EEVblog Electronics Community Forum
Products => Test Equipment => Topic started by: scalzomen on May 20, 2013, 11:05:38 am
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Hello there,
I am a new forum user.
After my presentation I searched on the forum for some characterisitics of DSOs since I would like to buy one.
Finally, I am undecided between 3 models:
Owon SDS7102V
Siglent SDS1102CNL
Hantek DSo5102B
Can you please me advice on what can be the better choice for a hobby-use especially in repair field?
Consider that I can take the OWON and the Hantek at the same price while the Siglent at a smaller price.
I am also interested in evaluating firmware modding if possible for some models.
Thank you for your advices.
Bye
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in generally you should use search function first, there are a lot of threads with exact the same questions.
A good idea is as well to define own requierements, currently i see only one:
I am also interested in evaluating firmware modding if possible for some models.
therefore
Owon SDS7102V
Siglent SDS1102CNL
Hantek DSo5102B
this is not a clear requierement :
Can you please me advice on what can be the better choice for a hobby-use especially in repair field?
hobby-use or/and repair field can be everything from DC to <10GHz
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Hello there,
I am a new forum user.
After my presentation I searched on the forum for some characterisitics of DSOs since I would like to buy one.
Finally, I am undecided between 3 models:
Owon SDS7102V
Siglent SDS1102CNL
Hantek DSo5102B
Can you please me advice on what can be the better choice for a hobby-use especially in repair field?
Consider that I can take the OWON and the Hantek at the same price while the Siglent at a smaller price.
I am also interested in evaluating firmware modding if possible for some models.
Thank you for your advices.
Bye
If you want even some amount apples - apples compare you have wrong Siglent in this group.
Owon have 10+10M full speed memory. (for both channels but with one channel use still 10M for channel)
Hantek have 4k full speed memory and 500k + 500k (1M if one channels in use) half speed Long merory.
Siglent have 40k full speed memory for 1 channel but only if 1GSa/s and 20k for lower speed in 1 channel use. 20k/channel always if 2 channel in use. CNL do NOT have at all long memory.
It need carefully think what this memory question means, not only for thinking how long capture can take but memory amount and speed is important factor for samplerate if use also other horizontal speeds than some fastest.
Siglent is ok if you do not need capture long data or if you do not need high samplerate with low horizontal speeds.
;)
Hantek you can mod to 200MHz model but it is good to remember that it do not affect memory speed and not sampling speed. And it is only scope in this group what you can really mod.. becouse it have open linux and in forum there is lot of cnowledge for it. There is even schematics available (due to Tinhead lot of nice works)
;)
Owon is far over these both machines if look sampling fidelity and display quality and specially sampling speed using low horizontal speeds. It can do 1GSa/s down to 500us/div.
Down to 2ms/div its frequancy BW is still 100MHz. (Nyquist limit 125MHz / 250MSa/s)
2ms/div Hantek have barely 10MHz BW what ever mod have done. (Nyquist limit is 10MHz /20MSa/s)
1ms/div Siglent have 100kHz BW (Nyquist limit is 125kHz with samplerate 250kSa/s)
(For some other compare: example Rigol DS1000E have 2ms/div <5MHz BW (10MSa/s)
Tektronix new some "1000" model have much less than Siglent becouse it have only 2.5k memory)
Siglent is good if no need this slow speed high samplerate and if look other features, it beats these other named models. There is true dual timebase ALT, there is best Equal Time sample mode. SCPI commands if need, good UI but not perfect. If look its dirty cheap price (specially CNL model what short time ago factory set for special offers).
If you need more sampling memory, drop out this CNL model and look CML model if ypu look Siglent.
Only Owon in this group is DSO others are more or less DPO's.
It means that Owon waveform update rate is slow.. but... this is not whole truth. It depends settings. Example Hantek. With long memory selected you can count with eyes this waveform update rate...1...2...3...4.. but Owon run even with 10M memory faster than your eyes. (of course exept if horizontal time/div do not reject it.. this can not make faster even fastest RTO)
Owon is also alone with thin design and battery option and external SVGA (in V models)
I have used these Hantek, Owon, Siglent, Rigol etc but my opinion is that useability (Human interface) in this group is Siglent and Hantek.
But signal ADC fidelity and fast sampling rate Owon outperforms these all. Also Owon 100MHz model analog BW is around 170Mz and over. (in middle range of voltages over 200MHz)
Today also Siglent building quality is acceptable (and very good in its price class)
There is available SDS1072CNL inside pictures also in forum.
Small detail, Siglent is only what have real glass over TFT.
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Hello and thank you both for the replies.
I just want to clarify that I do not have any type of oscilloscope and so I can be considered a beginner with them even if I have been used them sometimes.
At this time I do not work in electronic field and so my requirements are low: I will use the scope in home-made repairs on TVs and all consumer electronics and maybe in some studies which I can do.
Searching on the forum I already read some comparison between various brands but....I was confused and I posted to have a more reliable advice.
thank you to rf-loop for the detailed analysis.
reading your opinion I can understand that the Siglent should be sufficient for my intents...the only doubt I had regards the possibility to spend something more now to take in any case a better instrument even if I will not use its capabilities.
To better define the scenario I can say that I am able to have this prices in Europe
OWON SDS7102 €330
HANTEK DSO5102B €335
SIGLENT SDS1102CNL €240
It was also interesting the possibility to buy the Hantek 100Mhz and mod it to 200MHz but, as I can understand, that would not be of great importance in respect of other advantages of the OWON.
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Have you seen those video reviews by Marmad??
www.youtube.com/watch?v=u7UgKJ8M7LY (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u7UgKJ8M7LY#)
www.youtube.com/watch?v=eqcEi6ru4ZM (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eqcEi6ru4ZM#)
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thank you Hydrawerk, I will see this night.
do you have positive/ negative experiences with these class of instruments?
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Well, there are threads about all those scopes. Find them.
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Example after this Owon video there all things inside scope changed, least two major HW updates and many many of FW updates. Even case have littlebit changed. (rubber feets also in backside)
I have asked from Siglent factory and they claim wfms/s rate is up to 2000.
It is long time ago I have tested ans looked many rigol DS1000E and this Siglent feels faster. But this is only now feel.
Owon maximum is around 35 but it do it nearly allways also with longest memory, until time/div speed start limit it. And this limit happends in every scope afaik.
These prices feels very strange. With this total you get equipment to your hand?
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I think that the Siglent is quite OK, apart from the short memory. They produce scopes for LeCroy, Atten and BK precision... They call themselves to be the biggest OEM scope manufacturer. Anyway, beware of the Owon noise problem. https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/review-of-owon-sds7102/1125/ (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/review-of-owon-sds7102/1125/)
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Example after this Owon video there all things inside scope changed, least two major HW updates and many many of FW updates. Even case have littlebit changed. (rubber feets also in backside)
I have asked from Siglent factory and they claim wfms/s rate is up to 2000.
It is long time ago I have tested ans looked many rigol DS1000E and this Siglent feels faster. But this is only now feel.
Owon maximum is around 35 but it do it nearly allways also with longest memory, until time/div speed start limit it. And this limit happends in every scope afaik.
These prices feels very strange. With this total you get equipment to your hand?
Are you saying that Owon now is further better than the video's one?
What does it mean for Owon around 35?
Yes, with these prices I will get the equipment in my hand!!
I can say that Owon is in sale price on the ebay from UK (original was aroun €400) at that price while the Siglent is a favour price of a seller which is discounting from €280. I looked also for the CML version is €350 only from China while from UK is around €500...I don't know if it is good to pay those money in respect of the Owon. WHat do you think?
Thank you!
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I think that the Siglent is quite OK, apart from the short memory. They produce scopes for LeCroy, Atten and BK precision... They call themselves to be the biggest OEM scope manufacturer. Anyway, beware of the Owon noise problem. https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/review-of-owon-sds7102/1125/ (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/review-of-owon-sds7102/1125/)
maybe the short memory will not be a big issue for my usage since I have to feel with the instrument, I'm not an expert..
and maybe the better usability, as reported by rf-loop, could help me!
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And what is your opinion about an Atten ADS1102CAL?
Did you tested it?
I can get it for €270...
thank you all.
cheers
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Well I think I will get an Hantek DSO5062BM for around 300€ final price to mod to the 200MHz version.
After reading almost all the messages in the BIG hack thread I think that is the best solution. It should be a great investment than taking the SDS1102CNL for 240€.
Thank you.
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Well I think I will get an Hantek DSO5062BM for around 300€ final price to mod to the 200MHz version.
After reading almost all the messages in the BIG hack thread I think that is the best solution. It should be a great investment than taking the SDS1102CNL for 240€.
Thank you.
Check prices, the 100MHz (DSO5102B) is usually cheaper than the 60Mhz version. Watch out for the P models which only have 24K memory.
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Well I think I will get an Hantek DSO5062BM for around 300€ final price to mod to the 200MHz version.
After reading almost all the messages in the BIG hack thread I think that is the best solution. It should be a great investment than taking the SDS1102CNL for 240€.
...
Check prices, the 100MHz (DSO5102B) is usually cheaper than the 60Mhz version. Watch out for the P models which only have 24K memory.
Also think about probes, as mentioned a few times in the big hack thread. The probes that come with the DSO5062B top out below 100MHz whereas the probes with the DSO5102B top out around 150MHz. Don't take my word for it, though - search that thread just to be sure.
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Well I think I will get an Hantek DSO5062BM for around 300€ final price to mod to the 200MHz version.
After reading almost all the messages in the BIG hack thread I think that is the best solution. It should be a great investment than taking the SDS1102CNL for 240€.
Thank you.
Check prices, the 100MHz (DSO5102B) is usually cheaper than the 60Mhz version. Watch out for the P models which only have 24K memory.
this is the BM version with 2M memory depth...I think it is a good price and I checked for the 100MHz version but it is still higher!
I know the P version is cheaper but as there is not a great difference (not over 40€) maybe it is convenient to get the BM version.
If you have any other ideas...please let me know.
Moreover, I think that a modded FW for the P version was not already prepared as I read a tinhead post where he asked someone (who bought the P version) to upload the original FW.
Maybe tinhead could confirm!
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Also think about probes, as mentioned a few times in the big hack thread. The probes that come with the DSO5062B top out below 100MHz whereas the probes with the DSO5102B top out around 150MHz. Don't take my word for it, though - search that thread just to be sure.
Reading the thread I think I understood that the probes coming with the 60MHz and 100MHz versions are the same, marked for 150MHz while for the 200MHz are different.
I will check better and I will upgrade this post
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Bad after-sales service from Hantek, I wont consider the brand anymore....
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Bad after-sales service from Hantek, I wont consider the brand anymore....
from Hantek for sure, you have to be really patient to "not expolde" reading their answers ... however, the community is large,
we have schematics of theirs DSOs (on which i spend lot of hours), tons of firmware backups, we know how to run factory calibration,
we have even their CPLD designs (so in prnciple having this information one can clone and for sure repair these DSOs).
This is for sure the most documented DSOs since 15years or so.
The other stuff from Hantek, yeah, that's a differenct story.
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Decided :-+....
I am buying the Hantek DSO5062BM for €300 final price.
As soon as it will arrive I will test it and then proceed for the hack.
What are some simple test to ensure it is not a fault unit?
Thank you very much
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This is for sure the most documented DSOs since 15years or so.
Well, why?
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This is for sure the most documented DSOs since 15years or so.
Well, why?
huh?, as already said above, but let me repeat; for the Hantek/Tekway DSO/Handhelds
(due hundreds of hours which i spend on reversing) the community have:
- schematic available
- raw firmware dump available
- all FPGA/CPLD design dumps available
- factory calibration reversed and documented
- all licensing/feature settings reversed and documented
- etc.
All we don't have are gerber file to produce PCB, hehe, but everything else (to build or repair) is avilable
Afaik the last DSO with published schematics (except the leaked Instek GDS-8xxS Service Manual from 2003-2004)
with calibration procedure was afaik TDS500B/700A series.
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What are some simple test to ensure it is not a fault unit?
self calibration is doing lot of tests already, so when all knobs/button, display and USB are working then after self-calibration
you can confirm that everything fine (except of course potential firmware bugs).
When you got it, let me know your fw version (in the hack thread then)
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Well I think I will get an Hantek DSO5062BM for around 300€ final price to mod to the 200MHz version.
After reading almost all the messages in the BIG hack thread I think that is the best solution. It should be a great investment than taking the SDS1102CNL for 240€.
Thank you.
Check prices, the 100MHz (DSO5102B) is usually cheaper than the 60Mhz version. Watch out for the P models which only have 24K memory.
The Hantek DSO5102P would have only 24K memory ?
Here it says 40K ???
http://cgi.ebay.fr/Hantek-DSO5102P-USB-Digital-Storage-Oscilloscope-2-Channels-100MHz-1GSa-s-/321226229820?pt=UK_BOI_Electrical_Test_Measurement_Equipment_ET&hash=item4aca93483c (http://cgi.ebay.fr/Hantek-DSO5102P-USB-Digital-Storage-Oscilloscope-2-Channels-100MHz-1GSa-s-/321226229820?pt=UK_BOI_Electrical_Test_Measurement_Equipment_ET&hash=item4aca93483c)
The Hantek has a 800x480 TFT display where others only have 480x234. Is it a big stuff to consider ?
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The Hantek DSO5102P would have only 24K memory ?
Here it says 40K ???
it was 24k before, Hantek changed specs (and released update for existing customers) to allow 40k per channel.
The Hantek has a 800x480 TFT display where others only have 480x234. Is it a big stuff to consider ?
ask (any) woman if size matter
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For the future readers of this thread, have in mind and these (https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/review-of-owon-sds7102/msg313606/#msg313606) comparative tests between level of noise of these scopes.
Please note that these tests concern only the noise level of these oscilloscopes rather than a general comparison of all key points.
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I can only write as I find, having owned and used my Siglent 1102CNL daily, for the last 10 months it's not skipped a beat ever,I hope they bring out a mixed domain scope soon.