the worst marketing video ever, but goodness, what do they think? Oh yeah, gonna sell more scopes by making ourselves look like complete idiots who can barely put together a video.
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You have probably seen these commercials. They are from 2011.
What to do with your old oscilloscope- part 3 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nFND-WglHwU#ws)
This one actually made me laugh. By far not the worst marketing video ever, but goodness, what do they think? Oh yeah, gonna sell more scopes by making ourselves look like complete idiots who can barely put together a video.
That was just dreadful. I will take a dozen stoned LeCroy dudes over this horrible fart.
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This was just pure cringe throughout the video. God, at least they could have showed and actual person playing soccer with a Tek, and gotten rid of the silly finger.
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I was waiting for the guy to twerk up against that scope.. after all, who's doin' that?
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I was waiting for the guy to twerk up against that scope.. after all, who's doin' that?
Out of all the things you can twerk against... oscilloscopes? I think a Logic Analyzer would be a better choice
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Oh wow. That was spectacularly cringe-worthy. Who does lecroy think they are selling these precision measurement devices to anyway?
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i liked it :-+
it needs cursing and rap music
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You have probably seen these commercials. They are from 2011.
What to do with your old oscilloscope- part 3 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nFND-WglHwU#ws)
This one actually made me laugh. By far not the worst marketing video ever, but goodness, what do they think? Oh yeah, gonna sell more scopes by making ourselves look like complete idiots who can barely put together a video.
That was just dreadful. I will take a dozen stoned LeCroy dudes over this horrible fart.
omfg hhahaha what the hell fried your sense of humor
half of silicon valley probably dropped mad acid
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That was just dreadful. I will take a dozen stoned LeCroy dudes over this horrible fart.
omfg hhahaha what the hell fried your sense of humor
That goddamn music!
The concept was good. The execution was an insult to good concepts everywhere.
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And we thought the Rigol ones were bad. 1:11 minutes of pure cringe. BTW, anyone happen to have the video where the Agilent Land Cruiser runs over the Tek?
High Definition Oscilloscopes - Who's doin' that (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XGh1cZ4bRrU#ws)
Well it's American. In general Americans aren't funny; they lack wit and think that they can compensate by just acting retarded.
Mind you British humor isn't what it used to be either.
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That was just dreadful. I will take a dozen stoned LeCroy dudes over this horrible fart.
omfg hhahaha what the hell fried your sense of humor
That goddamn music!
The concept was good. The execution was an insult to good concepts everywhere.
thats the lsd
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Well it's American. In general Americans aren't funny; they lack wit and think that they can compensate by just acting retarded.
Of course we aren't funny. Who needs wit when you have freedom?
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Well it's American. In general Americans aren't funny; they lack wit and think that they can compensate by just acting retarded.
I ain't sayin a damn thing tonight. :)
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Of course we aren't funny. Who needs wit when you have freedom?
Really? Real freedom for me is being independent but in the US 80% of the people in the nation only have 7% of the nations wealth, how free are they really?
Political freedom: two parties to choose from, really? Two?
Freedom of speech: after 911 put anything bad on the internet and the doorbell rings ;)
Don't get me wrong I loved the US when I visited in the 80's and 90's, and there probably are still lots of nice places there. But it is so sad that the whole country changed in to paranoia and scared people after 911, I would not like to live there now, and really hope your country gets back the joy, humour and self confidence it needs.
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Of course we aren't funny. Who needs wit when you have freedom?
Really? Real freedom for me is being independent but in the US 80% of the people in the nation only have 7% of the nations wealth, how free are they really?
Political freedom: two parties to choose from, really? Two?
Freedom of speech: after 911 put anything bad on the internet and the doorbell rings ;)
Don't get me wrong I loved the US when I visited in the 80's and 90's, and there probably are still lots of nice places there. But it is so sad that the whole country changed in to paranoia and scared people after 911, I would not like to live there now, and really hope your country gets back the joy, humour and self confidence it needs.
thats a bit of a stretch.
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Of course we aren't funny. Who needs wit when you have freedom?
Really? Real freedom for me is being independent but in the US 80% of the people in the nation only have 7% of the nations wealth, how free are they really?
Political freedom: two parties to choose from, really? Two?
Freedom of speech: after 911 put anything bad on the internet and the doorbell rings ;)
Don't get me wrong I loved the US when I visited in the 80's and 90's, and there probably are still lots of nice places there. But it is so sad that the whole country changed in to paranoia and scared people after 911, I would not like to live there now, and really hope your country gets back the joy, humour and self confidence it needs.
+1 Same feeling about US, love it but is not the same anymore
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::)
My fault - I said the "A" word. Context is obviously irrelevant.
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Of course we aren't funny. Who needs wit when you have freedom?
Really? Real freedom for me ...
Oh, dear...
I was just teasing GK. I don't really mean that. How could I? It doesn't even make sense...
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Speaking as one of those Brits who aren't as funny as they used to be, who needs either wit or freedom when you can have a nice cup of tea?
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a nice cup of tea?
Yeah, but look at what that stuff is doing to your teeth!
(https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/another-marketing-dept-has-lost-it/?action=dlattach;attach=74157;image)
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That video told me nothing about the scope. So it has a pretty display. Whopptie Freaking Do! I can zoom in and look at anything on any cheap ass digital scope. Its all about the samples, ADC, and noise.. Yes, they think we are all idiots with lots of cash to spend on their crap. Give one to Dave. Let him sort it out and tell us what to think. hahahaha :clap:
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Freaking the squares (engineers) on purpose maybe.
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Of course we aren't funny. Who needs wit when you have freedom?
Really? Real freedom for me is being independent but in the US 80% of the people in the nation only have 7% of the nations wealth, Don't get me wrong I loved the US when I visited in the 80's and 90's, and there probably are still lots of nice places there. But it is so sad that the whole country changed in to paranoia and scared people after 911, I would not like to live there now, and really hope your country gets back the joy, humour and self confidence it needs.
+1 Same feeling about US, love it but is not the same anymore
Same here. My wife wants to go but I don't. Filling in endless forms? Bent over and have some TSA guy probe....? Sign away all your rights? :wtf: Hell no! There a lots of other places I can spend my money.
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Of course we aren't funny. Who needs wit when you have freedom?
Really? Real freedom for me is being independent but in the US 80% of the people in the nation only have 7% of the nations wealth, Don't get me wrong I loved the US when I visited in the 80's and 90's, and there probably are still lots of nice places there. But it is so sad that the whole country changed in to paranoia and scared people after 911, I would not like to live there now, and really hope your country gets back the joy, humour and self confidence it needs.
+1 Same feeling about US, love it but is not the same anymore
Same here. My wife wants to go but I don't. Filling in endless forms? Bent over and have some TSA guy probe....? Sign away all your rights? :wtf: Hell no! There a lots of other places I can spend my money.
7 Year ago I when to the US for a special flight training, it is cheaper than in Europe.
On the immigration check, the lady imigration officer seriously ask me “I hope you have no intention to crash your aircraft in one of our buildings”, was a special visa for flying training, she knew why I was visiting the Unites States, normally I don’t need a visa but for flying purpose yes and finger print record and pictures in the police station just like a criminal on arrival.
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I had to go through the naked body shit once. I like this video
Remy: Do the TSA Pokey Pokey (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hs5_jB46xQE#ws)
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Mind you British humor isn't what it used to be either.
Well I think some of them still have it right.
My Blackberry Is Not Working! - The One Ronnie, Preview - BBC One (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kAG39jKi0lI#ws)
:-DD
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Ronnie Corbett is old school.