Products > Test Equipment
IC testers, do they work?
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David Aurora:

--- Quote from: Someone on August 09, 2023, 04:31:11 am ---
--- Quote from: David Aurora on August 09, 2023, 03:49:30 am ---
--- Quote from: Someone on August 09, 2023, 02:37:40 am ---
--- Quote from: David Aurora on August 09, 2023, 02:13:04 am ---
--- Quote from: alm on August 09, 2023, 01:12:36 am ---
--- Quote from: David Aurora on August 09, 2023, 12:19:47 am ---Not true, they definitely can test *some* op amps. On mine it's only a handful, but I keep wondering if newer firmware has added any more.

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What is not true? That I don't think they have any value for testing analog ICs? Can you read my mind? I didn't say they couldn't do any test on op amps, just that I don't think it's a very useful test. Never mind other analog ICs like motor drivers or tape head amplifiers.

What do you mean it supports a handful of op amps? I can imagine doing a basic dc test for single and dual op amps, the same you can do with a breadboard, a few resistors and an LED.

But why would it need to support more than a generic single, dual and quad op amp? Is it going to test parameters that are different between a ua741, op07 or tl081? Slew rate? GBW? Offset voltage? Bias current? That would be useful for checking for counterfeit ICs, especially if they could give quantitative results. But I highly doubt the cheap IC testers are going to do those tests.

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You said you didn't think these are of any value for op amps. That's what I was saying was not true, based on the fact that I have identified tonnes of bad op amps with these in seconds flat.
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You believe that, and we don't. It's some arbitrary distinction of what you want as the threshold for "works" and what we want as the threshold. Rather than saying we're wrong (because we're not) why not explain your reasons rather than just attacking what we say as if its incorrect (which you cannot seem to build an argument to support).

Real simple, if you think it is a good test, what is it testing?
If you don't know what it is testing I say it is a bad test, and given it returns only a binary result barely able to be called a test.


--- Quote from: David Aurora on August 09, 2023, 02:06:13 am ---Those cheap 3 terminal multifunction testers that do LCR/transistors/etc. I use one all the time for checking go/no go status, checking pinouts, etc. It doesn't test under real world conditions, I don't know or care what exactly the test method is, and I don't trust or care about the particular measurement numbers it spits out. If those details matter I have dedicated, proper equipment for detailed measurements, but it's very rarely needed in practice. In most cases the 5 second test on the $10 tester tells me what I need to know in the moment and I can get on with the job.
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I feel the 3 terminal testers are vastly more useful and powerful as (the ones I have used) return some parameters that the user can make judgements from and allow insight into what the pass/fail criteria is. Just as some IC testers do, but not the one the OP asked about, which I say is generally a waste of time as you have no idea what it is claiming.

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Huuuuuge armchair expert vibes going on here.

I don't care if you "believe" these aren't of any value for troubleshooting, given that I make a living troubleshooting electronics and these have found a place in my toolkit.

You keep looping back to the testing parameters over and over again, despite the fact that absolutely nobody is using these for characterising devices. I can't tell if you're illiterate, inexperienced or just trolling here.

Have you actually used one of these and had issues with results, or is your issue here all in your head?
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You say you trust it but cannot say what it does? Great, leave it at that. Why keep coming back in combative argumentative mode?

If a product can not tell me what it is doing (and has no specifications) I treat that as a toy and value it accordingly, that is what I keep communicating and you keep coming back with more disagreement. You value it differently, both points of view have been put forward and I'm not arguing against your opinion of that. I'm pointing out your arguments against my posts are baseless, and continue to be so.

If I want to know if a part is working I'll test it in representative conditions, not some undefined mode. Have I debugged and fixed equipment in the field (away from a workshop or lab) ? sure have, and would not place any value in the cheap toy that the OP was asking about. You see that value judgement differently which is ok, but you seem to think it is ok to keep coming back and arguing that I cannot have such an opinion (and failing to explain or back up your claims that others opinions are wrong, just because you disagree does not mean it is wrong).

From my point of view you do care (keep coming back and choosing to quote specific comments + reply to them), and are unable to engage in basic discussion (as you simply dismiss other viewpoints without any basis and ignore direct questions).

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Issue is all in your head, got it.
Fungus:

--- Quote from: Someone on August 09, 2023, 02:37:40 am ---You believe that, and we don't.

--- End quote ---

Who's "we"?
Fungus:

--- Quote from: Someone on August 09, 2023, 04:31:11 am ---If a product can not tell me what it is doing (and has no specifications) I treat that as a toy

--- End quote ---

The source code is available. Feel free to download it and find out for yourself.

Do you really think that nobody who's coding this would make an effort to (eg.) check all combinations of inputs to a 7400-series chip to make sure it outputs correct values?
Someone:

--- Quote from: Fungus on August 09, 2023, 08:05:31 am ---
--- Quote from: Someone on August 09, 2023, 04:31:11 am ---If a product can not tell me what it is doing (and has no specifications) I treat that as a toy

--- End quote ---
The source code is available. Feel free to download it and find out for yourself.
--- End quote ---
Where?
Or are you confusing the well documented and more complex examples linked to in this thread as suggestions, vs the toy the OP opened with questions about?


--- Quote from: Fungus on August 09, 2023, 08:05:31 am ---Do you really think that nobody who's coding this would make an effort to (eg.) check all combinations of inputs to a 7400-series chip to make sure it outputs correct values?
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Where has anyone suggested that? As I keep saying, testing logic combinations is pretty much the only thing those low cost "testers" do. Doesnt meet the dictionary definition of a test, and is better described as identifying.
Doctorandus_P:
On a sidenote.

If you are interested in IC testing, look into an "IV tester" (as in current and voltage).
These things can detect "fake" and rebranded IC's even if they are "funcional", and can probably also detect ESD damage even if the IC is still "mostly working", but "just out of spec".
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