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High voltage oscilloscope probe

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EugenioN:
Hi all!

I'm looking for an oscilloscope probe for high voltage pulse measurements. High voltage means 50kV minimum, with reasonably high probability of 80-90kV excursions. Bandwidth should be around 1MHz, but higher is welcome. This should be good enough for showing high voltage pulses with ~5kV/us rise time, and duration less than 100us.
No need for differential probing, single ended is fine.
Passive probes cannot reach the bandwidth, so I think I need to go for an active one.
I don't like those manufacturer tied gadgets with fancy smart connectors. Just plain probe with its wall wart powered amplifier.

Do you have any suggestion?

jonpaul:
Bonjour we specialized in HV , EBY, ignitor and transient protection design in 1970s...1990s.

What is the appkication, eg transient research, compliance testing, EMC, EW, radar?

We have used many of these Tektronix HV probes. P6015,   P6015A, see specs. 20..40 kV 75 MHz derating depends on freq.

Current version P6015A: https://w140.com/tekwiki/images/b/b2/51W-8217-2.pdf

P6015 earlier version has larger comp box, requires Freon 114 gas fill, sale of the Freon was  banned long ago. Any used eg epay will have the F114 gas missing or already depleted so derated to 20 kV
https://w140.com/tekwiki/wiki/P6015

Above 40 kV or the derated spec of P6015, you have some probes (see below) but more are  HV dividers:  large terminals with precision vacuum or air dielectric capacitors (AC only) or high meg HV dividers.


Few vendors, like

Ross Engineering

https://www.rossengineeringcorp.com/products/measurement/hv-probes-multimeters/hv-probes.html

https://www.rossengineeringcorp.com/products/measurement/hv-voltage-dividers.html

Stangenes Industries

https://www.electricalproducts.stangenes.com/viewitems/products/standard-voltage-dividers

Expect high cost and long delivery as most of these are made to order.

I can vouch that both my old friends Ross and Stangenes are very experienced high quality manufacturers


Enjoy and be safe!

Jon

EugenioN:

--- Quote from: jonpaul on January 16, 2023, 11:37:02 am ---What is the appkication, eg transient research, compliance testing, EMC, EW, radar?

--- End quote ---

I need to build from the ground up some knowledge in HV generators. The main goal is to design and develop an high voltage pulse generator, that's basically very close to an automotive ignition coil and driver (with the exception of the spark plug), plus some ADCs to measure primary voltage&current and secondary current during discharge.


--- Quote from: jonpaul on January 16, 2023, 11:37:02 am ---We have used many of these Tektronix HV probes. P6015,   P6015A, see specs. 20..40 kV 75 MHz derating depends on freq.

Current version P6015A: https://w140.com/tekwiki/images/b/b2/51W-8217-2.pdf

P6015 earlier version has larger comp box, requires Freon 114 gas fill, sale of the Freon was  banned long ago. Any used eg epay will have the F114 gas missing or already depleted so derated to 20 kV
https://w140.com/tekwiki/wiki/P6015

--- End quote ---

Great! They are also readily available. I'll definitely have a look at that!



--- Quote from: jonpaul on January 16, 2023, 11:37:02 am ---Above 40 kV or the derated spec of P6015, you have some probes (see below) but more are  HV dividers:  large terminals with precision vacuum or air dielectric capacitors (AC only) or high meg HV dividers.


Few vendors, like

Ross Engineering

https://www.rossengineeringcorp.com/products/measurement/hv-probes-multimeters/hv-probes.html

https://www.rossengineeringcorp.com/products/measurement/hv-voltage-dividers.html

Stangenes Industries

https://www.electricalproducts.stangenes.com/viewitems/products/standard-voltage-dividers

Expect high cost and long delivery as most of these are made to order.

I can vouch that both my old friends Ross and Stangenes are very experienced high quality manufacturers


Enjoy and be safe!

Jon

--- End quote ---

Interesting companies! I'll check on them.

Thank you,  :-+

jonpaul:
Rebonjour Cher Eugèneion,

The ICE ignition system is over 100 years old , electronic ignition trace back to 1960s.

Not much has changed, so the HV ignition coils and spark voltage ,current, énergie and waveforms are well studied and optimized.  I have never seen a 50..90 kV auto ignition system, spark pluginss, cables, and ignition coils are rated to 20..35 kV not higher, so Tektronix P6015/A should be sufficient.

But, What exactly is your goal? The flyback energy in the coil core creates a 20..40 kV fast rise ring wave, and the load is at first the stray capacité of the coil secondary and ignition wires.After the combustion is ignited, the spark transitions to an arc,  and becomes more resistive.
Suggest you research the many books and papers on gaseous conductors, sparks and arcs.

Finally, beware  the common mode voltage of the ignition can be coupled around the HV probe, masking the true waveforms on the  scope, and can even damage the scope input.

Thus, HV  measurements you propose are difficult and risky to test equipment even with the HV probes.

Bon courage

Jon

Stray Electron:
jonpaul,

   I used to see a lot of those p6015 probes in the surplus since they couldn't get the freon to fill them with any longer. Is there another gas that could be used to fill them with that would allow them to be used to greater than 20 kV?

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