Author Topic: E36300 Series Programmable DC Power Supplies (E36311A, E36312A, E36313A)  (Read 34690 times)

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Offline gslick

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Anyone have one of these? They look like nice supplies designed to replace the E3631A. Priced in the same range as the E3631A, so 2-3x of something like a Rigol DP832. But if you buy one now they'll throw in a  U1242C for free.

E36311A 80W Triple Output Power Supply, 6V, 5A & ±25V, 1A, USB only US$ 1,100
E36312A 80W Triple Output Power Supply, 6V, 5A & 2X 25V, 1A USB, LAN, (GPIB Opt) US$ 1,400
E36313A 160W Triple Output Power Supply, 6V, 10A & 2X 25V, 2A USB, LAN, (GPIB Opt) US$ 1,700
E36312A-GPB / E36313A-GPB GPIB interface module for E36312A, E36313A - installed US$ 150

In addition to lacking the LAN and optional GPIB interface, the E36311A also lacks the rear output and sense terminal connections, and also lacks the front panel USB connection for saving test setups, test results, screen images, and log data directly to the USB device plugged into the front panel.

E36300 Series Programmable DC Power Supplies Data Sheet
http://literature.cdn.keysight.com/litweb/pdf/5992-2124EN.pdf

Buy one through September 30, 2017 and get a free U1242C Handheld DMM
Buy Any Keysight Big5 Bench Instrument, Get A Complimentary Handheld!
http://literature.cdn.keysight.com/litweb/pdf/5992-2215EN.pdf

E36300 Triple Output Bench Power Supply Product Overview
« Last Edit: June 15, 2017, 05:39:02 pm by gslick »
 
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Online kilobyte

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Yes, they look really interesting.
I saw these new power supplies already some days before on the website from the German distributor Datatec.

According to a picture in the Service Manual they use a STM32F4. This explains the fast startup time of round about 5 seconds in the video from Keysight.
There is already a firmware update available on the website. No wonder to see a USB DFU Updater.
And after a quick look in the Firmware file I think I found some text that belongs to an easter egg :D

BR
Kai
 
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Offline HighVoltage

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Looks really nice !

Especially to have Voltage, Current and Power finally on a Keysight PSU screen and that for all three channels in one view is great.

In Germany the list prices are:

E3611A:
Euro 989 +VAT

E3612A:
Euro 1258 +VAT

E3613A:
Euro 1528 +VAT

There are 3 kinds of people in this world, those who can count and those who can not.
 
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Offline rdl

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I don't see any need for the nursery school color coding. It looks out of place with the rest of the design and serves no purpose really, as everything appears to be arranged logically.

The front USB connector placement is a little odd (if that's what it is) seems like there's potential for blocking view of the display if something is plugged in it.

If you're going to use a green LED for power indicator at least use a modern true green type instead of that ugly snot green that's been around since the 80s, though almost anything is better than yet another blue LED.
 
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Offline alm

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This explains the fast startup time of round about 5 seconds in the video from Keysight.
Five seconds startup is fast for a basic bench power supply? That is because the micros the days are much slower than the ones used in their previous supplies, right?
 
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Online nctnico

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I think I'll put a E36312A on my wish list! Pretty much what I have been looking for in a PSU and the small current + logging features seem very handy to me.
There are small lies, big lies and then there is what is on the screen of your oscilloscope.
 
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Online colorado.rob

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The 12A and 13A seem to be the same size and features as the TTi MX100TP I just purchased, but with a lower load capability and at a higher price.  What am I missing?  The 11A is the same price, but far less capable.
 
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Offline gslick

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E36300 Series Programmable DC Power Supplies User’s Guide
http://literature.cdn.keysight.com/litweb/pdf/E36311-90001.pdf

E36300 Series Programmable DC Power Supplies Programming Guide
http://literature.cdn.keysight.com/litweb/pdf/E36311-90008.pdf

E36300 Series Programmable DC Power Supplies Service Guide
http://literature.cdn.keysight.com/litweb/pdf/E36311-90009.pdf

Some images from the Service Guide:
 
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Offline alm

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The 12A and 13A seem to be the same size and features as the TTi MX100TP I just purchased, but with a lower load capability and at a higher price.  What am I missing?  The 11A is the same price, but far less capable.

Better constant current mode (accuracy, noise)? Current readback resolution down to 1 µA? More software support (BenchVue, as opposed to only drivers to interface with your own software)? Stand-alone logging of data?

BTW, gslick, according to the datasheet GPIB is optional for the E36312A/E36313A. It should probably not be listed in the first post as a feature without noting that.
 
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Online nctnico

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Some images from the Service Guide:
Dang! They are going to put Dave out of business with service guides like these!
There are small lies, big lies and then there is what is on the screen of your oscilloscope.
 
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Online colorado.rob

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The 12A and 13A seem to be the same size and features as the TTi MX100TP I just purchased, but with a lower load capability and at a higher price.  What am I missing?  The 11A is the same price, but far less capable.
Better constant current mode (accuracy, noise)? Current readback resolution down to 1 µA? More software support (BenchVue, as opposed to only drivers to interface with your own software)? Stand-alone logging of data?
What good does having 1µA readback resolution do you when the level of accuracy quoted is 2-3 orders of magnitude greater?  Specs show 0.04% +3 mA and 0.25% +80 uA readback accuracy.

Given that stand-alone logging and BenchVue software are not features I want or need, the TTi is better value to me.  And, not that it matters to me, the MX100TP comes with GPIB.
 
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Online nctnico

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The 12A and 13A seem to be the same size and features as the TTi MX100TP I just purchased, but with a lower load capability and at a higher price.  What am I missing?  The 11A is the same price, but far less capable.
Better constant current mode (accuracy, noise)? Current readback resolution down to 1 µA? More software support (BenchVue, as opposed to only drivers to interface with your own software)? Stand-alone logging of data?
What good does having 1µA readback resolution do you when the level of accuracy quoted is 2-3 orders of magnitude greater?  Specs show 0.04% +3 mA and 0.25% +80 uA readback accuracy.

Given that stand-alone logging and BenchVue software are not features I want or need, the TTi is better value to me.  And, not that it matters to me, the MX100TP comes with GPIB.
The TTi PSU seems like a switcher to me when I look at the weight (approx 5kg). The RMS noise on the TTi PSU is about 10 times larger than this new Keysight series which seems to be linear (approx 8kg). I'm not saying a switching PSU is bad (I have a bunch of them) but sometimes you need a low noise PSU. Also the offset is over the entire temperature range so it may be lower at room temperature. Resolution is nice so at least you can see small changes. I expect the logging feature on these new Keysight PSUs is extremely helpful for low power devices to determine the power profile.
There are small lies, big lies and then there is what is on the screen of your oscilloscope.
 
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Online colorado.rob

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Resolution is nice so at least you can see small changes. I expect the logging feature on these new Keysight PSUs is extremely helpful for low power devices to determine the power profile.
Resolution is meaningless without precision (accuracy).  I suppose one could use the last two digits to feed entropy into a random number generator, so it's not entirely useless. ;)


 
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Online nctnico

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Resolution is nice so at least you can see small changes. I expect the logging feature on these new Keysight PSUs is extremely helpful for low power devices to determine the power profile.
Resolution is meaningless without precision (accuracy).  I suppose one could use the last two digits to feed entropy into a random number generator, so it's not entirely useless. ;)
Everything is relative and so are measurements. If the current jumps up or down 10uA then that will likely be a change in the current drawn by the load and not the measurement offset. Either way it is not trivial to measure these kind of low currents going into a ciruit without dropping a significant burden voltage or deteriorating the power supply's out impedance so I'm happy with what I can get.
There are small lies, big lies and then there is what is on the screen of your oscilloscope.
 
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Online colorado.rob

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Either way it is not trivial to measure these kind of low currents going into a ciruit without dropping a significant burden voltage or deteriorating the power supply's out impedance so I'm happy with what I can get.
As long as it meets your needs and you think you're getting value for you money, that's all that matters.  I'd be interested to see a good review and teardown video by someone who knows what they are doing and isn't just a button pusher.

What I really want I cannot have.  I really like the TTi, but I want it in a 2U <300mm depth with the same features on the front panel.  Physically, that cannot happen without some compromises.  The HMC8043 is the right size (and looks nice), but doesn't have binding posts or sense ports in the front.  And the user interface looks like it might be a little challenging with so few buttons compared with the TTi.  And the vent holes on top...  :palm:
 
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Offline TheSteve

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I'd like an E36313A for my bench - wonder when Keysight will have "power supply month".
VE7FM
 
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Offline Omicron

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This new power supply ticked all the right boxes for me. I ordered an E36312A from Farnell yesterday. It arrived this morning. Haven't had time to play with it much, but one thing I can confirm: the fan in this thing is whisper quiet! I've had fan-less power supplies that made more noise than this one (transformer hum). At my typical use case I simply can't hear it, even in a quiet room (250mA at 24V, room temperature in the office was about 25 degrees celsius). Very happy about that!
 
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Online nctnico

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It is good news about the fan! In older HP/Agilent PSUs the fans are usually loud and running at full throttle.
There are small lies, big lies and then there is what is on the screen of your oscilloscope.
 
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Offline alm

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Or just went from loud to VERY LOUD.
 
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Offline HighVoltage

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Because of the noise on older Agilent power supplies, I have exchanged almost all fans and slowed them down. Usually my PSUs don't run at full power, so full fan speed is not required.

Same here, this new Keysight power supplies fulfils everything I was looking for.
I will probably order the E36313A next week.
There are 3 kinds of people in this world, those who can count and those who can not.
 
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Offline anotherlin

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What good does having 1µA readback resolution do you when the level of accuracy quoted is 2-3 orders of magnitude greater?  Specs show 0.04% +3 mA and 0.25% +80 uA readback accuracy.

Specification states that error is (+/-0.04% of the output current) + (+/- 3mA of offset).
If you take a 1mA output current, error is 0.04% of 1mA, which is 0.0004mA (0.4uA), with an offset +/- 3mA.
So according to spec, the actual result can be with within [1 - 3.0004, 1 + 3.00004] mA.

However, most DMM quotes the offset as a % of the range of measurement.
For example my Agilent U3606 5.5 digit DMM, for the lowest 10.000 mA range, specifiies 0.05% of the reading + 0.015% of range.
My 5.5  DMM would be accurate within +/- 2uA if measuring a 1mA current. So its last 1uA digit would not be completely random.

I would rather think that the specified 3mA offset is the most pessimistic value using the highest measurement range of the readback circuit of the PSU.
And that actual performance may be much better, sufficiently that the last 2 uA digits are not completely random when the output current is <= 1mA.

Also the offset/range error is supposed to account for the overall noise of the measurement /readback circuit and this is supposed to be somewhat constant for the design.
So if you do a long log of measurements, you should be able to "null out" that offset error.

"Lots of people have made $100K or more mistakes and didn't get the boot. It's called training, why fire them after such an expensive lesson?" -- EEVblog Electronics Community Forum
 
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Offline gslick

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According to a picture in the Service Manual they use a STM32F4. This explains the fast startup time of round about 5 seconds in the video from Keysight.
There is already a firmware update available on the website. No wonder to see a USB DFU Updater.
And after a quick look in the Firmware file I think I found some text that belongs to an easter egg :D

Looking at some of the text strings in the CumuloNimbus_1_0_4_FP_1_0_0_Main_1_04.dfu firmware file it appears that it might be running uC/OS-II.
"uC/OS-II Idle"
"uC/OS-II Stat"
"uC/OS-II Tmr"
"uC/OS-II TmrLock"
"uC/OS-II TmrSignal"

Easter egg text?
"Doe, a deer, a female deer
Ray, a drop of golden sun
Me, a name, I call myself
Far, a long, long way to run
Sew, a needle pulling thread
La, a note to follow So
Tea, a drink with jam and bread"


 
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Offline Muxr

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They look interesting, although I personally would definitely go for the LAN option so E35312A would be it at a minimum.
 
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Offline Dubbie

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It's like Keysight was listening when I wrote my post a while back about "Why does no-one make a decent power supply"

I have been on the brink of getting a TTi, But I think I will get the E35312A instead.

The low current feature is great!
 
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Online nctnico

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It's like Keysight was listening when I wrote my post a while back about "Why does no-one make a decent power supply"

I have been on the brink of getting a TTi, But I think I will get the E35312A instead.

The low current feature is great!
The low current measurement feature is addictive. I already have an Agilent 66311B PSU which also has a low current measurement feature and it is excellent for low power electronics. I was already looking for a PSU with a high resolution current display but the low current measurement feature is way better.
There are small lies, big lies and then there is what is on the screen of your oscilloscope.
 
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