EIP 545B Frenquency counter

[Guile]

I've had a look at EIP 575 Service Manual and found Error 40 code means DAC table Error.

"DAC Table Error" is apparently an access problem to calibration data stored in A105 EEPROM, Error 32 is also suspicious related. Check all power supply voltages on main board, not directly on power supply board, often there are problem on connectors contacts to board edges.

Also check for possible data/address BUS overloads from PIA chips (68B21).

Thus, if this Service Manual can be used for my 545B I'll be able to repair it. At least I have to dig a bit more onto A107 board now.

Yes, this manual is usable.

Hi HighPrecision,

I've not been able to find anything wrong so far. Thus I did like Douardda and I've made a Dump of the EEPROM (from address 0x0800 to 0x0FFF) which took me around 20 minutes to download all the 2048 words thanks to his idea. Then I've had a look at data from 0x0C00 and they don't look right. At least up to 1Ghz (0x01F4) the data look ok but above I'm not sure:

0x0C00, 0x00
0x0C01, 0x08
0x0C02, 0x00
0x0C03, 0x00
0x0C04, 0x01
0x0C05, 0x2C
0x0C06, 0x01
0x0C07, 0x28
0x0C08, 0x01
0x0C09, 0xF4
0x0C0A, 0x01
0x0C0B, 0xF3
0x0C0C, 0x0C
0x0C0D, 0xB2
0x0C0E, 0x0C
0x0C0F, 0xD5
0x0C10, 0xFF
0x0C11, 0xFF
0x0C12, 0xFF
0x0C13, 0xFF

Indeed, if I've understood correctly the data I've dumped, the DAC is tuned at 600Mhz, 1Ghz, and 6.5Ghz, which looks weird and not in line with the Service Manual which is asking for 1Ghz, 1.3Ghz, 10Ghz and 20Ghz. Still it doesn't explain why my counter is not able to count above 1Ghz anymore as it should have done interpolation at least up to 6.5Ghz...

Any thoughts?

Thanks a lot!

[HighPrecision]

Hi Guile,

DAC Table is clearly incomplete, looks as a aborted TEST 90 calibration process, missing the DEF-2 bytes before 'Table End'.

If you have the required generator do a complete recalibration via TEST 90 as described on 575B manual, at 20 GHz point there is an error, with generator @ 20GHz the frequency inserted is 18 GHz, that is wrong, must be the same frequency of the generator.

If you are unable to do the complete calibration, try to modify EEPROM locations from 0x0C10 as:

3F FF 3F FF FF FF FF FF

Also the 600MHz is not a standard cal point for plain 545B without special options.

[Ash]

Sorry, I'm a bit late to this party.

I've got an EIP 575 which I'm planning to implement the power meter on, I've all the parts, just no time.. sigh.. 

I thought for future reference I'd add a link to the python script I wrote to use the TEST 10 process over GPIB to read out EPROMs. I was verifying my images matches the "Rev D" set available online. This can be adapted to read out what ever memory range you want.

https://github.com/AshleyRoll/GBIPLogger/blob/master/eip575_memory_reader.py

Note that I'm using a Prologix Etherent GPIB device, but you can modify the code or add drivers as needed to my hacked up code DM me if you need help.

Hope it helps someone.
Ash.

[Guile]

Hi Guile,

DAC Table is clearly incomplete, looks as a aborted TEST 90 calibration process, missing the DEF-2 bytes before 'Table End'.

If you have the required generator do a complete recalibration via TEST 90 as described on 575B manual, at 20 GHz point there is an error, with generator @ 20GHz the frequency inserted is 18 GHz, that is wrong, must be the same frequency of the generator.

If you are unable to do the complete calibration, try to modify EEPROM locations from 0x0C10 as:

3F FF 3F FF FF FF FF FF

Also the 600MHz is not a standard cal point for plain 545B without special options.

Thanks a lot HighPrecision, your tricks worked!! Error 40 is gone and I can hear the tick tick tick of the Band 3 assembly again!! Unfortunately the only source I have goes up to 8Ghz (which is ironic as I've retuned its YTO thanks to my EIP...).
I don't know what has gone wrong as the protection switch was in the protected position (it tooks me a while to understand why I had Error 20 when trying to access to Test 10). Thus I'm affraid that something went wrong and that the whole EEPROM, or a big chunk of it has been erased... I'll try to recalibrate it up to 8Ghz and I'll see if I can rent a 20Ghz source later.
Also I've never tried to run Test 90, but now I know how to proceed.

Thanks again 

[Guile]

Sorry, I'm a bit late to this party.

I've got an EIP 575 which I'm planning to implement the power meter on, I've all the parts, just no time.. sigh.. 

I thought for future reference I'd add a link to the python script I wrote to use the TEST 10 process over GPIB to read out EPROMs. I was verifying my images matches the "Rev D" set available online. This can be adapted to read out what ever memory range you want.

https://github.com/AshleyRoll/GBIPLogger/blob/master/eip575_memory_reader.py

Note that I'm using a Prologix Etherent GPIB device, but you can modify the code or add drivers as needed to my hacked up code DM me if you need help.

Hope it helps someone.
Ash.

Thanks for proposing your help Ash, but I've also developed similar script to dump my EEPROM. However if you can share with me your EEPROM content (from 0x0800 to 0x0FFF) I'll be very grateful!!
Now I need to recalibrate my counter again but I'm still interested with activating the Power Meter. Let's try together if you agree

Cheers

[Ash]

Sorry, I'm a bit late to this party.

I've got an EIP 575 which I'm planning to implement the power meter on, I've all the parts, just no time.. sigh.. 

...

Thanks for proposing your help Ash, but I've also developed similar script to dump my EEPROM. However if you can share with me your EEPROM content (from 0x0800 to 0x0FFF) I'll be very grateful!!
Now I need to recalibrate my counter again but I'm still interested with activating the Power Meter. Let's try together if you agree

Hi Guile,

I figured you had already done something similar, but I thought I would leave the code here for others in the future

I'll dump our the calibration data for you over the weekend. Hopefully it matches the memory range you expect. Mine is a 575, not a 545B however...

If you haven't seen it, here is another person adding the Option 2 power meter..

http://www.simonsdialogs.com/2014/09/eip-545a-microwave-counter-power-meter-upgrade/

I was planning on documenting and sharing my progress on the upgrade, so more than happy to work this out together

Cheers,
Ash.

[Guile]

Sorry, I'm a bit late to this party.

I've got an EIP 575 which I'm planning to implement the power meter on, I've all the parts, just no time.. sigh.. 

...

Thanks for proposing your help Ash, but I've also developed similar script to dump my EEPROM. However if you can share with me your EEPROM content (from 0x0800 to 0x0FFF) I'll be very grateful!!
Now I need to recalibrate my counter again but I'm still interested with activating the Power Meter. Let's try together if you agree

Hi Guile,

I figured you had already done something similar, but I thought I would leave the code here for others in the future

I'll dump our the calibration data for you over the weekend. Hopefully it matches the memory range you expect. Mine is a 575, not a 545B however...

If you haven't seen it, here is another person adding the Option 2 power meter..

http://www.simonsdialogs.com/2014/09/eip-545a-microwave-counter-power-meter-upgrade/

I was planning on documenting and sharing my progress on the upgrade, so more than happy to work this out together

Cheers,
Ash.

Hi Ash,

Sharing your code is a good idea for sure!
I'll be very happy if you can provide me this dump. Indeed I'm planning to repopulate my EEPROM with calibration from other meter and recalibrate it up to 8Ghz for now with the equipment that I have.
Regarding to the power meter, yes Simon is a really nice guy. First I've bought some programmed EEPROM from him but when I had my Error 40 failure and that I had to open my meter I've realized that our CPU board were totally different (shame on me). Thus I've a complete set of programed EEPROM for 548A if someone is interested with (just MP).
This meter is really confusing as both the SM of 545A and 575B manual are describing the same A105 CPU Board that I have (2020215) which is totally different from the one described by Simon and from the picture found in the EEPROM zip file available online.
Thus, regarding to 545B I need to find a way to activate the power meter (removing the Error 13). I'm wondering if computing the correct checksum like indicated by 545A SM would suffice to activate it?

Cheers

Guile

[HighPrecision]

Thus, regarding to 545B I need to find a way to activate the power meter (removing the Error 13). I'm wondering if computing the correct checksum like indicated by 545A SM would suffice to activate it?

Hi Guile,

For 'B' models, and more confusing for last CCN number of other non-B models, equipped with new A105 CPU card (2MHz clock) it's NOT necessary to calculate the checksum and nor to  write related location.

For Opt 02 activation you already know the modifications to A107 board to add missing DAC chip and remove/install components as explained by douardda, yes also the R40 has to be removed.

Give me your data in EEPROM locations from 0x0800 to 0x080F and I'll try to suggest the possible modifications for option activation

[Guile]

Thus, regarding to 545B I need to find a way to activate the power meter (removing the Error 13). I'm wondering if computing the correct checksum like indicated by 545A SM would suffice to activate it?

Hi Guile,

For 'B' models, and more confusing for last CCN number of other non-B models, equipped with new A105 CPU card (2MHz clock) it's NOT necessary to calculate the checksum and nor to  write related location.

For Opt 02 activation you already know the modifications to A107 board to add missing DAC chip and remove/install components as explained by douardda, yes also the R40 has to be removed.

Give me your data in EEPROM locations from 0x0800 to 0x080F and I'll try to suggest the possible modifications for option activation

HI HighPrecision,

Thanks a lot  I think we can consider my EEPROM as blank (as it is filled with 0xFF almost everywhere). I'll MP you my dump tonight when I'll be back home

By the way I've read again this entire thread (and my apologies to Douardda as I didn't want to flood his post with my problems) and it appears that I also have FW Special W98 (or something like that).

Thus recently I started to have the frequency offset (-160kHz) and resolution low activated at startup which I didn't have before. Thus if I understand correctly this information resides also in the EEPROM, am I right? As this problem appeared before Error 40 happened, I'm wondering if this was not an annunciation of a problem with the EEPROM?

Thus if someone with the same CPU board and same FW (and same EP1 545B) could also send me his dump, maybe I'll be able to compare and select the best data to compensate the lost I had in my meter  .

Finally, going back to my EEPROM dump, you mentioned that 600Mhz calibration was for special options. It looks like this option is related to the FW I have, right? Thus maybe 6.5Ghz is also part of this special calibration?

Thank you!

Guile

[Ash]

Thanks for proposing your help Ash, but I've also developed similar script to dump my EEPROM. However if you can share with me your EEPROM content (from 0x0800 to 0x0FFF) I'll be very grateful!!
Now I need to recalibrate my counter again but I'm still interested with activating the Power Meter. Let's try together if you agree

Cheers

So, on my unit the entire range between 0x0800 and 0x0FFF is "blank" (0xFF). It doesn't appear to have any non-volatile ram, at least in that range. I guess my entire memory map is different that I have found in the available service manuals..

My EIP 575 has A105 (CPU) board part number 2020195 (-01 hand written) if that helps at all.. probably not..

Maybe HighPrecision can shed some light on the older '575 units?

The model and serial numbers read:

Mod: 575 CCN 1802
SER: 00671


Ash.

[HighPrecision]

So, on my unit the entire range between 0x0800 and 0x0FFF is "blank" (0xFF). It doesn't appear to have any non-volatile ram, at least in that range. I guess my entire memory map is different that I have found in the available service manuals..

My EIP 575 has A105 (CPU) board part number 2020195 (-01 hand written) if that helps at all.. probably not..

Maybe HighPrecision can shed some light on the older '575 units?

The model and serial numbers read:

Mod: 575 CCN 1802

Hi Ash,

Between A105 old type (2020195-xx) and new type (2020215-xx) cards the memory and peripherals map is completely different, only the new 2020215 has one (EE)PROM (e2prom) allocated from 0x0800 to 0x0FFF (X2816A 2Kbytes type).

Old cards don't have any non-volatile configuration/calibration storage, only UV Erasable (E)PROM, 2516 or 2532 ancient types, the new card use three 27C128 UV (E)PROM with all option firmwares fitted.

On old card the options are added by additional UV (E)PROMs in related empty sockets as firmware extensions, for Opt.02 (Power Meter) is installed on A107 and contain either calibration table AND the PM firmware, it's important that the firmware is the SAME revision letter as the base firmware on A105 old type. For this reason Simon sells the entire set of (E)PROM (base + PM extension with cal data), obviously that CAL data isn't optimized for all counters, but only for the original calibrated unit.

Your EIP counter is a very early CCN#, this model (18GHz) was started with CCN:1800 in production and got new A105 card at CCN:1808, from CCN:1809 are all 575B models.

[Guile]

Thanks for proposing your help Ash, but I've also developed similar script to dump my EEPROM. However if you can share with me your EEPROM content (from 0x0800 to 0x0FFF) I'll be very grateful!!
Now I need to recalibrate my counter again but I'm still interested with activating the Power Meter. Let's try together if you agree

Cheers

So, on my unit the entire range between 0x0800 and 0x0FFF is "blank" (0xFF). It doesn't appear to have any non-volatile ram, at least in that range. I guess my entire memory map is different that I have found in the available service manuals..

My EIP 575 has A105 (CPU) board part number 2020195 (-01 hand written) if that helps at all.. probably not..

Maybe HighPrecision can shed some light on the older '575 units?

The model and serial numbers read:

Mod: 575 CCN 1802
SER: 00671


Ash.

Hi Ash,

Thanks to my blank EEPROM your results are really close to mine now  Thanks a lot for having tried!
Thus if I understood correctly what HighPrecision said, it looks like that what you have to do is to buy some EEPROM, DAC, and diode and program them with the available files online. 

By the way I know now that my model is 545B CCN 2213 and I have option WB68 installed.

Good luck for your modification !

[Ash]

My EIP 575 has A105 (CPU) board part number 2020195 (-01 hand written) if that helps at all.. probably not..

Maybe HighPrecision can shed some light on the older '575 units?

Hi Ash,

Between A105 old type (2020195-xx) and new type (2020215-xx) cards the memory and peripherals map is completely different, only the new 2020215 has one (EE)PROM (e2prom) allocated from 0x0800 to 0x0FFF (X2816A 2Kbytes type).

Old cards don't have any non-volatile configuration/calibration storage, only UV Erasable (E)PROM, 2516 or 2532 ancient types, the new card use three 27C128 UV (E)PROM with all option firmwares fitted.

On old card the options are added by additional UV (E)PROMs in related empty sockets as firmware extensions, for Opt.02 (Power Meter) is installed on A107 and contain either calibration table AND the PM firmware, it's important that the firmware is the SAME revision letter as the base firmware on A105 old type. For this reason Simon sells the entire set of (E)PROM (base + PM extension with cal data), obviously that CAL data isn't optimized for all counters, but only for the original calibrated unit.

Your EIP counter is a very early CCN#, this model (18GHz) was started with CCN:1800 in production and got new A105 card at CCN:1808, from CCN:1809 are all 575B models.

HighPrecision, wow, thanks heaps for the details!

I have the full set of "rev D" EPROM images, including the Option 2 EPROM that goes onto the A107 board. I actually verified that my A105 EPROMs all match this set byte-for-byte. So I'm pretty confident I can make the hardware changes and get the power meter option up and running.

I've also got a handle on the calibration process, but that will have to wait until I have some free time and can get to a friend's place to use his power meter and signal generators.. and lug along a PC and EPROM programmer

Do you know of any service documentation that better matches my model?

Thanks to my blank EEPROM your results are really close to mine now  Thanks a lot for having tried!
Thus if I understood correctly what HighPrecision said, it looks like that what you have to do is to buy some EEPROM, DAC, and diode and program them with the available files online. 

By the way I know now that my model is 545B CCN 2213 and I have option WB68 installed.

Good luck for your modification !

Thanks Guile, Hope you managed to find a way to fix yours as well!

Cheers,
Ash.

[Guile]

Thanks Guile, Hope you managed to find a way to fix yours as well!

Cheers,
Ash.

Hi Ash,

Thanks! Indeed, thanks to HighPrecision everything in my counter is back to normal and the Power meter is activated!! :

On the attached picture, I've set my Source output to -23dBm (the minimum it can do) through a 5dB attenuator, and I've read around -28dB with my Power meter, hence the calibration is a bit off but I'll try to fix that in the future.

@HighPrecision: I owe you a beer!! If you're coming in Nice one day let me know I'll fulfill my promise then

Cheers

[HighPrecision]

Do you know of any service documentation that better matches my model?

Hi Ash,
best available match is the 545A manual for CCN:2205, all cards, except A103 and A104, are pratically the same part number suffix (revision), I've uploaded here:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/hmu2vq9ew4fcaun/545A-548A_Manual_5580021-04_Apr83%20%28CCNs%202205%20and%202305%29_2nd%20Ed.pdf?dl=0

For A103 and A104 cards please refer to the available 57xB manual.

[HighPrecision]

@HighPrecision: I owe you a beer!! If you're coming in Nice one day let me know I'll fulfill my promise then

Cheers

Hi Guile,
Good! I'm glad to know that it has completely solved the problems.

[Ash]

Do you know of any service documentation that better matches my model?

Hi Ash,
best available match is the 545A manual for CCN:2205, all cards, except A103 and A104, are pratically the same part number suffix (revision), I've uploaded here:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/hmu2vq9ew4fcaun/545A-548A_Manual_5580021-04_Apr83%20%28CCNs%202205%20and%202305%29_2nd%20Ed.pdf?dl=0

For A103 and A104 cards please refer to the available 57xB manual.

Awesome, thanks @HighPrecision! That helps a lot.

Now I've just got to find the time to do some playing around with it.. 

Ash.

[Guile]

Hi guys,

I'm looking now on how to calibrate the power meter with the limited equipment that I have and then I've tried to read out the calibration data from files available online and also from 548B counter to see how I could interpolate the results over the entire range of the counter.

Thus I've attached the comparison results between 3 devices.
It looks like that a 2nd or 3rd order polynomial calculation could work well for the power level calibration at 2Ghz. However, the Frequency spread looks like more difficult to interpolate. At least I'll try once I'll have time and let you know how it goes.

By the way, at 2Ghz, with the data coming from the 548B counter I have 3dB of offset ; and as indicated by the Frequency chart spread, this offset varies over frequencies...

Cheers

[Guile]

Hi Guys,

I'm providing some update regarding to the power meter calibration.
I've decided to use my signal generator with a 20dB attenuator to calibrate the first 150 power values at 2Ghz. Indeed, my power meter is reliable down to -20dBm and it looks like that I need to go down to -40dBm in order to calibrate nicely at 2Ghz. Hence, as my signal generator is able to deliver from +10 to -20dBm I'll use the 20dB attenuator for the lower part with my power meter to confirm that I'm running at the right level before attenuation.
However I'm not able to go above 8Ghz and after 3.8Ghz my power source is no more leveling the signal. Then I can set something around -15dBm with various attenuators, but I'll not be able to calibrate above 8Ghz. That's the reason why I tried first to find a polynomial model to interpolate the calibration values up to 20Ghz, but without a success.
Then I've moved to machine learning with Gradient boosting algorithm and it looks like to give reasonable estimation (I've attached the estimation with different parameters in yellow; the red curve is the prediction based on one EIP545A meter eeprom dump while the blue one is the prediction based on one EIP575A meter eeprom dump. The yellow curve is the prediction combining both). Hence once ready I'll explain more the theory I'll use. But I need first to fix my EIP again as I'm no more able to read a thing from GPIB while writting works partially. Maybe a bus driver is faulty on the A101 board ( )

Cheers

[HighPrecision]

But I need first to fix my EIP again as I'm no more able to read a thing from GPIB while writting works partially. Maybe a bus driver is faulty on the A101 board ( )

Hi Guile,

if the interface don't respond at normal commands probably is a HW fault, BUT if you are not aware of these (E)EPROMs that have a limited number of WRITE cycles, apparently the Xicor type X2816A listed on 575B manual have approximately 500K/cycles estimated from new.

[Guile]

Hi HighPrecision,

Thanks for your helps!
Right, the interface hardly respond to command and does not send back data when asked. That's weird as it was working great previously. I don't know how many times the EEPROM has been written but for my case I've written the 531 values only once, thus I don't think the EEPROM as suffered from this task (even if I still don't understand why it has wiped some of the YIG calibration data out).
I'll have a look at the A101 board as soon I have time.
Regarding to the calibration interpolation I'm planing to use, I'm more and more considering to calibrate the power level of the counter up to 3.8Ghz and use the interpolation up to 20Ghz. Then, I'll test the other frequencies up to 8Ghz (which is the maximum I can reach with my equipment) to have an idea of my interpolation function error... I'll be able to say if this idea is good or not

Cheers

[Dave Cawley]

I think this is a relevant thread ?

I have an EIP 548A option 02, 06, counter that I have not used for about 15 years.

Today it would not do anything apart from some digits on the LED's.  Turned out the 12V line was a dead short on the +12V line on A107.  Fixed that (shorted tantalum by the edge connector) and it works at least up to 2.7Ghz (as far as I can generate right now).

However it is stuck on Band 3 and apart from the the offset button that sort of brings up the power meter, none of the other buttons seem to work, including test functions.  I would really like the power meter on/of  and the band buttons to work !  I seem to remember the band switching was always difficult.

I'm an analogue only engineer but have determined that the keypad is working with row and select going into the relevant chip, but then I'm stuck, any help greatly appreciated.

Thanks

Dave

[wn1fju]

While it does sound more like a digital problem, you never know.  On my similar EIP 578 counter, there were 15 shorted tantalums!!!  Most of them
were the 10 uF jobs.  Carefully check ALL the power rails and check for any tantalums that are used for other purposes than filtering the voltages coming
on to the board from the power supply.  It shouldn't take much time and you might get lucky.

[Dave Cawley]

All the power supply voltages are good.  I'll try all the other tants tomorrow, but see below :

I need to know what comes out where and especially what does the MC68B21 do and what should I see on its outputs ?

Thanks
Dave G4IUG

[HighPrecision]

Hi,
the manual explains logic of keyboard scan, see A110 and A111 boards section, see also the troubleshooting chapter for keyboard problems.

If the 'Offset' button (Power-Meter Offset ?) is the only responsive button seems that the 'Keyboard Interrupt' circuit is locked by a low level from a single or more 'columns' lines... apparently your 'Offset' switch seems to be stuck closed or is leaking.