Quality LCR Measurements at 1MHz

[mawyatt]

Anticipating some upcoming effort which will require accurate (<0.1%) matching of many L,C & R SMD devices at frequencies up to 1MHz (later maybe up to 2~5MHz), we've been looking at available instruments to help. The required frequency range is beyond our TH2830 and DE-5000, so looking into higher frequency options, one of which is from Hioki.

From the limited research we've done, Hioki seems like a well respected OEM. We have a TH2830 from Tonghui which is quite good, but have no experience with Hioki.

The one LCR meters that seems to fit our expected needs is the Hioki IM3536, but can't find any independent reviews/teardowns, and can't seem to find many reviews of Hioki in general other than handheld meters.

Any folks have any direct hand experience with Hioki LCR meters, or any other options that cover the intended frequency range. Know about using a VNA and such, but prefer to go with a LCR meter or impedance analyzer.

Things that are important sort of in priority:

Cost
Frequency 1MHz or greater
Accuracy/Repeatability
Fixtures
DC Bias capability
Graphics capability
Size/Noise (fan)

Best, 

[gamalot]

Maybe you can look at a used Hioki 3532 if cost and higher frequency are the first considerations.

[Martin72]

Hi,

Sourcetronic, where we got ours, offers LCRs up to 10Mhz:

https://www.sourcetronic.com/shop/en/lcr-meters/

[profanum429]

We have a 2MHz Sinephase USB Impedance Analyzer; https://sinephase.com

We use it for transducer work and it seems to work OK. Downside (or upside depending on the user) is that it is a USB device so you'll need a Windows laptop. You can get a fairly rudimentary API that lets you get the values directly from the device so you can make your own Labview/Python/C++/whatever app to interface to it for custom test setups if you want.

Fixtures are a bit basic, but they can supposedly design whatever extra fixtures you might dream up.

Just wanted to throw out another option!

[Jay_Diddy_B]

Hi,

You may want to look at the HP 4275A LCR (Z) meter. It is accurate and easy to use. You would have to find a used one. It covers the range 10kHz to 10MHz in a 1-2-4 sequence.



You will need a fixture for SMD parts.


Regards,
Jay_Diddy_B

[nctnico]

I would recommend against the  HP 4275A. I used to have it's lower frequency brother and it gets inaccurate real quick once you get outside it's comfort zone. The  HP 4275A is also an old clunker likely to have a whole bunch of problems.

[jonpaul]

Had HP 4275A for decades no issues
also 4277A Z meter.

For wideband Z measuring 100 kHz..500 MHz we use HP 4195A network Spectrum Analyzer to 500 MHz with matching  41952 Impedance test set and SMD fixtures.

Expect ~$2k on epay plus the test sets and fixtures

Jon

[pdenisowski]

Rohde and Schwarz just announced their new LCR meter, the LCX, today 

https://www.rohde-schwarz.com/us/products/test-and-measurement/lcr-meters-and-impedance-analyzers/rs-lcx-lcr-meter_63493-1172288.html

It goes up to 10 MHz, has excellent specifications, a full set of fixtures, internal and external DC bias, built-in graphics, etc.

[precaud]

Had HP 4275A for decades no issues
also 4277A Z meter

Same here. 4274A is a bit of a dog especially at low impedances due to low drive current (10mA IIRC). But the 4275A is very good, I still have and use mine.

[Keith956]

Had HP 4275A for decades no issues
also 4277A Z meter.

Ditto, got both, plus a 4280A for 1MHz C / C-V / C-t of caps down to femtofarads with builtin bias to +/- 100V. Like the HP3458A which is still the gold standard 8.5digit DMM, they were built to last.

[mawyatt]

Thanks to all for responding, we now have a few things to consider.

Best,

[Thundr_Pat]

I have been using a Hioki IM3536 LCR and IM3570 Impedance Analyzer recently and have really been liking it so far.

 

[mawyatt]

Ended up deciding on the IM3536, mainly for the extended frequency range (8MHz). How is the fan noise on your IM3536, ours is quite loud!!

All our fixtures for the Tonghui TH2830 we have fit and work with the IM3536, which is nice!!

Best,

[Thundr_Pat]

The fan noise is certainly noticeable. I might have to borrow a dB meter and measure just how loud it is. Ill update with my findings  

[KE5FX]

Something I've been kind of expecting/hoping to appear is a variant of the NanoVNA firmware that runs VNA "apps."  Basically, user-written scripts that run on the device itself.  An LCR meter would be a very obvious example but it's not hard to think of others... distance-to-fault measurements, velocity factor and cable length, crystal frequency and Q measurement, an emulated grid-dip meter, amplifier P1dB, that sort of thing.

Most test equipment would probably benefit from a more application-driven approach, but it's a no-brainer for VNAs.