Everyday bench scope, a 3 way race, EDUX1002A, GDS-1054B, SDS1202X-E

[alpher]

Well, seeing so many threads on the subject I've thought why not! 
I'm going to have to return Rigol 1054Z that I've had on loan  for last couple of years, no love lost here.
One thing I can say about the experience is that I just hate shared channel controls. I really do, most will say that you can get used to it,  I somehow  can't.
Already have a good analog scope (2465A ) and a decent high bandwidth DSO (54845A ), but firing up 1.5ghz hovercraft behemoth every time i want to see something simple on the screen ?
Tek being analog has it's issues also, that's where the trusty Rigol came to the rescue.
Now since I have to return the 1054z I'm looking for a replacement.
Requirements are in order of importance:

Separate controls for each channel (it's a must)
Responsive interface (nothing like sluggish 1054z)
Being hackable (since I will need serial decoding etc.)
4 channels would be nice but not absolutely necessary as long as serial decoding can use EXT trigger as a 3rd channel.
Decent display and nice fonts as my eyesight is not as it used to be.

Honestly I'm leaning towards the Keysight scope, as it will be more fun to hack (it requires quite a bit of hardware changes ) and when fully hacked will have arguably the best specs of the 3 (2Gsa, 250MHz).
But I'm open to any suggestions, especially from people that have 2 of them or more and can compare the experience.

Aha, the budget, they all within $500 ~$550 canadian rupies right now, Keysight being the cheapest at $503.

Thanks guys.

[Mortymore]

I believe that deep inside you already made a choice.

Go on and take the most fun out of it. After all you already are scope served.

[nctnico]

IMHO the EDUX1002A had too little memory (even with a hack). Remember that for an actual usage scenario the memory depth on a Keysight scope is 1/4 of what it says on the badge (and even less if you have digital channels).

[alpher]

IMHO the EDUX1002A had too little memory (even with a hack). Remember that for an actual usage scenario the memory depth on a Keysight scope is 1/4 of what it says on the badge (and even less if you have digital channels).

You have a valid point here, haven't thought about that. Could you elaborate a bit here?
Keysight 1Mpt, versus GWI 10Mpt, Siglent 7Mpt, in real word usage scenario will I see a big difference?

[nctnico]

The keyight has 250kpts (not 1Mpts) and yes this will make a big difference. With deep memory you can capture one trace at a slow time/div setting and scroll/zoom in on the details. You don't really have to care about the exact trigger condition. With shallow memory you'll loose details quickly which leads to needing multiple acquisitions and tedious trigger settings. You'll be wasting your time. Keysight makes great oscilloscopes (and other test equipment) but there just isn't enough memory in their oscilloscopes to be worth buying given the alternatives.

[alpher]

When talking about EDUX1002A I'm mentally jumping to the hacked specs so it should be 1Mpts.
But that aside if not Keysight then what?
Which of the 2 remaining? GW-Instek or Siglent?

[nctnico]

I'd get 4 channels if the budget allows it. IMHO 4 channels is a minimum requirement when you are designing circuits. Besides that: with 2 channels you can't do SPI decoding.

[alpher]

Do you really need 4 channels for spi ?
What about this then "
DSOX1EMBD Decodes and analysis for I2C, SPI, UART(RS-232) protocols Compatible with DSOX1102A or DSOX1102G"

Also Siglent lists spi available, while being 2 channel too?

[nctnico]

For SPI you need at least clock, data and enable.  But then you can only look at one side of the SPI bus and not on data-in and data-out. The Keysight uses the trigger input as a third channel so technically it can do SPI decoding. I don't know how the SDS102X-E handles SPI decoding. Maybe only clock and data but the absense of the select signal could make things difficult in situations where you have more then one SPI device connected to the same SPI bus.

[tautech]

For SPI you need at least clock, data and enable.  But then you can only look at one side of the SPI bus and not on data-in and data-out. The Keysight uses the trigger input as a third channel so technically it can do SPI decoding. I don't know how the SDS102X-E handles SPI decoding. Maybe only clock and data but the absense of the select signal could make things difficult in situations where you have more then one SPI device connected to the same SPI bus.

Exactly this ^

Other SDS1202X-E info
Quiet fan
All Decodes are free I2C, SPI, UART, CAN and LIN
Non hackable.....as in there's nothing that be hacked.

My current most popular seller.

[alpher]

How does the SDS1202X-E interface feels like? compared to the other 2 ?
I mean responsiveness and the display'font quality/size?
Also the cheapest I could find it in Canada was over $550, quite a bit more than both Keysight and GWI, (both around $500 ) .
Do you know a decent NA dealer that will sell for less than that?

[tautech]

How does the SDS1202X-E interface feels like? compared to the other 2 ?
I mean responsiveness and the display'font quality/size?
Also the cheapest I could find it in Canada was over $550, quite a bit more than both Keysight and GWI, (both around $500 ) .
Do you know a decent NA dealer that will sell for less than that?

These three 2ch models should offer similar responsiveness as they've all been around at least a couple of years.

I've not used the KS or GWI but I have no issues with how the SDS1202X-E behaves. Font's readability is related to colors used and the background they are on. Menus are on gray and channel display fonts (yellow or magneta) are on a black background.

Suppliers, well I guess you have some US/Canada border taxes so maybe Saelig pricing is not so hot however they do offer members here a discount. US list price is $ 379

Otherwise these are the authorized Canadian sellers for Siglent:
RCC Electronics
 905-669-6644
 www.rcce.com
 sales@rcce.com

Techno-Test
 450-681-5777
 www.Techno-Test.com
 info@techno-test.com

Test-Pal
 800-456-0961
 www.test-pal.com
 info@test-pal.com
 

[2N3055]

When talking about EDUX1002A I'm mentally jumping to the hacked specs so it should be 1Mpts.
But that aside if not Keysight then what?
Which of the 2 remaining? GW-Instek or Siglent?

Hacked specs mean 250kS per channel. 1MS divided by 4.
It is a big disadvantage for decoding.
If you plan to use decoding, Get a 4ch scope with long memory.
Also, if you do things where you need to take longer capture and then look at details you need long memory.

[nctnico]

Perhaps it is best to get both and return the one you like the least. When it comes to the UI preference is very personal.

One advantage of the GDS-1054B may be that it has vertical and horizontal menu buttons along the screen. This means that the menu structure is very flat and easy to use. I used to own an Agilent scope which only had one row of buttons at the bottom of the screen and navigating through the menu was a real nuisance compared to the GDS-2204E (the GDS1054B's big brother) I have.

[alpher]

When talking about EDUX1002A I'm mentally jumping to the hacked specs so it should be 1Mpts.
But that aside if not Keysight then what?
Which of the 2 remaining? GW-Instek or Siglent?

Hacked specs mean 250kS per channel. 1MS divided by 4.
It is a big disadvantage for decoding.
If you plan to use decoding, Get a 4ch scope with long memory.
Also, if you do things where you need to take longer capture and then look at details you need long memory.

Are you sure about that? I mean the specs sheet says 1Mpt for dsox series?
If what you're sayin is true then there is no contest , GDS is the winner?

[tautech]

IMHO the EDUX1002A had too little memory (even with a hack). Remember that for an actual usage scenario the memory depth on a Keysight scope is 1/4 of what it says on the badge (and even less if you have digital channels).

You have a valid point here, haven't thought about that. Could you elaborate a bit here?
Keysight 1Mpt, versus GWI 10Mpt, Siglent 7Mpt, in real word usage scenario will I see a big difference?

Oh and to point out 7M/ch.

[alpher]

Perhaps it is best to get both and return the one you like the least. When it comes to the UI preference is very personal.

One advantage of the GDS-1054B may be that it has vertical and horizontal menu buttons along the screen. This means that the menu structure is very flat and easy to use. I used to own an Agilent scope which only had one row of buttons at the bottom of the screen and navigating through the menu was a real nuisance compared to the GDS-2204E (the GDS1054B's big brother) I have.

I'll be buying it from Newark and honestly don't know about their return policy?
Never returned anything before , will I have to pay return shipping cost?

[nctnico]

I suppose you have to pay for return shipping but I'm not familiar with the Canadian laws regarding returns. But you better ask if they have a loan/test unit available. I doubt it for a relatively low cost piece of test equipment but you never know.

[nctnico]

Slow zoom/deep memory must be a problem specific for the Owon. The GW Instek will have no problem using long memory together with scrolling and zooming. I'm quite sure the same will apply to the Siglent.

[alpher]

Keysight 1Mpt, versus GWI 10Mpt, Siglent 7Mpt, in real word usage scenario will I see a big difference?

I run a 500kpts Keysight for years yet to see a need for more.
I had an Owon with 10Mpts, but at 10Mpts it takes too long to render so the screen update is not satisfiable for seeing glitches. I always had to dumb it down to 100kpts.

If you can set triggers properly, you should always never need to zoom out of your view.
And if you use Nth trigger, hold-off and segmented memory properly, you should always never need to zoom in either.

Wohoo , and to think that I was almost convinced to go with GWI?
Funny thing is that when I started this thread I was almost sure that I wanted a Keysight scope, yet deep down was expecting to be swayed to GWI first and finally to Siglent?
If I have to pay return shipping, buying all or even 2 of them is not an option.
I really don't want to spend more than necessary.

[Bud]

EDUX 1002A ticks many boxes in the wish list. You can't beat its hackability.

[nctnico]

But not 4 channels.

[tautech]

But not 4 channels.

Yep.
Channels, BW or memory. Pick any two.

[Mortymore]

Funny thing is that when I started this thread I was almost sure that I wanted a Keysight scope...

I had a feeling 

Well... If decoding you want, 4 channels you must.
So if... Keysight and Siglent... you know were that leads you.

Not speaking for the Keysight, I only would go to Siglent if it was the 4 channel version, but the vertical setup is like the Rigol you didn't like. I have a 2074E (GWI alike), not exactly the 1054B you are looking for, but I think you wouldn't be wrong with it.

[alpher]

Funny thing is that when I started this thread I was almost sure that I wanted a Keysight scope...

I had a feeling 

Well... If decoding you want, 4 channels you must.
So if... Keysight and Siglent... you know were that leads you.

Not speaking for the Keysight, I only would go to Siglent if it was the 4 channel version, but the vertical setup is like the Rigol you didn't like. I have a 2074E (GWI alike), not exactly the 1054B you are looking for, but I think you wouldn't be wrong with it.

 , You made my day here, but true it is?
Do you really must have 4 channels for serial work?
Wonder I?