New toy - Tek TLA614 Logic Analyzer

[TerraHertz]

So it's not a modular TLA 7xx series (could not afford), but it's a lot nicer than my old HP 1630G.

I'll be taking this apart soon, to make a backup of the hard disk, then see if I can transfer the system to a bigger HD, and also (hopefully) get the TLA application to run under WinXP rather than Win2000.
Also fingers crossed that I can add some more USB ports. It only has one on the back panel.
So, more disassembly pics then.

I'm really pleased to have such good luck with the cables. It has 8 ports, and a complete set of 8 P6418 cables. Also an extra one P6434 cable, for direct PCB connection.
Only thing I need to get more of is the little flying lead end clips (only one included), and the clock end clips.

[TerraHertz]

More pics.
So far it's just an exercise in blowing out dust (lots of it.)
The front panel knobs had that 'grippy' thin rubber coating, but it was yellowed. Fortunately it's easy to remove entirely by scraping with a fingernail, then finishing with a cloth with turps. I dislike the feel of that stuff anyway; and the cleaned plastic knobs look like new.

[tony3d]

Looks like it's in really good shape!

[Vgkid]

That looks to be a really nice units, it looks like a beast.

[marshallh]

I see an IBM Deathstar... may want to get on that

[SeanB]

I powered one up last month and it did actually start and run fine, pretty good after having been in storage for about a half decade after running for around 8 years. Of course the other one did nothing but click and whine.

[TiN]

Nice LA, congratz I see it's chassis similar to TDS7xxx/CSA7xxx scope.
Radisys i810 NLX motherboard for x86?

Be sure to store NVRAM and c:/vxBoot (hidden folder with powerpc boot image and settings), or your LA will be dead when NVRAM battery loose it's charge

Btw, i personally run TLA714 remotely, just have PCMCIA Intel 100 adapter connected to my main workstation PC (Win2008), where i run TLA App 5.8 (I tried all versions on my Win2000 in TLA, and so far 5.8 was latest to work).
GUI is much faster remotely on powerful PC, then locally running on LA with slow PC. Also TLA screams with bigger screen to fit all those waveform signals 

[nctnico]

I'm not quite sure Windows XP works on this LA. On my TLA704 the newest OS I could use was Windows 2000. But I put a 200MMX cpu, more memory and an 800x600 screen in it to beef it up a little.

[TerraHertz]

Nice LA, congratz I see it's chassis similar to TDS7xxx/CSA7xxx scope.
Radisys i810 NLX motherboard for x86?

The motherboard is an 'Intel SU810', which I have yet to search for data on. Very likely custom. Haven't even taken it out of the carrier frame it's in yet. But will be. For one thing it looks like the board has a dual USB stacked connector, while the TLA614 case only has an opening for one of the USB connectors. Fingers crossed both USB ports are actually there.
I can imagine in 2000 someone at Tek saying "USB? Newfangled rubbish, will never catch on, why would anyone need more than one port? We don't want to confuse people, so just blank over the 2nd port."

Be sure to store NVRAM and c:/vxBoot (hidden folder with powerpc boot image and settings), or your LA will be dead when NVRAM battery loose it's charge

Now this is why I love eevblog!
I'd noticed there is an NVRAM (one of those Dallas 'battery and RAM in a block' things), and guessed I probably have to back it up. I have a TopMax device programmer so can easily do that, except the thing is soldered into the main data capture PCB, and I'm highly unenthusiastic about taking a soldering iron to that board. Can do it, but fear accidents. Both of the data loss and lifted pads kind.
Thanks for mentioning the hidden folder. The hard disk is annoyingly a 2.5" with the mini-IDE + power connector, so I now have to find where I put my IDE to mini-IDE adapter before I can mount the drive on a PC or USB external dock.
Will probably use partition magic to make an exact image, and also ZtreeWin to do an all-files copy. That does copy hidden folders.

I'm dreading finding whatever Tek may have have done to lock their software to this machine in it's exact present form, and whether that will make upgrading it (eg bigger HD) either impossible or a pain in the butt.

Btw, i personally run TLA714 remotely, just have PCMCIA Intel 100 adapter connected to my main workstation PC (Win2008), where i run TLA App 5.8 (I tried all versions on my Win2000 in TLA, and so far 5.8 was latest to work).
GUI is much faster remotely on powerful PC, then locally running on LA with slow PC. Also TLA screams with bigger screen to fit all those waveform signals 

Good idea. I'd noticed it runs like a dog compared to newer PCs, but didn't make any judgment yet whether part of that is maybe 'grandfather Windows' effect (bloated registry and other junk) or just really old, slow hardware.
I mentioned WinXP because I have a stripped-down version, with CPU-cycle wasting stupidities like WFP removed, and it runs very nicely. Also I'm used to it. Really hoping I can transfer to that. But of course, on a new hard disk, keeping the original as fallback.
The screen in the TLA614 is 800x600 I noticed. Not too bad. So far I didn't find any way to adjust the brightness; maybe it's just fixed at 'bright as can be'.
Do you know if there's any kind of service manual available for these? I kind of doubt it, but might as well ask.
Also are there any good Tek LA user group forums for this gear? For instance where did you get the various versions of the TLA App? That's something else I need to do.

[TerraHertz]

I see an IBM Deathstar... may want to get on that

Ha ha... Took me a while to get that. So, the IBM 'Travelstar' hard drives have a reputation for sudden death?

Optimal solution would be to replace with a 4" drive, since I have boxes full of them. Looks like there is physically enough space. Leaving just power supply load and wiring questions.

[BravoV]

I see an IBM Deathstar... may want to get on that

Ha ha... Took me a while to get that. So, the IBM 'Travelstar' hard drives have a reputation for sudden death?

Optimal solution would be to replace with a 4" drive, since I have boxes full of them. Looks like there is physically enough space. Leaving just power supply load and wiring questions.

Assuming its an IDE drive, just curious if its replaceable using SSD with an ide to sata converter ? 

[echen1024]

I see an IBM Deathstar... may want to get on that

Ha ha... Took me a while to get that. So, the IBM 'Travelstar' hard drives have a reputation for sudden death?

Optimal solution would be to replace with a 4" drive, since I have boxes full of them. Looks like there is physically enough space. Leaving just power supply load and wiring questions.

Assuming its an IDE drive, just curious if its replaceable using SSD with an ide to sata converter ? 

I don't think you'll feel a major speed increase, especially with that 200MHz Pentium. A compact flash might be better. 

[TerraHertz]

I'm not after any speed increase via changing the hard drive. The objective there is simply to secure the code against loss. By having backups and establishing that I can create working images on new drives.

The SSD idea would undoubtedly work, except I'd have to buy one. While I really do have boxes full of perfectly good old 4" IDE drives. Even a 20GB one would be fine.
The aims are:
 * Eliminate NTFS. I *hate* NTFS, and the way all Windows versions use it to hide stuff and leave rabbit droppings everywhere. There's also a traumatic experience I had with NTFS once - a story for another time.
 * Split into separate partitions: C: system & installed utils, D: virtual mem, E, F etc: user work space. All of them FAT32.

Call me old fashioned, but I like to be able to hear the drive spin up and head seeks during boot. Very useful diagnostics, if boot fails.

The TLA 614 has a CDROM drive, read only. That's definitely getting replaced with a CD/DVD R/W unit.

[TiN]

while the TLA614 case only has an opening for one of the USB connectors.

Same here on CSA7404.

Now this is why I love eevblog!

I'm newbie here, lol. I used to own website for long time..

Can do it, but fear accidents. Both of the data loss and lifted pads kind.

Yes, those NVRAMs easy to loose data on overheat...and even no overheat. Who knows how alive that battery inside it already.
But this NVRAM crap was already the only reason for my luck with CSA7404 scope Bought it "dead" from previous owner, and disregarding HDD with bad sectors and bad smart, main failure was NVRAM battery. After replacing HDD and installing fresh Win2000, all software for scope and drivers - it did not work, because
of vxWorks trickery for PowerPC board. After i finally figured that out - i got everything working flawlessly and now upgrading scope in various ways (replace Celeron with PIII, add memory, already swapped CDROM to DVDRW, now changing LEDs on front panel and fixing some minor knob issues)

For instance where did you get the various versions of the TLA App?

From tek website. I can upload everything i have onto my public redmine project, if u want. I have TLA714 with 7AA4 module tho, not sure if everything work directly on your 614.

Also CMOS battery on PC board just died on my LA, so will tear it apart again

[Fsck]

I see an IBM Deathstar... may want to get on that

Ha ha... Took me a while to get that. So, the IBM 'Travelstar' hard drives have a reputation for sudden death?

Optimal solution would be to replace with a 4" drive, since I have boxes full of them. Looks like there is physically enough space. Leaving just power supply load and wiring questions.

correct, very very prone. I'd still vote for CF card over a spinner.

[echen1024]

So it's not a modular TLA 7xx series (could not afford), but it's a lot nicer than my old HP 1630G.

Funny how here in the states $220 + $30 shipping gets you a TLA704 with a TLA 7L1 card. Much cheaper than the TLA614s I see.

[TerraHertz]

while the TLA614 case only has an opening for one of the USB connectors.

Same here on CSA7404.

It turns out the motherboard *does* implement two USB ports (only USB ver 1.1 though.) But port zero
can be directed via jumpers to either the uppermost USB connector on the rear edge, or the NLX edge
connector. On my board it's jumpered to the NLX connector, which Tek uses to connect the motherboard to all the other LA system components. So it's pretty certain the USB port zero is in use for controlling some other system module. Not yet sure which though.

It was nice to find that Intel still has all the data for the SU810 board online, manual & drivers.
https://downloadcenter.intel.com/SearchResult.aspx?lang=eng&ProductFamily=Desktop+Boards&ProductLine=Discontinued+Motherboards&ProductProduct=Intel%c2%ae+Desktop+Board+SU810

Not so good to find there are no WinXP drivers, only '95, '98, NT & 2000. I guess I may have to leave it as Win2000 after all.

Yes, those NVRAMs easy to loose data on overheat...and even no overheat. Who knows how alive that battery inside it already.
But this NVRAM crap was already the only reason for my luck with CSA7404 scope Bought it "dead" from previous owner, and disregarding HDD with bad sectors and bad smart, main failure was NVRAM battery. After replacing HDD and installing fresh Win2000, all software for scope and drivers - it did not work, because
of vxWorks trickery for PowerPC board. After i finally figured that out - i got everything working flawlessly and now upgrading scope in various ways (replace Celeron with PIII, add memory, already swapped CDROM to DVDRW, now changing LEDs on front panel and fixing some minor knob issues)

OK, so the NVRAM is a priority. Trick being, to get it desoldered and backed up without ever allowing random induced voltages on pins to do any accidental writes.

For instance where did you get the various versions of the TLA App?

From tek website. I can upload everything i have onto my public redmine project, if u want. I have TLA714 with 7AA4 module tho, not sure if everything work directly on your 614.

Thanks but no need yet. I'll hit the Tek website once I'm done with this initial 'secure the data' stage.
The HD is a mini-IDE type, and I knew I had a mini-IDE to IDE adapter somewhere. But it took me till just now to find it. Most of the TLA is back together now after the 'explore and clean' dissasembly, and I'm eager to see if it still works with everything the same - after backing up the HD.

It's a bit sad to find there's no way to add any expansion boards to the thing. No spare PCI slot. Only a couple of 'PC Card' ports on the rear. So the idea of adding a USB 2 or 3 port on the front panel seems to be out.
At least the ethernet port is 10/100, thank god. I was half expecting it to be 10 MB/s only.

The CPU is marked "Intel Celeron, FV524RX500 128 SL3LQ, L0010164-0835" (500MHz) and supposedly 600MHz ones are compatible. I'm not sure if it's worth bothering to upgrade the CPU.  You say PIIIs are compatible? I'll look into that, eventually.

Also CMOS battery on PC board just died on my LA, so will tear it apart again

The coin cell on this MB is a bit low, only 2.9V. So that's getting replaced with the power on, next time the thing is back together.

[TerraHertz]

Ha ha. It's always funny doing data recovery on other people's hard disks. Guess what the bulk of the drive in this logic analyzer is full of, apart from Windows? 630MB of it.

[nctnico]

 

[casinada]

At least is not porn or spyware

[eurofox]

Maybe he was debugging an MP3 player 

eurofox

[echen1024]

At least is not porn or spyware

*Boss walks into lab*
What is it you were watching?
Uhhhh... It's not what it looks like. AN array of waveforms organized themselves. Seriously.

[free_electron]

I see an IBM Deathstar... may want to get on that

Ha ha... Took me a while to get that. So, the IBM 'Travelstar' hard drives have a reputation for sudden death?

Optimal solution would be to replace with a 4" drive, since I have boxes full of them. Looks like there is physically enough space. Leaving just power supply load and wiring questions.

oh yes ! the deathstar ... look for travelstar click of death ...

[free_electron]

Maybe he was debugging an MP3 player 

eurofox

talk to our settop box people. they are being paid to wath hd satellite tv all day long while debugging the system...

[leafi]

Do you know if the capture memory is fixed and real or is it software disabled? It would be great if people could start figuring out how to unlock tek equipment! They wanted to charge me 10K to unlock more capture memory on my Oscope when it is already there just disabled. I hate that!