Just got a Power designs 2010 in very nice condition for $60.00 on ebay today. Anxious to see how it performs.
Just got a Power designs 2020 (20V 2A other specs same as 2005) in excellent condition for $85.00 on ebay today. They are hiding in many places on ebay. A simple "Power Designs" search does not show them all.
You bought another? Good for you! I'm watching many of them, so you must be the one buying some as I see only single buyers on 2 units in the past week ;) ... but if our review means anything later on, it could be hard to find cheaply. Enjoy!
Service, user and schematics for the 2005, 2010, 5020 and C500 are available as pdfs. The schematics show some of the designs are so simple, its amazing such stability can be had so simply.
Likewise, many of the popular general PD PSU have manuals, such as that pictured in the Jim Williams post.
This was the first. I was the only bidder ..
This was the second. Was asking $119.99 ..
There are many in much worse condition and more money I was very fortunate thanks to your heads up on these supplies :)Service, user and schematics for the 2005, 2010, 5020 and C500 are available as pdfs. The schematics show some of the designs are so simple, its amazing such stability can be had so simply.
Likewise, many of the popular general PD PSU have manuals, such as that pictured in the Jim Williams post.
saturation, do you have links to these pdfs? I have looked some and only found them available for sale not free.
Thanks, robrenz
I own a BK Precision GPS-4303 PSU which I absolutely love. It is a 4 channel power supply, but you can get a 2 or 3 channel one for cheaper (around $200 - $400).
One thing I would like to mention as you say you are a beginner, is don't expect to find a PSU that offers quality constant current operation. When we refer to setting the current on a PSU it means the maximum current. It is always the voltage that is kept constant, and Ohm's Law can be used to determine how much current that will yield (I = V/R). If you set the voltage to a greater value than can be achieved while maintaining the max current dialed in, then effectively it will be a constant current source, but don't rely on this; it will over/under shoot and may fail altogether.
saturation, thanks for the help. I still need to find the 2010 manual. The googledocs was for 2020 not 2010 (I am not complaining :)).
I got the first unit (the 2010) today. Wow, as Dave would say "pure electronic equipment pornography" As a machinist I especially appreciate the quality of the knobs and dials. Voltage output is well within spec and front and rear panel are mint condition. Only the case paint needs a little help but I cant believe I got this for $60.00
Thanks again for all the info.
I agree about the manual similarity and that these power suppies are unbelievable.
100mV setting. stat mode on the 8846A 6.5 digit 100nplc digital filter
1 hour AVG 99.99839 mV 1.75 uV min-max span SD of .392 uV
3 hour AVG 99.99873 mV 2.93 uV min-max span SD of .667 uV
6 hour AVG 99.99935 mV 3.33 uV min-max span SD of .855 uV
My 8846A shorted input DC 24hr stability min-max span is 1.15 uV ! :o
Full 1A load output ripple measured with 8846A on AC is 15.8 uV max.
I know this is way out of the guaranteed specs of the 8846A but I did some crude testing here https://www.eevblog.com/forum/product-reviews-photos-and-discussion/low-level-ac-performance-of-fluke-8846a/msg76514/#msg76514 (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/product-reviews-photos-and-discussion/low-level-ac-performance-of-fluke-8846a/msg76514/#msg76514) that shows it is way better than the specs and does not put out bogus numbers down here like some meters aparently do.
I don't know about you but I might replace that mV pot with a 10 turn and a turns counter. It is very hard to set 1uv levels with that 1 turn pot.
I just switched to 1V instead of .1V and the min-max span is 16uV with a SD of 4.6uV for 2 hours run time. So it looks like it may be a percentage of output voltage just like the spec implies. What voltage are you testing at?
This is the turns counter I quickly found. This is the model with no brake. It is available with brake also.
http://www.alliedelec.com/search/productdetail.aspx?SKU=70125994 (http://www.alliedelec.com/search/productdetail.aspx?SKU=70125994)
(https://www.eevblog.com/forum/beginners/looking-for-goodinexpensive-bench-power-supply/?action=dlattach;attach=23195;image)
@ saturation
I have deoxit 5 for the switches and also gold, and I use the fader lube for pots. but its good to get a thumbs up on using it. I get the bottled liquid instead of the spray. If I need to spray it I put a drop or two in a fine solder paste dispensing needle and put it on my paste dispenser and give it a 70psi blast. With that you can get into places the spray cans cant touch.
Should we start a new thread for these PD suppies and ask for the PD related stuff here to be moved/copied to it?
10 volts is showing 16uv span and 2.3uV SD for 15 mins
Damn, 10 Mega Volt
Those are great ideas for applying deoxit, you think the spray can with nozzle is still not fine enough?
Those are great ideas for applying deoxit, you think the spray can with nozzle is still not fine enough?
I don't have a problem with spray cans. I just like the versatility and cost effectiveness of the bottles or tubes. You never run out of propellant pressure with my method and you can swab every last drop out of the bottle. I keep a micro brush applicator http://www.microbrush.com/automotive/products/microbrush/index.asp (http://www.microbrush.com/automotive/products/microbrush/index.asp) with each bottle for non spray application. I have more control with the hypodermic/paste dispenser method as to the amount and where it goes. a carefully located drilled source (and drain if needed) micro holes in a switch or pot can allow cleaning and lube without disassembly. You can put as much IPA or your favorite cleaning solvent into a glue dispenser syringe as you feel appropriate and inject it under pressure. Then take the piston out of the syringe and blow it out with just the air. Then blast the conditioner or lube in.
I own a BK Precision GPS-4303 PSU which I absolutely love. It is a 4 channel power supply, but you can get a 2 or 3 channel one for cheaper (around $200 - $400).
One thing I would like to mention as you say you are a beginner, is don't expect to find a PSU that offers quality constant current operation. When we refer to setting the current on a PSU it means the maximum current. It is always the voltage that is kept constant, and Ohm's Law can be used to determine how much current that will yield (I = V/R). If you set the voltage to a greater value than can be achieved while maintaining the max current dialed in, then effectively it will be a constant current source, but don't rely on this; it will over/under shoot and may fail altogether.
Thanks for the information about the current settings. The reason I'm interested in that setting is to test circuit designs under less than ideal power. Ie failing or low battery.
Here's another test you can run on the PD supplies, current sourcing. An idea current source is fully independent of output voltage, so in theory it outputs full current near "zero" volts.
In reality most supplies can't. However, the 2020B can pull rated amps, >2.2A on my test, set at 200mV, 1.3A at 100mV, and still gradually down the line as you approach zero VDC.
By comparison, my Chinese Mastech supply requires 1.0VDC to output its rated 3A, and drops quickly to 30mA at 600mV.
Here's another test you can run on the PD supplies, current sourcing. An idea current source is fully independent of output voltage, so in theory it outputs full current near "zero" volts.
In reality most supplies can't. However, the 2020B can pull rated amps, >2.2A on my test, set at 200mV, 1.3A at 100mV, and still gradually down the line as you approach zero VDC.
By comparison, my Chinese Mastech supply requires 1.0VDC to output its rated 3A, and drops quickly to 30mA at 600mV.
I tried that on my 2010 and 2020 and got similar results to you. Then I thought let me see what my Mastech 3030 triple supply does. It only required 6.5mV to drive the full 3A. A Chinese unit performing better than the PD supplies :o how can that be? Then I realized I shorted the output on the Mastech with my 3" heavy 8awg banana jumpers I made for paralleling the outputs. When I tested the PD units I used a 7" long piece of 20awg solid wire that was laying around. I retested the PD units with the heavy jumper and They both drive full amperage at approx. 6mV also. It makes sense to me now, the power supply has to put out at least the voltage drop across the short. So the 6.5mV at 3A means the total "short" resistance seen at the output was 2.16mOhm. My lesson learned, use very short shorts.
3. Mastech TRIPLE LINEAR DC POWER SUPPLY 30V 5A HY3005F-3
I've been drooling over the Mastech supply for a while now.
Robenz, I think you are measuring the resistance of the posts themselves, rather than anything else.........
And there I though using a thick copper foil as a zero ohm resistor was good enough........
So just to prove to myself that the short resistance is a big deal in CC testing I made a super short pictured here. .625 diameter tellurium copper with gold plated beryllium copper banana jacks.
...
Can you the Power Designs supplies sold in the US run off 230V 60Hz? Or is a step-down transformer required? Getting a supply from the states to Europe might be worth it for me if I can use it without much modification or having to buy extra equipment.
edit: After looking at a few manuals, it seems some models have a jumper on the power transformer for 240V operation and some may not. If anyone knows for sure please let me know.
As the users post them, they will be here. Some are already loaded:
http://www.ko4bb.com/manuals/ (http://www.ko4bb.com/manuals/)
The crazy part is that supply cost me $60.99 + shipping on ebay plus a $3.45 fuse. But the perfomance cannot be touched even by $400 to $600 modern supplies.
2005 weighs 9 pounds. 2020B weighs 13 pounds. I only see 4 of the precision units on US Ebay currently. Dont worry I am not buying any more of these.
The second 2005 I got continued to blow the 1 amp fuse. Three fuses later I see it happens when I move the current limit pot through its range and I noticed a spike in the needle on the amp gage. So it was the momentary open circuit on the pot that was spiking the current and blowing the fuse. So I took the pot apart to clean and lube but I kept getting a jump on my fluke87 ohms reading in roughly the same places. So half an hour later after ultrasonic cleaning and microscope inspection of every single turn of wire in the pot and still seeing the glitch in the pot travel. I finally realize the jump is the range change on the meter, not a open in the pot travel. lock the range on the meter and no problem :-[
The range change was on my fluke meter as I swept through the whole range of the 10k pot. The current limit pot was dirty and did go open as you moved it through the range. But when I had the pot apart and was checking the resistance before I put it together again I was thinking the blink when the range changed was a open circuit. So for half an hour at least I was searching for a problem that was not there. When I locked the range on the meter the pot was fine after cleaning. Quite embarrassing :-[
The current limit pot was dirty and did go open as you moved it through the range.Blowing fuses when a pot goes OC for a short time sounds like a design flaw to me. One should always assume that pots might go OC, especially the wire wound ones that might have a single bad turn.
For very accurate voltage creation you can use to check A to D converters, see my pal Mark Thoren's presentation on buffering a Deka-pot to give a precise output voltage: http://www.edn.com/video/video.php/?bclid=1028763155&bctid=1026280202 (http://www.edn.com/video/video.php/?bclid=1028763155&bctid=1026280202) "[/i]Video doesn't work here. I guess it's that nice cheap DIY design requiring a $4k+ pot? Seems Paul is a bit out of touch with the people that have limited budgets.
The current limit pot was dirty and did go open as you moved it through the range.
Blowing fuses when a pot goes OC for a short time sounds like a design flaw to me. One should always assume that pots might go OC, especially the wire wound ones that might have a single bad turn.
For very accurate voltage creation you can use to check A to D converters, see my pal Mark Thoren's presentation on buffering a Deka-pot to give a precise output voltage: http://www.edn.com/video/video.php/?bclid=1028763155&bctid=1026280202 (http://www.edn.com/video/video.php/?bclid=1028763155&bctid=1026280202) "[/i]
Video doesn't work here. I guess it's that nice cheap DIY design requiring a $4k+ pot? Seems Paul is a bit out of touch with the people that have limited budgets.
Calibration is very easy and covered in the manual. Then it will agree with your best meter at 0V and 20V which is better than no calibration at all. Make sure you use the corresponding manual. AFIK the one in the Paul Rako article is for the version with the large horizontal meter (2005). There is another one for the unit with the thin vertical meter (2005A). From my experience let it warm up at least an hour before calibration. If you have not had it on much since you bought it I would let it burn in a couple of days straight before calibration. FWIWI think I have the same unit, the meter is the large horizontal one. I did a "burn in" after I received the unit and then I tested the stability by dialing in 10.000 V (9.993 + vernier) measured with a Rigol DM3061 6½ digit DMM. After several days the drift was about 30 µV, amazing! Now I haven't used the PSU in some time, but the dial and vernier is untouched since last time. So, I just powered it on again, connected to the same DMM and I will check on it in a few hours!
Regards, robrenz
Have you tested the Rigol with a shorting bar for its DCV stability over the same time period?No, I have not. I thought about that too, I basically measure the differential drift in two independent instrument so there is a source for error. However, when I measure things like this, the Rigol is only my "readout instrument". In parallell I usually have my Fluke 45 (100 000 counts) and my TTI 1906 "Computing Multimeter" (210 000 counts) to track. They are all within a few counts on the LSD on the Fluke.
The current limit pot was dirty and did go open as you moved it through the range.Blowing fuses when a pot goes OC for a short time sounds like a design flaw to me. One should always assume that pots might go OC, especially the wire wound ones that might have a single bad turn.
I have a 110V PD 2005, and it seems to be in a bit crusty condition.
More to come on this I'm sure...
Dave.
Please give us some notice if you do a video on it - you have a record of affecting the ebay prices of test gear :D
Thats a nice post, saturation!
I think I have the model 2005 (without "A", or is it implicit?).
Edit: When I think of it, I did a 0V calibration, but not the 20V one. Some rainy day... But I really wish I could come up with something to make it a really stable current source without external components/electronics. Maybe replace the current shunt resistor?
I have a 110V PD 2005, and it seems to be in a bit crusty condition.
More to come on this I'm sure...
Dave.
Anxiously waiting ;D
Do I recommend it? Yes. But only if you think its worth the bucks! I payed near $200 for the unit, shipping, customs, Posten's (Swedish postal services) ridiculous fees and have to walk for 1 km to lug it home. The unit in it self only cost me about $70 of the $200 if I remember correctly! :-\
Tank you again, saturation. I did not remember to check the pots when I opened the device. I wonder if they are mis-wired three terminal pots or only rheostats? If the former, a simple wire will improve the safety.
I cleansed the rotary switch contacts and now it works really well. It's linearity is good but the unit is uncalibrated. But I'm happy. The only problem I have is the current limitation, its not so stable. If I look on the schematics, its probably temp drift in the shunt resistor or the pot, as they are "non ovenized".
This photo is the trend plot of the time to roughly thermal stabilize. The total vertical range is 200uA and the horizontal is 7 hours 58 mins 40 secs. ...
I will try the same thing on a 2005A next.
Wow, I didn't know you could actually see the curve on the bench meter itself, pics worth 1000s words. Those are great results too, BTW.This photo is the trend plot of the time to roughly thermal stabilize. The total vertical range is 200uA and the horizontal is 7 hours 58 mins 40 secs. ...
I will try the same thing on a 2005A next.
Embarrassedly (is that a word? Firefox says yes but I was never good in English back in school) I do not remember the values, but it was at least as bad as my "Voltcraft" LSP-1403 (a re-branded Manison cheap SMPS PSU), say 10 mA drift in 1 hour or so. My 2005 is in "cool shutdown" at the moment, but I fired the oven up just now. So, in a few hours I will check it again (the time is 01 AM here in Sweden, so the 2005 can warmup during the night (as can my DM3061 and Fluke 45), and I will check the current tomorrow).I cleansed the rotary switch contacts and now it works really well. It's linearity is good but the unit is uncalibrated. But I'm happy. The only problem I have is the current limitation, its not so stable. If I look on the schematics, its probably temp drift in the shunt resistor or the pot, as they are "non ovenized".
MBY, how unstable is the current? I am seeing about a 1.4mA variation on a 200mA setting on one of my 2005A's on initial testing. (not completely stabilized yet)
Regards, robrenz
Wow, I didn't know you could actually see the curve on the bench meter itself, pics worth 1000s words. Those are great results too, BTW.
So, in a few hours I will check it again (the time is 01 AM here in Sweden, so the 2005 can warmup during the night (as can my DM3061 and Fluke 45), and I will check the current tomorrow).
Yes, there are lot of error sources. What I do now is to feed 200 mA through my DM3061 from another PSU to warm the measure shunt up. And my 2005 is "idling" on a setting of 10.000V with no load. My goal is to see the drift of the 2005 shunt/CC-circuit when "everything" _except_ the CC-circuits is loaded/warmed up.So, in a few hours I will check it again (the time is 01 AM here in Sweden, so the 2005 can warmup during the night (as can my DM3061 and Fluke 45), and I will check the current tomorrow).
From what I have seen so far it appears it takes quite a while for the shunts in the meter and PS to thermally stabilize with a given current setting. The trend plot of the 2010 was 8 hours before it was reasonably stable. The drift in that time was 200uA. The drift after that was only 18uA. So it appears that when you are doing current measurements in CC mode (that generate heat in the meter and DUT) it is easy to confuse instrument and DUT thermal stabilization with DUT long term drift.
what are some practical reasons for a PS this stable?
what are some practical reasons for a PS this stable?
what are some practical reasons for a PS this stable?
Yes, there are lot of error sources. What I do now is to feed 200 mA through my DM3061 from another PSU to warm the measure shunt up. And my 2005 is "idling" on a setting of 10.000V with no load. My goal is to see the drift of the 2005 shunt/CC-circuit when "everything" _except_ the CC-circuits is loaded/warmed up.So, in a few hours I will check it again (the time is 01 AM here in Sweden, so the 2005 can warmup during the night (as can my DM3061 and Fluke 45), and I will check the current tomorrow).
From what I have seen so far it appears it takes quite a while for the shunts in the meter and PS to thermally stabilize with a given current setting. The trend plot of the 2010 was 8 hours before it was reasonably stable. The drift in that time was 200uA. The drift after that was only 18uA. So it appears that when you are doing current measurements in CC mode (that generate heat in the meter and DUT) it is easy to confuse instrument and DUT thermal stabilization with DUT long term drift.
Excellent! That measurement is more relevant to everyday use than the long term fully stabilized multi day stability.Exactly my thought!
Max Min Avg Smpl
LSP-1403 150.5309 150.4018 150.4949 17420
PD 2005 147.5291 145.7476 146.1012 100
PD 2005 147.5291 143.3662 144.3162 15970
PD 2005 145.1924 143.3182 144.0457 8820
Wow, I didn't know you could actually see the curve on the bench meter itself, pics worth 1000s words. Those are great results too, BTW.
From what I have seen so far on the 2005A the CC output is much more temperature sensitive than the CV output. My first step will be to replace the current sense resistor (R26 in the 2005A schem.) that is in the CC control loop with a much lower resistive temp coefficient and higher wattage. Just holding your hand on top of the PS for a minute will spike the current. The 12 mA droop in this picture is from a gentle blast of compressed air for just a few seconds directed at the top of the PS.Thank you! The trend plot is a real killerapp! Something I'm disappointed with regarding the DM3061 is the cheap stat functions. It shows max, min, average and number of samples only. Not even standard deviation, but every cheapish sci-calculator has one!
BTW your english is great. It is infinitely better than my Swedish.
(https://www.eevblog.com/forum/product-reviews-photos-and-discussion/looking-for-goodinexpensive-bench-power-supply/?action=dlattach;attach=24881)
Having a hard time ... deciding whether the fluke meter is a multimeter or a very slow scope :-X
The resistance temperature coefficient is much more important than the precision of the resistor in this case. So make sure you know what those shunt tempco's are. I have looked and at low ohms and 3W it is hard to find anything with a tempco lower than 50 or 25ppm. I see those slow oscillations in CC also. They are there in CV mode also but are very small.
I am pretty busy with work right now so I wont be participating much for the next wee
The resistance temperature coefficient is much more important than the precision of the resistor in this case. So make sure you know what those shunt tempco's are. I have looked and at low ohms and 3W it is hard to find anything with a tempco lower than 50 or 25ppm. I see those slow oscillations in CC also. They are there in CV mode also but are very small.Yes, I was a little sloppy to call them "precision shunts" without pointing it out that I actually meant the tempco. I have an assortment with shunt resistors in 1, 2, 3 and 5 watts with incredible low tempco's. I think one of them actually is something like 2 or 5 ppm, but most are 10, 25 and 50 ppm. If and when I try to use them I will give the part numbers if I can. (Edit: The best I can find in the "low tempco"-resistor bin at the moment is 25 ppm (5W and 22 Ohm, way to high). Hmm, I'm sure that I have better ones somewhere...)
I am pretty busy with work right now so I wont be participating much for the next week or two but I will be back.
Trend plots of oscillations when supply is set for 10uV. That is 1.2886uV PP oscillation with spec. of 100uV PP we are splitting hairs here but I do wonder what causes the slow oscillation. The choppy plot may be aliasing from the low sample rate of the Trend plot.
(https://www.eevblog.com/forum/product-reviews-photos-and-discussion/looking-for-goodinexpensive-bench-power-supply/?action=dlattach;attach=24927)
(https://www.eevblog.com/forum/product-reviews-photos-and-discussion/looking-for-goodinexpensive-bench-power-supply/?action=dlattach;attach=24929)
(https://www.eevblog.com/forum/product-reviews-photos-and-discussion/looking-for-goodinexpensive-bench-power-supply/?action=dlattach;attach=24931)
May I ask what time you have on the X-axis on the trend plot?
Just wanted to let you guys know that this thread compelled me to buy a PD 2005 and register for this forum...
Thank you robrenz! 674 ohms is much lesser than I expected. That translates to over 19 watts of heating power. Did you measure with the unit unplugged and in off-mode (otherwise you will measure the transformers primary in parallel)?
Hmm, that may explain why the heating up period of my PID is so slow as I only putting in about 5.5 watts to the heater. I used Kanthal wire of 178 ohms/m (six sub-metre threads in parallel making 21 ohms totally). My setpoint is 60C, and I think I will settle there as I suspect that the original temperature is higher. Lower temp translates to longer working life and lesser power consumption (in the heater, not electronics of course) but may be more sensitive to ambient temp drift.Thank you robrenz! 674 ohms is much lesser than I expected. That translates to over 19 watts of heating power. Did you measure with the unit unplugged and in off-mode (otherwise you will measure the transformers primary in parallel)?
Yes unplugged and off. :)
Pin 9-10 674.3 OhmI'm doing a second spin of the board now (pics and description in the other thread for the project). I promised to add something (copper layer, as this is home-etched) to thank you for your help. Some ideas?
Pin 9-11 .00839 Ohm
Oven case temperature 48.0 Deg.C
The original would be a simple glass wool, a rather nasty thing to work with. Causes skin problems, and the fibres are known to be carcinogens. Try using some polyester wool as a replacement, the common wall insulating ones will work well up to about 50C with little problems. Not good if you are running at more though, it likely will melt.Yes, it's was glass wool outside the filament and some pulverized stuff that has the same grey-blue color as asbestos just around/under the filament. A got rid of it all and is currently experimenting with insulations. Toilet paper, PU foam, cotton pads and even a vacuum flask are among those things I'm testing with. I'm actually going to fit some stuff outside of the outer shield as well. It's gonna be overkill! :)
Also what kind of tests can you recommend I do with my pathetic equipment (4000 counts Chinese DMM) and no oscilloscope (yet!) before I send it?
I have not read the whole thread; what problems with the knob are there? which model?...
once I deox'd the contacts, I saw accurate steps on the click knobs. amazing that that, alone, seems to get 95% of the job done (or more).
This has come up before, for example when Dave was so impressed by the Tek 2225 that went down to 500 uV/div....... snip .......
There is currently one on eBay in as-is/dont-know-how-to-test condition for $100, but it looks modified. There appears to be a custom plate around the gain knob and the /100 attenuation button is missing.
The 7A13 is the other very interesting 7000 series plugin for which Tek did not make a stand-alone version. It has a large and accurate DC offset range that is very useful for signals superimposed on DC voltages. It also has an excellent overdrive recovery. Sensitivity is much lower than the 7A22/AM502, but bandwidth is much larger. The early mechanical version often had problems with cracked gears, but I'm sure that would not be a problem for someone with the mechanical knowledge of robrenz. I believe Preamble labs hired the 7A13 designer and developed a similar product (DA185x?). Don't expect to find it for $50.
I have a 7A13 diff amp to do the 20MHz BW testing. That one was expensive $50.00 ::) it has a interesting infinite impedance mode for 50mV/div and below.
@ muvideo,
Thanks for the heads up on the high impedance mode. I missed that in scanning the manual.
Do your 7A22's have the awesome machined tuning capacitors like mine in this thread? (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/chat/reunion-with-my-first-scope-after-32-years/msg157326/#msg157326). The manual I downloaded shows regular tuning caps in the manual. The jumpers that get unsoldered for the high impedance mode are shown in those pics also.
That is one kick ass microvolt input scope! Few can match it today, most top scopes do 500uV/div as minimum, if at all. Not to mention the dynamic range, 10uV to 10V /div, it took a while to look at that range before I realized it was true!
IMO don't take it apart. Get the white handle Microbrush (http://www.microbrush.com/automotive/products/microbrush/index.asp) to apply the Deoxit. Cotton swabs will waste a huge amount of the very expensive stuff. Just wet each each contact with D100L and then cycle the switch a lot. Wash off with your favorite electronic cleaner and blow out. Then lightly lube each contact with Deoxit G100L with another white microbrush. I competely agree with using the liquid (not spray) versions of deoxit. HERE (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/projects/diy-flux-dispenser-bottle/msg152664/#msg152664) is my setup.
So here's my progress:
(http://i.imgur.com/vvbP7fe.png)
So I'm kind of confused. As you can see, after I cleaned it all the peaks and valleys are gone, which I thought made sense, but then when I calibrated it, they came back, and it's nowhere near as accurate as I thought it would be. Zero didn't really need to be adjusted all that much, it was at about -0.8mV, but I got it to within 0.5uV, then at 20V I got it to 20.005V.
Lets put this in perspective. The spec for the 2020 is 0.1% of setting plus 500µV.
Lets not even consider the additional 0.001% regulation, 8 hour stability of .001% + 100µV, and TC of 0.001% or 50µV whichever is greater/ deg C.
Min: 5.00231 that is 40µV variation (.36% of a .011V error band) Max error is .00235V spec allows .0055V less than 42% of spec.
Max: 5.00235 +.047% of set value error.
Min: 0.500546 that is 46µV variation (2.3% of a .002V error band) Max error is .000592V spec allows .001V less than 59% of spec.
Max: 0.500592 +.118% of set value error.
Min: 0.0499536 that is 41µV variation (3.7% of a .0011V error band) Max error is .0000464V spec allows .00055V less than 9% of spec.
Max: 0.0499577 -.093% of set value error.
Min: 0.00498626 that is 9µV variation (0.89% of a .00101V error band) Max error is .00001374V spec allows .000505V less than 3% of spec.
Max: 0.00499526 -.275% of set value error.
This is all well within the original specifications. :-+ Those microvolt variations are milli ohm variations in contact resistance. It is fun to try to improve it further. :-/O
The green line is expected, the blue line is erratic and suggestive of dirt; the yellow line now appears similar.
I suspect the calibration pot has oxidized grit; once manipulated the dirt is catching on the pot wiper arms. Try turning the adjust multiple times back and forth to clear out the grit and see what happens. I can't recall if the cal pot is hermetically sealed or not, and amenable to dexoit cleaning.
That makes it even better! The spec for the 2005 is 0.1% of setting plus 1mV.Lets put this in perspective. The spec for the 2020 is 0.1% of setting plus 500µV.Actually I forgot to point out this is my 2005, my 2020B is already pretty good. I'm hoping it can get better after being cleaned.
So, don't worry about the accuracy, just be happy the repeatability and drift are good (I measured it at 6uV at 12 hours so far)?Not at all, %-B just realize it is way better than its spec and improving it is going to take some very precise tongue angle :-/O
I suspect the calibration pot has oxidized grit; once manipulated the dirt is catching on the pot wiper arms. Try turning the adjust multiple times back and forth to clear out the grit and see what happens. I can't recall if the cal pot is hermetically sealed or not, and amenable to dexoit cleaning.
The pots aren't sealed as far as I can tell, but I'm not sure how I'd open them without destroying them. I tried wiping them back and forth several times, but it doesn't seem to have made any difference.One way you could check them is to disconnect one end of the pot and connect your ohm meter between there and the wiper and see if there are jumps in the readings as you travel the zone you have been using. If the ohm range crosses two of your meter ranges make sure you lock your meter into the higher range so you dont think the jump when auto ranging is a bad pot. I did that earlier in this thread :-[ You can also do the standard contact resistance variation test shown in the bourns potentiometer handbook (http://www.bourns.com/data/global/pdfs/OnlinePotentiometerHandbook.pdf)
Im pretty happy. After over a year of wanting another PD PSU I finally got a 2020B;
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Power-Designs-2020B-Variable-Power-Supply-Precision-DC-Calibrator-2AMP-20V-/221195966773?ssPageName=ADME:L:OC:US:3160 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Power-Designs-2020B-Variable-Power-Supply-Precision-DC-Calibrator-2AMP-20V-/221195966773?ssPageName=ADME:L:OC:US:3160)
Plenty of nice ones, but the shipping......... :( is not nice.
Im pretty happy. After over a year of wanting another PD PSU I finally got a 2020B;
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Power-Designs-2020B-Variable-Power-Supply-Precision-DC-Calibrator-2AMP-20V-/221195966773?ssPageName=ADME:L:OC:US:3160 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Power-Designs-2020B-Variable-Power-Supply-Precision-DC-Calibrator-2AMP-20V-/221195966773?ssPageName=ADME:L:OC:US:3160)
You should be happy, these are things of beauty ;D
Is there anything I should do when I get it?
Ok thanks guys. This thread was just a little overwhelming to read the entire thing.
It looks to be in fine shape and has all original knobs :clap:. I presume its Vout is factory stable perfect :-+
My wife's going to kill me but I caught this bug too after reading through this thread..
Am I the only one who wishes that some company would match the aesthetic beauty of older equipment with the features and functionality of modern ones?
As you can tell, you are not alone ;)
My wife's going to kill me but I caught this bug too after reading through this thread and I picked up a 6050A from ebay for less than $70, including shipping. I don't really need it but the quality and beauty seduced me. Trying as hard as I can to resist the call of the Tek 7000 series scopes...
Thought I'd share incase anyone else ever sees something like this in the future and could do with a troubleshooting idea.
It looks like the epidemic is spreading >:D
(http://www.stevenjohnson.com/web-pics/powerdesigns2005-5005R.jpg)My god that's attractive.... ahem...
The 2005 arrived yesterday. After a new power cord and a slight tweak it's dead on at 5.000 volts. When you get it up to 20 volts it's off by about .02 volts. Close enough for my use and until I find a service manual. It took me longer to get three cal and inventory stickers and their goop off the front panel.
They do look nice stacked.
The 2005 arrived yesterday. After a new power cord and a slight tweak it's dead on at 5.000 volts. When you get it up to 20 volts it's off by about .02 volts. Close enough for my use and until I find a service manual.
Thanks, I had forgotten about the link to the manual for the 2005 being posted here. It's only the 10-20V range thats out (across the entire range) so it looks like I will need to check the trimmer and resistor for the upper range.
We cant make that assumption until SLJ calibrates zero and at 20V and then checks 10V on the 10V scale. The 5V is affected by the decade switches and resistors. The 20V being off means it needs calibrated before you can do any other testing.Thus my "almost". But if its out in the entire 20V range by the same amount and not in the 10V range at all, then that would be my guess. Its easy to check anyhow.
The 2005 arrived yesterday. After a new power cord and a slight tweak it's dead on at 5.000 volts. When you get it up to 20 volts it's off by about .02 volts. Close enough for my use and until I find a service manual.
The manual is here (http://www.rako.com/Articles/29.html) from post#10 of this thread :-[. Calibration procedure is there.
Have you tried magic sponges?No but I don't trust those things - they're pretty much just normal sponges mixed with sand and chemicals. I think they'd take off the silkscreen as well as the yellowing.
Usually, they are made from melamine foam (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Melamine_foam).Have you tried magic sponges?No but I don't trust those things - they're pretty much just normal sponges mixed with sand and chemicals. I think they'd take off the silkscreen as well as the yellowing.
It is also the component of Magic Eraser and similar cleaning products.
If you are removing them, how difficult is it?
Don't even think about it.:-+ I figured that was probably the case ;D
I also noticed that the circled component below seems to have a "loose" top, ie it will wiggle and slightly rotate. I've essentially left it alone for now to prevent damage, as the supply seems to work well regardless. I'll look up the component after I finish cleaning.
Naaa alcool don't work very well.
You should use a degreaser (for the kitchen, NOT a solvent based ones)
Il you want it like new you must remove everything from the front panel and clean it separately.
Next, you should use alcool to remove all the trace of the degreaser especially from glass surface.
Here i use chanteclair, is a degrasser. It's so good that i buy it in 5L bottle.
Has anybody tried taking apart the rotary switches? I'd like to clean the contacts on the other right knob on my 5020. They are showing their age a bit...
Nobody seems to have tried, hence my question.Has anybody tried taking apart the rotary switches? I'd like to clean the contacts on the other right knob on my 5020. They are showing their age a bit...
See page 16.
I'm pretty sure that this thread was to blame, but here they are, and are my two only power supplies that I use every night on the bench:
I'm pretty sure that this thread was to blame, but here they are, and are my two only power supplies that I use every night on the bench:
Is that a 2225 above the 6050's?
I'm pretty sure that this thread was to blame, but here they are, and are my two only power supplies that I use every night on the bench:
Is that a 2225 above the 6050's?
Yes sir it is! I hold Dave responsible, but honestly, I am super super glad I started with the 2225... learned a lot about what all the controls are actually doing!
LOL! I love my 2225. 500uV/div is impossible to find in another analog scope.
LOL! Yeah... maybe I should say VERY difficult... unless you happen upon a $35 diff amp and the mainframe to plug it into.LOL! I love my 2225. 500uV/div is impossible to find in another analog scope.
You missed post #142 of this thread here (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/looking-for-goodinexpensive-bench-power-supply/msg169147/#msg169147) 10µV/div is possible ;D
LOL! I love my 2225. 500uV/div is impossible to find in another analog scope.I often end up recommending or at least mentioning the Tektronix 2225 just because its 500uV per division input sensitivity.
You missed post #142 of this thread here (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/looking-for-goodinexpensive-bench-power-supply/msg169147/#msg169147) 10µV/div is possible ;DWhile I have a couple of 7A22 plug-ins for my 7000 series mainframes, they are tricky to use at their most sensitive setting because their drift and low frequency noise performance is not as good as it could be. There is an equivalent plug-in for their 5000 series oscilloscope mainframes and also the stand alone AM502 which can be used with any oscilloscope.
Are there any power designs supplys with a negative rail? I would love a nice high precision +/- supply. :-+
Are there any power designs supplys with a negative rail? I would love a nice high precision +/- supply. :-+
By the way, I’m working on a simple USB adapter for the 2020B/2005P to allow remote control of voltage/current via SCPI commands over serial. If anyone is interested or has ideas, let me know!
By the way, I’m working on a simple USB adapter for the 2020B/2005P to allow remote control of voltage/current via SCPI commands over serial. If anyone is interested or has ideas, let me know!
Neat! I have a project in the back of the draw to do something similar for the 6050, 6050C and 6050D.
By the way, I’m working on a simple USB adapter for the 2020B/2005P to allow remote control of voltage/current via SCPI commands over serial. If anyone is interested or has ideas, let me know!
Neat! I have a project in the back of the draw to do something similar for the 6050, 6050C and 6050D.
Do those use the same 1k/V and 1k/A formula as the 20xx Series?
That's over complicating for this use, I think. Here's my plan:
Grab a 60V linear MOSFET or transistor and simply hook the source and drain up to the RV lines. Then use an OpAmp with the output hooked to the gate and the non-inverting input hooked to the PSU output. Then you can use a DAC or PWM signal on the inverting input to control the whole thing. (You'll also have to either attenuate the PSU output or boost the DAC's output for feeding the main OpAmp.)
I'll draw the circuit up later.
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That's over complicating for this use, I think. Here's my plan:
Grab a 60V linear MOSFET or transistor and simply hook the source and drain up to the RV lines. Then use an OpAmp with the output hooked to the gate and the non-inverting input hooked to the PSU output. Then you can use a DAC or PWM signal on the inverting input to control the whole thing. (You'll also have to either attenuate the PSU output or boost the DAC's output for feeding the main OpAmp.)
I'll draw the circuit up later.
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I seem to remember reading in the operating manual (+theory of operation) that any noise introduced onto the remote programming line will be present on the PSU's outputs. The idea was that you would use shielded cables + "shmick" pots to have near or equal noise specs at the output. But I could be very wrong about that. I need to consult The Fine Manual.
Yup, this is correct. They also recommend using Make-before-Break relays if you're switching in resistors, because when it goes open circuit it causes a loss of regulation which would induce transients into your output.
One of them is shorted then.
Put in a 2N3773 if it is a TO3 package, it will be a good replacement, and will work well within it's SOA limits as well.
Oh yeah, can anyone with a 2020B measure the voltage on the 10V/20V indicator lights for me? Thanks. =)
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Do the Power designs power supplys have floating outputs that I could connect togeher to make a +/- supply? Im hinking somehing along the lines of a tw5005
Oh yeah, can anyone with a 2020B measure the voltage on the 10V/20V indicator lights for me? Thanks. =)
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125V according to the schematic
Do the Power designs power supplys have floating outputs that I could connect togeher to make a +/- supply? Im hinking somehing along the lines of a tw5005
IMO save yourself a lot of trouble and just buy some new neon bulbs. I have replaced several on the PD units.
I began to smell something burning, but not in the normal Magic Smoke sense. This smelled like, I dunno, it reminded me of of those toy cap guns that took those rolls of paper caps?
I began to smell something burning, but not in the normal Magic Smoke sense. This smelled like, I dunno, it reminded me of of those toy cap guns that took those rolls of paper caps?
Hmm - two very distinct smells that aren't quite the same: cap guns and overpowered potentiometers. But that was my first thought. Is there (or was there) anything shorting a potentiometer?
Not sure what's up with that.
Not sure what's up with that.
It is a common way to repair a circuit that has a worn out aluminum electrolytic capacitor without removing it.
Not sure what's up with that.
It is a common way to repair a circuit that has a worn out aluminum electrolytic capacitor without removing it.
Hmmm, yeah, I assumed it was there to repair the cap it was strapped over; but if you don't remove it (or at least one leg of it), how do you even test it to know if it's bad? (I've got a decent cheaper LCR meter that can do in-circuit testing, but it doesn't really work well on bulk caps unless they're out-of-circuit most if the time.)
Also, removing the bad cap prevents it from leaking on stuff.
It just seemed sort of lazy and bodgy to me.
But, perhaps it's more common than I knew and I just hadn't run into it much. =)
Either way, I think I'm going to replace all the AEs in the unit; I can't imagine they'd be very stable after 40 years?
I'm also wondering about all the ceramic disc caps on this as well; I've heard tales of tin whiskers and such. 50 years (not 40 as I stated before; 1965 date code) is a long ass time! Half a decade...
...7.32 k can be made with 8.2 k || 68 k, both are E24 series.
So after testing R17 and R18 with makeshift Kelvin probes, they’re both exactly at 0.75Ohms, despite R18 being a bit deformed. However, after testing most of the resistors on the board, I did find R34 (the matched resistor to the LM399 reference) is measuring 3K~, instead of the marked 7.32K. Though, it doesn’t seem to be affecting accuracy? I might still replace it; unfortunately I can’t find any 0.3W replacements on Mouser (can only find 0.125W ones in-stock). So I may have to resort to using an SMD version with a little adapter board I’ve got laying around.
In the end, I went with the mid-90's Motorola parts because the price was right and the seller got me matching date codes (so I could try and get two as closely matched as possible).
In the end, I went with the mid-90's Motorola parts because the price was right and the seller got me matching date codes (so I could try and get two as closely matched as possible).
I just buy a few extras and grade them myself. I recently did this with 2N5886G transistors (80V 25A 200W 4MHz TO-3) and out of four, two matched to within a couple millivolts at the expected operating current. The original design did not even use emitter ballasting on the parallel transistors so I added that as well when I repaired it.
I just buy a few extras and grade them myself. I recently did this with 2N5886G transistors (80V 25A 200W 4MHz TO-3) and out of four, two matched to within a couple millivolts at the expected operating current. The original design did not even use emitter ballasting on the parallel transistors so I added that as well when I repaired it.
That's exactly what I did as well. I needed two, so bought four (with matching date codes to up my odds) and then used my cheap Chinese transistor tester to get the Hfe and base voltages, followed by a run through my homemade curve tracer to verify the current characteristics.
I ended up with two that were about a 1% match.
Those will read as shorted as they have jumpers across them at the back panel. Those protect the sense inputs.
Those will read as shorted as they have jumpers across them at the back panel. Those protect the sense inputs.
I’ve got those removed for testing, as I thought about that. It may be a bad cap after some more testing. But that wouldn’t cause the problems I’m seeing I don’t think. I wonder if it could be the Op-Amp? Hmmm, looks like the OP-05CP is equivalent to the uA741. Might grab one and see.
Those will read as shorted as they have jumpers across them at the back panel. Those protect the sense inputs.
I’ve got those removed for testing, as I thought about that. It may be a bad cap after some more testing. But that wouldn’t cause the problems I’m seeing I don’t think. I wonder if it could be the Op-Amp? Hmmm, looks like the OP-05CP is equivalent to the uA741. Might grab one and see.
Did you check Q3?
Those will read as shorted as they have jumpers across them at the back panel. Those protect the sense inputs.
I’ve got those removed for testing, as I thought about that. It may be a bad cap after some more testing. But that wouldn’t cause the problems I’m seeing I don’t think. I wonder if it could be the Op-Amp? Hmmm, looks like the OP-05CP is equivalent to the uA741. Might grab one and see.
Did you check Q3?
It's on my short list. It's not shorted, but it could still be bad. I'll have to take it out to test it, but I need to fix my cheap Chinese component tester first, as it shit the bed the other day. (I may have blown the ATmega after hooking it to a 9000uF cap that wasn't discharged by I clipped it to a blue-yellow wire instead of a yellow-blue wire in something I was testing...)
Weird thing is, the supply semi-works at the 1V setting (I get 1.5V out), but once you pass 2V or so you basically lose regulation and get 28V. On the 10-20V setting you get 32V.
I guess Q3 could be saturating very early or something? I just don't get what could have killed it. It worked fine the other day! It hasn't even been plugged in!
And Sean, you're right, I double checked and I had the RV/RC jumpers removed (when buzzing out some wires) and thought they were the sense jumpers when I looked last night. (The supply is upside down right now, easy 5AM mistake to make I suppose.)
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(In the numbers I gave above, I forgot to add 0V is 0.4V. Last time the unit was working, it was 0.000xxxV, so that indicates a problem outside of the switches, right?)
What do you guys think about designing a replacement for the internals of these supplies? I am thinking of:
- Replacement PCB using ... Op-amps instead of transistors except for the output drive stage.
That would be a lot better time spent than me re-designing the 2005A amplifier oven. Don't you think?
Edit: Though I might still do the 2005A Amplifier.
Not only that, but despite being pin for pin compatible and the specs being the same, the u741 won't replace the CP02-whatever OpAmp. So I've got to locate some NOS on eBay to see if that's my issue.
Okay. I'm getting pissed now. I replaced VR3 on my 2020B. Along with EVERY FUCKING TRANSISTOR AND ELECTROLYTIC CAPACITOR ON THE FUCKING FUCKER. PLUS U1 and U2.
Same exact shit as before. (I guess I had fried VR3 when I shorted the body of Q1 to ground.)
Not only that, but despite being pin for pin compatible and the specs being the same, the u741 won't replace the CP02-whatever OpAmp. So I've got to locate some NOS on eBay to see if that's my issue.
I'm at a loss for what to do if that doesn't work. It has to be in the feedback loop there somewhere.
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What do you guys think about designing a replacement for the internals of these supplies? I am thinking of:
- Replacement PCB using ... Op-amps instead of transistors except for the output drive stage.
This is not difficult to do but only the input stages of the error amplifiers matter. An alternative to replacing them is to use operational amplifiers to correct their offset and low frequency noise and drift.That would be a lot better time spent than me re-designing the 2005A amplifier oven. Don't you think?
Edit: Though I might still do the 2005A Amplifier.
The 2005A design shows that Power Designs used a dual transistor as the error amplifier and stuck it into the oven to do these very things. Improve the error amplifier and change the reference and the oven can be left out.
Sorry, I should have been more specific. I didn't mean use the 2005A error amp as part of a new control board. In moto's thread I was talking about designing a replacement for the 2005A's entire oven unit using modern SMD components, complete with a PCB based heater, to stick in a small 3D printed case.
The idea being it will fit in the hole left by the removal of the current oven on 2005A units.
An alternative to dealing with broken heaters and thermostats, etc.
Sorry, I should have been more specific. I didn't mean use the 2005A error amp as part of a new control board. In moto's thread I was talking about designing a replacement for the 2005A's entire oven unit using modern SMD components, complete with a PCB based heater, to stick in a small 3D printed case.
The idea being it will fit in the hole left by the removal of the current oven on 2005A units.
An alternative to dealing with broken heaters and thermostats, etc.
Another alternative I would consider is using almost the same oven board schematic without the oven but replacing Q3 with a modern integrated transistor pair like an Analog Devices MAT01 or SSM2212 or Linear Systems monolithic dual transistor and using the LM399A or reference of your choice.
Another alternative I would consider is using almost the same oven board schematic without the oven but replacing Q3 with a modern integrated transistor pair like an Analog Devices MAT01 or SSM2212 or Linear Systems monolithic dual transistor and using the LM399A or reference of your choice.
Yeah, I had already settled on Q3 being a MAT01.
So, you don't think there's any benefit to using PCB traces to keep the entire thing at a constant 50c to minimize drift?
Though I imagine with an LM399 and MAT01, you're going to have drift in other places like the selection resistors etc. so it might not matter.
The LM399 has built-in heater control, right? The data sheet doesn't mention, is it static off/on control, or simply a series of transistors that operate linearly in response to temperature? (I know current can vary on them, so I assume the later. This isn't in reference to anything specific, just a curiosity I've always had with the 399.)
The LM399 has built-in heater control, right? The data sheet doesn't mention, is it static off/on control, or simply a series of transistors that operate linearly in response to temperature? (I know current can vary on them, so I assume the later. This isn't in reference to anything specific, just a curiosity I've always had with the 399.)
It has a pass transistor and heater control circuit which operate linearly. The power drawn by the heater circuit is inversely proportional to external temperature as expected and drops to zero at about 85C. At 25C, it draws about 300 milliwatts. Operating voltage is from 9 to 40 volts.
The heater and zener allow for roughly an improvement of 5 to 20 times over a precision bandgap reference.
The LM399 has built-in heater control, right? The data sheet doesn't mention, is it static off/on control, or simply a series of transistors that operate linearly in response to temperature? (I know current can vary on them, so I assume the later. This isn't in reference to anything specific, just a curiosity I've always had with the 399.)
It has a pass transistor and heater control circuit which operate linearly. The power drawn by the heater circuit is inversely proportional to external temperature as expected and drops to zero at about 85C. At 25C, it draws about 300 milliwatts. Operating voltage is from 9 to 40 volts.
The heater and zener allow for roughly an improvement of 5 to 20 times over a precision bandgap reference.
Cool, that's about what I thought. I figured it might be neat to stick a simple shunt resistor on the heater power input (or output) hooked to a comparator to activate the "Oven" lamp on the 2005A. (Replaced with an LED, obviously.)
It would help keep things original looking too.
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The LM399 has built-in heater control, right? The data sheet doesn't mention, is it static off/on control, or simply a series of transistors that operate linearly in response to temperature? (I know current can vary on them, so I assume the later. This isn't in reference to anything specific, just a curiosity I've always had with the 399.)
It has a pass transistor and heater control circuit which operate linearly. The power drawn by the heater circuit is inversely proportional to external temperature as expected and drops to zero at about 85C. At 25C, it draws about 300 milliwatts. Operating voltage is from 9 to 40 volts.
The heater and zener allow for roughly an improvement of 5 to 20 times over a precision bandgap reference.
Cool, that's about what I thought. I figured it might be neat to stick a simple shunt resistor on the heater power input (or output) hooked to a comparator to activate the "Oven" lamp on the 2005A. (Replaced with an LED, obviously.)
It would help keep things original looking too.
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Or you could use the LTZ1000, which has an internal heater but external heater control. But actually, I think that LM399 heats up so quickly that it doesn't make sense to even have an oven light. These parts don't have to heat up a giant mass since it's just a heater built into the substrate of the chip.
Paint looks good.
I was told to use lightweight grease for the bearings/moving parts. I ended up using some firearms lubricant that I had. It is sort of like a slightly runny grease.
BTW - how did you ship that nichrome wire? I am sort of surprised it isn't here yet.
It has a pass transistor and heater control circuit which operate linearly. The power drawn by the heater circuit is inversely proportional to external temperature as expected and drops to zero at about 85C. At 25C, it draws about 300 milliwatts. Operating voltage is from 9 to 40 volts.
Cool, that's about what I thought. I figured it might be neat to stick a simple shunt resistor on the heater power input (or output) hooked to a comparator to activate the "Oven" lamp on the 2005A. (Replaced with an LED, obviously.)
You know, one issue I'm having is finding useful data on some of these old parts, like the diodes on the 2005A oven board. Man, I'd kill for some old data books!
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Hmm, I've got a buddy who's a Virginia Tech alumni, maybe he can find out if they do. I highly doubt it though.
Hmm, I've got a buddy who's a Virginia Tech alumni, maybe he can find out if they do. I highly doubt it though.
I can look at Concordia here, they had 1960s stuff back when I looked for vintage Tek parts info.
You know, one issue I'm having is finding useful data on some of these old parts, like the diodes on the 2005A oven board. Man, I'd kill for some old data books!
You know, one issue I'm having is finding useful data on some of these old parts, like the diodes on the 2005A oven board. Man, I'd kill for some old data books!
In the case of the interesting parts, I suspect Power Designs was grading them anyway so the original specifications would be of limited use. I usually end up reverse engineering the circuit in detail to find out what the specifications needed to be.
If I wanted to work from the part number, I would start is one of the Derivation and Tabulation Associates "D.A.T.A" books.
A fellow on the Antique Radio forum said they did their own semiconductor matching in house. I have seen some Sprague electrolytics in these supplies labeled, "For Power Designs," but I'm not sure what would be so special about them. I know at least in the HV supplies, they made their own transformers rather than buy them from suppliers.
Hmm, I've got a buddy who's a Virginia Tech alumni, maybe he can find out if they do. I highly doubt it though.
I can look at Concordia here, they had 1960s stuff back when I looked for vintage Tek parts info.
Ha! A fellow Montrealer! :D
Should I be worried about the wet tantalum caps leaking? They're in fully sealed little metal axial can packages and the values are still perfect.
If the tantalum caps have a glass end don't bother, they will outlive you. If the end is rubber they will need to be replaced.
Having the caps made for them was probably to get a low ESR ( for the time) or a higher ripple current capacitor, so internally they might have thicker foil and multiple tabs for each electrode.
I just got myself a Power Designs 2020B (with a pretty high serial number, woohoo) after reading this thread in its entirety, so please welcome me to the PD club. After properly calibrating the 0 V value and the highest voltage value per the calibration instructions using a 6 1/2 digit voltmeter as a reference, I have found some non-linearity in the voltage selection.
When switching between 5.000 V and 6.000 V (maybe it was between 4 V and 5 V), I noticed that the voltage coming out of the power supply goes from almost dead-on correct to about 1.4 mV higher than it should be. I realize that this is a small error, but it continues for all of the other unit voltage numbers above the threshold number (say 5 V, so e.g., 6 V, 7 V, 8V and so on). It is as if there is a resistor in place for the range 5-9 (whole) volts that kicks in after you cross the threshold and it is slightly off.
If someone can point me to the exact resistor this is among the many resistors connected to the rotary switch, I would really appreciate it, because it's really hard to tell what's what.
I just got myself a Power Designs 2020B (with a pretty high serial number, woohoo) after reading this thread in its entirety, so please welcome me to the PD club. After properly calibrating the 0 V value and the highest voltage value per the calibration instructions using a 6 1/2 digit voltmeter as a reference, I have found some non-linearity in the voltage selection.
When switching between 5.000 V and 6.000 V (maybe it was between 4 V and 5 V), I noticed that the voltage coming out of the power supply goes from almost dead-on correct to about 1.4 mV higher than it should be. I realize that this is a small error, but it continues for all of the other unit voltage numbers above the threshold number (say 5 V, so e.g., 6 V, 7 V, 8V and so on). It is as if there is a resistor in place for the range 5-9 (whole) volts that kicks in after you cross the threshold and it is slightly off.
If someone can point me to the exact resistor this is among the many resistors connected to the rotary switch, I would really appreciate it, because it's really hard to tell what's what.
Have you cleaned the switch contacts? This almost always needs to be done, and leads to voltages being off as you move between different values. There's instructions earlier in this thread, but in general the process is:
Spray out any dust and dirt with compressed air
Clean everything with a mild, general purpose electronic cleaner
Clean the contacts with some DeOxit Red
Use the electronics cleaner to remove any deoxit red
Apply some deoxit gold to the contacts and leave this in place
Re-lube the switch bearings and points where the metal rubs with some lightweight grease (just don't get this on the contacts).
Then recalibrate, and I bet your unit will work fine.
Yeah, all the switch resistors in my 2020B are dead on. Even the 5% and 1% tolerance ones are +/- 0.001Ohms. With all the switches in their full positions, I get exactly 10,000.01Ohms on my 6.5 Digit HP'57. So yours seems out for sure.
I might have a replacement here if you want it.
Sent from my Smartphone
Popped in the new LT1097 and she seems to work fine with one issue: I'm about -26mV at a switch setting of zero, with no more turns on the zero pot left. I guess I could always add some inline resistance to the offset input, right? Or a larger pot.
Either way I'll read up on the LT1097 today and figure out how to modify the 2020B accordingly.
Yeah, all the switch resistors in my 2020B are dead on. Even the 5% and 1% tolerance ones are +/- 0.001Ohms. With all the switches in their full positions, I get exactly 10,000.01Ohms on my 6.5 Digit HP'57. So yours seems out for sure.
I might have a replacement here if you want it.
Sent from my Smartphone
Say where are you measuring from/to to get that 10,000.01. I have a 3456A as well, so I can perform the measurement and see what I come out to...
Yeah, all the switch resistors in my 2020B are dead on. Even the 5% and 1% tolerance ones are +/- 0.001Ohms. With all the switches in their full positions, I get exactly 10,000.01Ohms on my 6.5 Digit HP'57. So yours seems out for sure.
I might have a replacement here if you want it.
Sent from my Smartphone
Say where are you measuring from/to to get that 10,000.01. I have a 3456A as well, so I can perform the measurement and see what I come out to...
With the supply off, the range set to 0-10V and the vernier fully counterclockwise, look at the board on the back of the switch array and you should see three lugs with a 10K resistor across the top two. Test from the center lug and DC- terminal.
Basically, one end of the vernier is connected to DC- and the other end to the bottom lug, which connects to the switch banks, from there it goes from S5 to S6 then the top lug of the switch board (input of that 10k resistor), the center lug (output of that 10k resistor) connects to RV2 on the back, which straps to RV1 and goes to the main board voltage OpAmp! By the way, that 10k resistor is bypassed when the front switch is in the 10V position.
Sent from my Smartphone
Popped in the new LT1097 and she seems to work fine with one issue: I'm about -26mV at a switch setting of zero, with no more turns on the zero pot left. I guess I could always add some inline resistance to the offset input, right? Or a larger pot.
Either way I'll read up on the LT1097 today and figure out how to modify the 2020B accordingly.
The LT1097 has a much smaller offset null range (+/- 600uV) than the OP-05 (+/- 4mV). If they were relying on this to correct for other errors which is generally a bad practice, then something else may have to be done.
Popped in the new LT1097 and she seems to work fine with one issue: I'm about -26mV at a switch setting of zero, with no more turns on the zero pot left. I guess I could always add some inline resistance to the offset input, right? Or a larger pot.
Either way I'll read up on the LT1097 today and figure out how to modify the 2020B accordingly.
The LT1097 has a much smaller offset null range (+/- 600uV) than the OP-05 (+/- 4mV). If they were relying on this to correct for other errors which is generally a bad practice, then something else may have to be done.
I took a 100k resistor and hooked it between ground and pin 8 (one of the offset inputs) of the LT1097 and now I’m able to get it zeroed out. Though I’m not sure how this will affect things longterm? Will it hurt the OpAmp? Should I balance things out by sticking the same value resistor on the the other offset input as well?
Okay, this is really fucked up. I accidentally fried the LT1097 (I grounded one of the offset inputs without a resistor attached by dropping a lead; no smoke, just stopped working), so on a whim I stuck the original OP-05 back in and… It’s fucking working. Seriously. Spot on, too.
I’ve honestly got no clue. The only thing that has changed is I don’t have the 10/20V selection switch wired in right now. I wonder if that’s somehow bad? Hmmm.
Or maybe something was messed up with the offset circuit? I un-soldered the adjustment pot, so maybe it was somehow shorting and all this fiddling has fixed it? Without the zero adjust pot even connected, I’m only getting -300uV of offset, which that LT1097 should have easily been able to null out. So, something weird is going on. (Hooking the pot back up with the OP-05 and I’m able get it down to around 5uV of offset.)
This one is truly baffling.
Interesting, I just got in an SSR and was thinking of doing what you said, only directly off the 120VAC mains heater input and not the transformer secondary.
Can you see a downside to this?
Sent from my Smartphone
This path may lead to destroying the ultra low ripple of these units. All this pwm heater stuff may be reflected in the output :(
You can get some DeOXIT inside via the back and shaft. Spray some in and toggle it a bunch.
Otherwise it's just a small DPDT switch (ON-ON not ON-OFF-ON).
Sent from my Smartphone
Interesting, I just got in an SSR and was thinking of doing what you said, only directly off the 120VAC mains heater input and not the transformer secondary.
Can you see a downside to this?
Sent from my Smartphone
I think this is exactly what the original circuit in my 2005A did. I remember there was a circuit attached to the SCR, and I played around with it in LT SPice a bit, and I believe it's basically a circuit to limit turn-on to near the ZC point (the SCR handles the turn-off at ZC automatically, as that's how they work).
The only downside is you're messing with A/C mains voltage with all the associated safety concerns. Oh, and also you'll obviously need significantly more wire, probably need a resistance around the 1500 ohms of the original circuit.
You can get some DeOXIT inside via the back and shaft. Spray some in and toggle it a bunch.
Otherwise it's just a small DPDT switch (ON-ON not ON-OFF-ON).
Sent from my Smartphone
Anything selling on e-bay that might match?
I think this is exactly what the original circuit in my 2005A did. I remember there was a circuit attached to the SCR, and I played around with it in LT SPice a bit, and I believe it's basically a circuit to limit turn-on to near the ZC point (the SCR handles the turn-off at ZC automatically, as that's how they work).
Is the linear control loop the same as a proportional control loop like the one used in the Fluke 732A? The thermal mass of the 732A seems comparatively large but they can maintain it at +/- 2 deg C.
timb -
I went over this before, but maybe you missed it. I already made a thermostat that you can set the hysteresis to whatever value you want (currently set to around 0.6C). However, that won't get you temperature regulation to within 1C. The problem is, when the thermostat shuts off, a big load of heat has already been transferred from the heater coil to the metal of the tube. This heat continues to soak in, and the heat within the tube continues to rise. I don't recall the exact numbers, but it was very significant - way more than the 1C.
timb -
I went over this before, but maybe you missed it. I already made a thermostat that you can set the hysteresis to whatever value you want (currently set to around 0.6C). However, that won't get you temperature regulation to within 1C. The problem is, when the thermostat shuts off, a big load of heat has already been transferred from the heater coil to the metal of the tube. This heat continues to soak in, and the heat within the tube continues to rise. I don't recall the exact numbers, but it was very significant - way more than the 1C.
Right, but the bi-metal thermostats originally used had 10c of hysteresis, so an IC with 1c (or hell, even 3c which is a common option) would be better than what was on there, right?
I have never had a Power Designs front panel that would not clean up completely when using a magic sponge (melamine foam) and IPA. They really are magic.
timb -
Here's some simulation results with the LTSpice model created for the original heater thermostat with SCR circuit. An image of the schematic and the LTSpice model are also attached.
The top trace is the AC mains voltage so you can see the relative position of the waveforms in the lower window. The green waveform is the voltage controlling the simulated thermostat cycle. I'm using a voltage controlled switch to model that, so -1V corresponds to an OFF thermostat, and +1V corresponds to thermostat ON. I've deliberately picked timing on that so we can see what happens when it turns on and off in the middle of a cycle. The pink waveform is the current through the heater.
You can see that it largely limits turn on to a zero crossing (there's a little spike because the circuit isn't perfect). The turn-off is restricted to a zero crossing by the behavior of the SCR.
And BTW, if you think the schematic looks sloppy, it's because I was trying to duplicate it exactly as it was drawn on the PD2005A schematic.
Interesting... I just added some scope meter measurements to my iCircuit simulation and got the same thing. I bet they did this to prevent interference from the thermostat switch. I have another PD supply with a working oven based on the 2005 design (100V model) and I can see a large transient on the regulated output when the heater turns on and off.
The switch may also spark, because a pair of nearby speakers make a popping noise as well.
Switching at zero crossing would prevent this.
I guess that NPN in the circuit is there to bias the SCR low when the thermostat is off?
I have been a reader of this forum for a year of so, lots of info here and a lots of it over my head. This thread got me to buy a 6050a off Ebay.
Like the few pieces HP equipment I have the in sides are a pleasure to look at. On to the 6050a I works ok. However I have measured 47v across the 40v cap. I have the info that was posted in this thread ( thank you to those that did it )but I need more. I would like some service info to run this down I do not mind buying it, but would like to do a PDF down load and not pay for the manual to be sent to Alaska. I have looked and all I find is a bound manual to be shipped. Any one know where on the web I can do a PDF down Load, thanks in advance
Luap2
That's pretty cool. I didn't know they had supplies like that. I think you qualify as an official Power Designs addict at this point. How many of these things do you have now?
Fortunately, space constraints on my lab bench limit me from acquiring any more :)
What a great job you did, timb :clap:
I was surprised by how out of shape your unit was and how you've brought it back to life, and looking forward to seeing your upgrades.
I'd be curious to see whether the panel meters will inject a tiny bit of noise into the output if you build it into the chassis.
I'm like MarkPalmer on maintaining the original look and technology as much as possible, and when I do need better metering of the power output, just drop my eload in series or use separate DMMs.
I've kept original labels from the primary owner whenever possible [ not the seller]. The top one was from Boeing, and one of the others is either Martin Marietta, or Grumman but fell off, and one from a cal lab that has stickers on the screws not to open it ;). Aside from cleaning and some Dexoit, the units are working as they came OOB from eBay.
Agreed! very nice job :-+
Very nice! I was wondering who bought that TW6050D ;) Glad it went to a good home. As for the display mod, that will be a very nice upgrade! :-+
Oh post pictures of that 6050C!
Hi folks! Since this thread has lots of Power Designs restoration info, I thought it appropriate to ask here about the control knobs used on many of the supplies. I just picked up a Power Designs TP340A on eBay in excellent condition, though the voltage control knobs seem to have been replaced --- black plastic instead of the typical Aluminium.
The picture below shows the control knob of a TP340A identical to what is on my unit, compared to aluminum knobs on TP343A and TP325.
I would like to restore the knobs on my unit to the classic aluminium version. I've seen tons of "control knob" sellers on eBay, but wanted to check here if anyone knows a source for replacement knobs of the same Power Designs design? (The shaft of the voltage control pots is 1/4" diameter.)
Thanks for any help! I would love to see this unit looking classy again!
There's a BIN Power Designs TP325 for $50 on ebay described as not working.
Hi, I just scored a Power Designs 4010 for a great price :-+ It appears to have all it's original dust inside! I'm hoping that someone has a PDF of the manual or the schematic for this unit. I haven't been able to find one online yet. It would be much appreciated. So far, I've just done a quick voltage check. It works, but is not quite "spot-on" The 10-turn pot seems a bit squirrelly. Right now I'm doing a cosmetic clean up on the front panel and outside case. Thanks for anyone that can help.
"Do you have time to do a test on this? The controls in the picture are set wrong. It looks like it is set to 26.40 v but the max it puts out is 20v.
Can you set it to 16.40 volts? You would only have to move the left inner dial from 2 to 1
then tell me what the meter reads"
The seller sent me this:
"I quickly looked at this and if its a 20V max there would be dials going higher, so the switch on top is 0-10V and 10-20V, then the inner left dial is 0-9v and outer is 10th, so what your saying cannot be correct"
Since I do not have this (and cannot understand him), I guess I made a mistake. What does it read? How would you set the dials to 20v?
Roger
The PS is set for 12.640V just like the voltmeter reads. The left most dial is 0-9 volts and the right most dial is 0-9 millivolts.
When you move the range switch to the 10-20V position you just add ten volts to the dial readings.The lower dial is for sub millivolt adjustments.
Hi folks! Since this thread has lots of Power Designs restoration info, I thought it appropriate to ask here about the control knobs used on many of the supplies. I just picked up a Power Designs TP340A on eBay in excellent condition, though the voltage control knobs seem to have been replaced --- black plastic instead of the typical Aluminium.
The picture below shows the control knob of a TP340A identical to what is on my unit, compared to aluminum knobs on TP343A and TP325.
I would like to restore the knobs on my unit to the classic aluminium version. I've seen tons of "control knob" sellers on eBay, but wanted to check here if anyone knows a source for replacement knobs of the same Power Designs design? (The shaft of the voltage control pots is 1/4" diameter.)
Thanks for any help! I would love to see this unit looking classy again!
Check both fuses (there should be a fuse on the /inside/ of the case, right after the transformer on the secondary side). If there is a high draw (bad current limiting, higher than normal voltage, etc) this internal fuse can blow. I got two units (different models however) with this fault. I am uncertain if the 2005 has this internal fuse.
Hi all, I just acquired a PD 3650- 0-36V, 0-5A. Weighs about 35-40 lbs. I tried searching this thread for this particular model, but didn't find much.You'll find it in K04BB's Manuals Directory: 06 Misc Test Equipment/Power Designs page (http://ko4bb.com/manuals/index.php?dir=06_Misc_Test_Equipment/Power_Designs) (.pdf's available for the operator manual, schematic, and service manual). :)
This thing is a beast. So far, I love it, but I've only been using it for a couple weeks.
I'm curious, does anyone have a manual or just some general info on the PD 3650?
You'll find it in K04BB's Manuals Directory: 06 Misc Test Equipment/Power Designs page (http://ko4bb.com/manuals/index.php?dir=06_Misc_Test_Equipment/Power_Designs) (.pdf's available for the operator manual, schematic, and service manual). :)
Just picked up a nice little Power Designs 4005 (a single not a twin) off eBay for like $14. The voltage while dead on won't go under 1v which I'm not sure was normal operation or a calibration issue. The pilot lamp is also burnt out, does anyone know the general specifications for the neon lamps used by Power Designs? Also I can't seem to find the service info anywhere not even on KO4BB's site so I really don't want to start playing with the trimpots just yet. ;)
Just picked up a nice little Power Designs 4005 (a single not a twin) off eBay for like $14. The voltage while dead on won't go under 1v which I'm not sure was normal operation or a calibration issue. The pilot lamp is also burnt out, does anyone know the general specifications for the neon lamps used by Power Designs? Also I can't seem to find the service info anywhere not even on KO4BB's site so I really don't want to start playing with the trimpots just yet. ;)
FYI guys, I've got PD2005 parts available if anyone needs them. A working reference board, pots, the switch array, transformer, freshly repainted cover, chassis, meter parts. Pretty much anything you'd need to fix a 2005. Send me a PM if you need anything!
FYI guys, I've got PD2005 parts available if anyone needs them. A working reference board, pots, the switch array, transformer, freshly repainted cover, chassis, meter parts. Pretty much anything you'd need to fix a 2005. Send me a PM if you need anything!
What's missing from the 2005 to prevent you from restoring the one you have?
Hi
I have a TP340 and everything works (all ranges will go to the max volts and amps). Except the bottom meter. On volts it works on amps it does not. I can use a multimeter to monitor the amps if needed but I wonder if this would be an easy fix or maybe not worth the effort?
thanks
I doubt not going under 1v is normal.
The supply is probably pretty similar to the sources in a TW4005 of similar vintage. I've been hoarding every Power Designs PDF I come across, and unfortunately, I don't have a manual for the 4005 or the TW4005.
I have used these (https://www.alliedelec.com/vcc-optoelectronics-2ml/70152563/)successfully.
For anybody interested in a PD precision supply - there's a 5020 on Ebay here: http://www.ebay.com/itm/252087857361 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/252087857361) (I have no connection to this auction, BTW)
5020s are pretty rare. I'm quite a fan of mine.
For anybody interested in a PD precision supply - there's a 5020 on Ebay here: http://www.ebay.com/itm/252087857361 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/252087857361) (I have no connection to this auction, BTW)
5020s are pretty rare. I'm quite a fan of mine.
For anybody interested in a PD precision supply - there's a 5020 on Ebay here: http://www.ebay.com/itm/252087857361 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/252087857361) (I have no connection to this auction, BTW)
5020s are pretty rare. I'm quite a fan of mine.
Any suggested max bids? I am currently at $177 but I have missed several over the last year so I am thinking of going to $233. I am in love with these power supplies.
Anyone want to sell theirs?
For anybody interested in a PD precision supply - there's a 5020 on Ebay here: http://www.ebay.com/itm/252087857361 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/252087857361) (I have no connection to this auction, BTW)
5020s are pretty rare. I'm quite a fan of mine.
Any suggested max bids? I am currently at $177 but I have missed several over the last year so I am thinking of going to $233. I am in love with these power supplies.
Anyone want to sell theirs?
I just received a 4010 restored by timb. It's exactly what he said it was, in case you're considering his offer.
Ed
I just received a 4010 restored by timb. It's exactly what he said it was, in case you're considering his offer.
Ed
I noticed that it's different from my 5020 as well - the things that stood out were the different meter and the lack of a counting dial on the mv knob.For anybody interested in a PD precision supply - there's a 5020 on Ebay here: http://www.ebay.com/itm/252087857361 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/252087857361) (I have no connection to this auction, BTW)
5020s are pretty rare. I'm quite a fan of mine.
Any suggested max bids? I am currently at $177 but I have missed several over the last year so I am thinking of going to $233. I am in love with these power supplies.
Anyone want to sell theirs?
Ahh, so you are the one! I was the original bidder. I already have a few PD precision supplies of different vintages & specs, including another 5020. The 5020s seem pretty rare, so I thought I'd bid. I'd already decided not to get into a bidding war on it though.
You are already past what I'd be willing to spend. If you like the look and the precision, you could probably get a lower-specced supply for closer to $100. I got both of my 2005a's for ~$60 shipped. Neither of them were working, but one just needed a new fuse and power cord. The other probably doesn't need much either, but I haven't spent the time to finish troubleshooting it yet.
If you like the precision and the volt/current range, you should be able to pick up an HP6114 on an auction or best-offer. The 6114 doesn't have the nice brushed aluminum aesthetic, but I still find the industrial design pleasing and evocative.
I'll also say that from a human-factors perspective, the dials on the PD precision supplies have a shortcoming, in that the meaning of the inner vs outer knob isn't consistent -- of the two digits handled by the right-hand controls knob sets the least significant digit, while the knob sets the most-significant digit of the two digits handled by the left-hand controls. Yes, there is a logic, but the fact that there are alternative mental models puts an added cognitive burden on the user, which can lead to mistakes. I think the HP 6114's dial controls have less ambiguity.
A few things I've noticed about the 5020 in that listing:
- The top-case isn't as perforated as my 5020, 4010 and 2005a.
- The current and vernier settings knobs are unusual. First, they match, which is odd because most of the 5020 4020 and 4010 supplies I've seen have a 10-turn counting knob for the vernier. Second, they don't look like the knobs used on most PD supplies. They might be replacements, but I've seen similar knobs on one triple output supply. It might be that they are factory original, some of their other later supplies also have different knobs (Bitseeker and I both have TP340a supplies with similar black resin knobs.
- The markings on the precision dials are a plastic appliqué, not the engraved and painted markings seen on most PD precision supplies. My PD5020 is a hybrid. It has engraved markings on the right-hand controls, and plastic applique on the left.
- The meter needle is black, rather than the high-visibility color pink used on most of my PD supplies, including others with that same style of meter. My TP340a, from the mid-1990s, has that same style meter too, but also has black needles on the meters, along with newer, less awesome knobs. It's still a nice, solid supply though.
As for the Vref, definitely not one of their custom ovenized references. Probably an LM399
I just received a 4010 restored by timb. It's exactly what he said it was, in case you're considering his offer.
Ed
I hope you're happy with the unit! It's a very nice little box. :)
Sent from my Smartphone
(Also, ask the seller for a picture of the meter in question if he just has a shot of the box; they made needles in white, black and orange.)
Quote(Also, ask the seller for a picture of the meter in question if he just has a shot of the box; they made needles in white, black and orange.)
I do not understand what you mean.
Just in case here is the listing:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/252087857361?_trksid=p2055359.m1431.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT (http://www.ebay.com/itm/252087857361?_trksid=p2055359.m1431.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT)
Someone talked about how confusing the dials can be. I missed a unit one time because I could not understand how they worked and the seller did not know either.
What ever short comings this has does not matter to me. This thing is just too sexy.
I'll probably put it on the fireplace mantle. It would make me feel like I am living in the Outer Limits. :-+
Quote(Also, ask the seller for a picture of the meter in question if he just has a shot of the box; they made needles in white, black and orange.)
I do not understand what you mean.
The dials are not confusing at all, each dial sets one digit in the output voltage. It is just like entering it on a keyboard, except you do it with four dials. The numbers are read from left to right, just like any other number. In the listing you referred to, it is set to 03.30V, note how those numbers show up in the little "window" in the piece of plastic.
The dials are not confusing at all, each dial sets one digit in the output voltage. It is just like entering it on a keyboard, except you do it with four dials. The numbers are read from left to right, just like any other number. In the listing you referred to, it is set to 03.30V, note how those numbers show up in the little "window" in the piece of plastic.
The part that might cause some confusion after acclimating to the general operation of the dials is the rightmost value, since it goes from 0-(10) instead of 0-9. Since the maximum value that could be reached under normal circumstances would be 49.99, that last digit goes to 10, instead of 9.
49.9(10) = 49.99 + 0.01 = 50.00
The part that might cause some confusion after acclimating to the general operation of the dials is the rightmost value, since it goes from 0-(10) instead of 0-9. Since the maximum value that could be reached under normal circumstances would be 49.99, that last digit goes to 10, instead of 9.
49.9(10) = 49.99 + 0.01 = 50.00
This is what happened to me - thanks
I just received a 4010 restored by timb. It's exactly what he said it was, in case you're considering his offer.
Ed
I hope you're happy with the unit! It's a very nice little box. :)
Sent from my Smartphone
Yes, I am quite satisfied with it. I was pleasantly surprised when I took it out of the box, I was kind of expecting the packaging material to be stuck to the fresh paint. Based on my experience with other peoples repaints, I was seriously hesitant to purchase the supply at all. I have seen a lot of repainted equipment at hamfests, the paint is usually sticky or at least so soft you can leave fingerprints in. Your paint job was very nicely done, you would be doing many people hear a favor if you explain your technique and what materials you use.
As for function, I was expecting it to work perfectly, and it does. Can't really say too much more than that. I turned on the supply and my HP 34401a and let them warm-up for a few hours, then I sent the supply to 5.00V and noted that it was less than 150 µV low. I set the meter to min/max mode and have monitored it at this setting for 24 hours three times, each time the total variation over that period is less than 200 µV, I did not record the actual numbers each time, but I believe it was probably actually within that tolerance over the entire three days. The meter and power supply were both close to a wall, and most of the voltage variation occurred the first time the central air cycled on and off. Not bad at all for a 40-year-old power supply.
If anyone is interested, I can do a short video showing the spray technique and the ins and outs of various off the shelf paints. Plus how to prepare the surface, etc.
The dials are not confusing at all, each dial sets one digit in the output voltage. It is just like entering it on a keyboard, except you do it with four dials. The numbers are read from left to right, just like any other number. In the listing you referred to, it is set to 03.30V, note how those numbers show up in the little "window" in the piece of plastic.
The part that might cause some confusion after acclimating to the general operation of the dials is the rightmost value, since it goes from 0-(10) instead of 0-9. Since the maximum value that could be reached under normal circumstances would be 49.99, that last digit goes to 10, instead of 9.
49.9(10) = 49.99 + 0.01 = 50.00
The first step is admitting you have a problem...
ez,Thanks will do
Looks like you got a good deal on the 5020. Looking forward to hearing all about it when it arrives.
The first step is admitting you have a problem...
Has anyone got a link that details the history & what happened to Power Designs Inc???
Try Ambitrol, they seem to have taken over the PD business. I was bidding for one, but it went for $1.25 with $30 shipping.Ambitrol seems to have been one of their trademarks, along with UNIPLY, REDULE, and PD (source (http://www.trademarkia.com/company-power-designs-inc-972591-page-1-2)). PD trademark expired in 2008, and on a previous search, there hasn't been any activity with the corporation (filing) since 1991.
They seem to have gotten acquired and vanished into thin air.
QuoteThey seem to have gotten acquired and vanished into thin air.
Maybe they came from the same place as Mat Franco. Aliens do not have to be extreme and go around blowing up the world. I believe Mat Franco is an alien with supernatural powers. What better way to live among earthlings than act like a magician? Why would a large company just disappear? It would be interesting to find out if Mat worked for Power Designs, he could make them disappear.
So for those that work on these things, keep your eye open for unusual tool marks or components or construction methods. Can you imagine how valuable these will be if we can prove they were made by aliens?
If enough info can be cobbled together, especially if it includes online references, a Wikipedia page could be started on it.I do not thing aliens will allow this.
I do not thing aliens will allow this.
If enough info can be cobbled together, especially if it includes online references, a Wikipedia page could be started on it.Do it!!!
A Power Designs 2020b Precision DC Power Source (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Power-Designs-Model-2020B-Precision-DC-Source-Tested-Free-Shipping-/181891221870) just showed up on eBay for $129.99 or best offer + shipping.
Last week, I was tweaking my power designs eBay searches, and in the process, I found a poorly listed "6005" supply. I've never seen this model before, and the price was good, so I bought it. After waiting for the better part of a week to get a tracking number, I started looking more closely at the seller, and found they also had a 60's or early-70's era 2020 Precision DC Power Source, also at a good price, so I bought it. Both are on their way, should be here next week. I'll post photos when they arrive.
Also, bitseeker, how's your TP340a coming?
Which reminds me, ez24, you must have your 5020 by now.
Of course!!! Don't turn it on, take it apart!QuoteWhich reminds me, ez24, you must have your 5020 by now.
Yes among other ones. I will fire it up tomorrow. Do you want me to take pics of the inside?
I'll definitely get pix up of both 2020 supplies, once I get the second one. I think they are my favorite power designs supplies. I like the rounded square GE meters, and I like the symmetry of the vertical orientation. The handle in the depression on top is nice too.Of course!!! Don't turn it on, take it apart!QuoteWhich reminds me, ez24, you must have your 5020 by now.
Yes among other ones. I will fire it up tomorrow. Do you want me to take pics of the inside?
- Not sure if that mV counter knob is original. I haven't seen a lot of 5020's, but I wasn't too concerned about it.
- No photos of it in operation, not even just turned on. However, the vref looked fine, all the rear jumpers were present, and the fuse cover was still present.
- Odd misalignment of the voltage dials. Since I don't have any hands-on time with the precision models, I don't know what that could mean. Maybe just a silkscreen misalignment? Maybe a broken switch?
I have a 5020.
Ebay listed it as for parts(?).
Has anyone seen the 2015 Horowitz & Hill "Art of Electronics" 3rd ed. chapter on power supplies? They tested a lot of them including Agilent, etc. and the quietest model (apart from a lead-acid battery) was a Power Designs model.
Has anyone seen the 2015 Horowitz & Hill "Art of Electronics" 3rd ed. chapter on power supplies? They tested a lot of them including Agilent, etc. and the quietest model (apart from a lead-acid battery) was a Power Designs model.
Has anyone seen the 2015 Horowitz & Hill "Art of Electronics" 3rd ed. chapter on power supplies? They tested a lot of them including Agilent, etc. and the quietest model (apart from a lead-acid battery) was a Power Designs model.
It's in Figure 8.123 on p. 580. The PD4010 is a winner! They measured 1.2 uV rms for their 1967 vintage unit.
They measured 1.2 uV rms for their 1967 vintage unit.
QuoteThey measured 1.2 uV rms for their 1967 vintage unit.
Is this 1.2 ripple?
Can a Rigol DZ1054Z measure this 1.2 uV easily? How to hook up? I am worried about stray signals. And would this ripple be 60 Hz? I tried to measure my 5020 once and failed because of noise.
If I ask this question under General, I will probably be laughed off this forum :-DD
1. The DZ1000z series has, at best, 1mv resolution. Dynamic range is, what 10mv? The ADC has 8-bits of resolution. so, that's 10mV/256 = ~40uV resolution. Unless I've had a major lapse of brian-thingyness, it doesn't sound promising, at least not without a low noise pre-amp.
1. The DZ1000z series has, at best, 1mv resolution. Dynamic range is, what 10mv? The ADC has 8-bits of resolution. so, that's 10mV/256 = ~40uV resolution. Unless I've had a major lapse of brian-thingyness, it doesn't sound promising, at least not without a low noise pre-amp.
i.e., if you can see the ripple on your 1054z, the PD precision supply is waaay out of spec.
Well, that 2020B sure went fast. Looks like it sold for between $100 and $125.
Thanks, eas! :-+I concur. :) Very nice indeed. :-+
Yes, thanks eas. I recently picked up a 2010 to keep my 2005A company. I can't find a manual for it online but the 2020 manual is probably close enough.
I've turned them into a searchable PDF, uploaded them to my site, and linked them from my page of Power Designs manuals (http://techobsessed.net/power-designs-manuals-and-schematics/). The page also links to previously uploaded original high quality scans of manuals for the 5020 and 2020b precision supplies, and the 6050.
I use Adobe Acrobat 9 Standard. It came with my scanner.I've turned them into a searchable PDF, uploaded them to my site, and linked them from my page of Power Designs manuals (http://techobsessed.net/power-designs-manuals-and-schematics/). The page also links to previously uploaded original high quality scans of manuals for the 5020 and 2020b precision supplies, and the 6050.
How did you make the pdf searchable. I've strougle with some huge but unsearchable pdfs in the past.
I guess they were cutting back on the cost of printing manuals even more than slipping in the R version. In the one you linked to, they just inserted a note, "Where reference is made to models 5005R and TW5005 in Section 1 and Section 2 of the following manual, substitute model numbers 5005T and TW5005T."
Yeah, there are so many models of PD supplies and then variations of them to boot.
Cool. It should clean up nicely too -- not all banged up like some I've seen.
How do you clean the big old pots on these things. I am getting voltage spikes up the wazoo trying to adjust the voltage setting. Do you have to actually open them up and spray them?
Are you referring to the Bournes multi-turn pots? I had a busted one in my TP340A and tried to fix it, but the contact inside is fiddly and never behaved correctly at the limits. So, if you do open one to clean inside, it may or may not work correctly afterward. It might be OK if you just pop the rear cap off to flush it with contact/electronics cleaner.
I don't know what the single-turn pots are like inside.
I see that there are metal tabs in impressions holding the metal back to the sides and was wondering if I need to deform these tabs to take the back off
So, the solution to the dilemma was to take a single 10 kOhm Chinese Bourns imitation 10-turn pot and replace the two (coarse and fine) with the single multi-turn pot. Sadly, the hole in the metal front panel was too small and I had to drill it slightly larger to fit the fake Bourns pot. The whole endeavor including removing the old pots, examining them and mounting the fake Bourns took about two hours.
In the end, this seems to have worked fine and allows, with some manual dexterity, adjustment on the order of about 5-10 mV.
So, the solution to the dilemma was to take a single 10 kOhm Chinese Bourns imitation 10-turn pot and replace the two (coarse and fine) with the single multi-turn pot. Sadly, the hole in the metal front panel was too small and I had to drill it slightly larger to fit the fake Bourns pot. The whole endeavor including removing the old pots, examining them and mounting the fake Bourns took about two hours.
In the end, this seems to have worked fine and allows, with some manual dexterity, adjustment on the order of about 5-10 mV.
Hey, waaaiiit a second. Didn't you raise a ruckus about these fake pots, contact the FTC, Bournes, etc (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/projects/fighting-chinese-sellers-of-counterfeit-parts-on-ebay/) to try and prevent them being sold. Now it turns out (no pun intended) that after getting a refund, one of them was used to fix your power supply. What the .. ???
So who on here bought the 2020(B???) on ebay?
I have a PDS 5005 coming next week to add to the bench. I will be on the lookout for noisy pots.
I have a PDS 5005 coming next week to add to the bench. I will be on the lookout for noisy pots.
Cermet pots are a whole different ball game, one dust particle = "infinite" voltage through your circuit...
I have a PDS 5005 coming next week to add to the bench. I will be on the lookout for noisy pots.
Cermet pots are a whole different ball game, one dust particle = "infinite" voltage through your circuit...
Maybe we should look into design and construction of an add-on (or add-in) adjustable crowbar over volt protector for the smaller, higher voltage PDS supplies?
a "micro bar" to borrow from an EEV Blog theme. :-DD
http://www.onsemi.com/pub_link/Collateral/MC3423-D.PDF (http://www.onsemi.com/pub_link/Collateral/MC3423-D.PDF)
So who on here bought the 2020(B???) on ebay?
Now, the problem presented itself when I tested the unit. Because all of these analog pots are older than dirt, tiny crap inevitably got inside of them. The result of this is a very VERY serious problem. To make matters worse, the main voltage control pot is not wirewound. It has a solid circular (ring) resistive metallic (or more likely ceramic because it's a Cermet pot) element inside and offered (notice the past tense here) seemingly true contiguous adjustment.
So, the solution to the dilemma was to take a single 10 kOhm Chinese Bourns imitation 10-turn pot and replace the two (coarse and fine) with the single multi-turn pot.
My only concern is not knowing how many watts of power are being placed through the pot itself to make sure that this is within the 0.6 W or so that it is rated for. In a conventional voltage regulator circuit, the current flowing between the Adj and Out pins is tiny. In this particular supply's circuit, who knows...
Does it deal with the range switchover on the transformer?
ELECTRIC CORPORATION
VOLT AMPERE TESTER
SUN VAT -40
AMMETER ELECTRICAL
ZERO ADJUSTMENT
This adjustment knob is used to periodically set
the ammeter pointer to the zero (0) line
electronically. When adjusting zero, the TEST
SELECTOR must be set to #2 CHARGING position
with the Load Leads connected to the battery
(Figure 1).
QuoteMy only concern is not knowing how many watts of power are being placed through the pot itself to make sure that this is within the 0.6 W or so that it is rated for. In a conventional voltage regulator circuit, the current flowing between the Adj and Out pins is tiny. In this particular supply's circuit, who knows...
Yeah, I'd be surprised if there was much going through it. Of course, if you really want to know, "take it apart"...again.
What it definitely does not do is control positive, zero or negative current into the load, which is what I thought it would do.
A beginner's question: do PD models that do not have dedicated CC/CV signalling bulb have any means to notify the user when control is switched to CC? Or one should recognize the decreasing voltage level on the meter?
I plan to buy a nice vintage PD supply but I have never used any yet.
First: thanks for the offer. In fact I am sitting in Europe but I do have a US address for shipping. But: I am a newbie to PD supplies only. I am an electrical engineer myself, so maybe you would like to preserve your supply for a real beginner who needs a starter kit.
But still, I am looking for a DC supply for daily use (I am not satisfied with my current one) and I believe keeping these vintage stuff alive is a good thing (and they also look nice). Your offer is thus interesting to me and I am also willing to pay a reasonable price for it (I am currently searching on ebay).
What modifications have you made on your model? I will have to modify my one anyway because of the different input voltage levels here.
First: thanks for the offer. In fact I am sitting in Europe but I do have a US address for shipping. But: I am a newbie to PD supplies only. I am an electrical engineer myself, so maybe you would like to preserve your supply for a real beginner who needs a starter kit.
But still, I am looking for a DC supply for daily use (I am not satisfied with my current one) and I believe keeping these vintage stuff alive is a good thing (and they also look nice). Your offer is thus interesting to me and I am also willing to pay a reasonable price for it (I am currently searching on ebay).
What modifications have you made on your model? I will have to modify my one anyway because of the different input voltage levels here.
Yes, I was thinking about giving it away as a prize if I ever get around to delivering that presentation on op-amps that I promised last year but have yet to deliver on.
As far as the mods/repairs, the heater coil and thermostat were gone when I got the unit. There were some other minor issues, but nothing major. The heater being out just means that the voltage reference wasn't inside a nice temperature controlled chamber. I rewound the heater with some resistance wire. I didn't want to mess with the mains voltage that was powering the heater, so I have rewired it to the unused phase of the secondary that supplies unregulated DC to the series regulator. The thermostat is just a simple comparator with hysteresis and a MOSFET. It seems to maintain the oven temps with a little better variation than how (I've read) the originals perform, and I am not able to measure any disruption in the output from the heater switching on/off. Of course, my circuit is just a hand-soldered protoboard mounted to the main PCB via some screws, standoffs, and holes I drilled in the PCB. Not pretty, but functional.
If you're OK with voltage adjustment via a potentiometer, there are lots of the older HP supplies like the 6237B on eBay for very cheap. IMHO the nicest "vintage" supplies are the HP 6114A and 6115A. I've repaired and completely refurbished several of these, and I love them and will never part with them :) They are really scarce now, but if you're not in a hurry, put a watch on eBay. Unfortunately, there are a few sellers up there with completely ridiculous asking prices and what amount to permanent auctions on these. This tends to mislead the usual eBay surplus scavengers into thinking that's what they can get for the partially functional or physically damaged units that they bought for next to nothing. But if you watch, you can still occasionally find one at a reasonable price, or maybe even talk a seller down by showing him what they actual sell for. The last one I bought I paid $75 (shipped). This is all eBay US, so maybe the situation is different where you are.
There are other good, but inexpensive, supplies out there, I am sure. This might be a good topic for a separate thread on the forum. Another option, if you want a project, is to get one of these old supplies and scrap everything except the chassis, KV divider, and transformer. Building a very good quality series regulator is not very complicated with all the wonderful ICs out there now.
First: thanks for the offer. In fact I am sitting in Europe but I do have a US address for shipping. But: I am a newbie to PD supplies only. I am an electrical engineer myself, so maybe you would like to preserve your supply for a real beginner who needs a starter kit.
But still, I am looking for a DC supply for daily use (I am not satisfied with my current one) and I believe keeping these vintage stuff alive is a good thing (and they also look nice). Your offer is thus interesting to me and I am also willing to pay a reasonable price for it (I am currently searching on ebay).
What modifications have you made on your model? I will have to modify my one anyway because of the different input voltage levels here.
Yes, I was thinking about giving it away as a prize if I ever get around to delivering that presentation on op-amps that I promised last year but have yet to deliver on.
As far as the mods/repairs, the heater coil and thermostat were gone when I got the unit. There were some other minor issues, but nothing major. The heater being out just means that the voltage reference wasn't inside a nice temperature controlled chamber. I rewound the heater with some resistance wire. I didn't want to mess with the mains voltage that was powering the heater, so I have rewired it to the unused phase of the secondary that supplies unregulated DC to the series regulator. The thermostat is just a simple comparator with hysteresis and a MOSFET. It seems to maintain the oven temps with a little better variation than how (I've read) the originals perform, and I am not able to measure any disruption in the output from the heater switching on/off. Of course, my circuit is just a hand-soldered protoboard mounted to the main PCB via some screws, standoffs, and holes I drilled in the PCB. Not pretty, but functional.
If you're OK with voltage adjustment via a potentiometer, there are lots of the older HP supplies like the 6237B on eBay for very cheap. IMHO the nicest "vintage" supplies are the HP 6114A and 6115A. I've repaired and completely refurbished several of these, and I love them and will never part with them :) They are really scarce now, but if you're not in a hurry, put a watch on eBay. Unfortunately, there are a few sellers up there with completely ridiculous asking prices and what amount to permanent auctions on these. This tends to mislead the usual eBay surplus scavengers into thinking that's what they can get for the partially functional or physically damaged units that they bought for next to nothing. But if you watch, you can still occasionally find one at a reasonable price, or maybe even talk a seller down by showing him what they actual sell for. The last one I bought I paid $75 (shipped). This is all eBay US, so maybe the situation is different where you are.
There are other good, but inexpensive, supplies out there, I am sure. This might be a good topic for a separate thread on the forum. Another option, if you want a project, is to get one of these old supplies and scrap everything except the chassis, KV divider, and transformer. Building a very good quality series regulator is not very complicated with all the wonderful ICs out there now.
If you ever decide to give that supply away I will sign up. I have been wanting to get a Power Designs supply for awhile, and my current bench supply is really starting to act up. Oh and Im also a relative beginner. I just like high quality gear that you can actually repair (My background is in technician work).
Those HP supplies look beautiful. Remind me of this one...
http://www.ebay.com/itm/272157564667?_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT (http://www.ebay.com/itm/272157564667?_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT)
What are some general usages of a supply with so much precision? Maybe setting bias currents on transistor pairs? Most of the opamp circuitry I have worked with hasnt been too fussy (yet atleast >:D)
A beginner's question: do PD models that do not have dedicated CC/CV signalling bulb have any means to notify the user when control is switched to CC?
If you're OK with voltage adjustment via a potentiometer, there are lots of the older HP supplies like the 6237B on eBay for very cheap.
IMHO the nicest "vintage" supplies are the HP 6114A and 6115A. I've repaired and completely refurbished several of these, and I love them and will never part with them :) They are really scarce now...
To add a digital readout to a vintage analog power supply, connect a free cheapie multimeter from Harbor Freight. :-DMM
Yeah, I've been looking for a 6114A with 10-turn pot at a reasonable price for, I don't know, a year now? Like you said, the flippers on eBay want way too much for them. $300+ :o
What do you find to be the primary pros/cons of the HP 6114A/6115A vs the PD 2005/2010/2020/4010/5020 precision supplies?
Ah, yes. Those little DVM modules are cool. They get up to 5 digits for a few bucks more.
Thanks for the links. I'll probably end up going the DIY upgrade route, depending on how my patience lasts. ;D
Nice comparison. #1 HP push wheels worry me a bit, too. The PD knobs look cool and unusual. #2 is the reason I waited to buy a 2010, no custom oven. #3 & 4 are the primary reasons I'd like to get one of the HP's. #5 I suppose could be a DIY upgrade to the PD. #6 for the PD is especially nice with panels that have engraved labels.
There's rarely a need for that much precision in a voltage supply. I do also have a precision current source, and I've used that to characterize transistors and LEDs. It's just more controllable to set current directly rather than trying to hit a target current with a voltage source. A hundredth of a volt on a PN junction actually makes a significant difference in current.
What I like about the supplies is that they are very low noise, pure linear supplies - not even a switching pre-regulator to introduce switching noise. They do not have a fan, so silent operation. The schematic is available, and there is a "Theory of Operation" section in the manual that is a good way to learn more about the design of series voltage regulators. And they seem to last forever if you take care of them. Plus, there's just something about restoring one of these things to near original condition that is satisfying. So much of what is manufactured these days has a shelf life of at most a few years. It's just wonderful to see a piece of solid engineering like this, even if the tech is a little dated, and to bring it back to life and think about it maybe making some future engineer happy long after I am gone.
Ah, yes. Those little DVM modules are cool. They get up to 5 digits for a few bucks more.
Thanks for the links. I'll probably end up going the DIY upgrade route, depending on how my patience lasts. ;D
Nice comparison. #1 HP push wheels worry me a bit, too. The PD knobs look cool and unusual. #2 is the reason I waited to buy a 2010, no custom oven. #3 & 4 are the primary reasons I'd like to get one of the HP's. #5 I suppose could be a DIY upgrade to the PD. #6 for the PD is especially nice with panels that have engraved labels.
On the pushwheels: I have disassembled and cleaned two sets of them. It's not bad if you are careful. robrenz has some good tips on this in the topic he posted about his 611xA rebuild.
Can you use any of the PD supplies in a constant current mode?That will depend on the model.
So, what I did instead was used my digital cutting machine to cut new numbers out of white adhesive vinyl. Kind of a pain in the ass to get them all aligned right, but it looks nice. Next time, I think I might try cutting all the numbers into a strip of static cling vinyl instead and then wrapping it around to wheel and applying white spray pain. Let it dry, remove the cling stencil and voilà!
Anyway. Very nice power supplies. Also, I made up some custom adapter boards to replace those 4-Terminal Sprague caps with standard 10mm Snap Caps. They're up on OSHPark if anyone wants them.
Anyway. Very nice power supplies. Also, I made up some custom adapter boards to replace those 4-Terminal Sprague caps with standard 10mm Snap Caps. They're up on OSHPark if anyone wants them.
BTW - can you give a link to the OSHPark project? I searched for it, but wasn't able to find it.
Anyway. Very nice power supplies. Also, I made up some custom adapter boards to replace those 4-Terminal Sprague caps with standard 10mm Snap Caps. They're up on OSHPark if anyone wants them.
BTW - can you give a link to the OSHPark project? I searched for it, but wasn't able to find it.
Yes, I actually need to upload new Gerbers first. One of the pads was off by 0.5mm (they still worked fine, but I might as well fix it). I'll do that tonight and pop the link here).
I also bought a physical copy of the 6114A service manual and scanned it plus the schematics in at 600DPI. I spent 12 hours stitching the schematics together, cleaning it up, and adding stuff from the Eratta sheet. I'll upload that, too. :)
I got one of the 6114As a while ago for $60 and the only problem was the paint flaking off the tens digit. Taking it apart wasn't too bad, and I made a tool to shave off the heat welded divots of the plastic pegs. Since it was only the one wheel, I was able to paint the numbers back with UV cured paint. Not perfect, but it turned out more than adequate..
Those are really nice supplies.
I got one of the 6114As a while ago for $60 and the only problem was the paint flaking off the tens digit. Taking it apart wasn't too bad, and I made a tool to shave off the heat welded divots of the plastic pegs. Since it was only the one wheel, I was able to paint the numbers back with UV cured paint. Not perfect, but it turned out more than adequate..
Those are really nice supplies.
I've got one here with missing paint on the zero of the hundredths digit. Beyond my skill to repaint it though - I'd just end up with more damaged digits. I like timb's idea of a vinyl stencil and spray paint.
I got one of the 6114As a while ago for $60 and the only problem was the paint flaking off the tens digit. Taking it apart wasn't too bad, and I made a tool to shave off the heat welded divots of the plastic pegs. Since it was only the one wheel, I was able to paint the numbers back with UV cured paint. Not perfect, but it turned out more than adequate..
Those are really nice supplies.
I've got one here with missing paint on the zero of the hundredths digit. Beyond my skill to repaint it though - I'd just end up with more damaged digits. I like timb's idea of a vinyl stencil and spray paint.
I can make up some vinyl stencils for you if you want to give it a go. I've actually got another 6114A here with damaged digits, so maybe I'll give it a go too. (This unit was in pretty bad shape. I need to locate a few parts before I can get it back together. Namely the mV pot and a front panel overlay in decent shape.)
Can you use any of the PD supplies in a constant current mode?That will depend on the model.
I'd look at the front panel photos on eBay for a CV/CC selector switch as not all of their models have this. For example, my TP343B is strictly a CV unit with current limiting, while the 5005R has a CV/CC selector switch ring on the fine adjust pot.
Pretty good price for a decent looking 5020 just listed on ebay (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Power-Designs-Inc-PDI-MODEL-5020-0-20V-2A-0-50V-1A-Precision-DC-Power-Supply-/131765025859?). Too bad I can't justify another one of these excellent supplies.
Sweet! Thanks for the heads up. Just got it :-+
BTW, there are a couple 3K10B (3kV/10mA) supplies available at eBay auction: #252330600672.
Thanks for the headsup on the 3K10B, rarer to find for sale, still used in many labs. Got it. If I've time I'll tear it down with photos for all as there is little on in on the net.Sweet! Thanks for the heads up. Just got it :-+
BTW, there are a couple 3K10B (3kV/10mA) supplies available at eBay auction: #252330600672.
I made sure to get one before I posted on here ;) It didn't take long for these to sell!Thanks for the headsup on the 3K10B, rarer to find for sale, still used in many labs. Got it. If I've time I'll tear it down with photos for all as there is little on in on the net.Sweet! Thanks for the heads up. Just got it :-+
BTW, there are a couple 3K10B (3kV/10mA) supplies available at eBay auction: #252330600672.
I'll be interested to hear what you all do with them.
Victor traps seem to have the market premade in e- traps:
http://www.amazon.com/Victor-Electronic-Rat-Trap-M240/dp/B000LNX06C (http://www.amazon.com/Victor-Electronic-Rat-Trap-M240/dp/B000LNX06C)
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B000E1RIUU (http://www.amazon.com/dp/B000E1RIUU)
Links have photos.
Victor traps seem to have the market premade in e- traps:
http://www.amazon.com/Victor-Electronic-Rat-Trap-M240/dp/B000LNX06C (http://www.amazon.com/Victor-Electronic-Rat-Trap-M240/dp/B000LNX06C)
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B000E1RIUU (http://www.amazon.com/dp/B000E1RIUU)
Links have photos.
I have 2 Victor electronic mouse traps (I do not have rats). They take the food all the to the last plate. He (or they) wil not take the last step in order to make contact from the last plate :-[
I guess from an ozone smell from the charged plates.
I have 2 Victor electronic mouse traps (I do not have rats). They take the food all the to the last plate. He (or they) wil not take the last step in order to make contact from the last plate :-[
I guess from an ozone smell from the charged plates.
I commonly use it for dielectric test or test rated maximum working voltage, to part's failure.
A big problem today is counterfeit or substandard parts, or parts that are quite old.
I got the Power Designs 5020 Last Week. Here is a mini teardown.Turn it over, then tear it down.
Cool. That supply should clean up nicely. For the permanent marker on the front panel, give a melamine sponge (a.k.a., Magic Eraser) a try. Since the aluminum panel has a clear coat on it, you might want to test it a bit in the corner or somewhere less conspicuous to verify that it isn't too abrasive. If it does dull the clear coat, you can probably bring it back with an auto clear coat polish.
Pedro, I always had the impression methanol's vapors were a neurotoxic substance. However, given you are the chemist, perhaps my fears are unwarranted...Cool. That supply should clean up nicely. For the permanent marker on the front panel, give a melamine sponge (a.k.a., Magic Eraser) a try. Since the aluminum panel has a clear coat on it, you might want to test it a bit in the corner or somewhere less conspicuous to verify that it isn't too abrasive. If it does dull the clear coat, you can probably bring it back with an auto clear coat polish.
Before using an abrasive I would just use methanol (wood alcohol). It usually does a great job of removing sharpie, though if left on certain materials for too long the sharpie can seep in and then your only solution is an abrasive. Plus most (but not all) clear coat finishes are stable in methanol.
methanol isn't that bad from a vapor standpoint. In general as far a toxic substances go, it's pretty benign. Your body naturally produces methanol as a by product of certain chemical reactions, similarly you actually ingest methanol when you eat fruits and veggies. As a result your body has ways of removing it and dealing with it. The NIOSH limits are in the hundreds of mg/m3, making this a relatively benign material. For sure, it, like any toxic substance, should be used in a will ventilated area but it's not something to be afraid of. Usually, I apply it to a paper towel or squirt it with a squirt bottle. For us chemists, we usually keep three squirt bottles on hand. Chloroform, methanol or acetone, and toluene. The methanol bottle is most commonly used for removing permament marker.Pedro, I always had the impression methanol's vapors were a neurotoxic substance. However, given you are the chemist, perhaps my fears are unwarranted...Cool. That supply should clean up nicely. For the permanent marker on the front panel, give a melamine sponge (a.k.a., Magic Eraser) a try. Since the aluminum panel has a clear coat on it, you might want to test it a bit in the corner or somewhere less conspicuous to verify that it isn't too abrasive. If it does dull the clear coat, you can probably bring it back with an auto clear coat polish.
Before using an abrasive I would just use methanol (wood alcohol). It usually does a great job of removing sharpie, though if left on certain materials for too long the sharpie can seep in and then your only solution is an abrasive. Plus most (but not all) clear coat finishes are stable in methanol.
Here's one I haven't seen before: Model 605 0-6VDC, 0-500mA. Looks like it has their custom oven like the 2005 models. The rear panel is like Swiss cheese.
Someone buy it so it stops tempting me. :-DD
http://www.ebay.com/itm/291742748367 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/291742748367).
Looks like someone bought it. Anyone here?
I don't have anything like the 100uF 80V on hand except for two salvaged "Jay'Long" 680uF 200V caps, but I wouldn't dare put these monstrosities in what is otherwise quite a nice design. I'll just order some. Serves me right for not keeping enough caps on hand. :palm:Meh. It helps keep your rarely used parts inventory under control, which is a good thing IMHO. ;D
Here's one I haven't seen before: Model 605 0-6VDC, 0-500mA. Looks like it has their custom oven like the 2005 models. The rear panel is like Swiss cheese.
Someone buy it so it stops tempting me. :-DD
http://www.ebay.com/itm/291742748367 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/291742748367)
Front:
(http://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/kB0AAOSwiYFXFptY/s-l1600.jpg)
Top:
(http://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/kKQAAOSw3mpXFpth/s-l1600.jpg)
Rear:
(http://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/yKIAAOSw1DtXFpuH/s-l1600.jpg)
(http://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/l9oAAOSwD2pXFptr/s-l1600.jpg)
That is not unexpected, the lower ranges use less accurate voltage setting resistors.
Also: what is the accuracy of your meter below a volt.
Most likely the resistors have drifted over time. Above 1V the deviation seems consistent, so you should be able to calibrate it. I'll pull mine out tonight and figure out which pots you need to tweak.
The deviation below 1V is most likely your meter and not the unit. What kind of meter are you using?
Anyway, there's normally two pots you have to tweak, one for zero set and the other for cal. There may also be a pot to adjust the front panel meter.
Hmm, I'm not really sure about those two variations in particular. Since the specs are the same, it may simply be architectural changes due to availability of parts or the like. Now that you've brought it up, I'd be curious to know more as well.
Unfortunately, there isn't a lot of info out there about the company or its products. I guess we, the PD product owners, need to start a wiki to consolidate whatever info we're able to find. I haven't even found documentation for all the supplies I already have.
... Seems to be almost no resources out there for PD collectors... which I guess I am now! :scared:
... Seems to be almost no resources out there for PD collectors... which I guess I am now! :scared:
I know I am in the minority, but is it possible aliens made these?
Most of us moved on to the HO 611x supplies :-DD
T has better regulation than S. I'm shopping for my son's home lab (3rd year EE) and thought a little old school PSU would fit the bill. 50V @ 1.5A should be plenty.
No way he is touching my 2020B... no way. ;D
BTW, is there a Wiki on EEVblog? Seems to be almost no resources out there for PD collectors... which I guess I am now! :scared:
Most of us moved on to the HO 611x supplies :-DD
ewwwww! :P Well, the HP (I assume you are talking about HP) precision supplies do have a certain... oh how shall I put this?.... functional "charm" about them. They do, however, lack copious amounts of aluminum and appear to be bathed in plastics of some kind. Only a face a mother could love, I think.
Although the HPs don't have the Art Deco/Streamline Moderne aesthetic of the PDs, they do have a lot of aluminum inside. If you haven't seen inside a 611xA or other instruments that use the "System I" enclosure, the beauty is inside (aluminum skeleton and gold traces/contacts). Here's my HP 3469A multimeter (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/hp-3469a-multimeter-70's-vintage-teardown-and-clean-up/) for a sampling.
Would be nice to have some sort of manufacturer-based resource on EEVblog, especially for the defunct ones.The entire company is defunct. :o :P
Although the HPs don't have the Art Deco/Streamline Moderne aesthetic of the PDs, they do have a lot of aluminum inside. If you haven't seen inside a 611xA or other instruments that use the "System I" enclosure, the beauty is inside (aluminum skeleton and gold traces/contacts). Here's my HP 3469A multimeter (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/hp-3469a-multimeter-70's-vintage-teardown-and-clean-up/) for a sampling.
Inside, for sure, but I usually don't stare at the internals unless there is an issue or after initial purchase for curiosity sake. When my 5335A Counter died, I parted it out and still have a stack of aluminum left (PM me for parts!). HP is all about the specs and durability which is all well and good but not so much visual appeal, especially for a collector. At any rate, finding a decent HP supply for under $50 is tough but PDs do drop under this price frequently.
I know this thread was about the Precision designs but I posted here because it appears to be the only PD thread in the forum with traction. Would be nice to have some sort of manufacturer-based resource on EEVblog, especially for the defunct ones.
To each his own. I just sold my 2005A, for $40 because I don't find it visually that appealing and that interface is just nasty to use. The center knob isn't too bad, but the ring dial gets old in a real hurry when you are changing settings.
I just sold my 2005A, for $40 because I don't find it visually that appealing and that interface is just nasty to use. The center knob isn't too bad, but the ring dial gets old in a real hurry when you are changing settings.
T has better regulation than S. I'm shopping for my son's home lab (3rd year EE) and thought a little old school PSU would fit the bill. 50V @ 1.5A should be plenty. No way he is touching my 2020B... no way. ;DI have a 5015A and its performance is absolutely amazing - I tested it throughout its range and the ripple was quite low and the voltage was quite stable. The only letdown for me is that it does not work as a current source.
BTW, is there a Wiki on EEVblog? Seems to be almost no resources out there for PD collectors... which I guess I am now! :scared:
T has better regulation than S. I'm shopping for my son's home lab (3rd year EE) and thought a little old school PSU would fit the bill. 50V @ 1.5A should be plenty. No way he is touching my 2020B... no way. ;DI have a 5015A and its performance is absolutely amazing - I tested it throughout its range and the ripple was quite low and the voltage was quite stable. The only letdown for me is that it does not work as a current source.
BTW, is there a Wiki on EEVblog? Seems to be almost no resources out there for PD collectors... which I guess I am now! :scared:
Not digital - I worship at the church of HP622x.
Inside, for sure, but I usually don't stare at the internals unless there is an issue or after initial purchase for curiosity sake. When my 5335A Counter died, I parted it out and still have a stack of aluminum left (PM me for parts!). HP is all about the specs and durability which is all well and good but not so much visual appeal, especially for a collector. At any rate, finding a decent HP supply for under $50 is tough but PDs do drop under this price frequently.
I know this thread was about the Precision designs but I posted here because it appears to be the only PD thread in the forum with traction.
I have a 5015A and its performance is absolutely amazing - I tested it throughout its range and the ripple was quite low and the voltage was quite stable. The only letdown for me is that it does not work as a current source.
That's ok. I'm bi-denominational. Currently with 4 PD supplies and 7 HP supplies including a 6114, 6115, 6632a and 6632b. Shit - when I list them like that it makes me realize I have a PSU issue... :palm:
Oh, no. I meant that the current control is a clamp. In other words, the output drops to zero if the limit is reached, requiring power cycling the power supply.T has better regulation than S. I'm shopping for my son's home lab (3rd year EE) and thought a little old school PSU would fit the bill. 50V @ 1.5A should be plenty. No way he is touching my 2020B... no way. ;DI have a 5015A and its performance is absolutely amazing - I tested it throughout its range and the ripple was quite low and the voltage was quite stable. The only letdown for me is that it does not work as a current source.
BTW, is there a Wiki on EEVblog? Seems to be almost no resources out there for PD collectors... which I guess I am now! :scared:
Is the current delivery not flat up to 50V?
Oh, no. I meant that the current control is a clamp. In other words, the output drops to zero if the limit is reached, requiring power cycling the power supply.T has better regulation than S. I'm shopping for my son's home lab (3rd year EE) and thought a little old school PSU would fit the bill. 50V @ 1.5A should be plenty. No way he is touching my 2020B... no way. ;DI have a 5015A and its performance is absolutely amazing - I tested it throughout its range and the ripple was quite low and the voltage was quite stable. The only letdown for me is that it does not work as a current source.
BTW, is there a Wiki on EEVblog? Seems to be almost no resources out there for PD collectors... which I guess I am now! :scared:
Is the current delivery not flat up to 50V?
FWIW, the images I see of the 5015A have a current knob (proper CC) rather than a set screw for current as is the case on other models (some with letters, some without).Oh, no. I meant that the current control is a clamp. In other words, the output drops to zero if the limit is reached, requiring power cycling the power supply.T has better regulation than S. I'm shopping for my son's home lab (3rd year EE) and thought a little old school PSU would fit the bill. 50V @ 1.5A should be plenty. No way he is touching my 2020B... no way. ;DI have a 5015A and its performance is absolutely amazing - I tested it throughout its range and the ripple was quite low and the voltage was quite stable. The only letdown for me is that it does not work as a current source.
BTW, is there a Wiki on EEVblog? Seems to be almost no resources out there for PD collectors... which I guess I am now! :scared:
Is the current delivery not flat up to 50V?
Something must have changed between the A and the S because mine limits like a charm. Once the limit is reached the voltage starts dropping keeping current constant. Raise the limit and the voltage rises again. The only downside is that you need to set the limit with a dead short across the terminals.
FWIW, the images I see of the 5015A have a current knob (proper CC) rather than a set screw for current as is the case on other models (some with letters, some without).The diagram I got had some usage instructions about the CC control of the 5015A, and they indicate it is a crowbar method, not CC. It also says there the price was $234.50 FOB factory in 1961 ($1919.81 in today's money), while the specified ripple is rated at less than 0.001% with a maximum of 500 microvolts :o
As someone else hinted in a past discussion, I am suspicious they were in fact from another planet and graced us with their designs...
Well, one of my PD 6050A was owned by Grumman Aircraft. ;D
God forbid, the PD is not the alien (but just in case I use kind words when I talk to my power supply)Easily testable. Hook it up to a scope and threaten it with a hammer.
I still need to find a pair of rear feet for this unit.
Yeah, many of the PD supplies as well as some other brands of instruments from the same era (Systron Donner, etc.) used the same feet. I have a 6050A that's missing a rear one. If you find a source (other than buying whole devices just for their feet), let me know.I did find a close match for the original rear feet on the 6050C. Just slightly shorter.
Very nice. My 2010 also has the locking toggle switch for the voltage output range. It's a good safety feature.My TP343 uses one for the tracking switch. So it seems Power Designs were really fond of locking toggles (seen it on other models as well).
My pot has a little 'catch' at about 900 ohms. I couldn't see any reason for it.
The 34461A's trend plot labeling leaves a little to be desired to say the least; they have room for another digit, but insist on displaying 10.000 2 twice...
I've been thinking lately of the practicality of using something like transparencies with reverse printing and just using that on a front plate. Easily cleaned and if it gets damaged you just print another.
Did anyone here win the "for parts" C500 on eBay today?
Cool, congrats. I look forward to seeing the C500. The photos in the listing weren't the greatest.
This morning I managed to snag 2 A models from fleabay, one working and one not for $100.99 + shipping. The one on the left is claimed to be working. It seems a switch was changed on the other one. Happy chappy me :-DD
In a moment of weakness I bought a 5020 the other day. It was only $52 so the price was just right. It lost a banana terminal on it's way to me so I'll have to replace that. Otherwise is in pretty nice shape with only a couple of scratches and some sticker residue on it's faceplate; the dials and output are still spot on. Pretty happy about it overall. I am running of space for power supplies though. I might have a problem.
In a moment of weakness I bought a 5020 the other day. It was only $52 so the price was just right. It lost a banana terminal on it's way to me so I'll have to replace that. Otherwise is in pretty nice shape with only a couple of scratches and some sticker residue on it's faceplate; the dials and output are still spot on. Pretty happy about it overall. I am running of space for power supplies though. I might have a problem.Decent price IMHO. :-+
That's exactly what I ended up doing ;D . I ordered a couple of new posts so it won't stay like that for too long.The workload is increased a bit this way, but it's an old trick that works well IME. >:D
I've got cosmetic projects for mine as well, nanofrog, so you aren't alone in that department.In my case it's my most used supply (favorite), so getting time to tear it apart hasn't been all that convenient over the years.
Howdy! Hopefully this is a good topic to reply to rather than starting a new one.In regard to the fine voltage knob, it probably only needs a good cleaning. Deoxit D (http://store.caig.com/s.nl/sc.2/category.188/.f) would do nicely.
I recently picked up a couple of Power Designs power supplies. These things are gorgeous!
I'm trying to diagnose what's up with the 5015T and figured some of you might have thoughts.
The first issue is that the fine voltage control bounces all over the place as I adjust it. Turning right sometimes increase voltage and vice versa. I'm assuming this is a potentiometer issue and have a replacement on the way.
The second issue thus far is with the meter itself. I can use the screw terminal in front to roughly calibrate it, but at 35V +, the wiper blade (:bullshit: not sure if that's what it is called) bounces side to side and never quite sets correctly. Any thoughts on what I should replace to fix that?
It's able to hold a rock solid 28.00V (what I'm primarily going to use it for) for hours. Amperes will be tested soon once I get a proper load resistor to ensure calibration there.
Howdy! Hopefully this is a good topic to reply to rather than starting a new one.
I recently picked up a couple of Power Designs power supplies. These things are gorgeous!
I'm trying to diagnose what's up with the 5015T and figured some of you might have thoughts.
The first issue is that the fine voltage control bounces all over the place as I adjust it. Turning right sometimes increase voltage and vice versa. I'm assuming this is a potentiometer issue and have a replacement on the way.
The second issue thus far is with the meter itself. I can use the screw terminal in front to roughly calibrate it, but at 35V +, the wiper blade (:bullshit: not sure if that's what it is called) bounces side to side and never quite sets correctly. Any thoughts on what I should replace to fix that?
It's able to hold a rock solid 28.00V (what I'm primarily going to use it for) for hours. Amperes will be tested soon once I get a proper load resistor to ensure calibration there.
Howdy! Hopefully this is a good topic to reply to rather than starting a new one.Very nice set of Power Designs supplies.
I recently picked up a couple of Power Designs power supplies. These things are gorgeous!
I'm trying to diagnose what's up with the 5015T and figured some of you might have thoughts.
The first issue is that the fine voltage control bounces all over the place as I adjust it. Turning right sometimes increase voltage and vice versa. I'm assuming this is a potentiometer issue and have a replacement on the way.
The second issue thus far is with the meter itself. I can use the screw terminal in front to roughly calibrate it, but at 35V +, the wiper blade (:bullshit: not sure if that's what it is called) bounces side to side and never quite sets correctly. Any thoughts on what I should replace to fix that?
It's able to hold a rock solid 28.00V (what I'm primarily going to use it for) for hours. Amperes will be tested soon once I get a proper load resistor to ensure calibration there.
Gotta catch 'em all. ;DUnfortunately I do not have the room to "catch 'em all". But this one did turn out to be a great catch.
That looks great, Barbouri! A very nice upgrade, indeed. Is the 6050D display board different from B and C? I only have the A models.Thanks bitseeker!
Of those three digital variations, do you have a preference? If so, what makes it that much better than the others?I would have to pick the PD 6050D as my preference. They are all great power supplies, and each of them has their own distinct features.
I couldn't resist sharing my 5015A (last cal in 1967!) at max current capacity (1.5A) supplying a state of the art 12-core 1.5GHz processor board. That is why these beasts took mankind to the moon!That is a nice looking PD 5015A.
Wow, I would love to have one of these, especially for $25 with zero shipping. You are a lucky man. :-+
I would have to pick the PD 6050D as my preference. They are all great power supplies, and each of them has their own distinct features.
To me it seems that Power Designs, Inc. made an incremental improvement in each revision of the 6050 series that actually improved the usability.
FWIW, I suspect it would survive load testing (these things are built like tanks IME). :-+
If not, there's surely someone that can post a proper schematic (I've a TP343B if that'll help; bit different obviously, but the offer stands should you need it).
I get it.FWIW, I suspect it would survive load testing (these things are built like tanks IME). :-+
If not, there's surely someone that can post a proper schematic (I've a TP343B if that'll help; bit different obviously, but the offer stands should you need it).
Oh it did pass load testing just fine - even before I replaced the burnt resistor. I just don’t like not understanding why that resistor blew.
I'm not sure if you noticed, but the vernier on your unit in the photo is set to 8.
So if you want to calibrate this to better than 1 mV then make sure to take that into account.
I have one of these and they have incredibly low drift and great repeatability once the heater has stabilized.
The first task is to get that 0.1 v position to move reasonably.I recommend going with Caig Deoxit (http://caig.com/) products. It's not cheap, but works extremely well. The K-2C sampler kit (https://www.ebay.com/itm/Caig-DeoxIT-Sampler-Kit-K-2C-Shield-S100L-FaderLube-F100L-D100L-G100L-Gold/302693316727?epid=1203632960&hash=item4679ed7877%3Ag%3AW6wAAOSwikdaxIDp&_sop=15&_sacat=0&_nkw=caig+kit&_from=R40&rt=nc) would take care of your 2005.
Yep, all orginal AFAIK. The PD supplies are like that.They are. :-+
2mtdoc: are these wires, soldering and cable ties original? It all looks very well and tidy for such an old piece of equipment.I have always been impressed with the quality of the wiring and attention to detail in the Power Designs Inc. supplies.
Yes, I think it is. If you compare my photos to Bitseekers in his repair thread (link in my earlier post), you can see there were several part changes in later models.Yep, all orginal AFAIK. The PD supplies are like that.They are. :-+
I noticed a date code in one of your photos (RCA TO-3) of 8501. I suspect it's original, but do you recall if '85 is right based on other components?
What I thought was interesting about this picture is that it shows the "newer" digital models along with the older precision supplies, although I can't make out which one it is.Hi Johnboy,
Sorry to revive such an old thread, but I read this today and was interested enough to do a little research on these mystery boxes on my own.
I found this picture of a PD catalog someone is selling on ebay. I've attached a picture from the cover, as well as the link to the item if anyone is actually interested enough to buy it (I am not the seller and have no affiliation). I also tried to find a scan of this floating around on the 'net somewhere and came up emptyhanded.
What I thought was interesting about this picture is that it shows the "newer" digital models along with the older precision supplies, although I can't make out which one it is. This was at one point in time at least, their lineup prior to the acquisition of their branding and the change that followed. An interesting time for a PD catalog, and I'd like to see what's inside if anyone else has found a scan of it somewhere.
(https://www.barbouri.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/11/PD6010Dfront10.jpg)
4. 6010(A/B/C/D)?. I've never seen the digital version of this, but the range table on the left side of the panel looks like the one on the analog 6010.
It seems very odd that there was so little left to find.
Unless, of course, they were aliens. :horse:
I have same thoughts. I'm surprised how many models they released. Would love to know the company history.
Tech Obsessed has a Power Designs Inc. History page
https://techobsessed.net/power-designs/
Tech Obsessed has a Power Designs Inc. History page
https://techobsessed.net/power-designs/
Thanks, Greg! I was hoping for a bit more, like a history from human perspective. Like, two friends got drunk in a garage, designed and assembled their first power supply over night, sold it with a good profit, then they decided to establish a business...
As someone else hinted in a past discussion, I am suspicious they were in fact from another planet and graced us with their designs...
Glad someone else believes this, since there is no internet history on them. If something exists then it will be on the internet. Since "they" do not exist but their products exist, something must be going on. A logical explanation is aliens made them for some purpose that we do not know about. Like help develop something for space flight that will take us to another planet. Once this theory is proven then the value of these supplies will greatly increase. I just hope humans will not become a food source like I think about every time I look at my power supply. God forbid, the PD is not the alien (but just in case I use kind words when I talk to my power supply)
Thanks, Greg! I was hoping for a bit more, like a history from human perspective. Like, two friends got drunk in a garage, designed and assembled their first power supply over night, sold it with a good profit, then they decided to establish a business...
Johnboy, this sounds really interesting! I would vote for adding the info to this thread to keep the PD info all in one place.
he did tell me that his father came home from work on more than one occasions very excitedly talking about the new laboratory he had access to. Apparently, they had a room where he could test the circuits he was building at very low temperatures
1. There was an [edited] discussion of why these low-power, highly stable precision units were necessary at that time and why they aren't widely produced anymore. Those of you who read it before the edits know what I'm referring to.
2. The units incorporating the Uniply design seemed to emphasize a main selling point of being able to do their own switching between ranges, "taking the place of multiple power supplies". One can see the potential value of a single unit being used to replace multiples in a situation where every ounce of weight has to be taken into account.
[weird schematics]
With the C400 and C500, the voltage is 100, so they use C, which is 100 in Roman numerals, to save space. Clever, eh?
A TEAdvantage? :-DD:-+ :-DD
Seeing all of these cleaned up power supplies makes me want to try cleaning mine again. There is some hardened glue from old stickers that I wasn't able to get off with isopropyl. What doe people recommend to clean up the brushed aluminum faceplate of these?I use Bestine solvent and thinner for rubber cement, which is N-Heptane. It does a very good job of removing old hardened sticker residue, but is very flammable though.
Seeing all of these cleaned up power supplies makes me want to try cleaning mine again. There is some hardened glue from old stickers that I wasn't able to get off with isopropyl. What doe people recommend to clean up the brushed aluminum faceplate of these?
The "power on" lamp of my lovely Model 5020 has given up the ghost! Does anyone know where one can source these bulbs?
The "power on" lamp of my lovely Model 5020 has given up the ghost! Does anyone know where one can source these bulbs?
My oven on light died a while ago so I bought a set of neons bulbs that were on sale at electronic goldmine. They had the plastic holder and it was a direct replacement and snapped into the case, but the plastic was orange.
The "power on" lamp of my lovely Model 5020 has given up the ghost! Does anyone know where one can source these bulbs?
My oven on light died a while ago so I bought a set of neons bulbs that were on sale at electronic goldmine. They had the plastic holder and it was a direct replacement and snapped into the case, but the plastic was orange.
I have never heard of this lovely place, but my wife will hear of it when she wonders what happened to my wallet!
Are you talking about these? https://www.goldmine-elec-products.com/prodinfo.asp?number=G24950 (https://www.goldmine-elec-products.com/prodinfo.asp?number=G24950)
https://www.barbouri.com/2020/11/22/power-designs-6010d-universal-dc-source-restoration/ (https://www.barbouri.com/2020/11/22/power-designs-6010d-universal-dc-source-restoration/)
I've read the article, thanks for sharing. At it says you have some plans to upgrade the meter. I'm curious what's your plan, if I may ask? More resolution, bt-connection, dual display? :)