Author Topic: New EEVblog BM786 Multimeter  (Read 56911 times)

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Offline J-R

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Re: New EEVblog BM786 Multimeter
« Reply #225 on: January 07, 2021, 05:00:47 am »
Actually, the digits on the BM235 are larger than the BM869!
 

Offline IanB

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Re: New EEVblog BM786 Multimeter
« Reply #226 on: January 07, 2021, 06:01:32 am »
Err, the BM235 has the same size display as the 869.

That's true. It was actually the labels around the rotary switch of the 121GW that I found quite small, and I misremembered which meter I was thinking of.
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Offline AVGresponding

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Re: New EEVblog BM786 Multimeter
« Reply #227 on: January 07, 2021, 06:19:27 am »
Does the meter benefit in any way from a higher cell voltage? ???

It depends. You do have to be a little bit careful though. The NiZn chemistry starts out at 1.8 V or higher when freshly charged and some devices may not work properly at such a high voltage.

I mentioned the Ni-Zn chemistry purely for when Ni-MH don't work due to low voltage. As Dave has already stated the 786 works fine with Ni-MH so there would be no advantage.

I run my 289 on Ni-Zn purely because I wanted to see if it would. I'm confident it would work as well with Ni-MH, preferably an LSD type like Eneloop etc.

Personally I like the Hobby King Turnigy brand for the simple reason they are pretty cheap, and reliable in terms of quality. I have found their Ni-MH LSD AA cells to be above rated capacity, haven't measured the Ni-Zn yet.

I would guess most modern battery devices to be designed with one eye on the Ni-MH cell voltage, so Ni-Zn is pretty niche really, mostly useful for older devices that don't like the low nominal Ni-MH/Cd cell voltage.
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Offline cschun86

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Re: New EEVblog BM786 Multimeter
« Reply #228 on: January 07, 2021, 11:13:52 am »
Is it sold out? Eevblog store stated sold out. Couldn't find it on Amazon as well.
Can only find it on welectron at the moment.

Any place else I can purchase it? I don't really want to get it shipped from UK/Euro all the way to New Zealand.
Thanks.
 

Offline EEVblog

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Re: New EEVblog BM786 Multimeter
« Reply #229 on: January 07, 2021, 11:54:13 am »
Is it sold out? Eevblog store stated sold out. Couldn't find it on Amazon as well.
Can only find it on welectron at the moment.
Any place else I can purchase it? I don't really want to get it shipped from UK/Euro all the way to New Zealand.
Thanks.

Sorry, had to shut down my store for while, I'm on holidays. No stock sent to amazon yet. Simons Electronics will have some shortly but he's in the UK.
 

Offline NuclearMusket

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Re: New EEVblog BM786 Multimeter
« Reply #230 on: January 07, 2021, 10:46:51 pm »
Thanks Dave, great meter. Just got my mine in today via DHL.
No trouble with it at all yet.
It does seem to be a quite a bit shorter than it appeared on camera, but maybe I'm just used to the oversized American brands...  :-DD
 
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Offline jknightandkarr

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Re: New EEVblog BM786 Multimeter
« Reply #231 on: January 09, 2021, 05:28:14 am »
Sorry, had to shut down my store for while, I'm on holidays. No stock sent to amazon yet. Simons Electronics will have some shortly but he's in the UK.
That explains things, when might the store be available for orders again?  I really have been wanting a 121gw dmm for a good while and finally have the cash for it.  I got one decent one, I think, but really want a nice one I can trust.  In school for electronics engineering and do hobby stuff as well.  Always enjoy watching your channel!

Joe
 

Offline symp

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Re: New EEVblog BM786 Multimeter
« Reply #232 on: January 09, 2021, 09:58:42 am »
Thanks Dave, great meter. Just got my mine in today via DHL.
No trouble with it at all yet.
It does seem to be a quite a bit shorter than it appeared on camera, but maybe I'm just used to the oversized American brands...  :-DD

Australia post at it's finest....I'm 400km from Dave in the same state and don't expect it until Monday.  :-DD

Edit: arrived safely, solid meter, auto hold is nice, think I'll miss is the LoZ mode compared to the 237 though, might get the 789 next time. I should of checked my old email, had the pre public link and a coupon in there, could of saved $15 for lunch! Haha
« Last Edit: January 12, 2021, 02:32:14 am by symp »
 

Offline bibz

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Re: New EEVblog BM786 Multimeter
« Reply #233 on: January 11, 2021, 12:05:29 pm »
Got mine today, nice display and ohms beepy is also great. First upgrade from a jaycar/chinesey meter and I feel this is the perfect price point for me, so thanks Dave! Cant wait to poke some stuff with it
 
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Offline Roger Need

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Re: New EEVblog BM786 Multimeter
« Reply #234 on: January 15, 2021, 08:58:03 pm »
I ordered my Brymen 786 on January 5 and it was shipped by DHL to Canada the next day.  Shipping was $30 Cdn. ($24 USD) for express delivery.  The package arrived 8 days later after a payment of $42 Cdn. ($31 USD) to DHL for Cdn. taxes, duties and the processing fee.  Everything was in great shape. 

I thought readers might want to know what comes in the "No BS Box" so I took some pictures of the meter and the accessories.  Batteries are not included but I never like the unknown brand that usually comes with Asian products.  It was nice to see that banana plug adapters come with the test leads and that standard alligator clips slide on easily.

I have been putting the meter through quite a few tests.  The RMS accuracy with different waveforms (sine, triangle, square wave etc.) and DC offsets is very good.   The Amps current range with 50,000 counts means I only have to use the ma. range, with the higher burden voltage, if I really need more than 3 digits.  The only drawback I have seen is that it does not have enough range to measure capacitors under 100 pF but my DE-5000 is used for that anyway.

 
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Offline Roger Need

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Re: New EEVblog BM786 Multimeter
« Reply #235 on: January 15, 2021, 09:02:10 pm »
Here is a photo with the battery holder removed.  Are the pins shown for flashing firmware??

Roger
 
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Offline EEVblog

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Re: New EEVblog BM786 Multimeter
« Reply #236 on: January 16, 2021, 07:40:48 am »
Here is a photo with the battery holder removed.  Are the pins shown for flashing firmware??

I believe they are, but Brymen don't want any (including me) to have the programmer or the details.
 
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Offline EEVblog

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Re: New EEVblog BM786 Multimeter
« Reply #237 on: January 16, 2021, 07:43:47 am »
It does seem to be a quite a bit shorter than it appeared on camera, but maybe I'm just used to the oversized American brands...  :-DD

I think I posted a photo of it compared to some other meters some time back, will try and find it again.
« Last Edit: January 16, 2021, 07:45:41 am by EEVblog »
 
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Offline NY2KW

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Re: New EEVblog BM786 Multimeter
« Reply #238 on: January 16, 2021, 02:49:47 pm »
How fast is the Autorange?
 

Offline joeqsmith

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Re: New EEVblog BM786 Multimeter
« Reply #239 on: January 16, 2021, 04:52:40 pm »
Here is a photo with the battery holder removed.  Are the pins shown for flashing firmware??

Roger

I was guessing that connector allowed them to perform the alignment semi-automatically.  There appears to be two other unpopulated connectors which I was guessing were for development and not needed once they got into production.   During my evaluation, any changes the to firmware required that I change ICs.   

Hopefully the majority of the problems have now been corrected and there will be little need for additional firmware changes. 

Just a quick check, the unpopulated 4-pin connector with the two pairs of common pins is on the back side of U20 and ground, used to power the meter during development or provide power to some peripheral. 

The other unpopulated connector is not in parallel with the one you asked about.   It's possible that these two unpopulated connectors were both intended to control an add-on peripheral rather than development.  The LCD is far enough away that there is certainly room to add something but with the lack of mounting holes in this area, my guess is they are both for development.   Probing the two connectors,  I didn't see anything while trying different modes.   
« Last Edit: January 16, 2021, 06:07:50 pm by joeqsmith »
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Offline Roger Need

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Re: New EEVblog BM786 Multimeter
« Reply #240 on: January 16, 2021, 07:02:04 pm »
How fast is the Autorange?

I suggest you take a look at joeqsmith's excellent Youtube videos on the latest firmware with autoranging.



Roger
 
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Online rsjsouza

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Re: New EEVblog BM786 Multimeter
« Reply #241 on: January 16, 2021, 07:33:00 pm »
Here is a photo with the battery holder removed.  Are the pins shown for flashing firmware??

Roger

I was guessing that connector allowed them to perform the alignment semi-automatically.  There appears to be two other unpopulated connectors which I was guessing were for development and not needed once they got into production.   During my evaluation, any changes the to firmware required that I change ICs.   
Despite they asked you to switch ICs, this may be due simply to the fact the devices have their JTAG port cut off to protect the Flash contents against prying eyes. This may still be used for flash programming (and perhaps some basic testing) during production.
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Offline joeqsmith

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Re: New EEVblog BM786 Multimeter
« Reply #242 on: January 16, 2021, 08:19:00 pm »
Here is a photo with the battery holder removed.  Are the pins shown for flashing firmware??

Roger

I was guessing that connector allowed them to perform the alignment semi-automatically.  There appears to be two other unpopulated connectors which I was guessing were for development and not needed once they got into production.   During my evaluation, any changes the to firmware required that I change ICs.   
Despite they asked you to switch ICs, this may be due simply to the fact the devices have their JTAG port cut off to protect the Flash contents against prying eyes. This may still be used for flash programming (and perhaps some basic testing) during production.

It's possible.  I didn't ask.  I did however offer to program them to avoid the shipping times and speed up our progress.   We may have saved a few weeks.  Then again, getting everything setup and working may have been more trouble than it was worth.  Not a big deal one way or the other.   It's not the 121GW.  While Dave's UEI meter still has some firmware problems noted with the prototype back in 2017,  the Brymen BM786 even though it's a brand new product, is much more mature (not to mention the quality of the parts and design).   The UEI meter needed that crutch.  I don't see that being the case with most high quality meters. 

My tests certainly are not the end all of tests but I am interested to see what problems early buyers find.  It may point to the need to improve or add to my own tests. 
How electrically robust is your meter?? https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCsK99WXk9VhcghnAauTBsbg
Software, documentation and test reports for the low cost NanoVNA & V2 Plus 4 may be found here:
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Online rsjsouza

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Re: New EEVblog BM786 Multimeter
« Reply #243 on: January 16, 2021, 08:43:11 pm »
While Dave's UEI meter still has some firmware problems noted with the prototype back in 2017,  the Brymen BM786 even though it's a brand new product, is much more mature (not to mention the quality of the parts and design).   The UEI meter needed that crutch.  I don't see that being the case with most high quality meters. 
UEI's core business is not on multimeters, but Brymen's is. For them it is make it or break it. For UEI, it is another department.

IIRC, shortly before the release of the 121GW UEI had discontinued their entire range of DMMs. Nowadays I see four models, all 4000/6000 counts clearly for industrial markets.
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Oh, the "whys" of the datasheets... The information is there not to be an axiomatic truth, but instead each speck of data must be slowly inhaled while carefully performing a deep search inside oneself to find the true metaphysical sense...
 

Offline joeqsmith

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Re: New EEVblog BM786 Multimeter
« Reply #244 on: January 16, 2021, 11:51:21 pm »
While Dave's UEI meter still has some firmware problems noted with the prototype back in 2017,  the Brymen BM786 even though it's a brand new product, is much more mature (not to mention the quality of the parts and design).   The UEI meter needed that crutch.  I don't see that being the case with most high quality meters. 
UEI's core business is not on multimeters, but Brymen's is. For them it is make it or break it. For UEI, it is another department.

IIRC, shortly before the release of the 121GW UEI had discontinued their entire range of DMMs. Nowadays I see four models, all 4000/6000 counts clearly for industrial markets.
I had tried to buy a few new UEI meters once Dave announced they were going to produce his meter.  They were already out of the business by that time which is why you never saw me run one. 
How electrically robust is your meter?? https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCsK99WXk9VhcghnAauTBsbg
Software, documentation and test reports for the low cost NanoVNA & V2 Plus 4 may be found here:
https://github.com/joeqsmith
 

Offline EEVblog

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Re: New EEVblog BM786 Multimeter
« Reply #245 on: January 17, 2021, 01:24:05 am »
Here is a photo with the battery holder removed.  Are the pins shown for flashing firmware??

Roger

I was guessing that connector allowed them to perform the alignment semi-automatically.  There appears to be two other unpopulated connectors which I was guessing were for development and not needed once they got into production.   During my evaluation, any changes the to firmware required that I change ICs.   

I have been told that "Firmware update will need Custom-made Programmer."
And I think way back they inidcated it was a re-programmable part as opposed to previous models that use OTP processors.

As for firmware changes, the BM235 had several firmware changes over 3-4 years as users slowly found obscure issues.
Just look at the ohm ranging issue with the BM867 recently, a once previously solidly tested meter.
So I'd be surprised if we don't see some firmware changes over the next few years.
 

Offline EEVblog

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Re: New EEVblog BM786 Multimeter
« Reply #246 on: January 17, 2021, 01:27:58 am »
While Dave's UEI meter still has some firmware problems noted with the prototype back in 2017,  the Brymen BM786 even though it's a brand new product, is much more mature (not to mention the quality of the parts and design).   The UEI meter needed that crutch.  I don't see that being the case with most high quality meters. 
UEI's core business is not on multimeters, but Brymen's is. For them it is make it or break it. For UEI, it is another department.

IIRC, shortly before the release of the 121GW UEI had discontinued their entire range of DMMs. Nowadays I see four models, all 4000/6000 counts clearly for industrial markets.
I had tried to buy a few new UEI meters once Dave announced they were going to produce his meter.  They were already out of the business by that time which is why you never saw me run one.

Actually not true. They have been selling into the Chinese market under the Kane brand.
http://www.kanetest.com.cn/category.php?id=33
And there is a new model coming our in that 500 series, it's an upgraded design based on the 121GW design, but new much bigger case for a tripple display much like the original concep 121GW proposed right at the start, and I believe new firmware.
I have partly shown this in a previous video, it's probably not far from release.
 

Offline joeqsmith

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Re: New EEVblog BM786 Multimeter
« Reply #247 on: January 17, 2021, 03:13:52 am »
Here is a photo with the battery holder removed.  Are the pins shown for flashing firmware??

Roger

I was guessing that connector allowed them to perform the alignment semi-automatically.  There appears to be two other unpopulated connectors which I was guessing were for development and not needed once they got into production.   During my evaluation, any changes the to firmware required that I change ICs.   

I have been told that "Firmware update will need Custom-made Programmer."
And I think way back they inidcated it was a re-programmable part as opposed to previous models that use OTP processors.

As for firmware changes, the BM235 had several firmware changes over 3-4 years as users slowly found obscure issues.
Just look at the ohm ranging issue with the BM867 recently, a once previously solidly tested meter.
So I'd be surprised if we don't see some firmware changes over the next few years.

Interesting about the programmer.  I have not looked into it beyond what I posted today. 

I bought the BM235 late and missed out on all the fun Scott was having with it finding early problems.  Outside of the cut away area around the connector for added clearance, the one I have seems fine for the most part.  I mentioned the autorange problem with it.   The BM869s has a similar problem but it's not anything that has hindered me. 

I've up'ed my game since looking at the very first handheld, even since looking at the BM235.   The benefit to the BM786 is that we find more problems early on and we have a company who not only wants to correct them but is also capable of doing so. 

After experiencing the 121GW, I have adopted the old adage of fool me once ....   I don't care if it's sold under UEI, Kane or Finest. 
How electrically robust is your meter?? https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCsK99WXk9VhcghnAauTBsbg
Software, documentation and test reports for the low cost NanoVNA & V2 Plus 4 may be found here:
https://github.com/joeqsmith
 
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Offline ian.ameline

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Re: New EEVblog BM786 Multimeter
« Reply #248 on: January 17, 2021, 09:25:41 pm »
Are the calibration procedures documented for this meter?
 

Offline joeqsmith

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Re: New EEVblog BM786 Multimeter
« Reply #249 on: January 17, 2021, 10:58:34 pm »
Are the calibration procedures documented for this meter?
I assume you are asking about how to align the meter.   I'm sure Brymen has these procedures documented along with everything else about the design.   It's not available to the general public that I am aware of.
« Last Edit: January 18, 2021, 01:29:18 am by joeqsmith »
How electrically robust is your meter?? https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCsK99WXk9VhcghnAauTBsbg
Software, documentation and test reports for the low cost NanoVNA & V2 Plus 4 may be found here:
https://github.com/joeqsmith
 


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