New Keithley DMM6500 and now DAQ6510

[Joel_l]

I bought mine March 2019. I will see how it goes. I also leave mine plugged in. When I get to having to do mine, I will decide if I want to mess with it.

[thanasisk]

Has anyone replaced the fan of their DMM6500? People have been complaining about that fan noise.  Saw pictures that it is a Sunon Maglev MF50100V2-1000C- (50mmx50mmx10mm 5V 25.6dbA 11CFM 0.11inchH2O). Too bad noctua doesn't yet produce their 50mm slim a series fan.

[KedasProbe]

It may be easier to add a resistor in series with the fan, since they said it is blowing harder than needed.

About the Battery, the one at work is always powered but the one at home I disconnect due to the annoying hum. (We will see how that goes.)

[wn1fju]

1.38V on my old battery, 20 months old, unit disconnected from power at the end of each day. 

Hardest part of the replacement was getting the four screws out to remove the case.  They are in there tight.

[Mr. Scram]

Does anyone here use the Kickstart software with these and is it worth the trouble? It seems to add not that much but perhaps I am mistaken.

Should I interpret the overwhelming lack of response as an equivalent lack of enthusiasm for Kickstart?

[thm_w]

We might not be able to move the location of the battery, but I will have us investigate whether or not a better Vendor / type of battery could be used and what is the cause of the drain - might also be able to be improved.

Its highly unlikely to be an issue with Panasonic cells, I've seen thousands and only a few died prematurely. The rest of those products last for 10 years+ (RTC current is 3uA, ~9uW).
Measure the quiescent current and it should tell you right away if it is a design issue.

MPC5125 has an internal RTC but I'm not sure if that is being used as it notes a 3V minimum input.. That is right on the edge of what a CR2032 will provide. Odd voltage for them to choose.
https://www.nxp.com/docs/en/data-sheet/MPC5125.pdf

MPC5125 power is rated 20uW (not sure if thats worst case or typical).
CR2032 = 220mAh = 0.66Wh/20uW = ~3.8 years

Maybe there is some additional leakage from Vbatt GPIO or diodes.

[KedasProbe]

Does anyone here use the Kickstart software with these and is it worth the trouble? It seems to add not that much but perhaps I am mistaken.

Should I interpret the overwhelming lack of response as an equivalent lack of enthusiasm for Kickstart?

I do have it (it was free) but I find myself not using it. (I only have the DMM6500 for it)
I use the screen of the DMM and if I want to see/control it on my PC I use the webinterface (does not work for digitizing), and if I want the data I just save the buffer.
It could be more interesting when you have more than one keithley device in Kickstart or multi-channel.

[Wintel]

Should I interpret the overwhelming lack of response as an equivalent lack of enthusiasm for Kickstart?

I buy KickStart license some time ago(~2 year), and use it for my 2450 SMU and DMM6500, but not frequently.

It's a good software. I like it much more Keysight BenchVue. I will never buy BenchVue.
I don't remember price, but is not too high - forever use is 200-300 bucks or so....
As i hear in this topic - when you buy DMM6500 a Keithley grant KickStart for free.

After buying license i created my own data logger software. But KickStart is still good for I/V curve on 2450. I don't regret about buying KickStart, in future i planned buy more Keithley SMU's, it will be very-very helpful.

Latest version 2.2.1 are fixed many bugs. It's  useful version.

I recommend it

3 Year or lifetime KickStart license?

[Wintel]

Update on the battery Issue:

There was a clock running that was supposed to be shut down by firmware while in standby mode. This prematurely drains the battery.
Next Firmware 1.7.3 resolves this problem - I was told released in a couple of months.

For those of you replacing it on your own, please be careful as the holder has a very fragile clip that might break during the replacement.

Thanks

Can send DMM6500 to Keithley service center to replace the battery free of charge?

[KedasProbe]

Update on the battery Issue:

There was a clock running that was supposed to be shut down by firmware while in standby mode. This prematurely drains the battery.
Next Firmware 1.7.3 resolves this problem - I was told released in a couple of months.

For those of you replacing it on your own, please be careful as the holder has a very fragile clip that might break during the replacement.

Thanks

So we can assume that the battery is not extra drained when the power cord is unplugged.
Meaning it's better to disconnect the device when not used until a new firmware is available?

[KedasProbe]

Drains anyway....
Well the good news about that is that you know when and how many people will start complaining in the coming months. You may want to prepare: "Press 9 if it's about the battery" 

I purchased a bit more than a year ago so I still have some battery left over.

[hoooooonza]

Hello,

I am considering buying DMM6500 for measuring IOT devices - mainly sleep currents and the transitiosn to the active modes. I saw some videos and I like DMM6500 digitizer function. Can someone tell me if it is good instrument for this purpose? I read a lot about bluescreens, RTC backup battery troubles etc.. so I am little bit worried.. But there are not many competitors on the market.

Main competitors:
https://www.qoitech.com/products/standard - nice desktop application, many interesting functions. But sampling is very slow (4ksps) so I am afraid it doesn't catch short spikes an also voltage output is <=5V.

https://www.anglercircuits.com/ - interesting product, but the GUI is not as advanced as Qoitech one. Same proble with voltage output range <=6V.

For IOT development we can live with voltage range 0-5V, but sometimes we do stuff for automotive an there are units with 12-24V input so would be great to have one instrument for everything.


Is is possible to use digitizer in Kickstart app? Does Keithley have any tool for working with graphs taken by DMM6500? (I mean I will record data, store them to USB and then I can do some measurments on PC).

We have budget 2k USD.

Thank you,
Jan

[cgroen]

I have 2 DMM6500 and love them.
But for characterizing powerconsumption on CPU's, wireless devices etc etc, I would never use anything else than my Joulescope. So much better suited for this purpose.

[hoooooonza]

Thank you for quick answer. I saw review from eevlog - did thy fix all the mentioned problems? It was mainly in GUI as far as I know.

[cgroen]

Yes, and there are updates often, new features etc
Also very open minded about suggestions from users!

[MegaVolt]

I have 2 DMM6500 and love them.
But for characterizing powerconsumption on CPU's, wireless devices etc etc, I would never use anything else than my Joulescope. So much better suited for this purpose.

You can take a look at the process of writing a buffer live.

[hoooooonza]

It really takes 50 sec to get the graph? Or did they improve this in the latest FW?

Thank you,
Jan

[MegaVolt]

It really takes 50 sec to get the graph? Or did they improve this in the latest FW?

I can say that in the new version for 7510 it became even slightly worse:
https://forum.tek.com/viewtopic.php?f=363&t=142031

It seems that this is not a key function of the device. This is still a multimeter. Data is transmitted to the computer at a speed of 60 kS / s.

Perhaps this will all be fixed someday. But the device has been over 5 years old and I don’t see them greatly improving this function.

[hoooooonza]

Okay, thank you. I will check Joulescope then

Jan

[Mr. Scram]

How loud is the fan on these? Needing active cooling instead of the passive cooling of the 34401A and Keithley 2000 seems a huge step back.

[jancumps]

not loud. For me no issue while on my bench.

[jancumps]

I'm in the hear it but not bothered by it camp. It isn't intrusive in my opinion, working in a fairly silent place.

[KedasProbe]

You can obviously hear it, otherwise you need to see a doctor.

My colleagues ask me to turn it off when I'm not using it due to the noise. (2-3 meters away)
Although I don't think it's very annoying, you do get the feeling "ah much better" when the noise is gone.

And if you are alone in a silent office you may also be bothered by the hum, I find that more annoying, I can hear that hum as soon as I enter the room but when the fan is on the hum isn't obvious anymore.
That is also the reason why I disconnect the power line when I don't use it. So the standby button is more a reboot button for me.

Having some music playing helps to forget the noise.

P.S my monitor or tablet do not have a noisy fan, even my laptop isn't making a sound now, not even a power adapter hum, it's certainly possible to design it silent but I guess then it will cost more or maybe they didn't care about it very much 'good enough state of mind'

[HendriXML]

That is also the reason why I disconnect the power line when I don't use it. So the standby button is more a reboot button for me.

Before disconnecting the power line, does one need to bring it in standby mode first?

I also disconnect it, but bring it in standby mode first, I was wandering this is really necessary.

[KedasProbe]

I do put it in standby first before disconnecting in case there is some shut-down sequence or relays.