Brymen BM867s ???

[nubinstanley]

If I try purchasing from Welectron, the price of the meter is shown as 175.63 Euros (no VAT ?  ) and after shipping/discount, the price is around 192.02 Euros (231 USD - all currency conversions from google).

Including customs duty (as per calculation from a govt. website) : 295 USD (~27.7% duty)

But I somehow feel that the customs duty is gonna be higher. I remember doing similar calculations when I imported my 3D printer from Europe. I finally had to pay around 40% customs duty!! Well, the HSN codes are going to be different, but... who knows !!

With 40% duty : 323 USD

Lowest offer from local dealer : 308 USD

I can also source it locally for a lower price than this if I choose to not get a bill. I am not comfortable with this anyhow.

As long as the meter is not manufactured in India, I would assume that the price structure would look something similar. Well, thats how much I have to spend. This is also true for the Rigol/Siglent DSOs.

Distributors/bulk importers only need pay the import taxes on their trade cost price whereas private buyers pay the import costs on retail price which is why it's normally cheaper (but not always) to purchase from your local supplier.

If the govt. website customs calculator is accurate, it would be a little bit cheaper to import. But, I guess the extra I end up paying would be worth it, in case I have some issues with the meter.

[nubinstanley]

They don't seem to sell the Brymen BM869s in the USA. Anyone know where I should buy one in the USA?

TME has them:

https://www.tme.com/us/en-us/details/bm869/portable-digital-multimeters/brymen/bm869s/

Plus there's an EEVBLOG discount (if you can find it...  )

You can get a 5% discount from Welectron as well.

[Caliaxy]

They don't seem to sell the Brymen BM869s in the USA. Anyone know where I should buy one in the USA?

TME has them:

https://www.tme.com/us/en-us/details/bm869/portable-digital-multimeters/brymen/bm869s/

Plus there's an EEVBLOG discount (if you can find it...  )

That's where I got mine from (BM869S seems to be out of stock now, though). I wasn't aware of the eevblog discount, but the price was great anyways (they don't charge VAT to US customers). The shipping was cheap and fast, too.

I highly recommend TME.

[rsjsouza]

I highly recommend TME.

Same here. I bought a few items from them and their service, prices and shipping to US are very good.

[HKJ]

I highly recommend TME.

Same here. I bought a few items from them and their service, prices and shipping to US are very good.

I dropped them when they would not sell a device to me, it was too expensive ($2000) and obvious they where not satisfied with the usual prepayment (of the full amount). I did ask them for a higher credit limit, but they never bothered answered (At that time I had already bought a couple of items). I found the item at another dealer that did not have any problems selling prepaid stuff.

[nubinstanley]

Hi All

Picked up the 869s yesterday.

Thanks for all the help.

[pcee]

PS: You need more than one meter. I'd get an AliExpress special as well as a Brymen. It's educational, good for reference, and you need it. :-)

eg. This one (Get the base one, the accessory kit is rubbish. Get some gold probes instead)

Edit: Get gold probes for your Brymen, too. They're only 10 Euros and well worth it.

I'd second that. Two cheaper meters is likely to will be more useful than one expensive one. And the left over money can buy other stuff.

I’m sure this is a stupid question, but why the love for two meters? A meter plus DSO I understand, but the 2 DMMs eludes me.

Also, it looks like the 857s comes with gold-plated leads. Are those different from the gold probes linked above?

[rsjsouza]

I’m sure this is a stupid question, but why the love for two meters? A meter plus DSO I understand, but the 2 DMMs eludes me.

Also, it looks like the 857s comes with gold-plated leads. Are those different from the gold probes linked above?

Two meters is usually a good combination as it can give you simultaneous voltage and current measurements - something that can be done with the oscilloscope and a DMM as well (although the scope has much lower resolution than any meter).

Another aspect is to double-check your instrument in case you suspect a reading is wrong due to harmonics, frequency of signal, an uncovered defect, etc. Ideally the recommendation is also done to avoid breaking the bank - i.e., having one very good meter and one average. 

[Fungus]

I’m sure this is a stupid question, but why the love for two meters? A meter plus DSO I understand, but the 2 DMMs eludes me.

 There's measurements that require 4 DMMs simultaneously. 

[pcee]

 

Are the gold-tipped probes included with the 857s any worse than the separate ones you linked.

[miro123]

Hello DMM experts,
Just to wake up an old thread. I have one question.
Does somebody measure the AC bandwidth of BM867S?

Thanks in advance

[J-R]

I don't have the exact answer to your question but this came to mind:
https://lygte-info.dk/info/DMMFrequencyResponse%20UK.html#Brymen_BM829s

The odds are good that the BM867s might be similar to the BM829s (or only slightly better), since the "100kHz AC, AC+DC Voltage Bandwidth" is a bullet point for the BM869s:
https://www.welectron.com/mediafiles/datasheets/brymen/Brymen_BM860s_Datasheet.pdf

There are also quite a few places in the Electrical Specifications section where the BM867s has "Unspec'd" listed, so it seems the BM869s would be the better choice.

[miro123]

Thanks for the input.  They are two resons why I asked for 867s
1. I already have BM869s + USB-PC dongle. I have already write python library for this dongle.
2. Price difference with 869s -160Euro vs 217Euro with all taxes. and shipments.

[Fungus]

Hello DMM experts,
Just to wake up an old thread. I have one question.
Does somebody measure the AC bandwidth of BM867S?

Datasheet clearly says 100kHz and which ranges it's specified on. I doubt Brymen are making it up.

[miro123]

Datasheet clearly says 100kHz and which ranges it's specified on. I doubt Brymen are making it up.

Thanks for the info
Could you send me an link with datasheet specifying AC BW=100KHz?
==
I cannot find any evidence that AC BW of BM867s is 100KHz.
BM869s is clearly specified until 100KHz
1. EU and global website catalog expelisitly says no for BM867S and yes for BM869s - see page 2 of link below
http://www.brymen.com/images/ProductsList/BM860s_List/BM860s_Catalog.pdf

2. User manual  - page 19 gives unspecified accuracy  for 20KHz...100KHz and 20Hz..45Hz
http://www.brymen.com/images/ProductsList/BM860s_List/BM860s-manual-print1-IEC61010-1-3rd-r3.pdf

[Fungus]

I cannot find any evidence that AC BW of BM867s is 100KHz.
BM869s is clearly specified until 100KHz

Oh, no. My bad. 867s is only 20kHz. 

[2N3055]

I cannot help for BM867, but I did measurement of BM869S... It is better than specified...

[miro123]

Thanks for the input,
I've just checked one old fluke 187, I don't have such professional setup as yours . I used rigol MSO7054 function generator and manually change the frequencies - same setting as yours 1vpp AC  You BM869 went from 0,707V to 0,6V rns at 280KHz while Fluke went to 0,600V at 174KHz. That said - the flatness on both dmm's up until 100KHz seems similar. Your bm869s seems over compensated arrount 100KHz while Fluke begins smoothly decrease from 92KHz  I'll test my BM869 tomorrow.

[Domitronic]

Hello,

i just did a quick test with my BM867s and a SDG1032X. Below is the result. I don't know whether the deviation is caused by generator or multimeter since my second multimeter is not here at the moment.

SDG1032X was set to 2,828V peak-peak in order to get approx 1V rms. BM867s was in auto range but remained in 5V range during all measurements.

Will test again when my Fluke multimeter is back to compare results.

[J-R]

For sure that is the BM867s??  Will be an interesting discovery if the BM867s and BM869s are essentially the same in this regard despite Brymen's claims.

[miro123]

For sure that is the BM867s??  Will be an interesting discovery if the BM867s and BM869s are essentially the same in this regard despite Brymen's claims.

If you look at findings so far there is huge difference between Brymen BM869s and  BM867s

[miro123]

I've tested my brymen 869s vs Fluke 187
Here are my findings.
 - BM869s shows the frequency up until 99.99Khz Fluke does not have this function at all
 - BM869s shows the frequency 1 digit lower - e.g. 80KHz shows as 79.99
Test setup
  - Rigol MSO5074 function generator set to amplitude 1V,  0Vdc
  - manual adjusted to pre-defined frequency
  - grapph shows normalized deviation to DMM own measurement at 50Hz
  - graph shows data up until specified 100KHz - both DMMs declines sharply above specified range
  - BM869 have strange overcompensation, personly I prefer the Fluke plot - #1 it is still acurate to specified range #2 Immune to nises above specification.
That siad - BM869s holds its own - BM869s flatnes up unitl 1KHz is implesive - maybe this parameter is more important in real live.

What is your opinion?
BR
Miro


        -

[miro123]

Hello,

i just did a quick test with my BM867s and a SDG1032X. Below is the result. I don't know whether the deviation is caused by generator or multimeter since my second multimeter is not here at the moment.

SDG1032X was set to 2,828V peak-peak in order to get approx 1V rms. BM867s was in auto range but remained in 5V range during all measurements.

Will test again when my Fluke multimeter is back to compare results.

Thanks for efforts and sharing,
Can you perform next measurements at 2Vpp - then we can easily compare them to other test results? - My & 2N3055
I observe the  following issues
  -  BM867s shows also the frequency 1 digit lower e.g x.99KHz instead of (x+1),00KHz -- same as BM869s
  -  huge difference in 0..100KHz range between BM869s/Fluke187 and BM867s  +-0,8% vs +-4%
  - already at 5KHz BM867s is 3% off - It is still within Brymen specs, but this is definitely showstopper for me.
  - Why BM867s characteristics goes up at MHz range? - what type of cable do you use, Do you terminate the coax cable at the end?
If the next BM867s measurement confirms the same characteristics - I'll byte the bullet and buy BM869s

[Domitronic]

Thanks for efforts and sharing,
Can you perform next measurements at 2Vpp - then we can easily compare them to other test results? - My & 2N3055

I could, but then the tolerance is even higher because it is below 15% of the 5V range. This means another 100 digits between 1kHz and 20kHz in addition to already very high 2dB.

I observe the  following issues
  -  BM867s shows also the frequency 1 digit lower e.g x.99KHz instead of (x+1),00KHz -- same as BM869s
  -  huge difference in 0..100KHz range between BM869s/Fluke187 and BM867s  +-0,8% vs +-4%

As you can see in my results my BM867s is already more than 8% off at 100kHz.

  - already at 5KHz BM867s is 3% off - It is still within Brymen specs, but this is definitely showstopper for me.
  - Why BM867s characteristics goes up at MHz range? - what type of cable do you use, Do you terminate the coax cable at the end?

I did not test in MHz range, only up to 150kHz as you can see in my results. Looks like the BM867s is definitely the wrong meter for you. Above 1KHz the specified tolerance is 2db. So not really usabale if 3% are already a showstopper for you. And above 20kHz its not even specified. I would recommend to just get the BM869s or any other meter that meets your requirements. Its wasted money to buy a meter that doesn't meet your requirements.

[miro123]

Thanks everyone who help me clarify my next purchase.
I'm power electronics/software developer.
The most signals that I measure are distorted, with higher harmonics and even worse, the pwm signals are still visible somehow. That is mostly true during development phase. The final product is good .
Thanks
Miro