New Rigol DS1054Z oscilloscope

[Mark]

One of my DS1054Z units has a problem, it won't boot, all I get is all lights on and a continuously clicking relay (at approx 5Hz).  Anyone had the same problem?

A quick search on the interwebs revealed this:
http://www.jackenhack.com/rigol-ds1054z-oscilloscope-hangs-boot/

Only problem with the factory reset procedure is that the menu defaults to Chinese, so you'll have to change that back.
As far as they state on that post, it does retain upgrades if any were made.

Edit: but the freeze on boot on that case showed the Rigol logo so I'm not sure if it is the same problem, worth trying I think.

Not the same problem, no. Jackenhack is probably describing the "freeze bug" that I discovered and reported on last year, which seems to afflict many but not all DS1054z scopes with Boot Version 0.0.1.2 when certain user settings are input. Scopes with Boot Version 0.0.1.3 don't seem to suffer from this particular bug. 

Yes, it would be nice to know if the Factory Reset (5th left grey button) procedure fixes the problem Mark has.

Negative.  I think it is power supply related, just a hunch.  The last time I used the scope a month ago it did the same thing, but I wiggled the mains lead and re-tried and it booted ok... but I don't think the mains lead is the problem unfortunately. 

[ytterligare]

Software Version 00.04.03.SP2

You can display the _complete_ System Info screen by pressing the Trigger section buttons (extreme right hand side)  Menu-Menu-Force-Menu very fast, then Utility-System-System Info.  If you don't see the complete system info screen, keep trying, you might not be pressing the Menu-Menu-Force-Menu sequence fast enough.

It is not possible, as far as I  know, to "downgrade" or roll back to an earlier firmware (software) version once a later version is installed.

Another way to tell if you have the 00.04.03.02.03 firmware installed is if you have the Pulses and Edges counters in the Horizontal Measurements menus, and the "Pluses" spelling error when you display these as Measurements.

Ok thanks, I'll try the sequence, with some luck...
And BTW, yes...I've got "Pluses"..

[gardner]

I have a dumb Q about the accuracy of the trigger level.

I have a brand new DS1054Z, Software Version 00.04.03.SP2, no hacks.

I was fiddling with a plain old rising edge triggering of a DC-coupled 5V square wave and I was kind of surprised at how inaccurate the trigger voltage level seemed be.  I find that it will not trigger reliably at less than ~430mV and will trigger reliably up to 7.3V.   Is it normal for the trigger level to be to inaccurate?

[XFDDesign]

How are you getting 7.3V on a 5V square wave?

[Fungus]

How are you getting 7.3V on a 5V square wave?

And what's your vertical scale?

[JPortici]

So, builtin fft sucks ass. protocol decoding kind of sucks (and it's hard to have a stable trigger.. harder than other scopes i'm used to). Ultraview is heavy and slow.
Another piece of software that gets the data via lan/usb, apply fft and do serial decoding? does it exist?

[gardner]

How are you getting 7.3V on a 5V square wave?

And what's your vertical scale?

Well, part of it is just the overshoot/ringing on the transition.  Here's zoomed in and I've highlighted what I think is kind of strange.  The measurements say max voltage in the waveform is at 5.6V, but the waveform is above the trigger level which claims to be set to 6.4V.  Maybe I haven't gotten the hang of what the measurements mean -- there are so many crazy ones to choose from.

This is 5V/div and the waveform looks to go to about 7V on the graticule.  I wouldn't swear to how well 0V is lined up to the division below though.  The ringing/overshoot goes down about the same amount too.  Which I took to be what Vpp is measuring, but if the measurements are just based on what appears on the screen, then 7.8V makes sense vs. what appears against the graticule and who knows what the Max is getting at.

Anyhow, I am very new to this scope and although I have seen all the videos, I still am having trouble groking the features.

[Fennec]

I have no idea, why you measure a 5V signal in a 5V range !. Set it to 1V or maybe 2V / Div. You have 8 DIVs ! Its like measure a 1V signal with a 2000 counts Multimeter in the 1000V range, and wonder why you can't see the ..9V Digit. WHY ?
The Signal is in your 5V Range 5,6V: FINE.
Trigger setting on the overshoot ?? But works fine in your screen shot.
Vpp 7,6V looks fine for me.

So whats your problem ? Maybe time to read the manual ?!

[alsetalokin4017]

How are you getting 7.3V on a 5V square wave?

And what's your vertical scale?

Well, part of it is just the overshoot/ringing on the transition.  Here's zoomed in and I've highlighted what I think is kind of strange.  The measurements say max voltage in the waveform is at 5.6V, but the waveform is above the trigger level which claims to be set to 6.4V.  Maybe I haven't gotten the hang of what the measurements mean -- there are so many crazy ones to choose from.

This is 5V/div and the waveform looks to go to about 7V on the graticule.  I wouldn't swear to how well 0V is lined up to the division below though.  The ringing/overshoot goes down about the same amount too.  Which I took to be what Vpp is measuring, but if the measurements are just based on what appears on the screen, then 7.8V makes sense vs. what appears against the graticule and who knows what the Max is getting at.

Anyhow, I am very new to this scope and although I have seen all the videos, I still am having trouble groking the features.

Hmm.... I'd say that the Vmax reading is wrong somehow. If you press the Help button and then the Vmax measurement button you'll see how the scope defines the vertical measurements. Yes, the measurements are taken from what is displayed on-screen, so your Vmax and Vpp should be a lot closer than what your measurement numbers are saying. The Trigger level and etc. seem to be indicating OK.

This is as close as I could get to your setup and signal (by clipping a small 20uH inductor between my DDS FG and the scope probe to get some visible ringing on the 1KHz positive pulse train). I could not duplicate the wide difference between Vmax and Vpp you are seeing -- the most difference I could get is 0.2 volts, as you can see here.

Have you let the scope warm up completely and then run the self-calibration routine?

[Fungus]

the measurements are taken from what is displayed on-screen

This is an important point. All the numbers you see on screen are calculated by looking at screen pixels. They are NOT calculated by looking at the original incoming voltage.

This is why it's important to maximize the height of the waveform on screen, eg. 1V/div for looking at 5V signals.

, so your Vmax and Vpp should be a lot closer than what your measurement numbers are saying.

There's also a measurement that tells you how much ringing there is.

The Trigger level and etc. seem to be indicating OK.

Yep.

[Eheran]

They are NOT calculated by looking at the original incoming voltage.

Well sure, they only measure with 8bit. How else could you do that? Unless you have the range properly adjusted you will simply not have any valid information.

by looking at screen pixels.

More like by looking at the raw data Points, so the actual Votage measured at each given point. If that would not be correct one could simply not see a Vmax of a very fast peak when looking at a larger timescale. I have not run into that problem so far - the Vmax does not change by zooming in or out of the Timescale when there is only that one max peak.

[Fungus]

by looking at screen pixels.

More like by looking at the raw data Points
[/quote]

The two are mathematically equivalent.

The point is that before it arrives at the ADC the input signal goes through op-amps, etc., whose gain is based on your vertical scale setting.

[malekia]

Hi, I've tried searching but can't find a solution.

I'm trying to save a file:
1) Press Storage button
2) Choose "Storage type" (Image, Waves, Setups, etc...)
3) Press Save
4) Navigate to internal storage

Why are the New File and Save buttons are greyed out?

I can only save to internal memory if the storage type is Param or Setups.

No issues saving to external storage.

[Teneyes]

Hi, I've tried searching but can't find a solution.

I'm trying to save a file:
1) Press  File and Save buttons are greyed out?
I can only save to internal memory if the storage type is Param or Setups.
No issues saving to external storage.

Check manual section 13- 3 (User's Guide Jan.2014)
                      Section 14-3 (User's Guide Dec.2015)
Yes, only setup saved internally storage

[alsetalokin4017]

I can only save to internal memory if the storage type is Param or Setups.

That's right.

You can also save and read mask files and reference waveform and waveform record files in internal storage, from their respective function menus.

See the manual. It's section 14 in my copy of the manual.

[malekia]

Thanks for help!

[Geoff_S]

What is the general consensus about the serial decoding ability of the 1054Z ?  How would it compare to a Salaea LA ?  [I tried searching here but most of the hits related to serial numbers, not serial decoding...]

[Fungus]

What is the general consensus about the serial decoding ability of the 1054Z ?  How would it compare to a Salaea LA ?  [I tried searching here but most of the hits related to serial numbers, not serial decoding...]

They're completely different beasts.

The DS1054Z decodes just what you can see on screen. You can zoom and pan to see different parts of the signal but it only works on the visible screen data. It can trigger on sequences of data, I2C addresses, stuff like that but it's a bit of a pain to enter the numbers using the rotating knob.

On the Saleae you press 'record' and record the signal for as long as you have RAM to store it. It decodes all the data in memory and you can search it for strings, addresses, etc. You use a mouse and keyboard.

[Geoff_S]

Thanks.  I've already got a Salaea, and pretty familiar with it.  I've just had a read through the Rigol manual and can see the basics of how it works, but it doesn't seem to say much about the ability to trigger on a sequence of data.  I'll keep reading and googling 

[Geoff_S]

Last question for today - is TEquipment still offering discount coupon codes on the DS1054Z ?

[bitseeker]

The code still works for more than just the scope, as far as I know.

[Geoff_S]

I've read chapter 7 on serial decoding in the DS1054Z manual several times now, and still not clear - can you configure the 1054 to trigger on a certain character or string of serial characters ?  I've sure I'm missing something obvious...

[ian.rees]

Another piece of software that gets the data via lan/usb, apply fft and do serial decoding? does it exist?

If you're comfortable with Python, I'm working on adding support to Python-IVI for Rigol DS1000Z between other projects.  Would be trivial to do FFTs, a bit more work to do serial decoding depending on what extent you want to take it (or perhaps it's easy to hook in to sigrok - not sure).  https://github.com/ianrrees/python-ivi/tree/20160421-add-rigol-ds1000z  Let me know if you use it, and whether you find any bugs or missing features that would be useful.   -Ian-

[Karel]

I've read chapter 7 on serial decoding in the DS1054Z manual several times now, and still not clear - can you configure the 1054 to trigger on a certain character or string of serial characters ?  I've sure I'm missing something obvious...

Yes, you missed to read chapter 5: "RS232 Trigger", page 5-32 (106), Rigol user's Guide Dec. 2015.

[Fungus]

I've read chapter 7 on serial decoding in the DS1054Z manual several times now, and still not clear - can you configure the 1054 to trigger on a certain character or string of serial characters ?  I've sure I'm missing something obvious...

Obvious: It's in the chapter called "triggering".