EEVblog Electronics Community Forum
Products => Test Equipment => Topic started by: edy on August 08, 2013, 10:18:06 pm
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Hi folks,
I just bought my first real analog oscilloscope! I'm so excited to be losing my "scope virginity". :-+ And it only cost me $85 with free shipping included. It is said to be fully functional and only missing a handle. I believe this is a fair value, as I noticed the last few 20 Mhz scopes I was bidding on were selling for around the $50-60 mark without shipping, and once you tagged on another $20-30 shipping it was around the same.
Wondering if anyone has one of these beasts and has any thoughts or things to watch out for? It looks like a fairly new model, maybe late 80's or early 90's? Does anyone know when these were made? I'm looking for manuals and found some on the web, but if you have good links and could post them here that would be awesome!
If you've been following some of the postings here, you may have noticed I was looking around eBay and Kijiji and Craigslist recently for scopes and managed to miss out on some pretty good deals. I was not willing to go over $50 but I finally caved in. But on average I think Dave was correct that you can get them for under $50 or even less, depending on whether they are tested or not. I'm pretending I bought the scope for "$50" and paid "$35" in shipping. ;) Now I feel a bit better.
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I am glad I did not lose my virginity to a over weight 50 year old truck stop prostitute.
Lots of (analog scope) chubby chasers on this forum
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Ha ha ha ha ha!!!
Thanks for a good laugh!
I am hoping to "cut my teeth" on this scope and gain experience. One day I'll pass it on to the next generation of analog scope virgins... This scope seems to have been quite promiscuous, likely passed through several scope virgins in it's day and I'm just one in a long line. :-)
Looking forward to reporting on how it performs.
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Ha ha ha ha ha!!!
Thanks for a good laugh!
I am hoping to "cut my teeth" on this scope and gain experience. One day I'll pass it on to the next generation of analog scope virgins... This scope seems to have been quite promiscuous, likely passed through several scope virgins in it's day and I'm just one in a long line. :-)
Looking forward to reporting on how it performs.
appreciate that intensity knob :-+
play oscillofun on it http://pouet.net/prod.php?which=58317 (http://pouet.net/prod.php?which=58317)
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Have some 1065 and 1065A (not sure what the difference between that and 1565 is?), the only thing I've noticed is that the switches and knobs can gum up but they clean up pretty easily. One of my 1065A has minor offset issues on CH2 but I haven't looked into it. Otherwise, no problems from me.
Pop the cover and look at some ICs for date codes to get an idea of when it was built.
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I was sniffing about this scope yesterday:
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/hitachi-v-1565-input-voltage/ (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/hitachi-v-1565-input-voltage/)
And when I finally decided to buy it on eBay, someone grabbed it, one minute before me. |O
That someone is you!
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Hitachi-V-1565-Oscilloscope-100MHz-MISSING-HANDLE-/261260541614?pt=BI_Oscilloscopes&hash=item3cd4577eae (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Hitachi-V-1565-Oscilloscope-100MHz-MISSING-HANDLE-/261260541614?pt=BI_Oscilloscopes&hash=item3cd4577eae)
I have mixed feelings now.. well, I should be happy at-least that it was sold to a fellow eevblog member!
Please update this thread when you get it.. I hesitated at first, because it looks really beaten, dirty, and the screen looks funny (maybe just a reflection).
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For what it's worth, I ordered a 1065A scope a few months ago, thinking it was designed for 230(etc.) Volts as well as 120(etc.) Volts mains.
It turned out, judging from the back of my scope, it's for 120 V only. |O From googling I know other 1065 scopes can use 230V.
Link to picture: http://imgur.com/kjMEdGZ (http://imgur.com/kjMEdGZ)
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Shalom Losnir!
I was sniffing about this scope yesterday:
And when I finally decided to buy it on eBay, someone grabbed it, one minute before me. |O
That someone is you!
I have mixed feelings now.. well, I should be happy at-least that it was sold to a fellow eevblog member!
As far as mixed feelings go, not only am I a fellow eevblog member, *BUT* I am ALSO a Sabra! :-+
Were you planning to ship to Israel, or to someone in the USA first?
Sorry I grabbed the scope before you! Oops! It was a "Buy It Now" so it could have been sold any time and it was listed for several days. Had no idea whether anyone else wanted it. I looked at various listings and it seemed relatively inexpensive (considering that free shipping was included). According to description, it works fully but just cosmetically foul and missing a handle.
Please update this thread when you get it.. I hesitated at first, because it looks really beaten, dirty, and the screen looks funny (maybe just a reflection).
Hopefully with a bit of cleaning and blow-dusting it will look a lot better. I don't really need a handle but I may be able to make something from metal/wood if needed as a stand. I will post update photos once I have it cleaned up and playing Oscillofun on it, we'll see if it actually functions as intended.
:palm:
Now as luck would have it, in this WEIRD turn of events I also had another EBAY "bid" going on another oscilloscope (JDR 20Mhz) which I never in a million years thought I would win, because someone had also bid the same amount on it hours before the end of the auction.... I was expecting the other person to grab it! But since I was "first in" with that bid, and nobody else bid anything, I ended up winning it!
So this morning I get a message that I won the scope, with a bid of only $20 (+$30 shipping) which validates Dave's $50 price for a 20 Mhz analog scope. See listing below. It includes a scope with probes, manuals and everything and actually in great condition. Here is the listing:
eBay auction: #111134496460
So from being a SCOPE "VIRGIN" I am now going to 2 scopes! So I also have mixed feelings because I purchased that Hitachi and ended up also with the JDR. I will have to check them both out once I receive them, clean them up, compare them and see which I want to keep (unless I keep both). I'll post a review of both here as well.
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For what it's worth, I ordered a 1065A scope a few months ago, thinking it was designed for 230(etc.) Volts as well as 120(etc.) Volts mains.
It turned out, judging from the back of my scope, it's for 120 V only. |O From googling I know other 1065 scopes can use 230V.
Link to picture: http://imgur.com/kjMEdGZ (http://imgur.com/kjMEdGZ)
Thank's for the input - I was suspecting it is 120V only by examining one of the auction's picture.
It looks pretty much identical to your 120V only unit:
(http://i.imgur.com/nBAztZNt.png) (http://imgur.com/nBAztZN)
Shalom Losnir!
As far as mixed feelings go, not only am I a fellow eevblog member, *BUT* I am ALSO a Sabra! :-+
Were you planning to ship to Israel, or to someone in the USA first?
Ha, what a coincidence!
I was planning to ship it to an Israeli reshipping company (http://buy2usa.co.il) that has logistics warehouses in Hillside, NY. The shipping rates to Israel would be around $45 for surface mail (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Surface_mail), which takes roughly 40 days.
Sorry I grabbed the scope before you! Oops! It was a "Buy It Now" so it could have been sold any time and it was listed for several days. Had no idea whether anyone else wanted it. I looked at various listings and it seemed relatively inexpensive (considering that free shipping was included). According to description, it works fully but just cosmetically foul and missing a handle.
You deserved it as much as I did, so no problem here :-)
I think it is a terrific price. I didn't really care for the handle, but the CRT looked dodgy, "foggy" perhaps. I just couldn't risk it - by the time I will have the scope, it will be too late to return it, not to mention the shipping cost back.
Hopefully with a bit of cleaning and blow-dusting it will look a lot better. I don't really need a handle but I may be able to make something from metal/wood if needed as a stand. I will post update photos once I have it cleaned up and playing Oscillofun on it, we'll see if it actually functions as intended.
Actually, there's a strong chance that you saved me from major frustration with the input voltage! :phew:
Don't forget to post a picture of the input voltage when you get it. :P
:palm:
Now as luck would have it, in this WEIRD turn of events I also had another EBAY "bid" going on another oscilloscope (JDR 20Mhz) which I never in a million years thought I would win, because someone had also bid the same amount on it hours before the end of the auction.... I was expecting the other person to grab it! But since I was "first in" with that bid, and nobody else bid anything, I ended up winning it!
So this morning I get a message that I won the scope, with a bid of only $20 (+$30 shipping) which validates Dave's $50 price for a 20 Mhz analog scope. See listing below. It includes a scope with probes, manuals and everything and actually in great condition. Here is the listing:
eBay auction: #111134496460
So from being a SCOPE "VIRGIN" I am now going to 2 scopes! So I also have mixed feelings because I purchased that Hitachi and ended up also with the JDR. I will have to check them both out once I receive them, clean them up, compare them and see which I want to keep (unless I keep both). I'll post a review of both here as well.
Oops :o
I think there is no doubt here that the Hitachi is the way to go, it is really a decent scope.
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I'll try to post pictures or videos of both of them running oscillofun or youscope, and I may open them up to see what is inside and get rid of dust/bugs. I will look at the voltage ratings for you as well. I know the JDR 20 Mhz comes with probes, but the Hitachi didn't include any... So I'll have to see if JDR probes are good enough for now, although eventually I will need to get something meant for the Hitachi 100 Mhz.
I am fortunate to have family in USA to accept shipments or buy on my behalf. If we travel regularly, then I just need to wait a few weeks to get it. I will try to coordinate my purchase around the time someone is visiting, just in case it is defective, they can take it back.
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I found these documents around the webs.... no schematics/service manual but a bunch of other goodies. See links and attached files:
MANUAL: http://people.virginia.edu/~cas8m/classes/phys3150/2012/scopemanual.pdf (http://people.virginia.edu/~cas8m/classes/phys3150/2012/scopemanual.pdf)
SCHEMATICS:
http://nice.kaze.com/V-1585-65-60-V-695-OM-Schematics-English.pdf (http://nice.kaze.com/V-1585-65-60-V-695-OM-Schematics-English.pdf)
Now if you look at the schematics above, and the BROCHURE attachment, you'll notice the scopes appear to have different numbers. I wonder if Hitachi used different model numbers for different regions. That's why I had trouble finding any service manuals for "V-1565".
For example, these seem to be very similar:
1065 - cursor, 100 Mhz - V 1565 ?
1065C - cursor, 100 Mhz - V1565 ? not sure
1060 - 100 Mhz - V 1560 ?
665 - cursor, 60 Mhz - V 695 ?
660 - 60 Mhz - not sure
If anyone happens to have service/schematics for this Hitachi, please do share. Or if you know about the naming of the model #'s and whether I am on the right track above, let me know.
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V-1060 has no cursors, V-1065 has cursors (time/volt/freq), V-1065A has cursors and a frequency counter, 1565 looks like 1065A but with wider input voltage - likely for different regions as you said.
I verified that my 1065s have stickers covering the rear print. The stickers do say 120V only.
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The funny thing is the 1065A I ordered came from Israel, someone there must have used a transformer like I do now. ???
Thank's for the input - I was suspecting it is 120V only by examining one of the auction's picture.
It looks pretty much identical to your 120V only unit:
(http://i.imgur.com/nBAztZNt.png) (http://imgur.com/nBAztZN)
(*newbie tendencies here* :-/O) The ground lead is not used, from what I see on the picture, is that recommended?
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OK, so my scope is "in transit" with Fedex already.
Have a look at the pictures on this listing....
eBay auction: #271236446371
And have a look at this:
http://www.auctiva.com/hostedimages/showimage.aspx?gid=1103842&image=684708630&images=684708561,684708578,684708604,684708630,684708651&formats=0,0,0,0,0&format=0 (http://www.auctiva.com/hostedimages/showimage.aspx?gid=1103842&image=684708630&images=684708561,684708578,684708604,684708630,684708651&formats=0,0,0,0,0&format=0)
The back clearly states 90-250V AC input with 48-440 Hz frequency range. So Israel I believe is 220V at 50Hz, which should work as it falls inside of the range.
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Never figured out why the world outside of North America became fascinated with 220v. I guess they like being electrocuted.
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They like to have a fast boiling kettle without having to use a gas stove. Also you can have a decent electric heater and not an anaemic pretend unit.
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Never figured out why the world outside of North America became fascinated with 220v. I guess they like being electrocuted.
Naah, almost nobody ever dies. Just think of the savings in copper you get from half the current at same power...
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P = V^2 * R
......... Just think of the savings in copper you get from half the current at same power...
Looking at the way he bashed 220V, don't think he understands both of your comments there. ::)
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P = V^2 * R
It is a bit unconventional to use * for division...
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They like to have a fast boiling kettle without having to use a gas stove. Also you can have a decent electric heater and not an anaemic pretend unit.
In the U.S., stoves, heaters, etc use 240V. Small appliances use 120V. Split Phase Power (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Split-phase_electric_power), don't ya' know? :-+
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Yes, but can you plug them into *****ANY***** outlet in the house, even via an extension cord of an arbitrary length. Not stuck to only being hardwired or only having a single dedicated outlet in the laundry for it.
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In the U.S., stoves, heaters, etc use 240V. Small appliances use 120V.
And elsewhere in the world we have 400 V three phase for the demanding stuff...
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You got the wrong quote, and here if I have 3 phase I get 400VAC anyway.
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P = V^2 * R
......... Just think of the savings in copper you get from half the current at same power...
Looking at the way he bashed 220V, don't think he understands both of your comments there. ::)
It was meant a joke! :box:
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Hey folks,
The scope has landed at my parents house in New Jersey!!! I had it delivered there to avoid crazy shipping and duty/brokerage fees crossing over into Canada. As my parents are driving here in a few weeks to visit the family, they will bring it. I asked my dad to open up the box and he confirmed there was a Hitachi V-1565 in there. He said it didn't look too beat up or dirty, although in the eBay photos things looked a bit more rough.
Anyways, I had asked the seller if they could please throw some probes in there even though it wasn't advertised with the listing, so I could use it right away. Well guess what... my dad said there were two kinds of probes in there! He said they were Tenma brand? Could it possibly be? One was apparently a normal spring-loaded probe tip with alligator clip ground, and apparently the other was 2 alligator clips.
Anyways, I am even more curious now... I can't wait to take photos and see how it works. Will keep you posted in a few weeks.
By the way, in case anyone wants to test their oscilloscope and use some nice 2-channel frequency generator that outputs sine/square/triangle and sweeps at different frequencies, etc.... (to do Lissajous type X-Y plots) then I found this very complicated and powerful but completely FREE software:
http://www.sillanumsoft.org/prod01.htm (http://www.sillanumsoft.org/prod01.htm)
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The scope has landed at my parents house in New Jersey!!! I had it delivered there to avoid crazy shipping and duty/brokerage fees crossing over into Canada. As my parents are driving here in a few weeks to visit the family, they will bring it. I asked my dad to open up the box and he confirmed there was a Hitachi V-1565 in there. He said it didn't look too beat up or dirty, although in the eBay photos things looked a bit more rough.
Lucky. I've received scopes from this seller, they've always been more beat up than in photos and with problems. But mine were listed as "working," not "good" condition and that's what I expected, so meh...
Anyways, I had asked the seller if they could please throw some probes in there even though it wasn't advertised with the listing, so I could use it right away. Well guess what... my dad said there were two kinds of probes in there! He said they were Tenma brand? Could it possibly be? One was apparently a normal spring-loaded probe tip with alligator clip ground, and apparently the other was 2 alligator clips.
Lucky.
By the way, in case anyone wants to test their oscilloscope and use some nice 2-channel frequency generator that outputs sine/square/triangle and sweeps at different frequencies, etc.... (to do Lissajous type X-Y plots) then I found this very complicated and powerful but completely FREE software:
http://www.sillanumsoft.org/prod01.htm (http://www.sillanumsoft.org/prod01.htm)
I've used VA to do some simple tests on portable amplifiers. It's pretty neat software.
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Lucky. I've received scopes from this seller, they've always been more beat up than in photos and with problems. But mine were listed as "working," not "good" condition and that's what I expected, so meh...
Yes, I'll let you know. I don't really care about the cosmetic appearance... I'll try to clean it up to at least remove some of the dirt/grime, but I know the handle is missing and this being my first scope, I just wanted something that works enough so I can learn on it, see a trace and look at some simple circuits and Arduino stuff. I figured the price was lower given the condition, because similar scopes that looked better were fetching double.
What I am expecting is a "working" scope... Where I can look at oscillator/frequency gen/Arduino PWM waveforms and make sure it is showing more or less accurate voltage readings and timing, and use cursors and frequency counter.
I am not doing any professional work with it, or scientific experiments, and for what I paid I am realistic in what I am getting. :-) I want to play with RC filters, look at capacitors charging and discharging, test basic components, and so on. So for these types of things I hope it should be ok.
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Anyways, I had asked the seller if they could please throw some probes in there even though it wasn't advertised with the listing, so I could use it right away. Well guess what... my dad said there were two kinds of probes in there! He said they were Tenma brand? Could it possibly be? One was apparently a normal spring-loaded probe tip with alligator clip ground, and apparently the other was 2 alligator clips.
Tenma is a Farnell brand. No doubt designed and manufactured by some nameless Chinese company. Though for 100 MHz, I wouldn't be too worried about performance. The other sounds like just a piece of 50 Ohm coax with two alligators on the end, something like this (http://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/CCBNCCL-MC-30/744-1282-ND/1867566). Though usable for very low frequencies, this is not what I would consider a real probe. It's useful for connecting a function generator to a circuit, however.
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I just wanted something that works enough so I can learn on it, see a trace and look at some simple circuits and Arduino stuff. I figured the price was lower given the condition, because similar scopes that looked better were fetching double.
edy, that's not just a good starting scope though, it's one that works well and should last you a long time. You did get a good price on it, especially since you got some probes to work with it. If I would have seen it, I probably would have bought it.
The on-screen readout on/off and 1x/10x setting is kind of stupid how it's implemented but otherwise it's all pretty easy and effortless. Thankfully those controls don't need touched really. The readout intensity is also a screwdriver adjust which kind of sucks.
The horizontal buttons do suck; if they don't seem to work right (timebase jumps all over or the wrong direction) then open the case, take off the top board, remove the second board, remove the front panel board and clean those switches with IPA. Same goes for the mode up/down switch. You can clean other buttons while you're at it but I never really saw problems with those. The other switches and buttons are better built than the horizontal adjust buttons.
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Hi folks,
Just a quick post. I plugged in the scope, calibration completed and got a nice image. All buttons seem to work, viewed digital display readouts, cursors, horizontal sweep, etc. But... Can't get any vertical. Tried square calibration, even a 9V battery, nothing on both channels. Will open it up... Hope it is something I can fix, because the cost for shipping back not worth it. I managed to pick up that other JDR 200 "Hung Chang" rebrand which works great, so I can use one scope to fix another.
Any advice? Is it the BNC's? Do they have fuse or protection? Is the preamp fried on both channels. Will have to look at schematics. Any ideas? Do I have some button pressed wrong (hopefully?). Will post videos soon of both scopes!
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Are you sure it's not an issue with front panel settings? Triggering set to normal or single sweep? Trace position? Does the beam finder (if it has one) help? Do you see no trace at all or just a flat line regardless of what you do?
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The scope has a horizontal sweep. I can set it and see a slow dot up to a fast line. I can adjust the position of the sweep. I can adjust V/div on both channels. Everything seems to work. However, I hook up a probe to a battery or square ref signal and no matter what I do, not vertical deviation from the straight line occurs. As if the inputs are not connected to anything inside the scope.
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Phew!!!!!
I'm a complete idiot. There is an extra button on each channel that is simply labelled GND and it was pressed in. I assume it grounds the input, or displays ground and ignores the input. Why do you need this button?
Anyways, looks like my square reference is there!! See attached photos.
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It's called ground coupling, it's used so you can accurately line up your input with a particular spot on the screen (typically the centre line) then when you switch back to DC or AC coupling, you can make accurate measurements. At least that's what I use it for.
EDIT: I notice you've got the button beside it out, so you're in AC coupling mode. Press that button in for most readings. AFAIK, there's only certain times you need AC coupling. Those more experienced than I can explain.
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I'm a complete idiot. There is an extra button on each channel that is simply labelled GND and it was pressed in. I assume it grounds the input, or displays ground and ignores the input. Why do you need this button?
Say you're measuring a DC rail, so you see a horizontal line. How do you know where this line is relative to ground? Especially on a scope without cursors? You press the ground button and it instantly shows you where ground is with your current settings.
Glad that you got it working!
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Thanks, I am going to have to read the manual a few times over. I have it on AC because I assume I want it centered on 0 and have the DC offset removed. In this case I assume the reference on the scope is already at 0 anyways, but if I was picking up a signal off a laptop soundcard that wasn't grounded, wouldn't I want AC coupling so that I can ignore the offset (subtract the DC component)?
So the ground button just ignores the input and displays ground without changing anything, so you can quickly see where ground is? So I would press GND and set the position vertically to the 0 graticule, then unpress GND and see where my measured input lays? So it would tell me the DC offset (an would have it also set to DC instead of AC in that case?
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Thanks, I am going to have to read the manual a few times over. I have it on AC because I assume I want it centered on 0 and have the DC offset removed. In this case I assume the reference on the scope is already at 0 anyways, but if I was picking up a signal off a laptop soundcard that wasn't grounded, wouldn't I want AC coupling so that I can ignore the offset (subtract the DC component)?
Ungrounded doesn't have much to do with it, AC coupled measurements will still be ground referenced (note that there can be both AC and DC between ground and your DUT), and you'll likely see some mains hum pickup if you don't connect the ground. Oscilloscope grounding is another interesting topic that Dave did a video on (http://youtu.be/xaELqAo4kkQ). In the case of a battery powered laptop you would clip the ground to audio ground. AC coupled mode is typically used when you explicitly want to ignore a DC component, for example if you want to measure the ripple on top of a 12 VDC power supply rail. In the case of an audio signal I might leave it on DC coupling, since I want to check whether there is a DC offset on there. Alan also did a video on AC/DC coupling ;). (http://youtu.be/Hkq-fvb5-NI) Not sure if he also discussed GND coupling. Not sure if you got the hint by now, but Alan has a whole channel with mainly scope tutorials that's definitely worth a look.
So the ground button just ignores the input and displays ground without changing anything, so you can quickly see where ground is? So I would press GND and set the position vertically to the 0 graticule, then unpress GND and see where my measured input lays? So it would tell me the DC offset (an would have it also set to DC instead of AC in that case?
Yes.
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Thanks, I am going to have to read the manual a few times over. I have it on AC because I assume I want it centered on 0 and have the DC offset removed. In this case I assume the reference on the scope is already at 0 anyways, but if I was picking up a signal off a laptop soundcard that wasn't grounded, wouldn't I want AC coupling so that I can ignore the offset (subtract the DC component)?
Yes, correct! But set to zero again anyways, that way you are sure its zeroed.
So the ground button just ignores the input and displays ground without changing anything, so you can quickly see where ground is?
Yes, correct! The ground button connects the input to the channel internally to ground, ignoring the input connector.
So I would press GND and set the position vertically to the 0 graticule, then depress GND and see where my measured input lays?
Yes, correct! For both AC and DC. You need to have a known starting place to count your divisions from.
So it would tell me the DC offset (and would have it also set to DC instead of AC in that case?
Yes, correct!
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Finally had some time to play with the scope. Here are a couple of videos.... and a big Thanks to David for his EEVblog videos for finally kicking me in the pants to follow his advice (yes it did not fall on deaf ears!). :-+
Here I'm hooking up the Gabotronics Xprotolab to view some simple waveforms and play with the cursor functions and frequency counter:
Hitachi V-1565 Oscilloscope and Gabotronics Xprotolab Frequency Generator Testing (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TNKsGI1An5k#)
And here I am trying to learn what the horizontal A/B functions do, and how delay sweep and magnification of horizontal waveform display works. I can't trigger independently on both A and B on this scope (that would be model V-1585):
Hitachi V-1565 Oscilloscope A/B Horizontal Options with Delay Sweep and Zoom Factors (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UYhfqUWPSR4#)