New Rigol DS1054Z oscilloscope

[JPortici]

have to agree, i had a surface 3 for some time and it was a really neat tool

[Loboscope]

A scope (and a DMM of course) will be useful for troubleshooting and repairing any gear in general (amplifers, PSU, etc.), but not for measuring THD and noise, especially at low levels.
To do this (and more), I use "hpw-works" [http://www.hpw-works.com/], together with a good interface (RME or comparable) - a really professional solution.

[Daque]

Can you dump a  I2C capture and use the data fix in another program to decode the data? If so what program would you use? I understand the scope's decoding could be better. The  data I want to decode at is very small and sent over up to about 10 seconds.  Basically a few bytes to start playback or record  at an address of a ChipCoder chip  then stop it at the end of message. Would one of those $6 eBay logic analyzes work better for this? There is a 3rd line that the chip sends out a timing sync pulse every 32 milliseconds that I want to take a look at eventually too.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[rstofer]

none is good.

-8 bit digitizer
- too much noise (a side effect of having a very high bandwidth

an audio interface, or a dc coupled audio interface, and a software suite is probably the best choice before ending up spending multi thousand dollars on audio analyzers

For audio, I would think the Digilent Analog Discovery with 14 bit ADC would be ideal.  It knows all about Bode' plots and FFTs.

[rstofer]

have to agree, i had a surface 3 for some time and it was a really neat tool

I have a high end Surface Pros and Surface Book.  There is no way in the world I would ever use the audio system to troubleshoot external stuff!  These things cost a whole lot of money - far more than a decent scope.

I do use the Digilent Analog Discovery which is USB based but, even then, I plug it into a powered hub.

[Fungus]

I want to decode I2C...  Would one of those $6 eBay logic analyzes work better for this?

Probably.

A 'scope is essential for troubleshooting I2C problems and making sure the bus is OK (good pullups, etc.) but one of those $6 eBay analyzers will win for collecting/decoding long streams of data from working devices.

[Daque]

Thanks.  I have one coming but it could still be a month out.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Mechatrommer]

Welcome to the forum.
Consider adding SDS1202X-E to your list. Bit dearer than a 1072 @ $379 but 200 MHz and excellent FFT.

I certainly don't need high bandwidth (or do I just not realize that I need it?), but excellent FFT is definitely a selling point. So, will FFT actually be useful for seeing small (inaudible) distortions of audio signals?

It will be better than the others on your list due to its 1 Mpts FFT.
Some screenshots:
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/new-siglent-sds1000x-e-oscilloscope-based-on-xilinx-zynq-7000-soc-architecture/msg1192654/#msg1192654

can we possibly download the whole 14Mpts data and plot FFT in PC like DS1054Z 24Mpts FFT like below?

[tautech]

can we possibly download the whole 14Mpts data and plot FFT in PC like DS1054Z 24Mpts FFT like below?

Outside my field but I'll see what I can do. Bookmarked.

Edit.
Yes but we're waiting for the programming manual to be finalised.
Can you provide a link to VISADSO please.

Are you pulling the data via LAN or USB ?

[Fungus]

can we possibly download the whole 14Mpts data and plot FFT in PC like DS1054Z 24Mpts FFT like below?

Probably, but... it's still an 8-bit ADC and that's the real limiting factor. No amount of buffer will remove the noise introduced in the signal by the ADC.

[AudioNoob]

Probably, but... it's still an 8-bit ADC and that's the real limiting factor. No amount of buffer will remove the noise introduced in the signal by the ADC.

8 bit means means ~48 dB SNR, is that why it's limiting? Subsequently, a perfect sine wave quantized in 8 bits would exhibit a certain (rather high) THD percentage due to that -48 dB random noise added to it. Am I getting it right?

[Fungus]

8 bit means means ~48 dB SNR, is that why it's limiting? Subsequently, a perfect sine wave quantized in 8 bits would exhibit a certain (rather high) THD percentage due to that -48 dB random noise added to it. Am I getting it right?

You'll see all the big frequency peaks but the noise will mask the small ones.

[technogeeky]

8 bit means means ~48 dB SNR, is that why it's limiting? Subsequently, a perfect sine wave quantized in 8 bits would exhibit a certain (rather high) THD percentage due to that -48 dB random noise added to it. Am I getting it right?

You'll see all the big frequency peaks but the noise will mask the small ones.

You can do what some THD analyzers and other equipment do; which is to place a notch filter on the fundamental frequency. You can continue down this path, if you wish, placing it on subsequent harmonics until you run into the genuine noise floor of the instrument.

[boggis the cat]

Can you provide a link to VISADSO please.

It is this software: http://www.soasystem.com/download/visadso/

Only working with some Rigol models at the moment.

[lacommtech]

Hope that this isn't off-topic.

Does anyone who's purchased one lately know whether the upgrade hacks still work?  I'm getting closer to buying one, figuring that eventually they will make it harder to permanently enable what they offer as trial features and that my old Tektronics may decide to retire soon.

Thanks in advance for any info!

[ebastler]

Hope that this isn't off-topic.

Does anyone who's purchased one lately know whether the upgrade hacks still work?  I'm getting closer to buying one, figuring that eventually they will make it harder to permanently enable what they offer as trial features and that my old Tektronics may decide to retire soon.

Thanks in advance for any info!

Not off-topic, but rather repetitive. 
Yes, the upgrade hacks still work. Don't buy an MSO or a "plus" model, though; these are (and always have been) much more difficult to hack.

[pmayhew]

Hi, I have the Rigol SD1054z, and used the http://gotroot.ca/rigol/riglol/ page for the modification.

Unfortunately I wasn't aware of this forum until now, and have installed all options DSFR and was not aware there was a bug at 500uV (I've not seen this bug myself)

I understand that all options can be remove, but I have been unable to find and download the UltraSigma software. Do any anyone here have a working download link, or can provide me with this program?

Is the bug only when reducing the amplitude to 500uv?

Peter

[Fungus]

I understand that all options can be remove, but I have been unable to find and download the UltraSigma software. Do any anyone here have a working download link, or can provide me with this program?

You don't need any special software. Just connect it to your PC with an Ethernet cable and open a command line.

Type this:

telnet XX.XX.XX.XX:5555            (where XX is the IP address of the 'scope).

If you don't see any messages saying 'unable to connect' then type:

:SYSTem:OPTion:UNINSTall

This removes all the options so you can start again.


While you're there you can install the options via command line as well. Use this to enter a key:

:SYSTem:OPTion:INSTall XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

Where XXXX is a key generated by Riglol.

Is the bug only when reducing the amplitude to 500uv?

Yes.

[kjh83]

Hi, I have the Rigol SD1054z, and used the http://gotroot.ca/rigol/riglol/ page for the modification.

Unfortunately I wasn't aware of this forum until now, and have installed all options DSFR and was not aware there was a bug at 500uV (I've not seen this bug myself)

I understand that all options can be remove, but I have been unable to find and download the UltraSigma software. Do any anyone here have a working download link, or can provide me with this program?

Is the bug only when reducing the amplitude to 500uv?

Peter

I haven't tried it but code DSER should install everything but the 500uV/div feature. It's not listed on the webpage you used but it should work once you've reset all the options. I wouldn't mess with the 500uV feature if your scope doesn't have the hardware for it.

YMMV.

[ebclr]

I may don't know how to recognize the bug, but my work just fine on 500uV

Maybe that is a more sophisticated bug other than just see the waveform on 500uV

[ebastler]

I may don't know how to recognize the bug, but my work just fine on 500uV

Maybe that is a more sophisticated bug other than just see the waveform on 500uV

If I recall correctly, one of the issues is a big jump in the offset which cannot be removed by self-calibration. But I can't find the thread where this was discussed at the moment.

In any case, there is little benefit to be had from a 500µV/div scale on the DS1054Z. The 1mV/div scale is already a digital zoom (i.e. visual magnification only, without gaining ADC resolution). And the analog input noise will probably prevent you from seeing much additional detail at 500µV as well.

[ebclr]

I'm lucky 1/2 division only,

[Hydron]

The DS1000Z series only has 2 analogue ranges, with an attenuator switched in for 500mV/div up to the max of 10V/div.

All other gain control is done digitally inside the HMCAD1511 ADC (it has internal precision >8 bits, and thus can do digital gain control over a fairly wide range), which Rigol has taken advantage of in order to make the analogue front end very inexpensive. However this digital gain has a max of 50x, with missing codes at gains higher than 32x (see HMCAD1511 datasheet).

As Rigol is using the same analogue gain for all ranges 200mV/div and under, best case is that they'll be hitting >32x digital gain (and therefore the ADC output will have missing codes) at 5mV/div, and will be beyond 50x at 2mV/div and 1mV/div, so will need software gain for these two settings. There will also be some decrease in ENOB as digital gain is increased - the datasheet specs 7.9 bits at 1x going down to 7.6 bits at 10x gain (which actually seems like a pretty good performance to me!)

tl;dr: it's already run out of steam at <5mV/div, don't worry about trying to do any better! You won't get amazing performance out of a DS1000Z scope, but you might get amazing value if your use doesn't push it's limits.

[Fungus]

Nothing massively bad happens on that range but it doesn't work very well. It's best not to be able to select it accidentally.

[David Hess]

The DS1000Z series only has 2 analogue ranges, with an attenuator switched in for 500mV/div up to the max of 10V/div.

It only has one attenuator section before the high impedance buffer.

All other gain control is done digitally inside the HMCAD1511 ADC (it has internal precision >8 bits, and thus can do digital gain control over a fairly wide range), which Rigol has taken advantage of in order to make the analogue front end very inexpensive. However this digital gain has a max of 50x, with missing codes at gains higher than 32x (see HMCAD1511 datasheet).

Is that right?  I thought Rigol was using one of National's LMH series of digitally controlled, variable gain amplifiers between the high impedance buffer, transistor preamplifier, and the ADC.  The DS2000A series uses the LMH6518 and as I recall, photographs of the DS1000Z series show an integrated circuit in this location but the markings are removed so it is not clear exactly which LMH part is used.