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Oscilloscope Zoom Out Quirk
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rsjsouza:

--- Quote from: 2N3055 on May 11, 2020, 12:18:16 pm ---
--- Quote from: nfmax on May 11, 2020, 12:10:30 pm ---Once again, may I point out that the 'zoom window' display (the equivalent of a dual timebase on an analogue scope) is not needed to zoom & pan either in or out post acquisition: just use the ordinary horizontal scale & position controls!

--- End quote ---
To make sure, for 3000T and Rigol that is correct. I don't know about the others.
But I LIKE zoom mode. It gives me overview where in the buffer I am. Also on 3000T, I just use touch screen to move around... I just wish that zoom window could change size (to be little smaller if I want) when it get crowded.
But, that is mostly because screen on 3000T is not very big.

--- End quote ---
Interesting; the DS4014 has a handy top "entire buffer" view that does the same thing and uses almost zero screen realstate. (Unless you mean something else, of course)
Wuerstchenhund:

--- Quote from: SilverSolder on May 11, 2020, 11:53:20 am ---
--- Quote from: Wuerstchenhund on May 11, 2020, 11:11:17 am ---
--- Quote from: SilverSolder on May 11, 2020, 01:57:48 am ---Imagine a camera with a zoom lens.  An experienced photographer does not start with the lens zoomed out to the max, and then only zooms in from that point.  Instead, they start with the lens zoomed somewhere around where their experience tell them is the best zoom factor for the kind of picture they are taking, then they trim the zoom both in and out a little bit from that point while watching the model in the viewfinder, until he/she looks "just right".  It is a fast and fluid way of working with a camera.
--- End quote ---

Very bad analogy. Because optical zoom on a camera changes the resolution per scene area, so capturing pictures fully zoomed out will result in a loss of information when creating closer-ups from that 'acquisition'.

On deep memory scope however, capturing long and zooming in does not result in a loss of information, because neither the vertical resolution nor the sample rate changes over capturing short.

I can tell you that, if the loss of information (detail) wasn't a problem with zoom then many photographers would gladly capture fully zoomed out, because by capturing excess scenery they can later easily adjust the actual image size and position without having to go back to the place of scene and re-capture.

--- End quote ---

If you have enough RAM in the scope, of course I agree.
--- End quote ---

I guess you mean sample memory, not RAM ;)


--- Quote ---But if you capture a "zoomed out" picture of a waveform on your scope of say, 10 seconds, just to pick an extreme,  and your scope does not have enough RAM to capture that at full resolution, there is indeed a loss of quality compared to capturing a smaller time slice at a higher rate.   That's my situation...
--- End quote ---

That is true of course, however if your scope has insufficient memory to capture a full sequence of whatever you're dealing with then you either have to capture a shorter sequence or, if the signal properties permit, capture long but at reduced sample rate.

In any ase, if the memory is insufficient to "capture long" then it is also insufficient for Nico's method.

But quite often, signals with long periods are also low BW signals, so you might well be able to capture the whole sequence at a reduced sample rate that is still sufficiently high.
jemangedeslolos:
As for MCUs or like many others things, the best scope is the one that fit your needs of the one you know best.

I like zoom mode because I can see my data in context but I can see the same data with different methods, Im not a Nazi.
It depends on what I'm trying to measure, my progress in debugging or my mood of the day.

And I can do all of that because my scope is the best  >:D
Someone:

--- Quote from: nfmax on May 11, 2020, 12:10:30 pm ---Once again, may I point out that the 'zoom window' display (the equivalent of a dual timebase on an analogue scope) is not needed to zoom & pan either in or out post acquisition: just use the ordinary horizontal scale & position controls!
--- End quote ---
But not all scopes will or can capture longer memory around the visible window.... the entire point of this discussion. So for those scopes zoom is a way to achieve the same thing. (loses some screen realestate, gains independent control of trigger/window/acquisition positioning)
2N3055:

--- Quote from: rsjsouza on May 11, 2020, 12:27:29 pm ---
--- Quote from: 2N3055 on May 11, 2020, 12:18:16 pm ---
--- Quote from: nfmax on May 11, 2020, 12:10:30 pm ---Once again, may I point out that the 'zoom window' display (the equivalent of a dual timebase on an analogue scope) is not needed to zoom & pan either in or out post acquisition: just use the ordinary horizontal scale & position controls!

--- End quote ---
To make sure, for 3000T and Rigol that is correct. I don't know about the others.
But I LIKE zoom mode. It gives me overview where in the buffer I am. Also on 3000T, I just use touch screen to move around... I just wish that zoom window could change size (to be little smaller if I want) when it get crowded.
But, that is mostly because screen on 3000T is not very big.

--- End quote ---
Interesting; the DS4014 has a handy top "entire buffer" view that does the same thing and uses almost zero screen realstate. (Unless you mean something else, of course)

--- End quote ---

Pretty much something like that. Maybe a bit bigger, just to get a glimpse of shapes....
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