Author Topic: If Brymen BM869s is cheaper and as good, why people would still buy Fluke?  (Read 115838 times)

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Offline 5ky

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Re: If Brymen BM869s is cheaper and as good, why people would still buy Fluke?
« Reply #200 on: August 25, 2015, 05:19:55 am »
When I google up Fluke, I get photos like this one with the 87 IV:

 :-+

When I google up Brymen, I get photos of Kiriakos testing temperature of his kettle with the BM869:

 :palm:

never underestimate the importance of perfect tea steeping temperature  :-DD
 

Offline pickle9000

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Re: If Brymen BM869s is cheaper and as good, why people would still buy Fluke?
« Reply #201 on: August 25, 2015, 05:25:03 am »
When I google up Fluke, I get photos like this one with the 87 IV:

 :-+

When I google up Brymen, I get photos of Kiriakos testing temperature of his kettle with the BM869:

 :palm:

never underestimate the importance of perfect tea steeping temperature  :-DD

I guarantee the tea testing is more enjoyable.
 

Offline nanofrog

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Re: If Brymen BM869s is cheaper and as good, why people would still buy Fluke?
« Reply #202 on: August 25, 2015, 06:17:09 am »
Brymen may not have taken such photos, but at least one of their ODM customers has.  ;)

Greenlee DM-860a  >:D

 

Offline TheBay

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Re: If Brymen BM869s is cheaper and as good, why people would still buy Fluke?
« Reply #203 on: August 25, 2015, 07:42:04 am »
Glad someone else appreciates the science behind making a cup of tea :), When I go to the states I have a hard time getting a good cuppa :)

When I google up Fluke, I get photos like this one with the 87 IV:

 :-+

When I google up Brymen, I get photos of Kiriakos testing temperature of his kettle with the BM869:

 :palm:

never underestimate the importance of perfect tea steeping temperature  :-DD
 

Offline naughtilus

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Re: If Brymen BM869s is cheaper and as good, why people would still buy Fluke?
« Reply #204 on: August 25, 2015, 08:25:20 am »
If Starbucks buys a BM869 for each of their shops around the world, Brymen will easily buy Danaher Corporation.
...or is it?
 

Offline TheBay

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Re: If Brymen BM869s is cheaper and as good, why people would still buy Fluke?
« Reply #205 on: August 25, 2015, 09:07:08 am »
Missed this, thanks for the link.
Are these prices subject to VAT on top or any other charges?

I know you are asking for something in the UK, but as Poland ships to the UK and their prices are really good I suggest you just get it from TME:
http://www.tme.eu/en/details/bm869/portable-digital-multimeters/brymen/bm869s/
 

Offline Wytnucls

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Re: If Brymen BM869s is cheaper and as good, why people would still buy Fluke?
« Reply #206 on: August 25, 2015, 09:19:15 am »
I suspect you have to pay VAT (unless you have a business) and postage charges:
They don't have stock, so the price could also change later.
« Last Edit: August 25, 2015, 09:21:56 am by Wytnucls »
 

Offline TheBay

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Re: If Brymen BM869s is cheaper and as good, why people would still buy Fluke?
« Reply #207 on: August 25, 2015, 09:45:58 am »
Thanks for finding that,

So it works out about £174inc VAT + Shipping £6.84 = £180.84 As a comparison works out $284.36 USD $395.24 Aus


I suspect you have to pay VAT (unless you have a business) and postage charges:
They don't have stock, so the price could also change later.
 

Offline joeqsmith

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Re: If Brymen BM869s is cheaper and as good, why people would still buy Fluke?
« Reply #208 on: August 25, 2015, 12:15:03 pm »
I wonder how the meters would handle radiated susceptibility.   
How electrically robust is your meter?? https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCsK99WXk9VhcghnAauTBsbg
 

Offline joeqsmith

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Re: If Brymen BM869s is cheaper and as good, why people would still buy Fluke?
« Reply #209 on: August 28, 2015, 11:44:41 am »
After a viewer had pointed out that the Fluke 87V had a peak hold feature,  I put together another video showing how it compares with the Brymen crest feature.   I thought I would also throw the EXTECH EX540 in the mix too.   




How electrically robust is your meter?? https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCsK99WXk9VhcghnAauTBsbg
 

Offline TheBay

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Re: If Brymen BM869s is cheaper and as good, why people would still buy Fluke?
« Reply #210 on: August 28, 2015, 12:18:25 pm »
Great video  :-+

After a viewer had pointed out that the Fluke 87V had a peak hold feature,  I put together another video showing how it compares with the Brymen crest feature.   I thought I would also throw the EXTECH EX540 in the mix too.   


 

Offline saturation

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Re: If Brymen BM869s is cheaper and as good, why people would still buy Fluke?
« Reply #211 on: August 28, 2015, 05:00:52 pm »
Good question.  In the archives of eevblog, the 87V went berzerk with GSM phones placed near the LCD, but a board revision fixed this but not sure it was a violation since the source had to be very close to the LCD to cause interference. 

True "CE" declaration also includes EMC compatibility.

https://www.adafruit.com/images/product-files/2610/EMCCertificate_of_Conformity.pdf

http://assets.fluke.com/manuals/101_____1aeng0000.pdf

Great video, as always.

I wonder how the meters would handle radiated susceptibility.   
Best Wishes,

 Saturation
 

Offline joeqsmith

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Re: If Brymen BM869s is cheaper and as good, why people would still buy Fluke?
« Reply #212 on: October 09, 2015, 11:49:41 pm »
I am nearing the end of this little experiment and I hope to have at least one data point that show if the Brymen BM-869S I purchased can survive a transient that the Fluke 87V was damaged with.   

This thread should provide some good background if anyone new is just starting to follow along.   
How electrically robust is your meter?? https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCsK99WXk9VhcghnAauTBsbg
 

Offline pascal_sweden

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Re: If Brymen BM869s is cheaper and as good, why people would still buy Fluke?
« Reply #213 on: November 29, 2015, 03:31:27 pm »
Why does the Brymen BM869s have 2 DC volt measurement options on the main rotary switch?
 

Offline Lightages

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Re: If Brymen BM869s is cheaper and as good, why people would still buy Fluke?
« Reply #214 on: November 29, 2015, 03:59:33 pm »
One selection is for volts, the other for milivolts. This is to switch in different dividers for these ranges to allow better accuracy. Each of these positions are for AC + DC also. If you look, AC also has two positions for the same reasons.
 

Offline pxl

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Re: If Brymen BM869s is cheaper and as good, why people would still buy Fluke?
« Reply #215 on: February 26, 2016, 09:07:52 pm »
Hi, I've just recently purchased a Brymen 867, please let me share few findings:

- the switch is very stiff. Sometimes I have a feeling that something will break apart if I force to turn it to the next position. I will fix it later, because it is hardy usable in this condition
- one of the connectors was decentered to that extent that is was almost impossible to plug the lead in. I fixed it with resoldering. It is okay now, but....
- the beeper is way too loud and it is impossible to switch it off permanently: it beeps as no future with every button press. I found that there is a "390K" labelled power resistor next to the spring of the beeper (0.5W maybe), which is about 3 ohm. I will replace that, hope that will help.
- the device is pretty hefty. I mean, ridiculously large. Not a big deal, though.

Apart from these, no other problems so far.
 

Offline _Wim_

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Re: If Brymen BM869s is cheaper and as good, why people would still buy Fluke?
« Reply #216 on: February 27, 2016, 07:19:46 am »
Hi, I've just recently purchased a Brymen 867, please let me share few findings:

- the switch is very stiff. Sometimes I have a feeling that something will break apart if I force to turn it to the next position. I will fix it later, because it is hardy usable in this condition
- one of the connectors was decentered to that extent that is was almost impossible to plug the lead in. I fixed it with resoldering. It is okay now, but....
- the beeper is way too loud and it is impossible to switch it off permanently: it beeps as no future with every button press. I found that there is a "390K" labelled power resistor next to the spring of the beeper (0.5W maybe), which is about 3 ohm. I will replace that, hope that will help.
- the device is pretty hefty. I mean, ridiculously large. Not a big deal, though.

Apart from these, no other problems so far.

- you can turn the beeper off by pressing the range button when swithing the meter on. The setting is however not remembered, its only for the current measurement session. But if you make ik a habbit of pressing the range swith when turning on the meter, it is ok :-)
 

Offline Fungus

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Re: If Brymen BM869s is cheaper and as good, why people would still buy Fluke?
« Reply #217 on: February 27, 2016, 12:44:16 pm »
- you can turn the beeper off by pressing the range button when swithing the meter on. The setting is however not remembered, its only for the current measurement session. But if you make ik a habbit of pressing the range swith when turning on the meter, it is ok :-)

It that's true then I'd be looking at a way to short out the range button during power-up (or only connect the buzzer when the meter is in continuity mode).

Even better: Send the meter back...   :palm:

 

Offline Wytnucls

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Re: If Brymen BM869s is cheaper and as good, why people would still buy Fluke?
« Reply #218 on: February 27, 2016, 01:58:30 pm »
Most meters have a high impedance on low DC volt and mV ranges (2.5GOhm) to prevent loading low voltage high impedance circuits. Could someone confirm that the Brymen 869 has the same feature? All I can find is 10MOhm on those ranges (Brymen site).
The docs are probably wrong, as, surely, Brymen owners would have complained about it by now.
« Last Edit: February 28, 2016, 10:14:12 am by Wytnucls »
 

Offline markone

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Re: If Brymen BM869s is cheaper and as good, why people would still buy Fluke?
« Reply #219 on: February 27, 2016, 03:24:44 pm »
Most meters have a high impedance on low DC volt and mV ranges (2.5GOhm) to prevent loading low voltage circuits. Could someone confirm that the Brymen 869 has the same feature? All I can find is 10MOhm on those ranges (Brymen site).
The docs are probably wrong, as Brymen owners would have complained about it by now.

It's actually 10Mohm for all ranges as written in docs, verified on mine 896S right now.

I was aware about that before purchase, so i do not complian.

Fluke's 87V standard voltage reading loads 10Mohm as well, the "high impedance mode" is only for 500mV range and is  unspecified for both actual impedance and precision (and has to be engaged with a key press on DMM's turn-on).

My meter's rotary switch is on the stiff side but still acceptable, no problem with beep sound level and instrument size, both are comfortable to me (and yes, my hearing is good).

I often use the double temperature reading function with differential readout, a neat feature not found in most competitor devices.

I found AC TrueRMS voltage reading very accurate in audio freq. range as well as DC current accuracy and resolution on both 10A and 0.6A ranges.

What i dislike is the LCD backlight, quite uneven on left side, plus the PC cable interface that miss standard USB COM profile adopting a bugged HID interface mode (it fails when you attempt ot import it under NI-VISA standard HID driver profile) and a ridiculous way to transmit the DMM readings (display's segments bit mapping :palm:), that translates into a huge PITA when you have to write your own logger application.

But considering Fluke's ripp-off EU street's prices (official distributors please, not buy&die ebay sellers), i'm happy to have spent 230E (VAT included) for this one.
 

Offline Wytnucls

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Re: If Brymen BM869s is cheaper and as good, why people would still buy Fluke?
« Reply #220 on: February 27, 2016, 04:10:04 pm »
Actually, the high impedance on mV ranges is not as common as I thought.
Confirmed meters with an impedance over 1GOhm are Gossen 30M, Hioki 4282, Chauvin Arnoux MTX 3293, Protek 608, UNI-T UT71 (2.5GOhm mV range) and UNI-T UT61 (>3GOhm mV ranges).
A few others go up to 100MOhm on mV ranges.
Bench meters often have an option for a >10GOhm impedance, when required, like the Rigol 3058 or Keithley 2000 (permanent on 10V and below ranges)

I don't know about the alleged high impedance mode on the Fluke 87V. I can only find a selectable low impedance feature. Normal mode is 10MOhm.

From the 87V manual:
When measuring voltage, the Meter acts approximately
like a 10 MOhm (10,000,000 Ohm) impedance in parallel with
the circuit. This loading effect can cause measurement
errors in high-impedance circuits. In most cases, the error
is negligible (0.1% or less) if the circuit impedance is
10 KOhm (10,000 Ohm) or less.
« Last Edit: February 28, 2016, 10:29:31 am by Wytnucls »
 

Offline markone

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Re: If Brymen BM869s is cheaper and as good, why people would still buy Fluke?
« Reply #221 on: February 27, 2016, 04:43:35 pm »
I don't know about the alleged high impedance mode on the Fluke 87V. I can only find a selectable low impedance feature. Normal mode is 10MOhm.

From the 87V manual:
When measuring voltage, the Meter acts approximately
like a 10 MOhm (10,000,000 Ohm) impedance in parallel with
the circuit. This loading effect can cause measurement
errors in high-impedance circuits. In most cases, the error
is negligible (0.1% or less) if the circuit impedance is
10 KOhm (10,000 Ohm) or less.

From the user manual :

 

Offline Wytnucls

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Re: If Brymen BM869s is cheaper and as good, why people would still buy Fluke?
« Reply #222 on: February 27, 2016, 04:54:07 pm »
Gee, they really buried that one! Grazie. Would be nice to know what the impedance increase is. Anybody measured it?
The Fluke 185 has the same feature.
« Last Edit: February 27, 2016, 06:14:20 pm by Wytnucls »
 

Offline mos6502

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Re: If Brymen BM869s is cheaper and as good, why people would still buy Fluke?
« Reply #223 on: February 27, 2016, 07:23:10 pm »
Gee, they really buried that one! Grazie. Would be nice to know what the impedance increase is. Anybody measured it?
The Fluke 185 has the same feature.

Just tried it. Using my DE-5000 LCR meter I measure around 10.000 megohms in normal mode and over limit with the Fluke in Hi-Z mode ... so that would be over 200 megohms?  :wtf:

That is with the DE-5000 in DCR mode. Using the AC measurement mode, I get from 1.05 megohms at 100 Hz to 2.1 kiloohms at 100kHz (the 87V still being in Hi-Z mode).
for(;;);
 

Offline Lightages

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Re: If Brymen BM869s is cheaper and as good, why people would still buy Fluke?
« Reply #224 on: February 27, 2016, 07:41:32 pm »
Why would you bother to measure the impedance of a DE-5000? It is not a passive device. It is a pointless and meaningless measurement.
 


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