FeelTech FY6600 60MHz 2-Ch VCO Function Arbitrary Waveform Signal Generator

[Ebel0410]

The puzzle is almost complete, thanks to all the contributors

1   CH340G             /USB to serial
2   HC245               /octal bus transceiver
3   25Q16BVSIG      /Winbond 16MBit Serial Flash with Dual SPI
4   EP4CE6E22C8N  /FGPA Altera Cyclone4
5   DAC904             /14 bits DAC 165Msps =Channel 2
6   DAC904             /14 bits DAC 165Msps =Channel 1
7   MCP4822E         /Dual 12-Bit Voltage Output DAC (level Ch2)
8   MCP4822E         /Dual 12-Bit Voltage Output DAC (level Ch1)
9   OPA686N           /wideband low noise voltage amplifier
10 OPA686N           /wideband low noise voltage amplifier
11 JRC4558D          /Dual op amp
12 ?                       /wideband amplifier
13 ?                       /wideband amplifier

[Ebel0410]

Hi all
Did someone tried to play around with arbitrary waves with the FY6600 PC Software?
I'm facing issues when I try to open waveforms that were previously saved (file xxxx.FY).
After having opened the file, the waveform is always not corresponding to the saved one, the scale and the plots are totaly messy 

Hereafter, a printscreen of a ramp waveform saved and then reloaded !

Update : the method described above wasn't the right one (thanks to cybermaus), you'd better use "text window" and "add waveform" to perform the handling of custom waveform.

[Chris56000]

Hi!

At the price they are it'd be within my monthly pocket-money allowance to buy one simply for the purpose of tearing-down and depopulating for the purposes of compiling a full proper instruction & service manual, and the posts in this thread so far, so if the superb clever chaps on here can pinpoint the last two chips U12 & U13 that'll be the inspiration I need to buy one for reverse-engineering purposes!

Is it worth looking in the EL-series to see if there's a pin-out match for the last two chips? Is there a way of removing the small square ali heat-sink from the O/P amplifier chips without risking wrecking the PCB it's made on?

PS!

1) Can anyone tell me how to extract pictures from PDFs and the little icons on toolbar buttons, etc., like they do to write software/product instruction manuals?

2) Has anyone dismantled the front-panel/display assembly of one of these and got the type-no and pixel-size spec. of the TFT colour display module yet?

Chris Williams

[cybermaus]

Hi all
Did someone tried to play around with arbitrary waves with the FY6600 PC Software?
I'm facing issues when I try to open waveforms that were previously saved (file xxxx.FY).
After having opened the file, the waveform is always not corresponding to the saved one, the scale and the plots are totaly messy 

Hereafter, a printscreen of a ramp waveform saved and then reloaded !

Just works for me:
Opened tool. Made a waveform (combined sine, triangle and ramp), saved it.

Closed program, reopened program, loaded the waveform, no problem (attachment 1)

The only slightly odd thing is, if you "Open" a waveform, you get a dialog that has title&button "Save"
But it is actually loading the file, not saving it. (attachment 2)

[cybermaus]

1) Can anyone tell me how to extract pictures from PDFs and the little icons on toolbar buttons, etc., like they do to write software/product instruction manuals?

If you have Acrobat, full version, there is usually a menu item to save all images as jpg. I am not familiar with any 3rd party Acrobat tools. Otherwise, you can just view at 100% and take a screen capture - tedious if there are many images...

Or if your budget is lower, GhostScript is the de-factor free-and-open-version. Very technical, but there are some interfaces like muPDF around it.
And many of the other commercial but cheap PDF tools are usually based on Ghostscript, but dumbed down for easy use.

I have not been active with that for a while, so not up to speed which of the cheap ghostscript wrap-arounds is currently best. Last time I used it was Foxit, actually not based on Ghostscript (or hidden very well). But that was years ago.

[xzswq21]

Hi!
1) Can anyone tell me how to extract pictures from PDFs and the little icons on toolbar buttons, etc., like they do to write software/product instruction manuals?

Chris Williams

Dear
I have prepared a simple video for you: (all the tools is free!)
http://s9.picofile.com/file/8311018192/Untitled_2017_11_05_21_01_24.mp4.html

if you want to extract the icons from any software, you can use Resource hack or any similar software.

Regards

[xzswq21]

I want to buy a FY6600 Function generator.
in contrast to the Feeltech's AD, the DAC IC is 160MSPS.
now I'm hesitating whether to choose 30MHz or 60MHz versions. Are you satisfied with your 60MHz version? or 30MHz is better?

Best Regards

[cybermaus]

Inspired by ArthurDents clock remark, I ordered a uBlox NEO-M8N module (arduino ready) for $10.
At the very least I should be able to turn that into a stand-alone 10MHz GPS reference singal, but maybe also add a x5 PLL and make this AWG run of it.
I took the M8N version, because it has flash, so you can configure it once and then hook it in.

If that works, one would have a better then 1ppm (uBlox claims 5ppb) generator as well as frequency counter.
Then all those digits they display (60.000.000.000.000 uHz) actually make sense 

I am thinking a NB3N502 PLL, because it can do x5 on a 10MHz signal, as well as passes through the original 10MHz buffered. And it is cheap. But if anyone has other suggestions.

Edit: later thinking is a double NB3N502. Because uBlox writes that only 1, 2, 4, 8 MHZ (any division of the internal 48MHz clock) is jitter free, whereas a 10MHz has significant jitter. So 2.5x VCO PLL on 4MHz would clean up an already good base signal. An 2nd x5 would then buffer out the 10MHz as well as provide the 50MHz.

Also, uBlox claims a 5ppm "holdover" precision when the GPS is not locked, so that is pretty much equal to the current 50.0000 VCXO
Probably because they internally use a 48.0000 VCXO themselves.

[Marco]

now I'm hesitating whether to choose 30MHz or 60MHz versions. Are you satisfied with your 60MHz version? or 30MHz is better?

Just for reference, there's an Ebay seller which ships from Frankfurt ... and he only sells the 60 MHz version. Don't know if that matters to you, but because it's above the custom limit for my country that clinched it for me. I don't want it for MHz signal generation, so that didn't matter to me.

[cybermaus]

Just for reference, there's an Ebay seller which ships from Frankfurt ... and he only sells the 60 MHz version. Don't know if that matters to you, but because it's above the custom limit for my country that clinched it for me. I don't want it for MHz signal generation, so that didn't matter to me.

Yeah, nowadays I just assume and budget for €20 handling + VAT extra when I buy stuff like that. Most off the bigger items are snatched by customs nowadays. Gone are the free days of the 2005~2015 era. However to my surprise, the FY6600 was *not* taxed.

I am sure they did take it out of the queue and must have handled it, because the address label had been tampered with, a new local Dutch one placed on top and it took an unusual (but not impossible) 5 weeks to arrive. (usual is 2 to 4).

But the expected "please pay extra" letter from KPN was not there. I think they could not recognize it from the X-Ray. 

[xzswq21]

now I'm hesitating whether to choose 30MHz or 60MHz versions. Are you satisfied with your 60MHz version? or 30MHz is better?

Just for reference, there's an Ebay seller which ships from Frankfurt ... and he only sells the 60 MHz version. Don't know if that matters to you, but because it's above the custom limit for my country that clinched it for me. I don't want it for MHz signal generation, so that didn't matter to me.

there are some sellers in aliexpress. the ship cost is $43,  the total price is $150~$170.
some people here uploaded some pics, the quality based on these pics is good but I'm very concerned about it! 
you know Chinese manufacturers use very low quality components in their designs! (after 6 month all capacitors, inductors, silkscreen,... will be corrupted)
 
My Brother told me, it's better to buy a Rigol to tune your medical board. (only check AC response and step response, the desired frequency is 10KHz to 20MHz)
for Harmonic distortion and noise analysis I will use other instruments.
I'm a student and don't want to pay money a lot.

Thanks

[Marco]

I am sure they did take it out of the queue and must have handled it, because the address label had been tampered with, a new local Dutch one placed on top and it took an unusual (but not impossible) 5 weeks to arrive. (usual is 2 to 4).

The one from Frankfurt I ordered Saturday and I got I think Wednesday, so that's another thing to consider.

[Ebel0410]

I ordered mine (30MHz version) from Fasttech, they sell both 30 and 60MHz.
Paid 88$ (~75€), with no shipping fees or taxes added.

[xzswq21]

I ordered mine (30MHz version) from Fasttech, they sell both 30 and 60MHz.
Paid 88$ (~75€), with no shipping fees or taxes added.

I have never been seen this website! it seems OK the price and shipping cost in the website is lower than aliexpress and other similar.
where is the origin of this website?
Thanks

[Diabolo]

Hello,

For FY6600 generators the maximum frequency is valid for the sinusoidal signal, the other signals capping at 20-25 mhz.
The 2 integrated circuits under the aluminum radiator are 4558.
The crystal quartz reference for the Altera Cyclone FPGA is still 50 mhz in FY 6600 and FY2300H.
The output level of the signals is guaranteed stable only on 5 volts, or below.
Sellers always indicate the characteristics, you need to consult them.
Pay attention to customs fees that can be charged by the customs of each country.
By going through the NL post we escape customs taxes since NL is European, that's why the delivery labels are replaced.

Regards,
Diabolo

[xzswq21]

Hello,

For FY6600 generators the maximum frequency is valid for the sinusoidal signal, the other signals capping at 20-25 mhz.
The 2 integrated circuits under the aluminum radiator are 4558.
The crystal quartz reference for the Altera Cyclone FPGA is still 50 mhz in FY 6600 and FY2300H.

Dear are you sure the IC is 4558? 

device has a 1.7 V/?s slew rate
Unity-Gain Bandwidth: 3 MHz Typ
8 nV/?Hz Typ at 1 kHz

The device is a dual general-purpose operational amplifier, with each half electrically similar to the ?A741, except that offset null capability is not provided.
this amplifier ideal for voltage-follower applications. The device is short-circuit protected, and the internal frequency compensation ensures stability without external components.

[Ebel0410]

Hi xzswq21
Fasttech is located in Hong Kong.

Regards

[xzswq21]

it's interesting!
*updated
I hope to @Ebel0410 will post the quality of FY6600-30MHz soon


for your information:
I want to make a comparison between SDG1010 (Siglent 10MHz), SDG1032x (High quality Siglent 30MHz) and Fy6600!!! 

inside the SDG1010 (Siglent 10MHz):




inside the SDG1032x (High quality Siglent 30MHz):

this is the quality of SDG1032x:



inside FY6600:


one of drawback of FY6600 is the LPF is placed before OPAMP.
another thing the Low CMRR of Amp stage (due to design)

and I don't know about the capacitors type inside FY6600 (at page 4 there are some tech information)
the Layout is very important.
and some area should be ground free!

[Mr. Scram]

I ordered mine (30MHz version) from Fasttech, they sell both 30 and 60MHz.
Paid 88$ (~75€), with no shipping fees or taxes added.

Can you look at the jumpers mentioned before? It would be most interesting to see the difference with the 60 MHz version.

[Diabolo]

Hello,

For FY6600 generators the maximum frequency is valid for the sinusoidal signal, the other signals capping at 20-25 mhz.
The 2 integrated circuits under the aluminum radiator are 4558.
The crystal quartz reference for the Altera Cyclone FPGA is still 50 mhz in FY 6600 and FY2300H.

Dear are you sure the IC is 4558? 

device has a 1.7 V/?s slew rate
Unity-Gain Bandwidth: 3 MHz Typ
8 nV/?Hz Typ at 1 kHz

The device is a dual general-purpose operational amplifier, with each half electrically similar to the ?A741, except that offset null capability is not provided.
this amplifier ideal for voltage-follower applications. The device is short-circuit protected, and the internal frequency compensation ensures stability without external components.

Hello,
On FY2300H 25 mhz they are MC4558 under the aluminum radiator, I looked.

Regards.

[cybermaus]

I ordered mine (30MHz version) from Fasttech, they sell both 30 and 60MHz.
Paid 88$ (~75€), with no shipping fees or taxes added.

Can you look at the jumpers mentioned before? It would be most interesting to see the difference with the 60 MHz version.

I followed one of the traces, and its not a setting, but routing the VCO BNC connector to a different trace.
So that is why they are in pairs with one connected (scratchable) and one not connectedd.
Either the BNC plug is connected to one, or to another trace.

I believe something similar is true for the other pair, but something with USB/serial.

IOW, nothing to do with frequency models.
As stated, it would have been too easy if that was how it worked.

So if you want the 60MHz, just shell out an extra $20 

[beanflying]

Hi all,

so I wasn't going to join up but I kept reading posts and watching some great videos from some slightly mad nerd and here I am 

I have just taken delivery of a 30Mhz version Firmware 3.1 which as mentioned here already has an issue with a fairly unhealthy floating AC issue. To go with the ugly it is also very accurate in most other things.

It also has an issue with the DC offset having a consistently increasing error that appears to be firmware/maths related. 'Apparently' according to Feeltech this can be and has been fixed with more recent firmware upgrades but as that means shipping a newly delivered unit to mainland China and back it really isn't worth it.    

Trying to protect their software IP is I guess the major reason rather than enabling a simple programming header or upload system. If that is the reason then it is a poor one plenty of people out there love a challenge 

First problem as discussed in this thread getting the ac floating voltage down. I was just going to drop an IEC socket in but changed my mind as there is plenty of case room for maybe fitting something else into the box as my electronics space is limited due to other toys. So Switch/Fuse and Socket adapter installed instead.

A quick check around the board, jacks and other metal plugs sees the USB case and all the BNC's sharing a common
 AC floating neutral. So like others I am far from happy plugging it into or onto gear until this is reduced.

Few components to add but the coffee needs roasting (part of what I do)

[Mr. Scram]

Could you check the aforementioned jumpers?

[beanflying]

I am assuming you mean the jumper from the power supply to main board?

All the terminals (including internal ground) are currently sitting at 32Vac at 50hz. I will be able to spend some more time looking at the board later.

Edit

went back a page. Gather you were now referring to the board jumbers J6, J10-12. They are the same settings as previously mentioned on mine.

2nd edit.

This makes for some interesting reading on the power supply design. https://www.eevblog.com/forum/projects/rm6203-switching-psu-controller/

[cybermaus]

I am assuming you mean the jumper from the power supply to main board?

Actually, I find the question on what "leakage voltage" you measure on the supply lines and/or BNC ground also interesting.
And maybe also how much the leakage voltage drops when grounding with a 1M, 100K, 1K resistor to ground. (iow, how current much the leakage can actually source)

As to your "where does the yellow one go" picture title? Is that a question?

If so, I saw someone claim that the 3 holes on the power board, shown pretty just below much dead-centre on your "Feeltech-stock.jpg" image, are ground connections.

And this guy suggests maybe in stead of directly grounding it, using a Y cap. Maybe even a switch and a Y cap, so you can choose whether you want floating or fixed.