Products > Test Equipment

Functional comparison of R&S RTB2000, Siglent SDS2000X and Keysight DSOX1000

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bdunham7:

--- Quote from: tautech on January 09, 2022, 06:08:29 am ---Seems entirely the wrong probe to use with a SDS2kX+.

https://w140.com/tekwiki/wiki/P6156
It is designed for use with wide band oscilloscope amplifiers with 50 Ω inputs

--- End quote ---

The SDS2xxxX+ isn't all that?  What part is it not? At 500MHz the P6156 10x will have a higher impedance than any 10M 10x probe like the SP3050A.  Of course it is resistive, not reactive, but that's another matter.

In any case, that shouldn't affect the operation of the readout pin, which is what I was testing.  And my other probe that I tried is for a standard 1M input.

tautech:

--- Quote from: bdunham7 on January 09, 2022, 06:41:54 am ---
--- Quote from: tautech on January 09, 2022, 06:08:29 am ---Seems entirely the wrong probe to use with a SDS2kX+.

https://w140.com/tekwiki/wiki/P6156
It is designed for use with wide band oscilloscope amplifiers with 50 Ω inputs

--- End quote ---

The SDS2xxxX+ isn't all that?  What part is it not? At 500MHz the P6156 10x will have a higher impedance than any 10M 10x probe like the SP3050A.  Of course it is resistive, not reactive, but that's another matter.

In any case, that shouldn't affect the operation of the readout pin, which is what I was testing.  And my other probe that I tried is for a standard 1M input.

--- End quote ---
A post or 2 back you answered your own question:

--- Quote from: bdunham7 on January 09, 2022, 03:29:19 am ---
--- Quote from: tautech on January 09, 2022, 02:26:26 am ---What is the pin to BNC outer resistance ? This 100x probe measures 6.2k and autosenses just fine.
Don't have a SDS2kX+ unboxed so checked on my SDS5kX demo.

--- End quote ---

I have a Tek P6156 with switchable 1x/10x/20x/100x.  The resistances for each are open, ~10k, ~1.5k and ~5k.  These all indicate correctly on my Tek scopes except for 20x, which was only supported on the 11000-series sampling scopes.  I also have a Probemaster 100X w/ readout and it measures 6.9k.  Again, both Tek scopes recognize it as 100x.  The SDS2000X+ switches to 10X if any probe I have with a readout pin is attached, and I checked all 4 channels.  From what I've read the nominal values are 10x--11k, 100x--6k, 1000x--??.  My 2465B actually recognizes the 20x one as 1000x, so I assume that the 1.5k is in the ballpark for that.  The 2221A probably doesn't know about 1000x probes.

--- End quote ---
Earlier I posted this ~6.2k sense pin resistance for 100x probe for SDS5kX and in previous checks with SDS2kX+ also sensed fine with the same 100x stock probes we have.

I suggest you get a 10k pot out and find the 100x sense pin thresholds for your 2kX+ as it appears they don't match Tek but is that any surprise ?
Since forever there has been no hard and fast standard for sense pin resistances.

FYI this is how the same probe autosenses in 50 Ohm mode.

Calvin:
Hi,

loads of effort  :-+
Regarding the UI Layout... I don´t share Your opinion about a unlogic Layout of the SDS -where I truely miss that You don´t show examples, but just talk talk talk.  :=\
For example Meas and Cursor buttons are close to the universal rotary knob .... just where they should be.
The same applies to the Setup Run/Stop, Default buttons which I would expect in proximity of the trigger settings ... just where they are.
Others mentioned already the quite sensible logic behind the illumination of the channel buttons.
The only buttons which may seem be a bit off at first glance are the Navigate row-of-4. But then ... where better to put them?
I find the R&S layout not at all more intuitive ... let alone the Keysight, where you can´t even see the buttons due to the stupid black casing colour.  :palm:
In the end its probabely just a matter of personal history and preference which UI one prefers.
I have lots of good experiences with Siglent -no lost foot at all on any of the 6 devices I work with and no terribly loud fan on either) and rather negative experiences with R&S (RTH handheld Osci) their service and their ridicolous accessories prices.
And I´m certainly p***** off by Keysights new ´we-sell-you-but-don´t-wanna-serve-after´ policy.
So I´m a bit biased in the opposite direction from Yours.
In the comparison table I miss the EasyWave software listed under the section Windows Apps.
Apart from that ... keep up the evaluation work  :-+ :clap:

regards
Calvin



tautech:

--- Quote from: Calvin on January 09, 2022, 08:08:35 am ---Hi,

loads of effort  :-+
Regarding the UI Layout... I don´t share Your opinion about a unlogic Layout of the SDS -where I truely miss that You don´t show examples, but just talk talk talk.  :=\
For example Meas and Cursor buttons are close to the universal rotary knob .... just where they should be.
The same applies to the Setup Run/Stop, Default buttons which I would expect in proximity of the trigger settings ... just where they are.
Others mentioned already the quite sensible logic behind the illumination of the channel buttons.
The only buttons which may seem be a bit off at first glance are the Navigate row-of-4. But then ... where better to put them?
I find the R&S layout not at all more intuitive ... let alone the Keysight, where you can´t even see the buttons due to the stupid black casing colour.  :palm:
In the end its probabely just a matter of personal history and preference which UI one prefers.
I have lots of good experiences with Siglent -no lost foot at all on any of the 6 devices I work with and no terribly loud fan on either) and rather negative experiences with R&S (RTH handheld Osci) their service and their ridicolous accessories prices.
And I´m certainly p***** off by Keysights new ´we-sell-you-but-don´t-wanna-serve-after´ policy.
So I´m a bit biased in the opposite direction from Yours.
In the comparison table I miss the EasyWave software listed under the section Windows Apps.
Apart from that ... keep up the evaluation work  :-+ :clap:

regards
Calvin

--- End quote ---
Yes.....
Not recognizing why Siglent have laid out the channel button indicators how they have seems like the user has recently migrated to a DSO after years of experience with only CRO's.

Channel tabs on the display indicate which channels are active and the channel LED indicates which one is active to the controls.....so simple....you don't even have to take your eyes away from the display if you need to know which is the active channel if you have a trace overlap as the control active trace is always on top.

We first saw this layout with the SDS1104X-E and it remains consistent throughout all Siglent's multiplexed control DSO's.

RBBVNL9:
Dear all, thanks for the various replies and feedback, appreciate it. Let me start with the hub comments.

I wrote "The SDS already has two USB connectors but for whatever reason, mine fails to work well with a hub." Of course, this is N=1, and it may be due to my specific case.

So, the hub I tried is an Anker type A7516, a fairly straightforward, recent 4 port hub. When connected to a USB host connector on the front panel of the SDS, it failed to work with a fairly standard PC keyboard (an HP H3C52AA). That same keyboard does work directly on the SDS, and the combination of the said hub and keyboard do work on the RTB and the SDOX. Actually, with the DSOX, four keyboards worked at the same time!

I also noted that when the keyboard failed to work, the LEDs on the keyboard do not turn on (they do turn on when connected directly to the SDS, or connected to RTB or DSOX via the hub). That suggests a power issue. Perhaps the RTB and SDOX supply more power to the hub than the SDS, allowing them to use 'heavier' accessories.

So I tried to find some other keyboards I could try around the house. What I found is:

* An 'original' Raspberry Pi keyboard (the funky red and white one). And... that one works with my hub on the SDS!
* A Logitech wireless K270 keyboard with its supplied proprietary (not 'unity') Logitech dongle. That one also works with my hub on the SDS.
* An HP keyboard that came with an old all-in-one PC, type KBAH21. Does not work with my hub on the SDS
* An Apple full-size keyboard type A1243. Does not work with my hub on the SDSSo, my tentative conclusions are that (1) the use of SDS with hub may depend on the specific model of hub and/or used USB devices, (2) higher-powered accessories may cause problems on the SDS when connected via hubs and (3) the RTB and DSOX seem less sensitive to the type of keyboards connected via hubs.

Of course, I could try to find other hubs and test them too, but the number of permutations would get high and I would rather reply to some other comments today as well ;-)

On a final note: the RTB and DSOX provide clear feedback when USB devices are not recognized/allowed, or when you use flash drives with 'exotic' formatting (see screenshots). As far as I know, the SDS does not provide explicit error messages, it remains silent.

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