Author Topic: FNIRSI LCR-ST1 (Inexpensive LCR Tweezers)  (Read 6544 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Rooster CogburnTopic starter

  • Regular Contributor
  • *
  • Posts: 212
  • Country: de
FNIRSI LCR-ST1 (Inexpensive LCR Tweezers)
« on: August 09, 2024, 09:35:55 pm »
Looks like there isn't a thread about these yet. 30EUR-ish LCR tweezers. Some more info on AliExpress / fnirsi.co. Can't find a review. They seem really neat, but knowing FNIRSI there are likely some bugs and issues :D Anybody try these yet?

1.Product Model: LCR-ST1
2.Capacitance range: 1pF-22mF
3.Inductance range: 1μh-10H
4.Resistance range: 10mΩ-10MΩ
5.Diode: On voltage 0.7V
6.Frequency test: 100Hz, 1kHz, 10KHz
7.Level test: 0.3V, 0.6V RMS
8.Parameter display: ESR, D value, Q value, Z value, X value
9.Display: 1.14'' color screen
10.Charging Interface: Type-C, 5V/A
11.Power Supply: 250mAh lithium battery
12.Auto recognition measurement: Support
13.Replaceable tweezer head: Support
14.Auto shutdown: Support
15.Data hold: Support
16.History record: Connect to PC to view and export
17.Language: Chinese, English
18.Size: 28×19×150mm
19.Weight: 41g




 

Offline Martin72

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 7019
  • Country: de
  • Testfield Technician
Re: FNIRSI LCR-ST1 (Inexpensive LCR Tweezers)
« Reply #1 on: August 09, 2024, 10:09:56 pm »
The accuracy specifications correspond to the price....
I would rather save up for an ST42 from Shannon, then you would have won several times over.
For example, as far as support is concerned, you can completely forget that with "Fnirsi".
 
The following users thanked this post: KungFuJosh

Offline indman

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 1208
  • Country: by
Re: FNIRSI LCR-ST1 (Inexpensive LCR Tweezers)
« Reply #2 on: August 10, 2024, 07:40:47 am »
Looks like there isn't a thread about these yet. 30EUR-ish LCR tweezers. Some more info on AliExpress / fnirsi.co. Can't find a review. They seem really neat, but knowing FNIRSI there are likely some bugs and issues :D Anybody try these yet?
This product is almost similar to the same one from ZOYI ZT-MD1.
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/zoyi-zt-md1-new-lcr-tweezers/msg5589285/#msg5589285
It seems that Chinese friends will soon fill the market with devices that will compete with the famous MASTECH MS8911 ;)
 

Offline Rooster CogburnTopic starter

  • Regular Contributor
  • *
  • Posts: 212
  • Country: de
Re: FNIRSI LCR-ST1 (Inexpensive LCR Tweezers)
« Reply #3 on: August 10, 2024, 08:37:15 am »
I would rather save up for an ST42 from Shannon, then you would have won several times over.

I would've also paid several times over. That's a device in a completely different price class.

For example, as far as support is concerned, you can completely forget that with "Fnirsi".

I know, hence me asking if anybody has tried these. Never know with FNIRSI if the firmware actually works. The Miniware tweezers seemed interested but they also seem to have software problems.

This product is almost similar to the same one from ZOYI ZT-MD1.
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/zoyi-zt-md1-new-lcr-tweezers/msg5589285

Yeah, could be a re-brand. Can't find the ZOYI ZT-MD1 for sale on AE, no reviews anywhere either.

It seems that Chinese friends will soon fill the market with devices that will compete with the famous MASTECH MS8911 ;)

I can only find the MASTECH MS8910 for sale and that seems like a rather basic DMM, none of the LCR features.
 

Online tautech

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 29813
  • Country: nz
  • Taupaki Technologies Ltd. Siglent Distributor NZ.
    • Taupaki Technologies Ltd.
Re: FNIRSI LCR-ST1 (Inexpensive LCR Tweezers)
« Reply #4 on: August 10, 2024, 08:45:28 am »
I would rather save up for an ST42 from Shannon, then you would have won several times over.

I would've also paid several times over. That's a device in a completely different price class.
And completely different capability class.

After nearly 2 decades of using SMD LCR tweezers I can vouch ST42 are currently incomparable for their cost.
Avid Rabid Hobbyist.
Some stuff seen @ Siglent HQ cannot be shared.
 

Offline indman

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 1208
  • Country: by
Re: FNIRSI LCR-ST1 (Inexpensive LCR Tweezers)
« Reply #5 on: August 10, 2024, 08:51:11 am »
I can only find the MASTECH MS8910 for sale and that seems like a rather basic DMM, none of the LCR features.
MS8910 is a simple toy compared to MS8911!

After nearly 2 decades of using SMD LCR tweezers I can vouch ST42 are currently incomparable for their cost.
This is true, but sometimes very high precision is not required from the tool and you can use a simpler device, especially since the price of the LCR-ST1
less than $30. Another question is whether this price is justified, we will only know when there is a full review of this model of tweezers.  ;)
« Last Edit: August 10, 2024, 08:53:20 am by indman »
 

Offline indman

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 1208
  • Country: by
Re: FNIRSI LCR-ST1 (Inexpensive LCR Tweezers)
« Reply #6 on: August 10, 2024, 09:08:08 am »
Brief user manual for those who want to know more about this product.
« Last Edit: August 10, 2024, 09:10:03 am by indman »
 
The following users thanked this post: egonotto, Rooster Cogburn, Kosmic, tonyalbus

Offline Kosmic

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 2554
  • Country: ca
Re: FNIRSI LCR-ST1 (Inexpensive LCR Tweezers)
« Reply #7 on: August 10, 2024, 02:23:40 pm »
I was curious and ordered one on ebay. Found a seller listing at 26$US with free shipping  :o  can't really beat that price.
« Last Edit: August 22, 2024, 12:08:59 am by Kosmic »
 

Offline Kosmic

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 2554
  • Country: ca
Re: FNIRSI LCR-ST1 (Inexpensive LCR Tweezers)
« Reply #8 on: August 10, 2024, 02:47:24 pm »
I would rather save up for an ST42 from Shannon, then you would have won several times over.

I would've also paid several times over. That's a device in a completely different price class.
And completely different capability class.

After nearly 2 decades of using SMD LCR tweezers I can vouch ST42 are currently incomparable for their cost.

Sincerely, since you are yourself selling the ST42, I think we need to take your comment with a big grain of salt  ;)
 

Offline Rooster CogburnTopic starter

  • Regular Contributor
  • *
  • Posts: 212
  • Country: de
Re: FNIRSI LCR-ST1 (Inexpensive LCR Tweezers)
« Reply #9 on: August 10, 2024, 02:50:47 pm »
I was currious and ordered one on ebay. Found a seller listing at 26$US with free shipping  :o  can't really beat that price.

Let us know ;-)

I don't need such a device often enough to spend three figures on a great one. For me the choice is between these and nothing. If they don't work well enough I keep rocking with nothing, that's fine, too.
 

Online csuhi17

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 351
  • Country: hu
Re: FNIRSI LCR-ST1 (Inexpensive LCR Tweezers)
« Reply #10 on: August 10, 2024, 06:16:54 pm »
I know, hence me asking if anybody has tried these. Never know with FNIRSI if the firmware actually works. The Miniware tweezers seemed interested but they also seem to have software problems.


Not just the software.
it didn't want to calibrate itself properly for me after the update, it succeeded 1 out of 5.
After 3-4 months it started to have a contact fault.
first at the jack connector and then also at the tip.
Random off during use.
Its measurement accuracy depended on how I held it, how tight it was on the two legs, how much I pressed it together...
approx. I sorted 800-1000 SMDs just with it, and it was destroyed.

I hope for those who buy Fnirsi that they get a better quality one, unlike me.
4 out of 7 is garbage...
« Last Edit: August 10, 2024, 06:18:40 pm by csuhi17 »
Fnirsi oscilloscope = waste&regret
 

Offline indman

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 1208
  • Country: by
Re: FNIRSI LCR-ST1 (Inexpensive LCR Tweezers)
« Reply #11 on: August 11, 2024, 06:56:10 am »
I hope for those who buy Fnirsi that they get a better quality one, unlike me.
4 out of 7 is garbage...
I don't know how to write a proverb in English, which is in Russian.
"Ежики плакали,кололись,но продолжали жрать кактус..."
That's about right, I think you'll get the point:
"The hedgehogs cried,they're in pain from needles, but kept eating cactus..."  :D
« Last Edit: August 11, 2024, 07:33:36 am by indman »
 

Offline indman

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 1208
  • Country: by
Re: FNIRSI LCR-ST1 (Inexpensive LCR Tweezers)
« Reply #12 on: August 11, 2024, 07:42:40 am »
Yeah, could be a re-brand. Can't find the ZOYI ZT-MD1 for sale on AE, no reviews anywhere either.
I found some short videos here, maybe it will be useful
https://www.bilibili.com/video/BV1EW421R74X/?spm_id_from=333.788.recommend_more_video.0
https://www.bilibili.com/video/BV1DT421k7Xr/?spm_id_from=333.788.recommend_more_video.5
« Last Edit: August 11, 2024, 07:50:23 am by indman »
 

Offline Kosmic

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 2554
  • Country: ca
Re: FNIRSI LCR-ST1 (Inexpensive LCR Tweezers)
« Reply #13 on: August 21, 2024, 09:37:12 pm »
I was curious and ordered one on ebay. Found a seller listing at 26$US with free shipping  :o  can't really beat that price.

I received the package today.

Come in a nice storage case with extra tips, manual and usb cable.



Side by side with the MS8911



The output at 0.6v 1kHz



Some measurements (all done at 1kHz):

  SR720MS8911LCR-ST1
2nF 0.1%C: 2.0004 D: 0.00025C: 1.99 D: 0.000C 2.012nF / D 0.0040
1uF 0.5%C: 1.0001 D: 0.00031C: 1.000 D: 0.001C: 1.002 D: 0.0002
500nF 0.5%C: 500.87 D: 0.00023C: 501.0 D: 0.000C: 503.4 D: 0.0040
125nF 0.5%C: 125.31 D: 0.00018C: 125.0 D: 0.000C: 126.1 D: 0.0032
5nF 0.5 %C: 5.0054 D: 0.00024C: 5.00 D: 0.000C: 5.022 D: 0.0027
160 pFC: 160.07 D: 0.00140C: 1.6 D: 0.001C: 164.0 D: 0.0002
10mHL: 9.4265 Q: 59.970L: 9.38 Q: 78.60L: 9.474 D: 0.0144
50mHL: 48.070 Q: 83.446L: 48.04 Q: 85.60L: 48.23 D: 0.0160
100mHL: 95.425 Q: 82.799L: 95.3 Q: 83.33L: 95.77 D: 0.0160
100Ohm 0.1%R: 100.32R: 100.3R: 100.4
1kOhm 0.1%R: 1.0002R: 1.001R: 1.001
10kOhm 0.1%R: 9.995R: 10.00R: 9.934
100kOhm 0.1%R: 99.925R: 100.0R: 99.93
1MOhm 0.1%R: 0.9983R: 1.001R: 1.00


So overall I'm pretty satisfied. Measurement is fast, accuracy seem to be in specs, form factor is small and light and the screen is bright and easy to read.

On the other hand, the secondary parameters are always the same. Rs and D. There is no way to get, for example, Q when measuring inductors. Build quality seem to be low but has to be expected from a 30$ device. Ex, there is only 1 screw holding each the tips. Not sure if they are going to last.
« Last Edit: August 22, 2024, 12:58:35 am by Kosmic »
 
The following users thanked this post: thm_w, DaneLaw, Rooster Cogburn, Teoman

Offline Kosmic

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 2554
  • Country: ca
Re: FNIRSI LCR-ST1 (Inexpensive LCR Tweezers)
« Reply #14 on: August 22, 2024, 12:36:46 am »
Ok so, to get more secondary parameters, you need to store the values on the device (using hold) and then connect via USB to retreive the .csv file

Ex of .cvs file you will find on the device:

No.TypeLevel(Vrms)Frequency(Hz)Value(R nF uH V)Rs(R)QDZ(R)X(R)
1C0.61000100.64684.0688388.64190.00261574.11631581.321
2C0.6100010.083535.4682445.00960.002215713.259815783.6943
3C0.610001.028465.6831332.46640.003154824.6875154823.9844
4C0.610000.09713353.3528355.16820.00281180783.51191004.125
« Last Edit: August 22, 2024, 03:30:39 am by Kosmic »
 
The following users thanked this post: tonyalbus

Offline indman

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 1208
  • Country: by
Re: FNIRSI LCR-ST1 (Inexpensive LCR Tweezers)
« Reply #15 on: August 22, 2024, 07:16:30 am »
Some measurements (all done at 1kHz):

  SR720MS8911LCR-ST1
2nF 0.1%C: 2.0004 D: 0.00025C: 1.99 D: 0.000C 2.012nF / D 0.0040
the difference in readings is D - 16 times!
 
1uF 0.5%C: 1.0001 D: 0.00031C: 1.000 D: 0.001C: 1.002 D: 0.0002
the difference in readings is D + 1.5 times!
 
500nF 0.5%C: 500.87 D: 0.00023C: 501.0 D: 0.000C: 503.4 D: 0.0040
  the difference in readings is D - 17 times!
 
125nF 0.5%C: 125.31 D: 0.00018C: 125.0 D: 0.000C: 126.1 D: 0.0032
  the difference in readings is D - 17 times!
 
5nF 0.5 %C: 5.0054 D: 0.00024C: 5.00 D: 0.000C: 5.022 D: 0.0027
the difference in readings is D - 11 times!
 
160 pFC: 160.07 D: 0.00140C: 1.6 D: 0.001C: 164.0 D: 0.0002
  the difference in readings is D + 7 times!

So overall I'm pretty satisfied. Measurement is fast, accuracy seem to be in specs, form factor is small and light and the screen is bright and easy to read.

If this toy is positioned as a bridge meter, it should at least somewhat fulfill this purpose.
Look at your table more closely - do you see what a huge difference there is in the secondary parameter D readings at 1kHz?!!! Why do you need such a resolution for this parameter of 4 digits after the dot, if he's grossly mistaken by the third digit? The MS8911 has a lower resolution of 3 digits and it more adequately shows a D value similar to the results in the SR720 instrument. ;)
I've already pointed out the incorrect D measuring on a similar ZOYI tweezers here
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/zoyi-zt-md1-new-lcr-tweezers/msg5604897/#msg5604897
I'll repeat my question here - If the secondary parameters Rs, D, Q can't be trusted, then they become a useless addition and can mislead you, right?
« Last Edit: August 22, 2024, 08:40:08 am by indman »
 
The following users thanked this post: danno_cj

Online Aldo22

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 1275
  • Country: ch
Re: FNIRSI LCR-ST1 (Inexpensive LCR Tweezers)
« Reply #16 on: August 22, 2024, 10:27:36 am »
What would you see as the advantages of these LCR tweezers (Zoyi, Fnirsi...) over a transistor tester (e.g. GM328A with SMD pad)?
Is it mainly about the handling?
 

Offline indman

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 1208
  • Country: by
Re: FNIRSI LCR-ST1 (Inexpensive LCR Tweezers)
« Reply #17 on: August 22, 2024, 10:53:47 am »
Is it mainly about the handling?
No, it's mostly to do with the way these devices work!
Tweezers work with sine signal and at different frequencies, transistor tester works at 1st frequency and only with rectangular signal! ;)
 
The following users thanked this post: Aldo22

Online Aldo22

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 1275
  • Country: ch
Re: FNIRSI LCR-ST1 (Inexpensive LCR Tweezers)
« Reply #18 on: August 22, 2024, 11:44:29 am »
Is it mainly about the handling?
No, it's mostly to do with the way these devices work!
Tweezers work with sine signal and at different frequencies, transistor tester works at 1st frequency and only with rectangular signal! ;)

Thank you. I guess so, but what does that mean in practice?
I assume that if the GM328A shows me 20pF, the tweezer will also show me 20pF etc.?
You say yourself that the secondary parameters can't be trusted. In-circuit measurements are apparently also questionable.
So what practical difference is there between these cheap devices?

As a beginner/hobbyist, I wonder whether such a device would be of any benefit to me.

 

Offline indman

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 1208
  • Country: by
Re: FNIRSI LCR-ST1 (Inexpensive LCR Tweezers)
« Reply #19 on: August 22, 2024, 11:54:52 am »
I guess so, but what does that mean in practice?
I assume that if the GM328A shows me 20pF, the tweezer will also show me 20pF etc.?
You say yourself that the secondary parameters can't be trusted. In-circuit measurements are apparently also questionable.
So what practical difference is there between these cheap devices?
Despite my criticism, a tweezer or a device that works as a bridge meter will give you much more convenience and advantages than a transistor tester. Do not forget that this tweezer is positioned as an full-fledged LCR meter, the capabilities of the transistor tester are very limited in terms of measuring these values, as they are in fact only a bonus application to the abilities of this project. For example, can you reliably measure a 1pF capacitance on a tranzistor tester? Yes, Karl-Heinz has a great resonant method of such measurements, but it is only an exception to the rule. :)
« Last Edit: August 22, 2024, 12:16:50 pm by indman »
 
The following users thanked this post: Aldo22

Online Aldo22

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 1275
  • Country: ch
Re: FNIRSI LCR-ST1 (Inexpensive LCR Tweezers)
« Reply #20 on: August 22, 2024, 04:27:20 pm »
Despite my criticism, a tweezer or a device that works as a bridge meter will give you much more convenience and advantages than a transistor tester. Do not forget that this tweezer is positioned as an full-fledged LCR meter, the capabilities of the transistor tester are very limited in terms of measuring these values, as they are in fact only a bonus application to the abilities of this project.

OK, if you say so....  :)

Ordered one. The price is good.  :-+
 

Offline Evi

  • Regular Contributor
  • *
  • Posts: 125
  • Country: ru
Re: FNIRSI LCR-ST1 (Inexpensive LCR Tweezers)
« Reply #21 on: August 25, 2024, 03:42:14 pm »
Anybody understand calibration prcedure?
This idiotic video explains nothing.
 

Offline UniSoft

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 306
  • Country: kz
Re: FNIRSI LCR-ST1 (Inexpensive LCR Tweezers)
« Reply #22 on: August 26, 2024, 04:41:14 pm »
MCU: ARTERY AT32F403ACGU7
LCD: N114-2413THBIG01-H13

2351501-0 2351481-1 2351485-2 2351489-3 2351493-4 2351497-5
« Last Edit: August 26, 2024, 04:43:22 pm by UniSoft »
 
The following users thanked this post: skench, PinheadBE, Rooster Cogburn, ZhuraYuk, Phil1977, NikNik

Offline NikNik

  • Newbie
  • Posts: 4
  • Country: ru
Re: FNIRSI LCR-ST1 (Inexpensive LCR Tweezers)
« Reply #23 on: August 31, 2024, 08:48:57 am »
New firmware v1.5  https://www.fnirsi.com/cdn/shop/files/LCR-ST1-V1.5.bin?v=1031665107150577539
https://www.fnirsi.com/pages/download-firmware

I did not find any information about the changes, probably the changes are aimed at improving the accuracy of measurements...
I did not see any changes in the work
+ He started to display the polarity of the diode
by turning the icon
« Last Edit: August 31, 2024, 02:59:25 pm by NikNik »
 
The following users thanked this post: Rooster Cogburn, UniSoft, Phil1977

Offline Phil1977

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 737
  • Country: de
Re: FNIRSI LCR-ST1 (Inexpensive LCR Tweezers)
« Reply #24 on: August 31, 2024, 09:24:03 am »
MCU: ARTERY AT32F403ACGU7
LCD: N114-2413THBIG01-H13

Thanks for the pictures!

One question: I´ve quite frequently seen quite highly priced semiconductors in these super cheap instruments. Like the INA 826 (usually around €3,- from authorized sources) in this case or sometimes even a €8 photomos-switch in a €10 DMM. 

I think even FNIRSI has too much reputation to loose to just use fake chips without any quality control. Do you think
a) Fnirsi uses originals from TI, even if these two chips alone would be one of the largest item in the BOM
b) there is a spot market for such chips, Fnirsi just produces as long as they get cheap components
c) they use fakes but good ones
d) they use bad fakes
e) anything else???

New firmware v1.5  https://www.fnirsi.com/cdn/shop/files/LCR-ST1-V1.5.bin?v=1031665107150577539
https://www.fnirsi.com/pages/download-firmware

Do you know about any changelog?
« Last Edit: August 31, 2024, 09:38:46 am by Phil1977 »
 


Share me

Digg  Facebook  SlashDot  Delicious  Technorati  Twitter  Google  Yahoo
Smf