Keysight U173xC series LCR meter shows ESR and capacity at once?

[carl_lab]

Please can owner of that meter verify if ESR is displayed at the same time as capacitance?
I hate switching functions while routine testing electrolytic caps...
Is that meter able to measure ESR "in-circuit"?

[sd]

For the U1733C at least I don't think ESR and capacitance can be displayed at the same time. The meter has dual display, the main display can show Z/L/C/R while the secondary one can show D/Q/? . Better check the manual though.

[TheAmmoniacal]

I do not believe it can, the secondary display is only for D, Q and phase, you have to switch between capacitance and ESR on the primary display.

I just tried it on my U1733C

[electrolust]

Confirmed, it cannot.  Is there a HH LCR meter that does have simultaneous ESR display?

[rjardina]

Confirmed, it cannot.  Is there a HH LCR meter that does have simultaneous ESR display?

Extech LCR200, & DER EE DE-5000 can?

[carl_lab]

Thanks for all the replies.

Extech LCR200: nice I could buy at Conrad in Germany for about 250 Euro (~250 $).

DER EE DE-5000: Not bad in the specs (0.3% for R and C, best of), 120$ at ebay...

What do you think, is Keysight better than Extech, and Extech better than DER EE?
Is the specs of DER EE (and Extech) real or just wishful thinking?

[tautech]

Smart tweezers do C and ESR simultaneously and will stretch over a reasonable sized TH cap leads too.

If you do any SMD they could be worth considering.
http://www.smarttweezers.com/st5s/

[carl_lab]

If you do any SMD they could be worth considering.
http://www.smarttweezers.com/st5s/

Thanks. 300$ is much money for such a little toy...

[HighVoltage]

What do you think, is Keysight better than Extech, and Extech better than DER EE?
Is the specs of DER EE (and Extech) real or just wishful thinking?

I had a DER DE-5000, the Extech and a few others of handheld LCR meters and sold them all, after I got the Keysight U1733C
I don't think there is any other handheld that can beat the Keysight in functionality, accuracy and quality.
It is just that the price is pretty high for the U1733C, 500 Euro + Tax in Germany.

[carl_lab]

I had a DER DE-5000, the Extech and a few others of handheld LCR meters and sold them all, after I got the Keysight U1733C

Why have you sold them?

[Hensingler]

I don't think there is any other handheld that can beat the Keysight in functionality, accuracy and quality.

The U1733C is Chinese garbage with an expensive Keysight badge.

Functionality is rubbish, every firmware version buggy until they stopped providing firmware updates because the garbage firmware update system bricked too many meters.

The OP probably doesn't understand that ESR, D, Q, and theta are just different ways of displaying the same measurement result. If the meter wasn't such utter garbage it would just change the display when you press the ESR button, but, it forces an auto range cycle and incredibly annoyingly deletes any single point calibration, the calibration you had to do because you were trying to measure small ESRs without 4 terminals. You can't switch between ZLRC without auto ranging and loosing calibration either. The firmware was specified/designed by idiots.

Maybe the current firmware is less garbage, but, without support for firmware update I will never know.

[HighVoltage]

I had a DER DE-5000, the Extech and a few others of handheld LCR meters and sold them all, after I got the Keysight U1733C

Why have you sold them?

I have several high end bench-top LCR instruments and only need one handheld LCR meter for traveling.
In addition, I have the smart tweezers that work really well for some applications, especially SMD selection and in circuit measurement.

[HighVoltage]

I don't think there is any other handheld that can beat the Keysight in functionality, accuracy and quality.

The U1733C is Chinese garbage with an expensive Keysight badge.

Functionality is rubbish, every firmware version buggy until they stopped providing firmware updates because the garbage firmware update system bricked too many meters.

The OP probably doesn't understand that ESR, D, Q, and theta are just different ways of displaying the same measurement result. If the meter wasn't such utter garbage it would just change the display when you press the ESR button, but, it forces an auto range cycle and incredibly annoyingly deletes any single point calibration, the calibration you had to do because you were trying to measure small ESRs without 4 terminals. You can't switch between ZLRC without auto ranging and loosing calibration either. The firmware was specified/designed by idiots.

Maybe the current firmware is less garbage, but, without support for firmware update I will never know.

Well, opinions obviously differ a lot, when it comes to the favorite lab instrument.

To be honest, I found the DER DE-5000 and the Extech belong to the category of garbage quality, compared to other quality handheld instruments I have. But others have raved about those two.

Somehow the Keysight U1733C works really well for measurements I have to do when I am traveling to customers and use this instrument for mainly L and C verification.

I have not touched the FW that was installed when I bought this U1733C and I have no issues at all.

[Hensingler]

Well, opinions obviously differ a lot, when it comes to the favorite lab instrument.

There is no opinion about it the U1733C is garbage (unless they have better firmware that I can't get). You just haven't noticed in your limited usage. Have you ever done a single point O/S calibration?

[HighVoltage]

Well, opinions obviously differ a lot, when it comes to the favorite lab instrument.

There is no opinion about it the U1733C is garbage (unless they have better firmware that I can't get). You just haven't noticed in your limited usage.

I bought my U1733C at the end of 2016, not sure what FW is installed.

Have you ever done a single point O/S calibration?

No!
Please explain what you do?
I do a lot of calibration work for L and C and for that purpose I only use calibrated bench top LCR instruments.

[Hensingler]

No!
Please explain what you do?
I do a lot of calibration work for L and C and for that purpose I only use calibrated bench top LCR instruments.

And presumably do open and short calibration on your test leads and jigs every time you use them.

Holding down the Ai button while powering on shows firmware version, mine 00.27 which I believe was last version you could download and IMO worse than the previous version but the stupid klunky firmware upgrade system would not allow a newer version to be replaced.

For a single point O/S calibration with what you want to measure connected to establish the range hold down the Cal button - you will then be prompted to open the test leads (and press Cal) then short the test leads (and press Cal). You should now have a fresh offset/stray calibration of meter and leads for that range and frequency which is required to make the most accurate measurement.

With 00.27 firmware some range/frequency single point calibrations are just garbage like 2000uF @ 100Hz after which the capacitance reading is just noise. If it did work the annoyance is the calibration is lost as soon as you change measurement display mode like ZLCR or ESR. If you wanted to accurately measure capacitance and ESR you would have to do a calibration in each mode which is stupid.

You can also do and store and use user calibration of all ranges/frequencies which takes longer and doesn't seem to be bugged.

[PA0PBZ]

Is there a HH LCR meter that does have simultaneous ESR display?

Not sure if it qualifies as a HH, but Mastech MS5308 can do that, it's a decent meter as long as you don't use the included power supply (search the forum).
Price about $150

[electrolust]

If the meter wasn't such utter garbage it would just change the display when you press the ESR button, but, it forces an auto range cycle and incredibly annoyingly deletes any single point calibration, the calibration you had to do because you were trying to measure small ESRs without 4 terminals. You can't switch between ZLRC without auto ranging and loosing calibration either. The firmware was specified/designed by idiots.

Maybe the current firmware is less garbage, but, without support for firmware update I will never know.

My firmware is 0.24.  I bought it on the Fry's 50% off clearance sale, it's NOS Agilent branded.  (Info so you can date the firmware rev.)

I didn't try ESR, but I can switch to DCR and back to L, and it doesn't go out of manual ranging mode.  Usually.  Sometimes it does, I can't yet figure out how to repro.

How would you know if you lost the cal?  There's no indication on the display that calibration is in effect. Do you figure it by seeing the C value change, after you switch from auto-range back to manual range?

[sd]

Regarding the U1733C OS active calibration, there is an indication in the upper left corner.

If you just power on the meter it will display either "OS-Factory" or "OS-User". Pressing the "Cal" button and doing a quick O/S calibration will make that OS-Factory/OS-User symbol disappear.
Switching measurement mode (Z/L/C/R) or the frequency does bring back the "OS-Factory"/"OS-User" calibration.

Regarding OS-User calibration, you can run this by holding button "Cal" pressed and turning on the meter. This will take significantly longer than the quick calibration as it will calibrate for all the ranges, frequencies etc.

From the meter setup menu (hold "ZLCR" button when powering on the meter) you can select the default OS calibration, either OS-Factory or OS-User.

This is described in the manual:

"The corrections for the OS-Factory and OS-User are
pre- stored in the LCR meter. They are both calibrated at the
terminal ends.
You can set the LCR meter to start up using the OS-Factory
or OS-User open/short correction from the Setup menu (see
page 60).
There are three types of open/short corrections available:
• OS- Factory: Re- calibration requires you to enter the LCR
meter’s calibration mode (security code protected)
• OS- User: Re- calibration is possible through the power- on
options (see page 10).
• Quick range: Single range and frequency as required by
pressing and holding the "Cal" key for more than 1 second"


I've never had any problems with the meter showing garbage after quick calibration. My meter is running FW version 03.06.

[electrolust]

Regarding the U1733C OS active calibration, there is an indication in the upper left corner.

If you just power on the meter it will display either "OS-Factory" or "OS-User". Pressing the "Cal" button and doing a quick O/S calibration will make that OS-Factory/OS-User symbol disappear.
Switching measurement mode (Z/L/C/R) or the frequency does bring back the "OS-Factory"/"OS-User" calibration.

Mine (FW ver 0.24) doesn't do that.  The OS symbol remains as it was at startup, at all times.  (Except during ESR/DCR when it is always absent.)

No wonder I couldn't make sense of these labels based on the manual.

EDIT: correction, mine does operate this way.  It also loses the cal when you press pretty much any button.  It's pretty unusable.

[Hensingler]

Switching measurement mode (Z/L/C/R) or the frequency does bring back the "OS-Factory"/"OS-User" calibration.

ZLCR ESR D Q and theta are not measurement modes, they are display modes. The measurement is exactly the same which is why auto ranging and loosing calibration is so dumb. You can cycle round D, Q and theta instantly but not ZLCR or ESR which is idiotic. And lol at a special ESR mode anyway which is for people too dumb to understand ESR is just R in a series equivalent circuit.

[zaoka]

This tester is really cool, ESR & capacitance at the same time....

http://www.peakelec.co.uk/acatalog/jz_esr70.html

[HighVoltage]

I have one of these Peak Electronics ESR meters and it works really well and fast for ESR measurements.
Especially "in circuit" measurements.

[carl_lab]

I have one of these Peak Electronics ESR meters and it works really well and fast for ESR measurements.
Especially "in circuit" measurements.

Would you prefer PEAK to U173xC series for trouble-shooting?

[HighVoltage]

I have one of these Peak Electronics ESR meters and it works really well and fast for ESR measurements.
Especially "in circuit" measurements.

Would you prefer PEAK to U173xC series for trouble-shooting?

For troubleshooting electrolytic capacitors and get a fast reliable reading, definitely the PEAK Electronics ESR + meter. But keep in mind, it is limited to do only that!