| Products > Test Equipment |
| Keysight officially lost the plot - don't buy if you're a hobbyist |
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| kcbrown:
--- Quote from: nctnico on January 14, 2022, 11:26:18 pm ---So far I didn't have any problems with Acal BFI handling warranty issues. Never had to deal with Keysight directly. In general I'd avoid a reseller redirecting warranty issues to the manufacturer; it is not what I pay them for. --- End quote --- You didn't have any problems with them handling Keysight warranty issues as a non-customer? Because that's the question on the table here. If you have a good working relationship with them, you should call them up and ask them if they'd handle warranty claims on Keysight equipment that wasn't purchased from them, by someone who hasn't ever purchased from them before. Should be interesting to see what they say. |
| bdunham7:
--- Quote from: kcbrown on January 14, 2022, 11:06:48 pm ---So: which vendors will handle such claims? --- End quote --- US and EU rules are going to be a lot different. Resellers in the EU have pretty well defined obligations as the actual responsible party, whereas in the US resellers are more likely to be considered 'middlemen' that aren't legally responsible for warranty or liability issues, although this varies widely by situation (product) and state. Transcat is US Keysight reseller that doesn't wash their hands of you once you make a purchase. https://www.transcat.com/return-policy |
| rsjsouza:
--- Quote from: nctnico on January 14, 2022, 05:15:49 pm --- --- Quote from: rsjsouza on January 14, 2022, 04:40:31 pm ---- With the introduction of the entry-level product line, myself (and many others around here) also asked how successful will this be in face of the quite popular low cost brands. The DSO1000X series uses the praised Keysight ASIC that differentiated their other product lines for many years, thus at first glance would be a slam dunk of usability when compared to others - however, whenever someone from the mass market asks on a forum like this for an opinion, rarely sees their products suggested due to a perceived low "bang-per-buck" ratio. Sure, the other brands have other features deemed more useful (and quite a few of them are), therefore I can't help but think that Keysight realized this might have been a miscalculation on their part - at least for the mass market (education might still be fine). --- End quote --- Define mass market. You have to realise that this forum has a huge bias towards Rigol and Siglent. A brand like GW Instek is hardly ever mentioned. However, if you look at revenue you'll see that GW Instek is bigger than Rigol and Siglent combined. --- End quote --- Mass market is everything that abides by the laws of consumer protection - retail, not B2B or negotiated contracts. Things you can buy over the counter. For many years the bias towards these brands has reduced a lot around here. I participate in forums where Fnirsi is considered a Rigol and Rigol as R&S; other forums and discussion groups I attend have B-brands recommended all the time. If there is a forum biased towards Instek, Keysight, R&S and others and we could have a more balanced view; otherwise, this is what is widely available. Besides, unfortunately revenue alone means very little to get an idea on market coverage. --- Quote from: SilverSolder on January 14, 2022, 06:02:31 pm ---Audi, BMW, Mercedes, Lexus all show that A-brands can thrive with a healthy price premium. They don't try to grow sales by offering cheaper prices, they do it by making customers feel they are getting something for their money! Things like reputation, styling, "feel", quality, and service differentiates them. Introducing a "low end of the range" model range can be a good idea (e.g. Mercedes A-class or BMW 1-series). This gives entry level aspirational buyers a way into the brand. This is how I always saw the DSO1000X series: the entry level to a premium brand. --- End quote --- I agree with you regarding the differentiation. However, these brands are not refusing to fix your car, they are just charging $200 to change the oil of your A-class Merc - according to the reports here, Keysight is not giving you the option to change the oil and the reps/disties will not commit without mfg backing or do this for free. --- Quote from: SilverSolder on January 14, 2022, 06:02:31 pm ---As to why this series doesn't get recommended much... goes back to your first point about what kind of buyer makes up the bulk of the market. Most hobby/private buyers are looking for acceptably well performing tools at the lowest possible absolute price. Keysight is probably OK with only picking up a relatively small percentage of aspirational buyers from this pool! --- End quote --- Fully agree, although never forget that management changes happen and can cause tectonic shifts in the approach to the mass market. Highvoltage's post is on point: the absence of the regulars here may have signs of such shift. I have been in the same shoes in the past and had to deal with the frustration of a market segment that I had to leave orphaned. It is not fun to do this. |
| kcbrown:
--- Quote from: bdunham7 on January 14, 2022, 11:40:39 pm ---US and EU rules are going to be a lot different. Resellers in the EU have pretty well defined obligations as the actual responsible party, whereas in the US resellers are more likely to be considered 'middlemen' that aren't legally responsible for warranty or liability issues, although this varies widely by situation (product) and state. --- End quote --- That may be, but even in the US, Keysight is apparently demanding proof that one is a business. --- Quote ---Transcat is US Keysight reseller that doesn't wash their hands of you once you make a purchase. https://www.transcat.com/return-policy --- End quote --- Ah, very nice. But: will they do that for equipment not purchased from them? That is the real question on the table here. Nico's claim is that resellers will behave like car dealerships. Any given car dealership will handle warranty claims from anyone who purchased the dealer's brand, irrespective of whether it was from that dealership or not. And that is most certainly in question, even in the EU. While the EU may demand that resellers be responsible for handling anything purchased from them, that's vastly different from demanding that they handle anything from a brand they offer for sale even when it wasn't purchased from them. Quite clearly, at least some resellers are not obligated by Keysight's contract with them to handle warranty claims from their customers, much less all Keysight owners. That is a fundamental difference between T&M resellers and auto dealerships, the latter of which are contractually obligated (or, at least, financially incentivized) to handle warranty claims by all owners of the brand. |
| SilverSolder:
It seems doubtful to me that Keysight would really leave customers high and dry with respect to equipment they have already purchased directly from Keysight, even if they change the model for future purchasers... That would be so unprofessional that it could only happen to a company in severe decay... on the other hand, look at what happened to Boeing... |
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