JUST got my BRAND NEW AGILENT DSOX2022A for 800$ !!!!

[SeanB]

If you are designing an analogue ASIC for the scope ( like Agilent and TEK both do) then it is simple and almost no cost to include the reference source, most of a dual slope converter and switching into the chip.  A few spare pins on the package are used, and it will be useful during manufacture and assembly to do the DC setup as well. Having it as an option in firmware will then be easy to add.

[hunter]

Man, I got all my stuff on ebay, not mentioning they are used, old, and what not 

[Tooms]

They really should. Optioning out all this stuff in a scope is silly and actually one of the reasons I steered away from Agilent. That kind of selling/marketing really annoys me. Stick it all in there and charge a price, dont tempt me with features and a price point then charge me after Ive jumped for the stuff you told me about.

I think it is an good thing as i think the concept of "one fit all" is more bad.

I am in the process of buying a MSOX3024 and i relly like that i can start with one version of the scope (with all the power in there but not enabled) and later on when i need the function(have the money) then i can just get the option enabled.

yes yes i know that the msox3024 cost alot and i can get bigger rigol or other chinese models, but i realy like agilents scopes and okey with apying some extra for that



Tooms

[Wuerstchenhund]

I am in the process of buying a MSOX3024 and i relly like that i can start with one version of the scope (with all the power in there but not enabled) and later on when i need the function(have the money) then i can just get the option enabled.

I never thought that someone is actually *happy* to pay more for less. But whatever floats your boat ;-)

[Tooms]

I am in the process of buying a MSOX3024 and i relly like that i can start with one version of the scope (with all the power in there but not enabled) and later on when i need the function(have the money) then i can just get the option enabled.

I never thought that someone is actually *happy* to pay more for less. But whatever floats your boat ;-)

I more see it as investment in the right gear from the begining and there can grow as you need it.

i better like to pay more to have the relly cool and nice gear and then have it over an longer time, instedt of buying x number of chinese modeles over the years and not having the same happy feeling when using it.

i think that the agilent ones are kickass more cool and nices then the chineses ones, but i think this is much like cars where some are buying the best they can afford and have the happines every day and others just see it as a metal can with wheels and like to get them cheap.

But it is good we are all different and have different tastes


Tooms

[Wuerstchenhund]

I more see it as investment in the right gear from the begining and there can grow as you need it.

I understand, but unfortunately it often remains a nice idea as usually at the time you want to upgrade it's rarely cost-effective any more when technology and products have moved on. In the end, it's more likely to be cheaper to sell the scope and just buy the newer model which already comes with what you need than to upgrade your old scope.

i better like to pay more to have the relly cool and nice gear and then have it over an longer time, instedt of buying x number of chinese modeles over the years and not having the same happy feeling when using it.

That's certainly a good decision, but independent of the scope brand I think you're a bit too optimistic about the upgradeability (a trap many have fallen into). 

[Tooms]

I more see it as investment in the right gear from the begining and there can grow as you need it.

I understand, but unfortunately it often remains a nice idea as usually at the time you want to upgrade it's rarely cost-effective any more when technology and products have moved on. In the end, it's more likely to be cheaper to sell the scope and just buy the newer model which already comes with what you need than to upgrade your old scope.

yes i fully understand what your saying but i most say that in the past i have been happiest with the gear where i have spent on it and other times have have been standing with cheap gear where i have been thinking... why have i spent money on this crap and wasted time on this.
also i think the "used car value" is better on the good gear and it is easyer to sell it to an good pice when your going for the upgrade.

i better like to pay more to have the relly cool and nice gear and then have it over an longer time, instedt of buying x number of chinese modeles over the years and not having the same happy feeling when using it.

That's certainly a good decision, but independent of the scope brand I think you're a bit too optimistic about the upgradeability (a trap many have fallen into).

yes and i am using a very long time to pick what gear to get and how long time i can use it.

Now i am loking at a new(demo unit) msox3024 with lan option for 3900£ and yes the prices are higher here in denmark and that includes 25% sales tax that we are forced to pay for.

msox3024 (3 year warrent )
+lan option
+wavegen
+voltmeter

[jpb]

At least with Agilent there is the option.

I have a new-to-me LeCroy WaveJet 334 and I had intended at some point upgrading by getting the LeCroy Logic Studio but I find LeCroy have set things up in the following bizarre way:-

The WaveJet 300 (not A) series have a USB port but it is "not operational" (I suspect this is firmware rather than hardware).

You can get remote control by upgrading to a LAN or GPIB port (v.expensive though at around £400).

BUT the LeCroy Logic Studio only talks to the WaveJet (300A series) via the USB not the LAN or GPIB.

Why don't they at least make the LogicStudio software talk to the LAN, and perhaps bundle the LAN interface with Logic Studio or they could charge to upgrade the USB port to make it operational (it is there and physically wired in - at least when I plug it into my pc with the LeCroy driver loaded it registers it as functioning ok - you just can't change the menu item to make the oscilloscope act remotely).

(OK when LogicStudio came out the A series had been out a while but it doesn't fit in well with LeCroy's statements about providing long term support to their products.)

[AndyC_772]

I'm sure it will convince some university administrator that they don't need to buy function gens and DMMs for the lab. That's one less Agilent 34401A per bench, in exchange for an option Agilent will probably give them for free. Good trade

You ARE kidding, right? The DVM option is just a very basic voltmeter and frequency counter, it can't measure current or resistance at all. There's absolutely no way anyone could confuse the two or think that one could ever substitute for the other.

[ben_r_]

So what features does the "setting date/time back" to get the trial period to be unlimited work for and how does one enable the trail period on these scopes? Will if work for the WaveGen and DVM? What about the digital decoding protocols for the Logic Analyzer?

[Wuerstchenhund]

I have a new-to-me LeCroy WaveJet 334 and I had intended at some point upgrading by getting the LeCroy Logic Studio but I find LeCroy have set things up in the following bizarre way:-

The WaveJet 300 (not A) series have a USB port but it is "not operational" (I suspect this is firmware rather than hardware).

If the port on your Wavejet 300 is not operational then it is defective. Both 300 and 300A have USB 1.1 ports, and the 300 manual lists how it can be used to store waveforms on USB flash drives.

And it's unlikely to be the firmware as both 300 and 300A seem to use the same image.

I guess the main reason why the LogicStudio lists the 300A as requirement is because the WaveJet 300 is no longer supported, and if a product is no longer supported then a manufacturer won't test new products like the LogicStudio for compatibility with it. And that's not just LeCroy, any manufacturer does the same.

There is really nothing bizarre in this in any way.

However, I wouldn't be surprised if you find that LogicStudio works just fine with your Wavejet 334 (maybe just needs the latest firmware), with the only disadvantage that if you run into troubles then you're on your own as you would be running an unsupported configuration.

(OK when LogicStudio came out the A series had been out a while but it doesn't fit in well with LeCroy's statements about providing long term support to their products.)

IIRC when LogicStudio came out the WaveJet 300 was already out of support, and as the Wavejet non-A must have come out around 2003-2004 and was retired around 201072011 that makes still for 7 years of support.

Also, don't forget that the WaveJet Series is a upper entry level product, and you can't realistically expect the same support as for a midrange/highend scope like the Waverunners or LabMasters. Not to forget that the WaveJets were designed by Iwatsu.

Again, this is normal practice. Go to Agilent or Tek and you'll find the same. All the options of the Agilent DSO-X2000 Series won't mean a thing once it has reached EOL status.

[jpb]

If the port on your Wavejet 300 is not operational then it is defective. Both 300 and 300A have USB 1.1 ports, and the 300 manual lists how it can be used to store waveforms on USB flash drives.

And it's unlikely to be the firmware as both 300 and 300A seem to use the same image.

I guess the main reason why the LogicStudio lists the 300A as requirement is because the WaveJet 300 is no longer supported, and if a product is no longer supported then a manufacturer won't test new products like the LogicStudio for compatibility with it. And that's not just LeCroy, any manufacturer does the same.

The front USB port works fine - I've used it to save data and screens to a USB stick. I was referring to the rear USB port which is the one used for control. This has a sticker over it saying non-operational (as do all the 300 series). My unit isn't faulty, this is true of all the non-A series (the LeCroy technical support person confirmed that this was the case and told me that my only options were to either try and swap my scope for the A series or to simply look at the waveforms on the scope rather than the pc and allow for extra 100 nsecs of trigger delay).

The firmware detects that it is a 300 series scope and when you go into the Remote menu the option to turn USB on is set to be just off. The help menu states that it is the WJ300A series only.

The A series came out in 2007 I think - my scope was late 2006. The LogicStudio came out in 2010 I think. The decision was made not to support the pre-A series even though they were only 4 years old. I understand that it is a low level product but it is not so cheap as to be throw-away after less than 5 years.

My main grumble is that it would be very easy for them to have supported the pre-A series, even if this was just via the LAN port. I suspect that the rear USB port is actually functional and is just locked out via firmware. On their web site, LeCroy have written under the subject of retrofitting features :

"When technically feasible, we make product extensions and new features available for existing equipment. These may include capabilities associated with an "A" version of a product as well as features enabled by software/firmware upgrades."

It is just a minor grumble though, I am generally very happy with the scope which I got at a bargain price - in a way I'm looking a gift-horse in the mouth, I'm just frustrated that I have what appears to be a functioning rear USB port and can't use it probably because of a single flag in the menu system in the firmware!

[Wuerstchenhund]

The front USB port works fine - I've used it to save data and screens to a USB stick. I was referring to the rear USB port which is the one used for control. This has a sticker over it saying non-operational (as do all the 300 series).

Ah, ok, then it's probably a hardware limitation. Maybe a problem with the USB controller.

The A series came out in 2007 I think - my scope was late 2006. The LogicStudio came out in 2010 I think. The decision was made not to support the pre-A series even though they were only 4 years old. I understand that it is a low level product but it is not so cheap as to be throw-away after less than 5 years.

I understand your frustration, but I don't think you can say that the scope is a throw-away just because LogicStudio doesn't work with it. It still does all it should do, and quite frankly the requirements for LogicStudio are clearly listed in the spec sheet on the LeCroy homepage.

And if there is a hardware issue then there's not much LeCroy could have done anyways.

My main grumble is that it would be very easy for them to have supported the pre-A series, even if this was just via the LAN port. I suspect that the rear USB port is actually functional and is just locked out via firmware. On their web site, LeCroy have written under the subject of retrofitting features :

"When technically feasible, we make product extensions and new features available for existing equipment. These may include capabilities associated with an "A" version of a product as well as features enabled by software/firmware upgrades."

Well, the thing is that if the 300 Series does not support USB client mode or the rear port is otherwise flaky then there is not much LeCroy could have done. Using LAN may or may not have worked with the 300 Series, but at the end of the day the LogicStudio is an USB device and not a LAN device. Of course they could have added LAN but that would mean much higher complexity and as a result a much higher price, something which they probably found that their customers aren't willing to accept.

It is just a minor grumble though, I am generally very happy with the scope which I got at a bargain price - in a way I'm looking a gift-horse in the mouth, I'm just frustrated that I have what appears to be a functioning rear USB port and can't use it probably because of a single flag in the menu system in the firmware!

I see your frustration, but knowing LeCroy I am very sure that there is a reason why the port doesn't work. Also don't forget that the WaveJets are actually Iwatsu scopes (designed and built by Iwatsu) which LeCroy just happens to sell under their own label. So they probably have less influence in changes going into these scopes than they do for LeCroy designed scopes.

[jpb]

I understand your frustration, but I don't think you can say that the scope is a throw-away just because LogicStudio doesn't work with it. It still does all it should do, and quite frankly the requirements for LogicStudio are clearly listed in the spec sheet on the LeCroy homepage.

You're right of course. Given its present price of nearly £1500 (about what I paid for the scope) I'm unlikely to buy the LogicStudio anyway. I don't consider the scope throw away, I was merely indicating what I assume LeCroy's logic was.

Well, the thing is that if the 300 Series does not support USB client mode or the rear port is otherwise flaky then there is not much LeCroy could have done. Using LAN may or may not have worked with the 300 Series, but at the end of the day the LogicStudio is an USB device and not a LAN device. Of course they could have added LAN but that would mean much higher complexity and as a result a much higher price, something which they probably found that their customers aren't willing to accept.

LeCroy's free wavestudio software is quite happy to talk to the scopes over the LAN so I can't believe it would be a major upgrade to the software. But given that all the A series already had a USB link provided, very few customers would have added LAN as an option given that it costs £400 so the possible customer base for such an addition would be tiny and not worth investing any money in.

The main cause of my frustration is when I bought the scope it was advertised as being an A series, it was only when it arrived I found it was a 300 series. I could have sent it back but a 350MHz 4 channel scope for less than £1500 was too much of a bargain to give up on just because it didn't have USB remote control.

[ben_r_]

Well I jumped. Just ordered an MSOX2024A base model for $1850 as a Certi Prime refurb from Agilent via eBay. Full warranty, brand new condition, all accessories and packaging included. Couldnt say no. Now just gotta sell my Tektronix TDS2014C.

[HackedFridgeMagnet]

I jumped too, I offered US$1950 instead of US$1850 as I was worried I wouldn't get one.

There is still at least one left.

They charged me 10% on top,  duty ,GST, Vat etc. The payment type is called  'incoterm DDP'.  I wasn't expecting them to add it on although I knew I was going to have to pay it somewhere.

Learn something new everyday.

[EEVblog]

Well I jumped. Just ordered an MSOX2024A base model for $1850 as a Certi Prime refurb from Agilent via eBay. Full warranty, brand new condition, all accessories and packaging included. Couldnt say no. Now just gotta sell my Tektronix TDS2014C.

For those playing along, Agilent have new video up comparing the new DSOX2000 with the Tek DPO2000

[EEVblog]

I jumped too, I offered US$1950 instead of US$1850 as I was worried I wouldn't get one.

For the MSOX2024A?
That's $3700 excluding GST here in Oz
Nice score.

[ben_r_]

Yep, and they seem to have quite a few as they keep relisting them. They also discount most of the add-ons/options/upgrades quite heavily as well.

[jpb]

My 3054A says the rise time of a 1.0Vpp square wave, generated by the internal wavegen and with the scope input set to 50 Ohm, is 18.3ns. The fall time is exactly the same.

For comparison, if I set my Rigol DG4062 to generate a square pulse using the Arb function, the rise and fall times are 2.8ns. (Oddly, this figure increases to 9.8ns if I use the built in square wave function... an artificial software limitation of the 60MHz model, I presume).

I don't think the extra rise time is down to software, I think that the standard waveforms have extra filtering which is not applied to the arb output (the arb output goes through the 150/160MHz image reject filter but is not further filtered). I guess the three different models in the DG range have different output filters. I would guess the built in square wave has less ringing than one done on the arb.

[grego]

Yep, and they seem to have quite a few as they keep relisting them. They also discount most of the add-ons/options/upgrades quite heavily as well.

Or people aren't completing their transactions.

It's a pretty good deal for the price.  I think there are better out there but if you want an Agilent you can't beat the offer.  I just did some price calcs and to get the 2024A at the ebay price of $1850USD, then add in LAN, the memory upgrade, I2C/SPI decode, CAN decode, and segmented memory at 66% off (which is what they are listing on the ebay offer for the LAN and segmented memory, plus 90% of list for the decodes based on what my vendor has quoted me) it comes out to $3417.  Quite a lot there once you add the goodies in.

[Hydrawerk]

For those playing along, Agilent have new video up comparing the new DSOX2000 with the Tek DPO2000

Well, why do they compare a 2-channel Tek with 4-channel Agilent?  The Tek is an obsolete machine from year 2008, but it still has the search function and possibility to place marks. Agilent probably doesn't have this. 

[Tooms]

Now i am jump in also with the most expansive item that Dave got me to buy 

So i have just pickup an Agilent msox 3000 scope

it is an MSOX 3024A demo unit with LAN/VGA, WaveGen, DVM and the 3 year warrent for 3900£(with the danish 25% sales tax)

Because it is an demo unit then it has all options enabled for 90 days so i can test them and then i can request trial keys later on also, so i will wait with buying other options for now.


only issue is that one logic wire on the first logic pod has a danage wire that i not see when i collected the item, but i will ask them to replace the wire.


Now i just has to learn all the functions it has.


Tooms

[ben_r_]

Yep, and they seem to have quite a few as they keep relisting them. They also discount most of the add-ons/options/upgrades quite heavily as well.

Or people aren't completing their transactions.

It's a pretty good deal for the price.  I think there are better out there but if you want an Agilent you can't beat the offer.  I just did some price calcs and to get the 2024A at the ebay price of $1850USD, then add in LAN, the memory upgrade, I2C/SPI decode, CAN decode, and segmented memory at 66% off (which is what they are listing on the ebay offer for the LAN and segmented memory, plus 90% of list for the decodes based on what my vendor has quoted me) it comes out to $3417.  Quite a lot there once you add the goodies in.

Add this new promotion into your calculating:
http://www.home.agilent.com/agilent/editorial.jspx?cc=US&lc=eng&ckey=2309757&nid=-33573.970736.00&id=2309757

And what scope are you referring to thats "better out there" for the price?

[grego]

I think the Rigol 4000 series is a bit better than the 2000 Agilent (personal opinion please, no flame wars) for what it does.  Also the Instek, on paper and with initial (limited) data seems to give the 2000 a run for its money as well for a fair bit less.

BTW - "for the price" includes the options.  You can't compare in a vacuum - Rigol and Instek include a lot more options in their "base" price.  But that's a known with Agilent.

To be clear, you can not go wrong with the Agilent!  Can't beat the name and support - that's a total win hands down.  I've been going back and forth on my scope purchase to replace my Picoscope for a while now and decided to pull the trigger on the Instek 2204A based on the information I've gotten from Instek and at least one user of the device, but that's just me.  If I had the cash and could justify it I'd jump on a 3000 Agilent without a second thought.   The 2000 model just required me to really do some more research.