Author Topic: New Rigol DS1054Z oscilloscope  (Read 1606353 times)

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Offline alsetalokin4017

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Re: New Rigol DS1054Z oscilloscope
« Reply #1600 on: August 01, 2015, 06:26:45 pm »
Heh... sorry, we've been using Ubuntu Linux here for so long that I tend to forget that not everyone has Linux at their fingertips. May I suggest that you try a dual-boot installation of Ubuntu (or some other modern Linux distro) next to your Windows, so that you can try it painlessly?

I fired MicroShaft long ago and only keep it around on one laptop for controlling my telescope and astronomical cameras. I even do the astrophoto processing on Linux these days, running a Windows version of PixInsight under WINE on the Linux boxen -- along with gimp, of course.


Also, on the DSRemote webpage you'll find the contact information for the developer, and he is very responsive to bug reports. Email him and ask about a Windows version!
« Last Edit: August 01, 2015, 06:28:38 pm by alsetalokin4017 »
The easiest person to fool is yourself. -- Richard Feynman
 

Offline miguelvp

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Re: New Rigol DS1054Z oscilloscope
« Reply #1601 on: August 01, 2015, 07:02:39 pm »
@TheBloke

From earlier in this thread:
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/new-rigol-ds1054z-oscilloscope/msg675845/#msg675845

I modified it because my DS2000 doesn't support telnet, so I used alex.forencich's vxi11

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/python-based-instrument-control/msg676772/#msg676772

Also you have:

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/free-ds6000ds1000z-software/

That has source etc, but it is Linux, that said you could probably port it to Windows.
 

Online MarkF

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Re: New Rigol DS1054Z oscilloscope
« Reply #1602 on: August 01, 2015, 08:58:00 pm »
Thanks very much Howard and alsetalokin!

Howard, thanks, that all makes sense - and it's nice to have my purchase validated, of course :) 

alseta, thank you, I hadn't seen DSRemote before.  It looks excellent, with just one minor inconvenience - it looks from that page that it's Linux only at the moment?  I'm running Windows as my primary platform right now.  But I see it's written in QT, so perhaps it might compile on Windows.  At least the app part of it, not the driver - and I'd guess it wouldn't know how to interface with the Rigol driver without specific support, which it won't have unless it was targetted for Windows.  Perhaps LAN connect would work.

Has anyone heard any discussion of DSRemote being compiled and run on Windows?  If not is no big deal, I have a Raspberry Pi here, and/or I can easily set up a Linux VM.

Anyway I'm really glad to have the scope setup and am enjoying fiddling with it already-  even though I don't know a huge amount what I'm doing! :)  I did watch Dave's entire one hour feature review, as well as about 2 hours of general "How to use an oscilloscope" type YouTube videos (mostly from mjlorton)

Unless you have a special project, I think you'll use the scope directly and not want to operate it remotely.

I've written many QT programs and if you can get it compiled on Windows or find a Windows executable, it should be totally transparent whether you're running it on Linux or a Windows system.  After all that's the main purpose of QT (to be cross platform compatible).  If you have trouble, I may be able to make time to compile it for you.
 

Offline TheBloke

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Re: New Rigol DS1054Z oscilloscope
« Reply #1603 on: August 01, 2015, 10:32:11 pm »
Thanks again everyone!

I've done a fair bit more experimenting.  I have to say the PC side of the Rigol does appear to be a major weak link.  Well, I don't know how other scopes compare :)  But certainly it seems pretty weak on this scope.

To answer my earlier question, UltraScope has been updated since Dave installed it - according to what he showed on screen in his January video, he installed version 03, and it's now 05 on the website.  But unsurprisingly, there's no huge difference - I guess maybe some bugfixes, but nothing seemingly major.  Still no control panel and lots of obvious visual/UI bugs and plenty of missing features.

As a quick example of an egregious bug - on first connect it always shows the probe as being X1.  Fortunately it doesn't actually tell the scope to change its X10 setting to X1, and if you then set the probe to X10 in UltraScope you will be in sync again and future changes will work OK.  Not the end of the world, just struck me as an example of a bug that should have been spotted in 30 seconds if anyone at Rigol had thought to QA their PC software :) 

I've also had some significant problems with the LAN connection.  I got it configured on the scope fine, but then UltraSigma couldn't find it or connect to it until I rebooted the scope, even though it said it was configured and I could ping it.  Far more annoyingly, I've now had the scope hard crash a total of four times, always while doing LAN related stuff.  Once it happened when I was trying things in the Network menu.  The other three times, it's happened while I have been connecting to the scope from external tools: twice with UltraScope, once from a third party tool, the LabView software released by Alessandro.  In all cases, the scope just stops responding to new commands.  It's still showing a waveform, and all lights are on, but no button or dial does anything, and the PC app connected to it will freeze or hang or show an error.

So that's a bit worrying, and I guess maybe I should go back to USB - it didn't happen when I was connecting with UltraScope via USB.

I'm currently in the process of installing a new KUbuntu VM in VMWare Workstation, so I can try out DSRemote.  Maybe I'll get a bit further with that - certainly its UI looks a bit more complete than the others. 

Anyway, I don't mean to sound down - the scope itself is clearly awesome, and I'm sure I'll find that I don't need tight PC control or fast screen updates.  It's no hardship leaning over and using the scope interface.   And I'm sure I'll find I can export the data I need.  The only reason I'm concerned at all is because the data I will mostly want to look at, in the short term at least, will be long running captures, lasting tens of seconds or a couple of minutes, with no repeating data.  In other words, several screens of data, which I had hoped I could easily get exported as a single wide image and then a corresponding CSV data table.  I'm sure the latter is possible, but for the former I'm wondering if I need to simply take multiple screen shots as I scroll across a recorded capture on the device. 

I'm sure I'll figure it out.  The Labview-based software by Alessandro did look promising, with its Long Wave Capture mode, but when I tried it that was one of the times the scope hard crashed (and the PC app.  I'll try that again, maybe over USB next time, and contact Alessandro the author if it persists.

Unless you have a special project, I think you'll use the scope directly and not want to operate it remotely.

In this case, I imagine yes - as there's no complete control panel option available for the DS1054Z it seems (I don't think DSRemote is complete, though it does have lots of options.) 

But had there been a complete option - as the software for the DS1052E seems to be - then I can't imagine why I'd use the scope rather than the PC.  I'd much rather look at the UI on a 1920x1200 screen and click through menus with a mouse, than press buttons on a physical device that I have to lean over to reach.   Not that the front panel of the DS1054Z is hard to use - in fact it seems like a pretty decent UI - or that leaning over is hard! :)  Just, with full remote control, I can't see why it wouldn't always be quicker to use it via a PC.  At worst it would be no slower, but at best it would be a lot quicker - eg where on a physical UI I have to turn a dial to change from <high value> to <low value> and with mouse/keyboard I can click and then type.  And just in general, I feel mouse/keyboard would be quicker than using physical buttons.  Not to mention it enables having the scope much further away than I would otherwise, if there's no need to easily read the screen and physically press buttons.

But anyway that's all moot because the DS1054Z doesn't have that.  And that's fine.  I can see now that it's definitely better to have a sophisticated scope without decent PC access, than a good PC interface on a rudimentary scope, so I'm certainly glad I got the Rigol.

I've written many QT programs and if you can get it compiled on Windows or find a Windows executable, it should be totally transparent whether you're running it on Linux or a Windows system.  After all that's the main purpose of QT (to be cross platform compatible).  If you have trouble, I may be able to make time to compile it for you.

Thanks very much for the offer.  I've done a bit of QT development and compiling before, so I should be OK in theory.  My concern was that there might be platform-specific code in there which wouldn't compile on Windows.  I know in theory QT is meant to prevent that, but in practice I suspect that's not always the case - especially in any software that connects directly to hardware.  DSRemote supports USB connection via a Linux-specific USB driver.  I would suspect it therefore includes headers or makes system calls that can't compile on Windows.  So given it appears to have been targettd at Linux exclusively, I'd be surprised if it compiled immediately on Windows (or OSX.)  But it might just be a case of commenting out those references, or there might be a make variable to exclude anything USB-related from the build.

For now I'll just use it via Linux as I can do that fairly easily via VM and/or Raspberry Pi.  But if I find the software useful I might have a go at compiling it on Windows at a later point.
 

Offline TheBloke

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Re: New Rigol DS1054Z oscilloscope
« Reply #1604 on: August 02, 2015, 12:10:30 am »
Just a quick update to say I've got DSRemote running on my Linux VM and it definitely seems to be the best of the available apps.

Still very basic and missing the vast majority of available features, but it is at least usable and seems stable :)  And it seems capable of refreshing the screen much faster than UltraScope - I have it set down to 100ms (default is 500ms) refresh, and I think it's doing that (hard to be certain right now with the basic test wave I have on screen.)

And as it's open source it could be extended by anyone, perhaps even myself.  I do like the way it outputs the SCPI commands to console, so I can immediately see how I could manually run various commands myself.

Best of all - I'm using it over LAN but it hasn't crashed yet, and more importantly nor has my scope while I've been using it :)   (Actually not quite true on the former; the first time I ran it it didn't work at all, throwing an error about unrecognised command or something like that, and not responding to any input.  That first time I ran it I had my in Trigger Delayed mode, which isn't implemented by the app, so it probably didn't understand the response it got from the scope and didn't handle that very well.  I switched the scope out into basic Edge trigger and then the app ran.)

 

Online vk6zgo

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Re: New Rigol DS1054Z oscilloscope
« Reply #1605 on: August 02, 2015, 05:36:15 am »
It is interesting how manufacturers get things wrong on a regular basis.

At my last work,the IFR Spectrum Analyser had extensive facilties available to remotely adjust settings,etc via an old style serial port,but it was all one way!

The only way you could get a "screenshot" was to save to a floppy drive!

Flabbergasted,I searched through the book (one complete volume devoted to "Computer Interfacing")
But no!---back to your floppy!!

It wasn't old equipment----- this thing was made well into the age of USB.

The PC downstairs had a floppy drive,but the one upstairs where I wanted to put the screenshots didn't.

So the routine became:-

Save a bunch of screenshots to a floppy.

Put the floppy in the downstairs PC,save to a USB thumb drive.

Go upstairs & stick the USB drive into that PC.

At least it was good exercise!! ;D
 

Offline pascal_sweden

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Re: New Rigol DS1054Z oscilloscope
« Reply #1606 on: August 02, 2015, 11:15:05 am »
 

Online vk6zgo

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Re: New Rigol DS1054Z oscilloscope
« Reply #1607 on: August 02, 2015, 12:23:24 pm »
They were about $35 in those days--carrying it upstairs was free!
 

Offline TheBloke

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Re: New Rigol DS1054Z oscilloscope
« Reply #1608 on: August 02, 2015, 04:00:23 pm »
Hey guys, I have a probably-newbish question.  One I can't seem to figure out on my own with the manual.

I don't fully understand how the DS1054Z is setting Samples/second and MPts based on timebase.

I do understand that:
  • The higher the H timebase (more data shown), the more memory required
  • If more memory is required than is available, the Sample rate needs to be dropped
That all makes sense, but then I can't understand many of the actual numbers the scope displays at different timebases.

I've gone through a range of timebases and written down the Sample/second and MPts in use.  Here's the data.  Note that my DS1054Z has been hacked to enable 100Mhz, 24Mpts, and all other usable options (with the DSER code).  All tests were done using only Channel 1, connected to the scope's internal square wave test signal, and with a simple Edge trigger active at 1.25V.

First, with Mem Depth manually set to 24Mpts:
  • 200us - 1G/s
  • 500us - 1G/s
  • 1ms - 500M/s
  • 2ms - 250M/s
  • 5ms - 125M/s
  • 10ms - 50M/s
  • 20ms - 50M/s
  • 50ms - 25M/s
  • 100ms - 10M/s
  • 200ms - 10M/s
  • 500ms - 4M/s
  • 1s - 2M/s
  • 2s - 1M/s
Second, with Mem Depth at the default of AUTO.  Rows in red have a different (and lower) sample rate than the same timebase above, ie the sample rate lowers in AUTO versus manually setting 24Mpts.  Rows in black were unchanged, ie no improvement in sample rate from manually setting Mpts higher.

  • 200us - 1G/s  - 2.4Mpts
  • 500us - 1G/s  - 6Mpts
  • 1ms - 500M/s  - 6Mpts
  • 2ms - 250M/s  - 6Mpts
  • 5ms - 125M/s - 7.5Mpts
  • 10ms - 50M/s - 6Mpts
  • 20ms - 25M/s  - 6Mpts
  • 50ms - 10M/s - 6Mpts
  • 100ms - 10M/s  - 12Mpts
  • 200ms - 5M/s - 12Mpts
  • 500ms - 2M/s - 12Mpts
  • 1s - 1M/s  - 12Mpts
  • 2s - 500k/s  - 12Mpts
So I can't figure out the patterns here.  In particular, here's what I don't understand:

  • Why does Mem Depth = AUTO never use more than 12Mpts even when 24Mpts option is enabled (and available via manual setting)?  Especially given that, in some cases at least, manually setting 24Mpts improves sample rate - but the scope chooses to drop sample rate rather than use it in AUTO?  Is this a bug?
  • Why does it sometimes lower the sample rate while only using 6Mpts and 7.5Mpts?  Eg at 1ms, lowering sample rate to 500M/s  while only using 6Mpts - and this happens in both Mem Depth Auto and with Mem Depth set to 24Mpts.  Why can't it use 12 or 24 Mpts and keep the sample rate at 1G/s rather than lowering to 500?
  • Why does sometimes the sample rate drop when time increases, and sometimes not?
  •   Example: In Mem Depth = Auto, Going from 50ms to 100ms does not halve the sample rate (stays at 10M/s), instead it doubles the Mpts.  So why doesn't it double the Mpts from 10ms to 20ms (both are at 6Mpts), instead of dropping the sample rate from 50M/s to 25M/s?  Likewise, Going from 200us to 500us increases Depth from 2.4 to 6Mpts, leaving Sample rate alone, but going from 500us to 1ms keeps depth the same and halves sample rate?
  • Why did manually setting Mem Depth to 24Mpts help the sample rate in some of the above cases (those in red), but not the others? 
Apologies if this is a very basic question.  I have read the manual for the part where it talks about timebase but can't figure it out yet. 


Note that I am mostly asking out of a general, academic desire to understand the workings of the scope - I don't think this is necessarily going to cause me any great problems.


That said, it would be good to know whether I should just set Mem Depth manually to 24Mpts to ensure I get the best possible sample rate at all times, or whether there's any disadvantage to doing that.  I still don't quite understand why one would use AUTO when it sometimes lowers sample rate - but maybe there's some disadvantage to having the Mem Depth higher than necessary, which I don't yet see.


Thanks in advance!
« Last Edit: August 02, 2015, 04:03:30 pm by TheBloke »
 

Offline dadler

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Re: New Rigol DS1054Z oscilloscope
« Reply #1609 on: August 02, 2015, 06:15:13 pm »
This thread might provide some insight as to why the device behaves as it does:

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/some-important-points-to-remember-when-evaluating-waveform-update-rates/

 

Offline pickle9000

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Re: New Rigol DS1054Z oscilloscope
« Reply #1610 on: August 02, 2015, 06:59:48 pm »
@TheBloke

DSO's share the capture system between channels. First, you noticed and charted your results that get's you a two thumbs up,  :-+ :-+. Try checking your numbers with only Channel 1 on. If you like try some of these combinations 1+2 on 1and3 on. To save time just set the highest sample rate.

You did good, it takes time to build trust in equipment and these type of observations will serve you well in the long run.
« Last Edit: August 03, 2015, 03:47:27 am by pickle9000 »
 

Offline Fennec

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Re: New Rigol DS1054Z oscilloscope
« Reply #1611 on: August 03, 2015, 03:43:19 am »
Why not buy a USB floppy disk drive? It costs only 5 EUR in China these days :)

Because u need floppys too and have to plug it from scope to PC, to scope, to pc... For what ? A 1GB-stick cost the same, ist much smaller and don't need this crappy slow floppys.

Maybe someone build in a Wifi module like an ESP8266.

http://www.adafruit.com/search?q=ESP8266&b=1

But I do not really know for what it should be good for.  For this 3 Pix in a year ?
 

Online vk6zgo

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Re: New Rigol DS1054Z oscilloscope
« Reply #1612 on: August 03, 2015, 04:24:44 am »
Why not buy a USB floppy disk drive? It costs only 5 EUR in China these days :)

Because u need floppys too and have to plug it from scope to PC, to scope, to pc... For what ? A 1GB-stick cost the same, ist much smaller and don't need this crappy slow floppys.

Maybe someone build in a Wifi module like an ESP8266.

http://www.adafruit.com/search?q=ESP8266&b=1

But I do not really know for what it should be good for.  For this 3 Pix in a year ?

I don't think you know the (off-topic) back story here:-

About 8 posts back,I was commenting,in passing,on the IFR Spectrum analyser I had to use a few years ago.
It had lots of ways to remotely control it from a PC,but the only way to get screenshots off it was by using a floppy.

Unfortunately the PC I wanted to put the screenshots on didn't have a floppy drive,so I had to do it in a more indirect manner.

I was retuning a lot of RF Amplifiers at the time,so it was more like 10-12 Pix per day!
 

Offline TheBloke

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Re: New Rigol DS1054Z oscilloscope
« Reply #1613 on: August 03, 2015, 04:36:32 pm »


Quote from: dadler on Yesterday at 19:15:13
This thread might provide some insight as to why the device behaves as it does:

>https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/some-important-points-to-remember-when-evaluating-waveform-update-rates/



Thanks, reading through that now.


Quote from: pickle9000 on Yesterday at 19:59:48
@TheBloke

DSO's share the capture system between channels. First, you noticed and charted your results that get's you a two thumbs up,  :-+ :-+ . Try checking your numbers with only Channel 1 on. If you like try some of these combinations 1+2 on 1and3 on. To save time just set the highest sample rate.

You did good, it takes time to build trust in equipment and these type of observations will serve you well in the long run.


Thanks!

You're right that multi channel definitely has a  big effect. But all my tests are with one channel only.

I've done a bit more testing and experimenting but still can't figure out how it automatically decides many of the sample and Mpts settings.  It doesn't matter at all for the work I'm doing, I just like to understand how these things work if possible :)

One thing that does affect me though, and I'm still curious to know:  should I leave Mem Depth on Auto, or should I set it to the maximum 24Mpts?  Or should I sometimes have Auto, sometimes set 24?

I've now read through the whole manual, and it doesn't really help on this question.  I don't even understand why the Mem Depth setting is there - why would the user ever want to use less than the maximum available Mpts?   So my first reaction is that I would always want to set it to 24Mpts, especially as Auto doesn't seem to ever use 24 automatically (another thing I don't understand.) 

But maybe there's some disadvantage to using more Mpts than is required?   Perhaps it slows the scope down?  If anyone knows I'd be most grateful!

For now I've put it back on Auto, because sample rate isn't that important for the testing I'm doing at the moment, so I don't want to run any risk of there being issues/disadvantages with using maximum Mpts until I know more about it.
 
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Offline mv

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Re: New Rigol DS1054Z oscilloscope
« Reply #1614 on: August 03, 2015, 05:00:37 pm »
One thing that does affect me though, and I'm still curious to know:  should I leave Mem Depth on Auto, or should I set it to the maximum 24Mpts?  Or should I sometimes have Auto, sometimes set 24?

I've now read through the whole manual, and it doesn't really help on this question.  I don't even understand why the Mem Depth setting is there - why would the user ever want to use less than the maximum available Mpts?   So my first reaction is that I would always want to set it to 24Mpts, especially as Auto doesn't seem to ever use 24 automatically (another thing I don't understand.) 

But maybe there's some disadvantage to using more Mpts than is required?   Perhaps it slows the scope down?  If anyone knows I'd be most grateful!

I think that there are more people that are confused by this (including me). Could someone explain the details behind this?
 

Offline Karel

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Re: New Rigol DS1054Z oscilloscope
« Reply #1615 on: August 03, 2015, 05:35:50 pm »
A possible answer could be that allways using the maximum memory lowers the waveform update rate.
I haven't done it myself but you can do this by connecting one inputchannel with the trigger output at the back of the scope.

 

Offline TheBloke

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Re: New Rigol DS1054Z oscilloscope
« Reply #1616 on: August 03, 2015, 05:51:09 pm »


Quote from: Karel
A possible answer could be that allways using the maximum memory lowers the waveform update rate.
I haven't done it myself but you can do this by connecting one inputchannel with the trigger output at the back of the scope.

What is the waveform update rate exactly?  Is that different to the Sample/second rate that it captures at (ie the maximum of 1GSa/s.)

Regarding the external trigger output, the manual says this:

Quote from: DS1054Z manual, 5-37
A signal which reflects the current oscilloscope capture rate can be output from
[Trigger Out] connector each time a trigger is generated by the oscilloscope. If this
signal is connected to a waveform display device to measure the frequency, the
measurement result is equal to the current capture rate.

When I read that I assumed "current oscilloscope capture rate" meant the Sample/second rate, ie maximum 1GSa/s.  But is it something different, like what you are talking about the - waveform update rate?

If you are talking about the main Sample/S rate, then Mpts does affect the Sample rate - that's what I first posted about, that in Auto it never uses 24 Mpts and when you manually select 24 Mpts, it sometimes results in getting a higher sample rate than in Auto.  I posted two sets of data, with Mem Depth = Auto and with Mem Depth = 24.  In the 24Mpts case, there were 6 or 7 cases where the sample rate was higher than in Auto.

That still doesn't make sense to me though, because a) why does Auto not use the full 24Mpts available - why does it choose to lower the sample rate instead of increasing the Mem Depth  and b) that means that, for Sample/s alone, it's always best to keep Mem Depth on 24 Mpts.  So why have the option at all?  Why not just always set it to the maximum 24Mpts (or 12 without the option) to ensure Sample/s is always the highest it can be?

It seems there must be some disadvantage to having Mpts higher, which would explain why the Mem Depth setting is there, but I'm not sure what that is.
 

Offline dadler

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Re: New Rigol DS1054Z oscilloscope
« Reply #1617 on: August 03, 2015, 07:36:14 pm »
Waveform update rate is not the same thing as the sample rate.

Scopes are blind most of the time, this is related to the waveform update rate.

Did you read that thread I linked above? It is a bit confusing and there is some arguing, but the essential idea is there.

Here is a good post:

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/first-impressions-and-review-of-the-rigol-ds2072-ds2000-series-dso/msg160064/#msg160064

Here is another link with a graphic:

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/a-simple-technique-to-measure-waveform-update-rates-on-dsos-with-no-trigger-out/180/
 

Offline pascal_sweden

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Re: New Rigol DS1054Z oscilloscope
« Reply #1618 on: August 03, 2015, 08:10:00 pm »
Can you rudimentary compare it with feeding a 50Hz TV signal to an LCD flat screen, where the LCD back panel physically either supports 50Hz or 100Hz, but where the software and the scaler in the TV uses special techniques to increase the refresh rate up to 200-600 Hz? :)
 

Offline pickle9000

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Re: New Rigol DS1054Z oscilloscope
« Reply #1619 on: August 03, 2015, 08:34:41 pm »
Can you rudimentary compare it with feeding a 50Hz TV signal to an LCD flat screen, where the LCD back panel physically either supports 50Hz or 100Hz, but where the software and the scaler in the TV uses special techniques to increase the refresh rate up to 200-600 Hz? :)

Waveform update rate is a simulation of the glowing phosphor on and analog scope tube. It gives a feeling for how unstable or for catching glitch like events. If you see the glow the inclination is to try and see whats there in more detail, how you adjust it out  (if possible) depends on signal.

Memory depth is described in the Rigol manual 4-6. Also have a close look at 5-3 Pre-trigger and delay trigger even if you have minimal memory available you can use this to grab what you need. Trigger skills are basic to scope operation and should not be overlooked.

The autoset memory depth could be a compromise, hardware limitation, lack of programming initiative (lazy programmer) and so on. As with any bit of gear it's important to know it's limits but your logic skills can get you a useful and get you out of a hard spot. Not perfect but good enough.
 

Offline bitseeker

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Re: New Rigol DS1054Z oscilloscope
« Reply #1620 on: August 03, 2015, 11:06:07 pm »
Just a quick update to say I've got DSRemote running on my Linux VM and it definitely seems to be the best of the available apps.

Thanks for the update on your experience thus far. I haven't yet tried the PC side of the 1054Z, so it's interesting to see what you've encountered.
I TEA.
 

Offline pascal_sweden

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Re: New Rigol DS1054Z oscilloscope
« Reply #1621 on: August 04, 2015, 09:23:40 am »
How come some Tektronix scopes can do 1 Million waveform/s update rates on all memory depths?

They do this in hardware, while others do it in software?

Why does Rigol not just throw in an extra FPGA for that waveform update part?

I understand they do it in software on the DS1000Z series, but at least in the DS2000A and DS4000 series they could try to hit higher barriers :)
 

Offline H.O

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Re: New Rigol DS1054Z oscilloscope
« Reply #1622 on: August 04, 2015, 04:44:48 pm »
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How come some Tektronix scopes can do 1 Million waveform/s update rates on all memory depths?
I don't know which scopes you're talking about but really, it's all about how long it takes to fill the selected amount of memory at the selected sample rate (and then the scopes processing time in between each trigger event)

If the scope(s) you're talking about really does achieve 1Million waveforms/s update rate at ANY memory depth then they either got an incredibly high sample rate or pretty low amount of sample memory.

For example, if your sample rate is 1Gsps and you select a memory depth of 2500pts, then it takes 2.5us to fill that memory. There can not be more than 400 000 waveform updates per second. In order to achieve 1million updates per second with that memory depth (2500pts) the scope (or its user) must select a sample rate of at least 2.5Gsps.

If you select a memory depth of 100kpts and you expect a waveform update rate of 1Million waveforms per second then your sample rate needs to be 100Gsps.
 

Offline pascal_sweden

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Re: New Rigol DS1054Z oscilloscope
« Reply #1623 on: August 05, 2015, 07:09:01 am »
I read that in document where they compared 2 scopes against each other. In this document, there was a table with 3 columns and several rows, and the waveform update rate was displayed in the second and third column for scope A and scope B. Each row entry for scope A always listed 1M wfm/sec, while the waveform update rate for scope B dropped further and further going down in the rows. I can not find that document anymore unfortunately. Most likely the table was made for a comparison of two scopes with a limited max. memory depth.
 

Offline H.O

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Re: New Rigol DS1054Z oscilloscope
« Reply #1624 on: August 05, 2015, 07:35:04 am »
Was it perhaps Agilents Oscilloscope Waveform Update Rate Determines Probability of Capturing Elusive Events?

EDIT: I guess it was since you posted a link to the "same" (but with the Keysight logo) document in another thread.
« Last Edit: August 05, 2015, 07:37:36 am by H.O »
 


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