EEVblog Electronics Community Forum
Products => Test Equipment => Topic started by: CrazyTiger on February 16, 2019, 12:21:54 pm
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Tonite I am supposed to get a DPO2024B, got it cheap for about 200USD. To prepare for a bandwidth test, I fired up my TDS380P to verify the amplitude of a 200MHz Signal, to my sadness and it gave me errors, it failed self-test and SPC Test :'((it was fine yesterday).
Which made me wonder, maybe the feeling of my TDS380P got hurt with an arrival of a baby brother :P
Anyone else come across this situation, you get a new and shiny Instrument and the older one starts throwing tantrums?
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Yup. Ordered a 'new' RF generator and the old one stops to work the same day.
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I haven't noticed that.
What I have seen is that test equipment fails in the middle of a difficult repair, when you least want it to, presenting you with another difficult repair you have to do before you can continue with what you are doing. I think it resents the attention given to something else and does something outrageously naughty to make itself centre stage.
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I'm glad this thread is within sanity. I had a coworker that literally believed water had feelings. He put his water in a glass bottle and would set it next to a plant and play music for it. He would talk to his water. He would hold some kind of rock on a string over it and observe the perturbations and believe the water was communicating back to him. In all other respects, he seemed like a normal guy.
When I was younger, I would curse my equipment and call it foul names, and threaten it with demolition. It never twitched, not once. :horse:
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Years ago I worked on an HP3000 mini computer. Just occasionally, always late on a Friday afternoon, doing a long compilation, the compilation would stop with a long strange error report. It wasn't a compiler error, it wasn't an operating system error, it wasn't in any manual, it didn't identify itself clearly, but it wasn't gibberish, it wasn't repeatable.
I always thought the HP3000 had been at it all week, it was close to home time on Friday afternoon, it was looking forward to the weekend, and its mind wasn't really on it.
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No
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I hope you are kidding, by asking whether (cold dead) instruments (been made of metal, silicon and plastics) having feelings or not!
Well, if you are not, the answer is straightforward:
Not even humanoids (meaning: not humans ['anthropoi'], but human-like [bio-robots or 'spartoi (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spartoi)' just like the ones Prometheus (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prometheus), Cadmos (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cadmus), Deucalion (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deucalion) & Pyrrha (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pyrrha_of_Thessaly), etc. created]) have any feelings; they might have senses by their sensory organs (as instruments having sensors might have a vague picture of their environment) but they do not have a psyche (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psyche) at all!
So, yes, they might be able to be sensing some things but they are totally unable to be feeling.
-George
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Yep, they do feel. Every time I browse for another dead 3458A, my working ones produce 0.2ppm blip in readings... When once in a year I power off the calibrator, all meters die from sadness a little. :-DMM
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I foresee an animated movie featuring test equipment as the characters. Or perhaps a live action movie which is more like Christine (https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0085333/).
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(https://media.giphy.com/media/fJP7zmfO5JcXu/giphy.gif)
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Tonite I am supposed to get a DPO2024B, got it cheap for about 200USD. To prepare for a bandwidth test, I fired up my TDS380P to verify the amplitude of a 200MHz Signal, to my sadness and it gave me errors, it failed self-test and SPC Test :'((it was fine yesterday).
Which made me wonder, maybe the feeling of my TDS380P got hurt with an arrival of a baby brother :P
Anyone else come across this situation, you get a new and shiny Instrument and the older one starts throwing tantrums?
My instruments dont (I hope). I *do* have feelings about them (if they dont do what I want). Nothing than can be duplicated here, just general obscenity and foul language :)
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That is one of my favorite "adult" animated movies Echo88, maybe because it is very non-Disney.
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Where from is the video ?
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They must, why else would you need to constantly pet the watch-dog?
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Its a blend of the word feelings and karma, but they certainly sense whats going on around them.
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That is one of my favorite "adult" animated movies Echo88, maybe because it is very non-Disney.
What's the name of the movie, please?
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On another note i have a haunted HP 8566A
It was sitting there in the rack powered off, but then all of a sudden all of its fans started running, nothing came up on the front panel apart form a few LEDs, clicking the power button back and forth did nothing and kept going until i eventually pulled the plug for the rack.
After some time i pulled the heavy bastard out of the rack to take a look and found only a blown fuse for the standby power rail(used to hold the oven warm and such). Turns out this thing is using the standby rail to hold the relays for the rest of the rails open, so if the standby rail fails all the other rails come up regardless of the power switch position, but the instrument doesn't boot because of the missing standby rail.
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That is one of my favorite "adult" animated movies Echo88, maybe because it is very non-Disney.
What's the name of the movie, please?
"The Brave Little Toaster"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I8C_JaT8Lvg&t=4417s (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I8C_JaT8Lvg&t=4417s)
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Update:
My TDS380P that died has a dead Dallas DS1644-120 NVRAM, now I am sourcing for a replacement chip.
The "new" DPO2024 arrived, the best part is the run time counter states only 60 Hours of usage, it even smells new..yay
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Allow me to slightly reword this comment:
What I have seen is that test and development equipment fails in the middle of a project, when you least want it to, presenting you with a difficult repair you have to do before you can continue with what you are doing.
1000% THIS!!! I can't count the number of times I'm deep in some development project and suddenly a scope gives me trouble, or I reveal some hitherto unknown bug in the compiler or IDE, etc. My head is buried in the project's details, it's all organized in my brain, I'm "one with" everything that's happening, I can feel that the answer is moments away - and then my development environment has an issue that stops the entire process dead. POW, the mindset is lost... I have to unwind the mental stack and switch contexts to work on my freakin' R&D gear just so I can get back to what I was actually supposed to be doing. Even if the fix only takes a few minutes, it can take an hour or more to re-establish the environment and get my head completely back into the game.
Tools are supposed to HELP with development, not hinder it.
I've told myself that if I ever start another company, I'm going to hire someone whose primary responsibility is to keep all R&D equipment properly functioning, with hot spares ready to go at a moment's notice. If I'm that deep in development and a problem arises, this person will temporarily rectify the problem so I can keep my brain phase-locked rather than lose all of that focus. I won't have to think about what's wrong... I won't have to switch gears into "fix-it" mode... I'll just yell someone's name and they will swap out equipment until things start moving again.
Hey, allow me this one fantasy, OK? :)
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What I have seen is that test and development equipment fails in the middle of a project, when you least want it to
1000% THIS!!! I can't count the number of times I'm deep in some development project and suddenly a scope gives me trouble, or I reveal some hitherto unknown bug in the compiler or IDE, etc.
Selective memory?
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I don't think so. I generally factor in "quirks" of equipment or software tools. I even make note of accommodations for known issues in my source code comments, for example.
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Animism is one of the most primal and primitive forms of belief system or religion. Although I have to admit I've cursed at my car or computer at times too, I think it's more a matter of having more patience to deal with problems when you think there's something sentient on the other side.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Animism
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Allow me to slightly reword this comment:
What I have seen is that test and development equipment fails in the middle of a project, when you least want it to, presenting you with a difficult repair you have to do before you can continue with what you are doing.
1000% THIS!!! I can't count the number of times I'm deep in some development project (...)
Tools are supposed to HELP with development, not hinder it.
Exactly. They will HELP you when they FEEL like it. :-DD
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Selective memory?
Plus the weight of the issue. If you experience a quirk without anything being on the line the issue is much smaller than when it's crunch time during an important project.
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Yep this is also where Murphy's law comes from. You just remember the times a lot better when something really goes wrong.
But i still swear my old inkjet printer had a urgency sensor in it to refuse to print only when the level is above a threshold. Until i bought a color laser printer and couldn't be happier with its reliable performance.
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I foresee an animated movie featuring test equipment as the characters. Or perhaps a live action movie which is more like Christine (https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0085333/).
Drop an AllSpark fragment in your lab.
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Yes, they have feelings and are usually unreasonably sensitive. But it’s all about managing expectations. Sit them down, calmly explain what is going on, and ease them into the new reality. Might also help to have grief counselors waiting on the sidelines.
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This thread is hilarious and very enjoyable.
With respect to anthropomorphizing test equipment... I am honest enough to admit that when I purchased my most recent oscilloscope, I said to my wife "I think it's time to invite another scope into the family".
And she didn't think it was weird.
I definitely married the right girl! :-+
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My guitar gently weeps.
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can a hydralisk jump?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=16aGSx9gFO4 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=16aGSx9gFO4)
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Allow me to slightly reword this comment:
What I have seen is that test and development equipment fails in the middle of a project, when you least want it to, presenting you with a difficult repair you have to do before you can continue with what you are doing.
1000% THIS!!! I can't count the number of times I'm deep in some development project and suddenly a scope gives me trouble, or I reveal some hitherto unknown bug in the compiler or IDE, etc. My head is buried in the project's details, it's all organized in my brain, I'm "one with" everything that's happening, I can feel that the answer is moments away - and then my development environment has an issue that stops the entire process dead. POW, the mindset is lost... I have to unwind the mental stack and switch contexts to work on my freakin' R&D gear just so I can get back to what I was actually supposed to be doing. Even if the fix only takes a few minutes, it can take an hour or more to re-establish the environment and get my head completely back into the game.
To be rational about this, if you are using the equipment intensively for days or weeks, statistically it's more likely to fail in a period like that. Then there's a mental filter where things of special significance figure large, and having your concentration and thread of thought broken when it's taken days to build is one. Then our brains are tuned to see certain patterns, partticularly in terms of people and animals and we can see them were there are none; faces in the fire, those photos which turn up in the daily rags from time to time - snow on a hedge which looks like Jesus. There's a temptation to give complex inanimate objects names and personalities; Thomas the Tank Engine; some people give their cars names - Felicity Ford. There's a Fawlty Towers episode where John Cleese's car lets him down at an awkward time and he tells it he's warned it and warned it and it won't listen, so he's now going to give it a damned good thrashing - which he does.
This thread's a lot of fun and it can certainly seem that test equipment has got it in for you and picks its time carefully. It's boring being rational all the time.
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This thread is hilarious and very enjoyable.
With respect to anthropomorphizing test equipment... I am honest enough to admit that when I purchased my most recent oscilloscope, I said to my wife "I think it's time to invite another scope into the family".
And she didn't think it was weird.
I definitely married the right girl! :-+
Presumably she thought it was happy, confident and alert and she was impressed by the way it came up and made friends straight away. It wasn't the smallest one which ran off and hid in the corner as soon as it saw you, and seemed dopey and morose.
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Years back when fixing a friends valve based Colour TV when I arrived to fix it the picture was often breaking up no vert or horiz hold. I approached the set and it started working perfectly again. Whatever I tested, tried etc could not bring the fault back. I said to the friend leave the set on and I will come back in an hour or so. On returning the friend commented that the set became faulty again just after you left. I reached the door into the room where the set was it was still failing. I approached the set and once again it started working again. Having assumed the set wanted to be nice to me only when I was present :) I told my friend to give me a call when it stayed faulty. Finally a week or so later it stayed failed for long periods. My return didn't encourage it to work again either. :( However the fault was traceable and found to be a hairline crack in the PCB, which had valves mounted on it, that was expanding and contracting due to temperature variations. Bridging the crack cured the problem. Did the set have feelings and like me at first. :) or did it then sulk :( because I didn't stay and look after it who knows?
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Even simple tools can have feelings - if you do not take good care of them, they may let you down :)