Products > Test Equipment

Brymen BM789

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EEVblog:

--- Quote from: Neutrion on September 27, 2023, 05:47:03 pm ---
--- Quote from: AVGresponding on September 05, 2023, 04:50:36 am ---
--- Quote from: EEVblog on September 03, 2023, 11:12:43 pm ---
--- Quote from: AVGresponding on September 03, 2023, 03:09:41 pm ---Has anyone dug into why their custom silicon suffers these failures? Firmware corruption (I feel if it were this there'd be a lot more cases)? Ionic contamination of the die? Contamination or damage of the die during manufacture? Charge carrier migration or accumulation? It might be nice to have a failed one decapped/X-rayed, to see if there's anything obvious.

--- End quote ---

We don't know.
BTW, the Brymen processor is not custom, it's a known brand. I'm under NDA so I can't tell you which one.

--- End quote ---

That just makes me want to see one decapped even more, to search for clues!   ;D

--- End quote ---
But was it the main processor which was failing or the frontend?

--- End quote ---

IIRC Brymen said it was the processor.

AVGresponding:

--- Quote from: Neutrion on September 27, 2023, 05:47:03 pm ---
--- Quote from: AVGresponding on September 05, 2023, 04:50:36 am ---
--- Quote from: EEVblog on September 03, 2023, 11:12:43 pm ---
--- Quote from: AVGresponding on September 03, 2023, 03:09:41 pm ---Has anyone dug into why their custom silicon suffers these failures? Firmware corruption (I feel if it were this there'd be a lot more cases)? Ionic contamination of the die? Contamination or damage of the die during manufacture? Charge carrier migration or accumulation? It might be nice to have a failed one decapped/X-rayed, to see if there's anything obvious.

--- End quote ---

We don't know.
BTW, the Brymen processor is not custom, it's a known brand. I'm under NDA so I can't tell you which one.

--- End quote ---

That just makes me want to see one decapped even more, to search for clues!   ;D

--- End quote ---
But was it the main processor which was failing or the frontend? As far as guessing went, the frontend was supposedly the _Hycon HY3131 or some close modification of it.

I was also mentionig it a few months ago, that it would be unique to see some troubleshooting within a microchip if Dave could arrange it with some labs.
Any clue or guess what chip  technology (nm size) these Hycon chips use? 

And although off here but is there any statistics anywhere aviable about reliability of microcontrollers? Regarding to manufacturers, nod sizes, etc?

--- End quote ---

I'd imagine Dave's NDA would prevent that; Brymen would probably consider such activities a violation of the spirit of it, even if not the exact words.

Neutrion:
Maybe it is not covering the BM235.  However, it has another processor....

By the way, new interesting feature of the BM789: In any dc only measuring mode, be it current or voltage, if I turn on the record mode, the display update rate jums up to 9-10/second.
Do other Brymens do this?  Yet another Fluke 87V busting feature! :)   

EEVblog:

--- Quote from: AVGresponding on September 28, 2023, 05:25:26 am ---I'd imagine Dave's NDA would prevent that; Brymen would probably consider such activities a violation of the spirit of it, even if not the exact words.

--- End quote ---

There was a specific NDA for getting the programmer. So I'm not allowed to say processor or programmer is used.
But I don't have a schematic or any other design info.

mwb1100:

--- Quote from: Neutrion on September 28, 2023, 10:33:34 am ---By the way, new interesting feature of the BM789: In any dc only measuring mode, be it current or voltage, if I turn on the record mode, the display update rate jums up to 9-10/second.
Do other Brymens do this?  Yet another Fluke 87V busting feature! :)

--- End quote ---

This is documented in the manual.

The following Brymen meters have 20/second update in REC (aka MAX/MIN) mode (not a comprehensive list):

  - BM257s
  - BM525s
  - BM817s (Amprobe AM-270)

The 20/second display update isn't really useful as far as the display goes - if the numbers are changing fast, they're just a blur - better to look at the bargraph.  Of course, the important thing is it helps ensure that the meter will catch very short MAX & MIN durations.

Some that do not have faster update in REC mode:

  - BM235
  - BM857s (Amprobe AM-140-A)

As far as busting the 87V, I'd say "not so fast"!  The 87V's default MIN/MAX record rate is 100ms (10/second), just like the BM789.  It's just that it doesn't update the digital display any faster (the min/max is taken from the bargraph reading).

Also, the Fluke 87V and many of the Brymens support a "Peak" or "Crest" mode where the min/max is captured for very short transients (0.25ms for the 87V and 0.25ms-5ms for the Brymens depending on the model).  In this mode the display doesn't update continuously - it shows the MAX or MIN value (whichever you select)

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