Author Topic: new killer scope in town - a true game changer from R&S - RTB2002 & RTB2004  (Read 403003 times)

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Offline LaurentR

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Re: new killer scope in town - a true game changer from R&S - RTB2002 & RTB2004
« Reply #2225 on: October 07, 2018, 08:42:24 am »
AFAIK the entire memory is decoded (which is what you want. Trust me!). Depending on your memory depth setting and samplerate there can be a lot of decoded data outside the screen. All in all it is not really avoidable to have decoded data off-screen as there will also be a part of the trace which isn't shown. You could use the fine time/div control to squeeze all the data and traces on screen but then the decoder information may not be readable.

It all makes sense, thanks! I have understood my scope a bit more today.

I set out to figure out how much is off-screen. For example, at 10Msa (max) record length:
* At 20ms/div, the scope picks 41.7Msa/s (2.5GSa/s / 60), so the screen shows 41.7MSa/s * 12 * 20ms = 10MSa - the screen shows 100% of the memory
* At 21ms/div, the scope picks 31.2MSa/s (2.5Gsa/s / 80), so the screen shows 31.2MSa/s * 12 * 21ms = 7.9MSa - the screen shows 79% of the memory

The dividers from 2.5GSa/s seem to be: 1, 2, 4, 8, 10, 16, 20, 40, 60, 80, 100, 120, 140... Over the lower samples rates, the screen is 80-100% of the buffer. At higher sample rates with dividers in powers of 2, the variation is higher going 50-100%.

This clearly explains the behavior in my earlier post.

Having tried a few avenues, it would seem that the best way to keep all data on screen and enable precise positioning of the start of decode vs. the trigger is to set the "record length" in the History menu to samplerate * timerperdiv * 12. That seems to work well enough.

I wonder if there is a more direct way, e.g. ask the decode to start at the trigger or have a command to move the trigger to the start of the data (not the screen) or be able to "zoom out" to be able to see the extra off-screen info (zoom only zooms in).
« Last Edit: October 07, 2018, 11:26:43 am by LaurentR »
 
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Offline nctnico

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Re: new killer scope in town - a true game changer from R&S - RTB2002 & RTB2004
« Reply #2226 on: October 07, 2018, 07:27:01 pm »
In stop mode you can use the horizontal position knob to scroll left/right and make the off-screen signal visible.
There are small lies, big lies and then there is what is on the screen of your oscilloscope.
 

Offline Cthulhoid

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Re: new killer scope in town - a true game changer from R&S - RTB2002 & RTB2004
« Reply #2227 on: October 13, 2018, 01:42:41 pm »
I saw the new promotions and I'm a bit confused.

The fully-optioned package (RTB2K-COM4) costs $6185. Straightforward and reassuringly expensive.

That SKU appears to be identical to the 4ch 300Mhz MSO package (RTB2K-304MP35) at $4760 plus the application bundle (RTB-PK1) at $1260. Breaking up the purchase this way results in a total cost of $6020, or a $165 savings; at the moment, PK1 is half-price, so the total is $5390, saving $795 off the COM4 price.

Am I missing something here?
 

Offline SteveRosenlund

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Re: new killer scope in town - a true game changer from R&S - RTB2002 & RTB2004
« Reply #2228 on: October 25, 2018, 10:19:01 am »
Have any of you found or used an anti-reflective screen protector on the shiny RTB2K screen?  If so, where did you get it?  I'm searching Amazon now and found one that is larger and i could just trim it down.  Thoughts?
 

Offline KaneTW

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Re: new killer scope in town - a true game changer from R&S - RTB2002 & RTB2004
« Reply #2229 on: October 25, 2018, 10:39:31 am »
I don't feel like I need one.
 

Offline markb82

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Re: new killer scope in town - a true game changer from R&S - RTB2002 & RTB2004
« Reply #2230 on: October 25, 2018, 12:48:01 pm »
Anyone still have the 2.000 firmware file (RTB200x_Firmware_V02.000.zip) - seems like I lost it from my computer and I'd like to revert.

Thanks.
 

Offline RGK

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Re: new killer scope in town - a true game changer from R&S - RTB2002 & RTB2004
« Reply #2231 on: October 25, 2018, 02:01:39 pm »
Anyone still have the 2.000 firmware file (RTB200x_Firmware_V02.000.zip) - seems like I lost it from my computer and I'd like to revert.

Thanks.

Send me a pm with your email address....

BK
 

Offline mikeselectricstuff

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Re: new killer scope in town - a true game changer from R&S - RTB2002 & RTB2004
« Reply #2232 on: October 25, 2018, 03:17:31 pm »
Have any of you found or used an anti-reflective screen protector on the shiny RTB2K screen?  If so, where did you get it?  I'm searching Amazon now and found one that is larger and i could just trim it down.  Thoughts?
I found one that works well just searching antireflective screen protector, but couldn't find tbe right size so had to cut down.
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Offline RGK

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Re: new killer scope in town - a true game changer from R&S - RTB2002 & RTB2004
« Reply #2233 on: October 25, 2018, 03:27:05 pm »
Have any of you found or used an anti-reflective screen protector on the shiny RTB2K screen?  If so, where did you get it?  I'm searching Amazon now and found one that is larger and i could just trim it down.  Thoughts?
I found one that works well just searching antireflective screen protector, but couldn't find tbe right size so had to cut down.

Someone here previously recommended this product:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01NAFNWVT/ref=ox_sc_saved_title_10?smid=A2C3SMXXIDC93V&psc=1

BK
 

Offline SteveRosenlund

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Re: new killer scope in town - a true game changer from R&S - RTB2002 & RTB2004
« Reply #2234 on: October 25, 2018, 09:20:15 pm »
Awesome!  Thanks. I just ordered it.
 

Offline Rich@RohdeScopesUSA

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Re: new killer scope in town - a true game changer from R&S - RTB2002 & RTB2004
« Reply #2235 on: October 26, 2018, 04:31:46 am »
Looks like everyone has found their answers (2.00 FW and screen protector - sorry I was slow to help).  On a positive note, I can confirm the next firmware is in final manufacturing test and should release the week of 11/5.  Stay tuned!

-Rich 
 
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Offline maginnovision

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Re: new killer scope in town - a true game changer from R&S - RTB2002 & RTB2004
« Reply #2236 on: October 27, 2018, 09:35:03 am »
Looks like everyone has found their answers (2.00 FW and screen protector - sorry I was slow to help).  On a positive note, I can confirm the next firmware is in final manufacturing test and should release the week of 11/5.  Stay tuned!

-Rich

I hope I'm not disappointed after all the hype! Haha.
 

Offline SteveRosenlund

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Re: new killer scope in town - a true game changer from R&S - RTB2002 & RTB2004
« Reply #2237 on: October 29, 2018, 11:08:38 am »
FYI with those screen protectors, they need to be cut down to the proper measurements, but once they are cut they work great. There are a couple holes in the screen protector for camera and something else that I cut off.
The proper measurements are: 8 3/4” x 5 1/2” then round off the corners. It really cuts the glare completely out and doesn’t leave fingerprints. Sure the screen looks a tad better without the anti-glare protector, but the drawbacks aren’t worth it to me.
 

Offline Hydron

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Re: new killer scope in town - a true game changer from R&S - RTB2002 & RTB2004
« Reply #2238 on: October 29, 2018, 06:34:00 pm »
I tested one and agree with the above post, but in my situation there wasn't much glare so ended up leaving it off.

If you want the perfect fit and don't care about the calibration void sticker then you could also open the scope and fit it under the bezel - would look like a bought one as long as you manage to avoid dust or air bubbles being trapped.

Finally I think there are places which will custom cut protectors, but you'll obviously pay a premium.
 

Offline LaurentR

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Re: new killer scope in town - a true game changer from R&S - RTB2002 & RTB2004
« Reply #2239 on: October 30, 2018, 11:20:46 am »
I found the glare level unacceptable.

I ended up with this screen:
https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B015IKUNL2/

Needs to be cut down to size. For example with a trimmer:
https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B0038F1A0S/

And if you insist on having perfect corners:
https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B0076FJ7SS/

I really like the result. Looks quite professional. It takes determination to put it in without bubbles or dust, but it is totally possible (even without removing the frame).
« Last Edit: November 01, 2018, 02:59:11 am by LaurentR »
 

Offline Rich@RohdeScopesUSA

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Re: new killer scope in town - a true game changer from R&S - RTB2002 & RTB2004
« Reply #2240 on: October 31, 2018, 03:48:07 am »
Looks like everyone has found their answers (2.00 FW and screen protector - sorry I was slow to help).  On a positive note, I can confirm the next firmware is in final manufacturing test and should release the week of 11/5.  Stay tuned!

-Rich

I hope I'm not disappointed after all the hype! Haha.
Ha!  I hope you aren't either.  In addition to the normal bug fixes, here are some of the bigger additions for 2.201:

-Math equations increase to five, and number of operators increased to 15 including differentiation and integration.  Math on math is possible (some minor limitations)
-New 'Cut Waveform" feature for Option B6 (function generator) allows the user to select a portion of a captured waveform to load in to the arbitrary setup
-Burst feature for B6 allows user to specify a fixed number of cycles.
-Oscilloscope simultaneously displays cursor results with measurement statistics
-New capability for user to independently set offset and position values.  User can assign vertical position knob now to control either
-Enhanced FFT usability

All of the above are free upgrades (the B6 enhancements clearly assume you have B6 installed).

-Rich
 
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Offline maginnovision

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Re: new killer scope in town - a true game changer from R&S - RTB2002 & RTB2004
« Reply #2241 on: October 31, 2018, 05:08:16 am »
Looks like everyone has found their answers (2.00 FW and screen protector - sorry I was slow to help).  On a positive note, I can confirm the next firmware is in final manufacturing test and should release the week of 11/5.  Stay tuned!

-Rich

I hope I'm not disappointed after all the hype! Haha.
Ha!  I hope you aren't either.  In addition to the normal bug fixes, here are some of the bigger additions for 2.201:

-Math equations increase to five, and number of operators increased to 15 including differentiation and integration.  Math on math is possible (some minor limitations)
-New 'Cut Waveform" feature for Option B6 (function generator) allows the user to select a portion of a captured waveform to load in to the arbitrary setup
-Burst feature for B6 allows user to specify a fixed number of cycles.
-Oscilloscope simultaneously displays cursor results with measurement statistics
-New capability for user to independently set offset and position values.  User can assign vertical position knob now to control either
-Enhanced FFT usability

All of the above are free upgrades (the B6 enhancements clearly assume you have B6 installed).

-Rich

Fixing the math "problem" makes me happy.
 
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Offline Hydron

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Re: new killer scope in town - a true game changer from R&S - RTB2002 & RTB2004
« Reply #2242 on: October 31, 2018, 10:21:09 pm »
Sounds great, thanks for listening to user feedback. I look forward to the release!

Regarding math on math, does this include FFT on math (I recall that this is not currently possible, though I'm not infront of it right now so may be mistaken)?
 
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Offline Rich@RohdeScopesUSA

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Re: new killer scope in town - a true game changer from R&S - RTB2002 & RTB2004
« Reply #2243 on: November 01, 2018, 04:24:48 am »
Sounds great, thanks for listening to user feedback. I look forward to the release!

Regarding math on math, does this include FFT on math (I recall that this is not currently possible, though I'm not infront of it right now so may be mistaken)?
I haven't had a chance to play with it yet, but given we support that on the 3000/4000, I'm going to say it is highly likely.  But I won't know until I get the FW to use.

-Rich
 

Offline SteveRosenlund

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Re: new killer scope in town - a true game changer from R&S - RTB2002 & RTB2004
« Reply #2244 on: November 07, 2018, 05:27:11 am »
I gotta say...I really like this scope. Coming from a Rigol to the R&S it’s eye opening all the capabilities this thing has.
 
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Offline Hydron

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Re: new killer scope in town - a true game changer from R&S - RTB2002 & RTB2004
« Reply #2245 on: November 14, 2018, 12:38:51 am »
Hi Rich,
Any update on the release data? Obviously it didn't make it out last week as planned.

On another note Dave has pointed out an oddity in the timebase - I've seen it too but hadn't noticed that it's only 1-2-4-8-2 (vs 1-2-5-1-2 etc) in a single part of the range:
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/rohde-schwarz-rtb2004-timebase-quirk/
Any comments?
 
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Offline mikeselectricstuff

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Re: new killer scope in town - a true game changer from R&S - RTB2002 & RTB2004
« Reply #2246 on: November 14, 2018, 01:05:30 am »
 Just saw the new RTA2004 at Electronica. Appears identical to the RTM3004 apart from 100M memory. WTF is going on with their series names..? Unlessmayme this will replace the RTM, but they were also.showing that.
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Offline casinada

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Re: new killer scope in town - a true game changer from R&S - RTB2002 & RTB2004
« Reply #2247 on: November 14, 2018, 01:23:22 am »
RTA4000 series ? :-//
 

Offline mikeselectricstuff

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Re: new killer scope in town - a true game changer from R&S - RTB2002 & RTB2004
« Reply #2248 on: November 14, 2018, 02:40:19 am »
RTA4000 series ? :-//
Sorry yes. Brain getting fuzzed by too many freebie gunmy bears
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Offline exe

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Re: new killer scope in town - a true game changer from R&S - RTB2002 & RTB2004
« Reply #2249 on: November 14, 2018, 02:51:23 am »
I propose RTFM series :)
 
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